Two people, 3 airline seats?????

[ducklite]

Um.....no. What you are doing is trying to justify a (IMO) moralizing, self-righteous position (that people shouldn't get something you've decided they don't deserve) by inventing hypothetical situations far removed from the original complaint about a free glass of wine.

 

And, even if those situations did occur with anything near enough frequency to make a discernible difference, business class would still be full with people who want the space and comfy, full-recline seats. People can already get just the lounge if that's all biz or first class means to them, yet those sections are still full.

 

 

The carriers have SOP's that state the very limited circumstances in which the purser (not just any FA) may authorize the distribution of alcohol outside of the assigned class of service and/or at no charge. Giving drinks to friends is not among those circumstances, and that is an infraction that carries disciplinary action.

 

By the way, when the lounges get full they stop issuing day passes for a fee. I have seen this happen numerous times. And there is no amount of money that will buy your to the first class lounges of many international carriers. Buy a F ticket or go away.

Edited July 1, 2015 by ducklite

[ducklite]

Not when the calendars are going to be thrown out anyway.

 

Some companies (so I read somewhere, never saw it myself) pour bleach on discarded food, too, so the hungry can't eat it when it's been dumped....maybe you could shred the calendars before they get tossed.

 

And we're talking ONE glass of wine....not inebriating an entire coach class full of friends. Perspective....help yourself to some.

 

 

Most companies have policies on giving anything away. Mine included. If something will be thrown away I can request to take it, but typically unless I want it for a not-for-profit, the answer would be "no."

[azevedan]

And apparently there are people who feel they MUST report the gifting of a glass of wine.

*slow, sad headshake*

[ducklite]

And apparently there are people who feel they MUST report the gifting of a glass of wine.

 

*slow, sad headshake*

 

 

Where on this thread did you see anyone say they reported anything?

[FlyerTalker]

Where on this thread did you see anyone say they reported anything?

I posted that in post #40.

 

It was more than just a few beverages. It was full meal service out of BusinessElite, amenity kit, first class pillow and blanket plus the FA spent so much time talking with her friends, other passengers weren't being properly served in her section.

 

And yes, the company was both apologetic and expressed thanks that I brought this to their attention.

[azevedan]

Post #40 also contained this exchange, which *was* over just some wine:

 

Quote Originally Posted by pris993:

"Have found fellow passengers pay a lot of attention, we were on a flight with a friend who is a flight attendant -- she brought us some wine from first class, we were surprised to learn later another passenger complained. I could understand if we were bothering someone but we were quietly enjoying the wine. Can you imagine. Flying today on crowded aircrafts is a rough experience compared to years ago."

 

Reply to that quote in Post #40:

"Yes, I can imagine.

Unequal treatment of passengers like that is simply wrong. You received, due to your friendship, services that were not provided to others who also purchased your class of ticket. They didn't get to "quietly enjoy that wine" as you did.

Had I been in their position, I would have asked the FA for their name, then asked to speak with the purser, and then written a letter to the base supervisor...."

 

So that's two people....

[ducklite]

Well it seems that in FlyerTalkers case, service was impacted. In that case I would have reported it as well.

 

A few months ago there was a post in FlyerTalk from someone upset that they had run out if the wine he was enjoying in F because the FA kept taking glasses of it to a couple of good looking guys she was canoodling with in PE. The poster was debating whether he should report it or not. Across the board he was encouraged to, even by some FA's that post in the site.

[azevedan]

Well it seems that in FlyerTalkers case, service was impacted. In that case I would have reported it as well.

 

FT counts because of the statement that s/he would have done the same thing just over the pax quietly drinking the wine. By the way, apology accepted. Oh, wait...

 

A few months ago there was a post in FlyerTalk from someone upset that they had run out if the wine he was enjoying in F because the FA kept taking glasses of it to a couple of good looking guys she was canoodling with in PE. The poster was debating whether he should report it or not. Across the board he was encouraged to, even by some FA's that post in the site.

 

Once again, a completely egregious situation is being put forward as defense for the reporting of a friendly favor.

Edited July 1, 2015 by azevedan

[CantanaLobo]

So one glass of wine is a friendly favor and should not be reported, while "meal service out of BusinessElite, amenity kit, first class pillow and blanket" is egregious and it's OK to report. Apparently a line is crossed between the two. Anyone care to say what that line is? A glass of wine and a pillow? Wine, pillow, and meal? Or is it "I'll know it when I see it?" Seems to me an FA would have no idea if someone were going to report them, and it would be wise to not break the rules if the rules prohibit bringing first/business class amenities back to economy.

[azevedan]

So one glass of wine is a friendly favor and should not be reported, while "meal service out of BusinessElite, amenity kit, first class pillow and blanket" is egregious and it's OK to report. Apparently a line is crossed between the two. Anyone care to say what that line is? A glass of wine and a pillow? Wine, pillow, and meal? Or is it "I'll know it when I see it?" Seems to me an FA would have no idea if someone were going to report them, and it would be wise to not break the rules if the rules prohibit bringing first/business class amenities back to economy.

 

By that rationale, throwing a snowball at a car is as bad as firing a bullet.

Or that, since you can't draw a line between when night ends and day begins, it's not possible to tell the difference.

"Know it when I see it" works for the Supreme Court.

 

STILL haven't seen why people feel it necessary to stick their nose in.

[azevedan]

So one glass of wine is a friendly favor and should not be reported, while "meal service out of BusinessElite, amenity kit, first class pillow and blanket" is egregious and it's OK to report.

 

Never said it was ok to report that, nor is it the 'egregious example', which is what I called the situation described by the other poster (in post #132). (The situation you cite was reported in post #40 by someone else.) I wouldn't report it. None of my business. Not hurting me, or anyone else, except the people who apparently cannot stand that someone in cattle class got the merest taste of forbidden fruit (grapes, processed).

Edited July 2, 2015 by azevedan

[sverigecruiser]

Um.....no. What you are doing is trying to justify a (IMO) moralizing, self-righteous position (that people shouldn't get something you've decided they don't deserve) by inventing hypothetical situations far removed from the original complaint about a free glass of wine.

 

 

I know that my hypothetical situations aren't the same as a free glass of wine. It's still so that free things given away to some people does affect other people with in this case higher fares so it's not correct that it doesn't affect other if someone is given something they haven't paid for, someone will pay for it! If I care about the fare for my ticket, it is minding my own business if I complain.

 

I can say that I should never complain if I saw someone be given a glass of wine they didn't paid for but I don't think that it's wrong to do it!

[sverigecruiser]

And, even if those situations did occur with anything near enough frequency to make a discernible difference, business class would still be full with people who want the space and comfy, full-recline seats. People can already get just the lounge if that's all biz or first class means to them, yet those sections are still full.

 

You obviously don't really know the differences between businessclass and economy. Sometimes the only difference is the service on board and sometimes it's only a matter of flexibility on the tickets.

[sverigecruiser]

Not when the calendars are going to be thrown out anyway.

 

Some companies (so I read somewhere, never saw it myself) pour bleach on discarded food, too, so the hungry can't eat it when it's been dumped....maybe you could shred the calendars before they get tossed.

 

And we're talking ONE glass of wine....not inebriating an entire coach class full of friends. Perspective....help yourself to some.

 

It's still stealing if the calendars are taken without asking first. It doesn't matter if the calendars shall be thrown away.

 

Some companies in Sweden also pour bleach, or other things, on discarded food to avoid people taking it because they don't want people to steal! In Sweden noone really has to steal food to survive but some people still wants to do it to save money, does it matter? Yes it does if they then buy less food! When they steal food from companies selling food that company loose money because they will sell less food. What do you think they will do to get that money back? They will raise the prices for everyone not stealing food!

[sverigecruiser]

IIRC, people still bought B/FC when the booze was free back in coach, as it used to be. B/FC is very much an expensive proposition....you're not likely to pay extra just because you want a drink. Those who have the money or points or status to snag an upgrade on an oversold flight will continue to use their money/points/status with the same frequency as before.

 

 

I don't agree with that. Sometimes the pricedifference between economy and business isn't very big and then it might be worth it to pay for business just to get free drinks and food on the plane and in the lounge.

[sverigecruiser]

STILL haven't seen why people feel it necessary to stick their nose in.

 

I have told you a few times. You may not agree with me but you can't say that I haven't explained it to you.

 

People stick their nose in because it affect them too.

[azevedan]

In fact, I travel extensively for business (in addition to my vacations), and, I can assure you, I do indeed know the difference between economy, premium economy, business, and first, and how those vary internationally as compared to domestically, on US and international airlines, as well as between refundable vs. non-refundable, and fare codes within those.

And I'm sure you do, too, which is why I know (and you do, too), that there is (so close to being the case that it's correct to say) always a space difference with business class....whether it's more leg room, fewer seats across, or a middle seat 'blocked out'. Yep, some little RJ's flying without different classes....but they warn you of that and you know you're not flying in a higher class of service.

 

And I've explained back to you how it *doesn't* add to the cost of your ticket. Prices charged have relatively little relationship to the costs, which is why non-stops can cost more than layovers, and flying to Dayton by way of Cincinnati costs less than just flying to Cincinnati, and why airlines lost money for so many years. Heck....all those coach pax paying for their bags are *subsidizing* your fare. They took free baggage away from coach, and now those pax pay for it. Likewise with meal and drink service. Likewise with extortionate change fees. Meanwhile, BC and FC internationally and now cross-country are getting better and better. BC is getting better; coach is getting worse (and fees added), but *they're* costing you money? Right....

 

What it comes down to, I know (and you do, too), that all the excuses are rationalization for just being PO'd that someone is getting something they're 'not supposed to', that they're 'not entitled to', that 'they could get if they would just pay for BC if they wanted it', that 'they don't deserve'. But, sure, rationalize the pettiness by convincing yourself it's adding to your fare if that helps you see a kind person when you look in the mirror.

Edited July 2, 2015 by azevedan

[azevedan]

Some companies in Sweden also pour bleach, or other things, on discarded food to avoid people taking it because they don't want people to steal! In Sweden noone really has to steal food to survive but some people still wants to do it to save money, does it matter? Yes it does if they then buy less food! When they steal food from companies selling food that company loose money because they will sell less food. What do you think they will do to get that money back? They will raise the prices for everyone not stealing food!

 

Sad to say, in America, a lot of people do go hungry.

But if you want to make yourself feel better by assuming people risk disease by taking food out of a dumpster just to save money, go right ahead.

Edited July 2, 2015 by azevedan

[ducklite]

FT counts because of the statement that s/he would have done the same thing just over the pax quietly drinking the wine. By the way, apology accepted. Oh, wait...

 

 

 

Once again, a completely egregious situation is being put forward as defense for the reporting of a friendly favor.

 

 

A friendly favor that was in fact stealing from an employer.

[ducklite]

Never said it was ok to report that, nor is it the 'egregious example', which is what I called the situation described by the other poster (in post #132). (The situation you cite was reported in post #40 by someone else.) I wouldn't report it. None of my business. Not hurting me, or anyone else, except the people who apparently cannot stand that someone in cattle class got the merest taste of forbidden fruit (grapes, processed).

 

 

Actually it is hurting someone else. All of us. You keep saying the wine gets thrown away. Well what about the additional bottle that had to be opened for the giveaways? Just like with any thief, what else have the taken? There is a reason that companies have a zero tolerance policy in theft of anything.

[azevedan]

A friendly favor that was in fact stealing from an employer.

 

A glass of wine, destined to be discarded if not consumed, given by a person who has discretion to provide special services. Yep. Right up there with embezzling a couple of million.

 

Isn't it wonderful that there are perfect people in the world to keep the rest of us in line!

[ducklite]

A glass of wine, destined to be discarded if not consumed, given by a person who has discretion to provide special services. Yep. Right up there with embezzling a couple of million.

 

 

 

Isn't it wonderful that there are perfect people in the world to keep the rest of us in line!

 

 

I ran this thread past a FA friend. She has been with one of the big U.S. Carriers for 25 years. Her primary role is lead FA/purser. She said that on the legacy she flies for that a FA giving away alcohol except under very specific conditions spelled out in the SOP would be punished. Other crew

Who knew about it and didn't report it could also be disciplined. Discipline could be anything from loss of seniority points in the route/schedule bid process to suspension to termination.

 

So yes, a FA who gives away alcohol not only could get themselves in trouble, but also their coworkers.

[azevedan]

Well what about the additional bottle that had to be opened for the giveaways?

 

And you know a new bottle was opened how?

 

Just like with any thief, what else have the taken?

 

Thinking you're just a little over the top now?

 

There is a reason that companies have a zero tolerance policy in theft of anything.

 

Yep....it's so they don't have to think and actually consider circumstances. Which is why kids get suspended from school for violating drug policy because they gave a friend a Midol.

Edited July 2, 2015 by azevedan

[azevedan]

So yes, a FA who gives away alcohol not only could get themselves in trouble, but also their coworkers.

 

So, you're in favor of reporting it and getting several people in trouble because you assigned yourself policeman? Wow.

 

Isn't it wonderful that there are perfect people in the world to keep the rest of us in line!

Edited July 2, 2015 by azevedan

[ducklite]

And you know a new bottle was opened how?

 

The same way you know one wasn't.

 

 

 

 

 

Thinking you're just a little over the top now?

 

An employee who knowingly defies company policy and gives away items that there is written policy about them giving away is stealing from the company, plain and simple.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Yep....it's so they don't have to think and actually consider circumstances. Which is why kids get suspended from school for violating drug policy because the gave a friend a Midol.

 

 

Too bad the some rotten eggs have to spoil it for everyone. Maybe they should have thought about long term implications before giving things away that they knew they weren't supposed to.