when did cruising become so sloppy

[luv2cruisefromNY]

As a short pudgy woman, I refuse to wear dresses at all. I will wear a dressy top and pants on formal night with a low heel. I take care to make sure my hair is neat, apply light makeup and that my clothing is pressed. I've never sat next to a person that smelled bad in the dining room or seen anyone dressed poorly enough to consider them sloppy. Sloppy dressing to me would constitute ripped clothing, or soiled and unpressed clothing. I find men blowing their noses at the table disgusting and that happens way more often then someone being inappropriately dressed in the MDR. Then again some in this thread might think that I am sloppy by virtue of being an under dressed roly poly. :rolleyes:

[Smokeyham]

I have some sympathy with the original posters point that the general standards have changed. I remember cruising with HAL in Alaska in 1993, and we were all expected to wear at least a jacket and tie to dinner each evening. On formal nights the whole ship seemed to be glittering, as everyone was well dressed whether in the dining room or in one of the public venues.

On my last cruise (Princess in Alaska) it seemed that the majority of people in the MDR were nicely dressed on formal nights. As others have said, it looked like what I might expect to see at a nice restaurant on shore.

However, once dinner was over you step outside of the MDR and join the rest of the ship with people in very mixed attire, so I think you do lose some of that special feeling of everyone participating in a special event. So, I wonder where you could go if you wanted to recapture that sense of everyone on board in formal wear on formal evenings? Even the high end lines (i.e. Silversea) offer an alternative for those who do not wish to dress up.

“On formal nights, guests dining in La Terrazza may opt to wear casually elegant attire (dresses or trouser suits for women; jacket, tie optional for men). Following dinner, all guests are free to take advantage of any or all of the public spaces for both entertainment or cocktails and after-dinner drinks.” http://www.silversea.com/new-to-cruising/general-information/packing/

Having written the above, I do also remember wishing that we could dress down on some nights, so it is nice to have the options now.

Edited March 6, 2014 by Smokeyham

[calliopecruiser]

I don't really care who flames me since I am stating my OPINION. When did cruising become so sloppy? All I read is do I have to follow the rules?? Do WE have to follow the dress code? How can I cheat the system? The thing I love about cruising is seeing people dressed up in the evenings. The atmosphere that was classy. Now it seems no one cares. It's all about I paid and I don't want to dress up and I don't want to wait in line and I don't want to pay for that and I am the ONLY one that matters, why can't MY kid do that why do I have to watch MY kid I'm on vacation!

Is anyone else tired of hearing about how people want to not do what is "suggested" by the cruise lines??

 

Your post is kind of split -- one side is about "sloppy" attire and not being dressed up and fancy, and the other is about what you see as selfishness by your fellow passengers.

 

If you want to see people really dressed up in the evenings and enjoy a classy atmosphere, I'd suggest you don't cruise. Like it or not, the industry is changing and it's changed in response to market pressures -- i.e. it's changed to give the majority of people what they want so they can sell more tickets and fill more ships. People in general are choosing to dress more casually, and that's true at almost all financial levels and in all social classes. And when you're asking people to pack light (airline luggage costs) and squeeze into a tiny room with little closet space (lower fares, smaller cabins), that's even more true. Even the luxury lines no longer have formal-dress required evenings.

[calliopecruiser]

Ruined ain't the word for it. DH has passed away. I MAY still cruise but it sure won't be on a mass market cruise line where no one gives a S***. Why would I want to slum it with people in their shorts and flip flops or even Dockers and a collared shirt??? NOT my idea of a cruise...........Go, enjoy yourself. Just know that you have NOT truly gone on a cruise unless you participated in all that is the cruising tradition. And that includes a tux or suit for formal night. Flip flops, Dockers sans jacket. NOT my idea of a cruise.

 

Your idea of a cruise doesn't exist any more. Even the luxury lines are full of people who wear Dockers, flip flops, and shorts (though not to dinner). I don't know of any cruise line where formal attire is required at all (I think Crystal was the last "formal night" cruise, and they've changed to 'black tie optional").

 

I can't figure out why you think it's "slumming" to be with people who wear shorts or Dockers.......do you think they are dumb, unsophisticated, or unmotivated? If so, then you're not looking around the real world to see titans of business, brilliant professors, and wealthy socialites who wear jeans, t-shirts, and sandals when they're not at work (and sometimes when they are).

[dorisis]

It isn't just cruising that has gotten "sloppy". It has become a Walmart type of society we live in.Travel used to be mainly for the wealthy. And cruising on luxury lines is very different than cruising on mainstream lines.

[Gunner22aa]

I certainly agree that one should follow the dress code. Don't like Cunard because it is jacket and tie every night for dinner then cruise NCL where shorts and a tee shirt are considered semi formal.

 

I do however put part of the blame for the sliding of dress standards on the cruise lines themselves. Any line is free to set whatever dress code that they want. Don't like it go elsewhere. The issue is enforcement of the dress code. If the minimum for formal night is jacket and tie then the guy that shows up with an open collar gets sent away to get a tie or dine elsewhere. If the cruise lines won't enforce their own policies don't expect the passengers to abide by them.

Edited March 6, 2014 by Gunner22aa

[ducklite]

I agree that the ships should either simply say "come as you are" and only enforce a shirt and shoes requirement, or enforce their dress code. Otherwise nobody wins. The lack of enforcement is one if the reasons that we have decided no more mass market cruising.

[marco]

It's not just cruising, it's just society dress codes in general. I remember going shopping "downtown" with my mother. She wore a dress, hat and gloves. I wore a jacket and tie. When you went to church or temple, women wore dresses, hat and gloves, men wore jacket and tie. When you flew, same thing. Pretty much when you left your house, you "dressed". Now, everyone wears sweats, sneakers, shorts and flip flops everywhere. General customs and mores relative to dress have also been adopted for cruise attire. I think too, when Carnival first came on the scene, they eschewed the older traditional stereotypes of cruises and people who took them.

[RJ2002]

It's not just cruising, it's just society dress codes in general. I remember going shopping "downtown" with my mother. She wore a dress, hat and gloves. I wore a jacket and tie. When you went to church or temple, women wore dresses, hat and gloves, men wore jacket and tie. When you flew, same thing. Pretty much when you left your house, you "dressed". Now, everyone wears sweats, sneakers, shorts and flip flops everywhere. General customs and mores relative to dress have also been adopted for cruise attire. I think too, when Carnival first came on the scene, they eschewed the older traditional stereotypes of cruises and people who took them.

 

Totally agree. This is what I was trying to say in my earlier response.

[poncho1973]

geriatric prom (as it was so eloquently put before)

 

Thanks!

[poncho1973]

The lack of enforcement is one if the reasons that we have decided no more mass market cruising.

 

"The lack of enforcement" is because they have very few rules on dress. They have suggested guidelines that aren't enforced, you know, because they are suggestions and not enforced rules.

 

In my cruise experience, the rules in MDR have been enforced. The suggestions, rightly so, have never been enforced. I have heard on CC about rules not being enforced, but haven't seen it myself and if I did, I would ask them to please enforce them.

Edited March 6, 2014 by poncho1973

[ducklite]

"The lack of enforcement" is because they have very few rules on dress. They have suggested guidelines that aren't enforced, you know, because they are suggestions and not enforced rules.

 

 

 

In my cruise experience, the rules in MDR have been enforced. The suggestions, rightly so, have never been enforced. I have heard on CC about rules not being enforced, but haven't seen it myself and if I did, I would ask them to please enforce them.

 

 

Call it what you want, but as I said, if they don't care what people wear, they shouldn't offer suggestions to begin with. It sets up unrealistic expectations and simply caters to the lowest common denominator--which as we have seen over the past few years, has been pretty much ripped from the "Creatures of WalMart" web site.

[LMaxwell]

The guidelines exist so that people of different backgrounds and cultures have an understanding of the cruise line terminology. What is formal in the Southeast may not be so in the Midwest, let alone in countries from Europe or Asia. The suggestions provide a baseline of understanding to those "not in the know". They are not rules, requirements, or dress codes. Far too many people here have a very difficult time understanding or comprehending these facts of the matter. If they were requirements, they would be stated as such. I myself am having a hard time why people cling to explanations or "guidelines" as hard and fast rules.

[Beachdude]

I believe the "it's my vacation and bla bla bla" has taken away the elegance and romance of cruising. Cruise ships are turning into party barges.

 

Burt

[DrD]

The guidelines exist so that people of different backgrounds and cultures have an understanding of the cruise line terminology. What is formal in the Southeast may not be so in the Midwest, let alone in countries from Europe or Asia. The suggestions provide a baseline of understanding to those "not in the know". They are not rules, requirements, or dress codes. Far too many people here have a very difficult time understanding or comprehending these facts of the matter. If they were requirements, they would be stated as such. I myself am having a hard time why people cling to explanations or "guidelines" as hard and fast rules.

 

Well technically there are no rules against cutting in line, or letting a door go in someone's face, or any one of a number of things. As I stated earlier many of us prefer a society in which every little polite thing does not have to be a rule.

 

But for the record I think decent clothes are fine, as long as people don't show up in t-shirts or shorts, or baseball caps.

[Gunner22aa]

Not all cruise lines offer suggestions. Some actually have set rules and enforce them:

 

FORMAL: Dinner jacket, tuxedo or dark suit with tie for gentlemen. A range of gentlemen’s formal wear is available to hire on board. Evening or cocktail dress for ladies.

 

INFORMAL: Jacket required, tie optional for gentlemen. Cocktail dress or stylish separates for ladies. No jeans or shorts. Please see below examples of dress code per cruise. This is a guide only and variations may occur.

 

Cunard and having sailed them people are turned away for not dressing to the required standard. Actually very few are turned away because they know the rules will be enforced and dress appropriatly. Very few gentlemen that I saw were not wearing a tie at dinner.

[tip]

Some folks can accept change. And as evidenced by some of the comments on these boards, some folks cannot.

[Post Captain]

I always thought a cruise was SPECIAL. NOT ANYMORE. SLUMMING around with the bottom of the barrel a lot of the time (especially if there is a CHEAPO price tag). Is there NOTHING special anymore??? Doesn't seem like to me (unless you get invited to the Oscar's or similar).

 

I only ever went on cruises for three reasons:1. to get away from faxes, phones, computers, my daily business life. 2. to see some out of the way place I probably would NOT pay airfare to get to-Manta, Ecuador comes to mind. 3 to get dressed to the nines which is not part of my normal daily life. I spend way too much time in Levi's and t shirts in warehouses, on docks and in and around semi trucks which is the business I own.

 

Sloppy people, sloppy attitudes totally RUINED cruising for us. Last cruise, just before my dear husband passed away-he made the comment "if you really want to get both of us dressed up, guess you either have to join some kind of charity where they have fancy balls and stuff or just throw all those fancy clothes you have away. I'm not going to be mistaken for a waiter again".

 

What a sad comment on today's lifestyle. Down, down, down-how much dumber down can we get our society???

Gina ~

 

I gave up posting on CC dress code threads some time ago, when my wife finally persuaded me that arguing with strangers in cyberspace got me nowhere and only wreaked havoc with my blood pressure, and that there were far better uses of my time. But I wanted to briefly raise my head above the parapet here to tell you that you're not alone in your sentiments on this issue.

 

It might hearten you a bit to watch this little video I shot during the winter crossing of Cunard's Queen Elizabeth this past January. Thankfully there are still some remaining vestiges of style and elegance at sea; you just have to know where to look for them:

 

 

PS. Very sorry to hear about the passing of your husband. I do remember him from the 2006 QE2 winter crossing.

[SeekingSun!]

There are also a lot of highly dramatic drama llamas that make mountains out of molehills.

 

 

Suddenly, if someone doesn't show up in a tux or ball gown to the Geriatric Prom®, it is made out like they are showing up in their dirty undies, a t-shirt with Toe-backy juice stains, a hayseed sticking out of their mouth, a ballcap with a dirty slogan on it, no deodorant, yesterday's ketchup on their chin, and they are probably burning Old Glory in the process.

 

 

I see a lot of people not dressed very formally, but still dressed very nicely. They aren't the scum of the universe, they just don't see the need to get formal. Enjoy your cruise and leave them alone.

 

If they show up in those actual items... report them to the staff immediately... don't complain to people on this forum who can't do a single thing about it.

 

Bahahahaaa!! I just laughed so hard reading this post...'toe-backy'... priceless! oh, and the trademark....:D This seems a bit tongue in cheek, but I have to agree with what you say about reporting to the staff. Rather than make a scene if it's truly inappropriate, like I've seen someone do before, or on the flip side being upset about it inside and never saying anything until you vent on a forum, it's better to just say something, politely, to a staff member, then let it go, enjoy your vacation and have fun! Again, just an opinion, but I've found the only person who can make me upset is me if I let things bug me;)

Edited March 6, 2014 by SeekingSun!

[$hip$hape]

I should have also noted that your thread title will be offensive to some.

 

I'm not sure why some people think its rude not follow guidelines and rules and then casually throw out insulting and rude comments at

people with a different opinion.

A recent study has shown that, as much as facts can change one's opinion;

pretentious attitudes change interpretations of facts.

 

Is it rude to tell someone they are rude?:)

Edited March 6, 2014 by $hip$hape

[ducklite]

The guidelines exist so that people of different backgrounds and cultures have an understanding of the cruise line terminology. What is formal in the Southeast may not be so in the Midwest, let alone in countries from Europe or Asia. The suggestions provide a baseline of understanding to those "not in the know". They are not rules, requirements, or dress codes. Far too many people here have a very difficult time understanding or comprehending these facts of the matter. If they were requirements, they would be stated as such. I myself am having a hard time why people cling to explanations or "guidelines" as hard and fast rules.

 

My point is that they obviously don't care what people wear as long as they have on shirts and shoes, and many people don't pay attention to the guidelines anyhow, so why bother? They should either have a dress code or none--and allow people to figure out on their own what they want to wear.

Edited March 6, 2014 by ducklite

[Sherlock43031]

Bahahahaaa!! I just laughed so hard reading this post...'toe-backy'... priceless! oh, and the trademark....:D This seems a bit tongue in cheek, but I have to agree with what you say about reporting to the staff. Rather than make a scene, like I've seen done before, or being upset about it inside and never saying anything until you vent on a forum, it's better to just say something, politely, to a staff member, then let it go, enjoy your vacation and have fun! Again, just an opinion, but I've found the only person who can make me upset is me if I let things bug me;)

 

do you think the trailer park trash got into the NDR without the staff seeing them?

[obnurse]

It's a commentary about how we've evolved in this country. People used to dress up to take a flight, we dressed for school, church, etc. I can remember my mom dressing us nicely to go to a family picnic or family reunion. My dh has mentioned that he doesn't like you employees dress in hospitals. The nurses don't wear white anymore, they all wear scrubs and sneakers. When I started nursing I wore white, white hose, white shoes and a nursing cap! Imagine that now! Do I think the evolution to casual is good? Nope.....but it is what it is. Jeans in church, butts hanging out in school.........we're stuck with it.

[train460]

Maybe the REAL upperclass, looking down their nose types that insist on wearing their armani suits should just sign up for the captains table dinne so as to avoid the riff-raff?.

again mt 02.

michael

[Desertbelle]

Maybe it isn't that society is getting sloppier, but society is becoming less superficial.

 

With the obvious exceptions of some closed minded and judgmental folks, instead of looking at people only clothing deep, which can give a very false interpretation of the true character of a person, we now let the person show us in his talk and actions his character. I like this.

 

I am getting old (62) but I am not too old to appreciate the new changes in the world. My parents and the people in their generation were very quick to make judgements based on color, race, religion, and even clothing....I am glad that I have lived long enough to see our society begin moving past that.

 

If cruising isn't giving you what you need or making you happy, then move on, find something that makes you happy. It's not anyone's job to make you happy.

 

As for my husband and I, we love cruising the way it is NOW.