bazzaw Posted December 17, 2011 #51 Share Posted December 17, 2011 No No! That is David's new part-time abode that he is having built for him in Auckland Harbour. He will only use it when he is not cruising! Barry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CroNich Posted December 18, 2011 Author #52 Share Posted December 18, 2011 In the autumn 2011 edition of Shipping Australia Limited,http://www.shippingaustralia.com.au/Portals/57ad7180-c5e7-49f5-b282-c6475cdb7ee7/ShippingAut2011.pdf Gavin Smith from RCCL talks about having a berth for the cruise ships at Port Botany. He writes that Sydney Harbour be used for visiting ships, whilst the local ships operate out of Port Botany. I agree with what he says 100% With the amount of new container terminals at Port Botany I am sure there could be room for one or two cruise terminals, however it's got to do with money, if the government would invest properly it could actually be worthwhile and it's not like Botany is an ugly Bay it's just it's very industrial but like he says for seasonal or year round cruises it's not really about Sydney Harbour (although it's a nice touch) it's about the cruise itself so I think it could work, plus it's close to the airport as well Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CroNich Posted December 19, 2011 Author #53 Share Posted December 19, 2011 "Carnival Australia boss Ann Sherry has revealed she expects a positive outcome for the cruise industry following the review into the possible shared use of Garden Island. But she warned that the challenge facing the cruise sector is not winning approval for shared use of the naval base but actually making the arrangement work. Speaking at the Carnival Australia Partnership Summit aboard Princess Cruises’ Dawn Princess, Sherry said she was expecting the review, conducted by Dr Allan Hawke, to spell good news for cruise lines. A report will be submitted to defence minister Steven Smith early in the new year. “We are expecting them to say yes you can share. The next phase is how do you make it work,” she said. “There has been a huge amount of support and a lot of submissions.” Sherry added that the presence of nine ships in Sydney Harbour this year was an added incentive to push approval of the scheme through. She ruled out the possibility of a solution in Botany Bay, saying it was a last resort in case Garden Island fell through. “Nobody is advocating use of Botany Bay,” she declared, a view which may surprise Royal Caribbean which is keen to explore the prospect of Port Botany catering for its liners. The visual effect of sailing past the Harbour Bridge and Opera House was a major drawcard for cruisers that would be overlooked by such a proposal, Sherry said. “That's one of the reasons that Newcastle didn’t go as well as we thought,” she said. “Customers were willing to drive the extra couple of hours to have the opportunity to sail through the bridge.” Meanwhile, she revealed that she had “somewhere in mind” for a new Brisbane facility closer to the airport, but declined to disclose further details." Do you think the RAN would just be able to relocate there Canberra Class Ships up north during the November-April season? Because during the winter months there would not be any use for the cruise terminal at Garden Island, and they can use it then Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sutho Posted December 19, 2011 #54 Share Posted December 19, 2011 I do not think the RAN will be happy sharing if they have to move their ships. The Garden Island wharfs are not long enough to share. When the Canberra class arrives they can only dock where the QM2 docks. The wharfs are not straight. There is no room at Garden Island as the wharfs are far too short to support cruise ships and warships. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kiwi Kruzer Posted December 19, 2011 #55 Share Posted December 19, 2011 I do not think the RAN will be happy sharing if they have to move their ships. The Garden Island wharfs are not long enough to share. When the Canberra class arrives they can only dock where the QM2 docks. The wharfs are not straight. There is no room at Garden Island as the wharfs are far too short to support cruise ships and warships. No room???? Does not look like that to me... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bazzaw Posted December 19, 2011 #56 Share Posted December 19, 2011 (edited) Not sure what you mean David:confused: Those berths look fairly "full" to me. Ann Sheery might be very positive -- but I will be VERY VERY surprised if....... Barry Edited December 19, 2011 by bazzaw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sutho Posted December 19, 2011 #57 Share Posted December 19, 2011 No room????Does not look like that to me... No there is no room after the FFG's berthed right in front of QM2, the warf turns and changes angle. The FFG's are 138m long and the FFH's about 118m long. Getting in closer the depths are not that great and with the accommodation on the other side space is limited getting a cruise ship further in. Where the QM2 is right now is the only place a cruise ship can dock. I believe the Canberra class will be too big for the cruiser wharf and other wharfs near the Captain Cook drydock. With all the ships the RAN has it is too small. Plus there is the shore power connections to consider when the RAN ships berth. They need priority access. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CroNich Posted December 19, 2011 Author #58 Share Posted December 19, 2011 I Like the Idea of the cruise lines joining together to buy back the finger wharf, however that is next to impossible. Is there anyway to extend the Fleet Base East to the East more? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CroNich Posted December 19, 2011 Author #59 Share Posted December 19, 2011 Also If they were to share it, Would they build a Permanent Cruise terminal there or would be a Marque type thing like you see at Wharf 5 at Barangaroo??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bazzaw Posted December 19, 2011 #60 Share Posted December 19, 2011 (edited) Have a look at the satellite view of garden Island here Once upon a time :) - Garden Island was indeed an island - you can see the original island with the trees showing at the very northern part of what we now call "Garden Island" . Over the past couple of hundred years, the island was joined to the mainland to create a dockyard. When I was in the navy myself, there was no such thing as a "Fleet base" ( on the western side of Garden Island). The Navy Fleet used to berth inside the Dockyard itself - however with the privatisation of the Dockyard in the late 80's , the powers -to-be decided to separate the two activities (refitting/maintenance of Navy ships and normal Naval weekly "running") and the Fleet Base was built. You can see from the pic what Sutho has been saying about these individual berths being quite small -- big enough for most naval ships , but not very suitable for large cruiseships. On the eastern side of GI, there are no wharves at all. BTW - the Navy ships that you can see in that pic are around only 130 metres long - Vista class ships are almost 300 metres - Voyager of the Seas Azura and QM2 are even longer. The wharf at the OPT is only 220 metres long. Personally I can see no place anywhere in Sydney Harbour that would be acceptable to Sydneysiders as an additional cruise terminal, east of the bridge. Nor can I imagine the Federal Authorities agreeing to complicate Naval operations out of the Fleet base. Barry Edited December 19, 2011 by bazzaw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ccsclean21 Posted October 6, 2017 #61 Share Posted October 6, 2017 (edited) Hi all Well it is now 2017 and the debate is still going on about where to berth the oversupply of cruise ships on Sydney Harbour and no closer to solving it. Someone in this post mentioned about putting the cruise ships at the old HMAS Platypus dock and I think that has some merit but would probably need dredging to accommodate the large ships then you will no doubt get resistance from residence in that area about causing congestion in the area. Sydney needs Tourist money to help local businesses and increase jobs. Another idea is maybe a floating dock that can easily be put into place when a ship is expected in port, bit like what they do when the International boat show is on in Darling Harbour but a much bigger scale then remove when not in use and use charter boats to ferry the passengers to Circular Quay or pick up passengers for their booked tours. Maybe a good place to put the floating dock would be in that area between Robertson Light house and Bradleys head or around the corner at Port Jackson Bay as these areas are out of the way of the shipping lanes. May need dredging to fit the ships. I am pretty sure that the HMAS Melbourne was anchored in that area between Roberson Light house and Bradleys Head but more near the Bradlys Head side and the Aircraft Carrier Melbourne had a draft of around 25ft, so is possible. Edited October 6, 2017 by ccsclean21 add more info Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Big_M Posted October 6, 2017 #62 Share Posted October 6, 2017 Good suggestions - realistic/practical options given the situation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NSWP Posted October 6, 2017 #63 Share Posted October 6, 2017 I do not think the RAN will be happy sharing if they have to move their ships. The Garden Island wharfs are not long enough to share. When the Canberra class arrives they can only dock where the QM2 docks. The wharfs are not straight. There is no room at Garden Island as the wharfs are far too short to support cruise ships and warships. Time to move the Navy base to Jervis Bay or Newcastle. Give Garden Island back to the people and the cruise lines, bring some money in to Sydney.:halo: As for QM2, when we were on her in March, Sydney to HK, she berthed at the Overseas Passenger Terminal - Circular, bit of overhang, but all the large ships overhang a bit there, no dramas, they just reverse in to their berth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aus Traveller Posted October 7, 2017 #64 Share Posted October 7, 2017 Time to move the Navy base to Jervis Bay or Newcastle. Give Garden Island back to the people and the cruise lines, bring some money in to Sydney.:halo: As for QM2, when we were on her in March, Sydney to HK, she berthed at the Overseas Passenger Terminal - Circular, bit of overhang, but all the large ships overhang a bit there, no dramas, they just reverse in to their berth. I agree with your suggestions, but I don't suppose our opinions will count for much. :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NSWP Posted October 7, 2017 #65 Share Posted October 7, 2017 I agree with your suggestions, but I don't suppose our opinions will count for much. :D Muchas Gracias, Senorita/Senora. (Covering all the bases.) :halo: Buenos Dias. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rare Womble99 Posted October 7, 2017 #66 Share Posted October 7, 2017 Time to move the Navy base to Jervis Bay or Newcastle. Give Garden Island back to the people and the cruise lines, bring some money in to Sydney.:halo:. Why is there a need to bring more money into Sydney Uncle Les? Pretty sure there is plenty of it there already the residents stare at it everyday held within their 4 walls............. Maybe we should share the love and move the money to other areas like Newcastle or Jervis Bay? :eek: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NSWP Posted October 7, 2017 #67 Share Posted October 7, 2017 Why is there a need to bring more money into Sydney Uncle Les? Pretty sure there is plenty of it there already the residents stare at it everyday held within their 4 walls............. Maybe we should share the love and move the money to other areas like Newcastle or Jervis Bay? :eek: Or send them to Port Kembla, beautiful scenic views of the Steelworks and they can breathe in the polluting smoke. The Illawarra needs the tourist dollar too. A few cruise ships have actually called into Port Kembla.:rolleyes: Don't know why, I lived in the 'Gong back in the 1970's. The pollution probably caused my lung problems.:evilsmile: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GUT2407 Posted October 7, 2017 #68 Share Posted October 7, 2017 One problem is they never saw it coming. To a degree that’s understandable as cruising was once the domain of the “well to do”. By the time the powers to be saw the industry would inject huge money into the economy the best spots for a dock were all gone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Big_M Posted October 7, 2017 #69 Share Posted October 7, 2017 Time to move the Navy base to Jervis Bay or Newcastle. Give Garden Island back to the people and the cruise lines, bring some money in to Sydney.:halo: Given Garden Island is used by the Navy, part of the Defence department of Australia, it is already held by the people. :) If it's sold off for cruise access, then it will most likely not be any more held by the people... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Big_M Posted October 7, 2017 #70 Share Posted October 7, 2017 By the time the powers to be saw the industry would inject huge money into the economy the best spots for a dock were all gone. I'm still sceptical that "huge money" does come in from cruises. It's certainly profitable for the operators so you can see why they try to sell that argument. But every cruise I'm on the pax barely spend anything ashore, often not wanting to buy any souvenirs at all, looking for free tours/transport, and often eating mostly onboard as well. Of course, there's a small amount of spending ashore for incidentals, but I can't see how the big numbers they claim are being generated. Especially for domestic oriented cruises; those getting international visitors usually get some more spending, but the stats on Australian cruises show how much of it is Australian traffic, where shore spending is minimised. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Docker123 Posted October 7, 2017 #71 Share Posted October 7, 2017 The income is not just derived from passenger expenditure, especially at turnaround ports. Port of Sydney charges $35 per passenger (capacity), plus all sorts of other fees like pilots etc. Add to that all the expenditure in food, drinks and other provisions, fuel oil, and whatever else is put onboard. As we see on this board, some of the tourist expenditure is not the day tripping, it is the extra days either side of a cruise. And of course, the booming pie business. https://www.portauthoritynsw.com.au/media/2532/port-authority-schedule-of-port-charges-fy1718_-pass-site-occ_syd-harbour_final.pdf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aus Traveller Posted October 7, 2017 #72 Share Posted October 7, 2017 Sydney is nearly always a turn-around port, not just a port day on a cruise. From reading this forum, many Australian passengers fly into Sydney the day before. They then have to pay for a night's accommodation and meals even if they don't do any or much sightseeing before the cruise. They also have to have transport to and from the ship. All this helps create jobs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GUT2407 Posted October 7, 2017 #73 Share Posted October 7, 2017 The income is not just derived from passenger expenditure, especially at turnaround ports. Port of Sydney charges $35 per passenger (capacity), plus all sorts of other fees like pilots etc. Add to that all the expenditure in food, drinks and other provisions, fuel oil, and whatever else is put onboard. As we see on this board, some of the tourist expenditure is not the day tripping, it is the extra days either side of a cruise. And of course, the booming pie business. https://www.portauthoritynsw.com.au/media/2532/port-authority-schedule-of-port-charges-fy1718_-pass-site-occ_syd-harbour_final.pdf Yes mustn’t forget the pie sales, wonder of they can dock down at the ‘loo or would lawsie and rusty get upset. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NSWP Posted October 7, 2017 #74 Share Posted October 7, 2017 Given Garden Island is used by the Navy, part of the Defence department of Australia, it is already held by the people. :) If it's sold off for cruise access, then it will most likely not be any more held by the people... But the cruise ships won't take up all of Garden Island. I have been inside it, it is big. Even with a cruise terminal there, a nice foreshore park could be established for the 'people.':hearteyes: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
banzaii Posted October 7, 2017 #75 Share Posted October 7, 2017 I think the ideal spot would be adjacent to Mrs Macquarie's Chair. Rename the area to Royal Caribbean Botanical Gardens. Problem solved![emoji48] Sent from my iPad using Forums Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Please sign in to comment
You will be able to leave a comment after signing in
Sign In Now