Maybe Celebrity Does Have a Plan

[cpj]

It is the type of plan that looks wonderful in presentations, but implementation generally becomes a problem because none of the items get full focus. For example, SPE sounds wonderful, but the implementation in the aqua spa cafe is IMHO just awful. The pick a perk/1-2-3 offers free drinks but most realize it's built into the price...and btw, if you don't pick that perk, you are overpaying because the price increases to cover the cost of the promotion are are based on the drink package. The michael's club for suite guests remains unused because those guests actually like to talk to others so they go to the regular cocktail events. And so on.

 

As long as the ships are full at a higher average profit per cruise, Celebrity will pat themselves on the back. My personal opinion is that they are losing some loyal customers...and they don't even know it...and I don't think they care because in good times, it's easy to fill ships. But there aren't always good times....and at some point, they may well have lost those loyal passengers.

 

The bottom line will tell....

GHStudio As usual you nailed pretty good. I went on NCL Getaway last week and was really impressed with there new ship. Anyway they lost me until they make some major changes in the food at Celebrity. Was really impressed with 22 places to eat and the largest casino I ever saw on a ship.

[ariawoman]

The wifester has Celiac, .

 

I just have to say, I love that you call her "the wifester" lol!

[dbsb3233]

I totally disagree. The drink package was only one of the items that attarcted us to try Celebrity, and we are not "party hearty" as you call it. I may have 3 alcoholic drinks a day. You can't assume the the drink package only attracts this type. People like that will drink with or without a package.

The problem is, the cost of those "free drinks" has to come out of somewhere. We all know that when you offer unlimited free alcohol, there will be some that use up a LOT of $$$ worth of it.

 

The question is, where's the offset for that going to be? Higher base fares? Higher restaurant upcharges? Cost-cutting around the ship?

 

There's no denying that most people think free drinks (especially alcohol) is a great deal. Who wouldn't want free drinks? As long as we don't think about what else it's coming out of.

 

I think overall, a free unlimited alcohol package is an unwise thing to offer. The more often they do this, the more it's likely to attract the type of customers that will use it excessively, racking up $1000+ in costs. As that cost structure to the cruise line rises, they're gonna have to make up for it in other ways. And that will disproportionately hit the customers that don't drink a lot.

[k9x8]

Somehow the OP read a lot more into it than I did. Don't know where it mentioned anything about the drink package, or cut backs in food, or music, or that AQ cabins are I the most undesirable locations.

 

All that I got out of it was the chef explaining some of the new menus and the purpose for them.

🍸🍻

 

Not singling you out - yours is easy to quote.

I'm not surprised the OP has drawn these conclusions, based on more experience Celebrity cruisers' perceptions. Cutbacks, negative effects of the "free" drink package, and the undesirable location of AQ cabins are repeated over and over on this board.

[Oville]

. The michael's club for suite guests remains unused because those guests actually like to talk to others so they go to the regular cocktail events. And so on.

 

The bottom line will tell....

 

How many Michael's Clubs have been converted and where did you get info about the new concierge perk not being used by suites and zenith members?

[Oville]

Not singling you out - yours is easy to quote.

I'm not surprised the OP has drawn these conclusions, based on more experience Celebrity cruisers' perceptions. Cutbacks, negative effects of the "free" drink package, and the undesirable location of AQ cabins are repeated over and over on this board.

 

But the OP used an interview with a Celebrity Chef answering questions about the "Top Chef" upcoming cruises to make his/her point. There was nothing in the interview about "Top Chef" that had a thing to do about the drink packages, AQ cabins, cutbacks let alone perceptions here on CC.

 

Again not sure why the OP used this interview to make points not apparent in the interview.

[wallie5446]

Just returned from the Celebrity 'Event' in Dallas tonight. It is very safe to report that at 60 we were some of the youngest there in the 700-800 guest.

[Host Jazzbeau]

It isn't a ridiculous statement. I didn't take the OP to be suggesting that everyone who takes the drink package is a "party hardy" type. I understood them to say the "party hardy" types would be more attracted to Celebrity than they were in the past due to to drink package perk. Which, logically, sounds like it's probably accurate. It may well also be an attraction to other types of drinkers too, but it's hard to argue that it would not be attractive to "party hardy" types.

 

Subsequent posters seem to have taken offense thinking if they took the drink package the OP was labeling them "party hardy" types, and I don't believe that is the case at all.

 

You are correct.

--OP

[Oville]

You are correct.

--OP

 

Thanks for posting Jazzbeau but the interview was about Celebrity's deal with "Top Chef" nothing to do with your observations. What gives?

[ghstudio]

How many Michael's Clubs have been converted and where did you get info about the new concierge perk not being used by suites and zenith members?

 

First hand experience on the infinity...and talking to suite and zenith members at the elite cocktail event...and posts here on cc.

 

I don't know how many have been converted...and they apparently have different hours as reported here as well. It's inconsistent....why is this not a surprise?

[Oville]

First hand experience on the infinity...and talking to suite and zenith members at the elite cocktail event...and posts here on cc.

 

I don't know how many have been converted...and they apparently have different hours as reported here as well. It's inconsistent....why is this not a surprise?

 

I was on the Century for 11 days, which I believe was the first to convert. The Zenith members I met were thrilled with the change and loved the new Michael's Club. Once converted they do not have different hours, I think you are referring to the old Michael's Club.

 

You've only been on one ship, why ever did you make the unfortunate negative statement regarding this new perk? The ships are changing over this month and hopefully we'll hear some feedback soon. Perhaps you are right and all those Zenith folks on Century were wrong.

 

Sorry, but you've trashed the new perk. I'll be interested so see how many suites and Zenith agree with you.

Edited March 14, 2014 by Oville

[ghstudio]

I was on the Century for 11 days, which I believe was the first to convert. The Zenith members I met were thrilled with the change and loved the new Michael's Club. Once converted they do not have different hours, I think you are referring to the old Michael's Club.

 

You've only been on one ship, why ever did you make the unfortunate negative statement regarding this new perk? The ships are changing over this month and hopefully we'll hear some feedback soon. Perhaps you are right and all those Zenith folks on Century were wrong.

 

Sorry, but you've trashed the new perk. I'll be interested so see how many suites and Zenith agree with you.

 

http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showpost.php?p=41727434&postcount=9

 

So far we have michael's club on the century dedicated 24 hours (see the above post) and on the infinity where it was reserved until 7PM on the 2/16 cruise (that's last month). You might also check http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showpost.php?p=42033467&postcount=25 because apparently it's not even consistent on the infinity. I think that pretty much supports my assertion that they actually do have different/inconsistent hours.

 

As far as feedback, I've only been on the infinity since the new mission for michaels' club...and i can only report what I saw (I think the most I ever saw in there at one time was 2) and what I heard from some suite guests during the cocktail hours (I guess you'll have to trust me on that).

 

I'm not trashing it....I'm just reporting on how it appears to be working as reported here and experienced so far.

Edited March 14, 2014 by ghstudio

[Host Jazzbeau]

Thanks for posting Jazzbeau but the interview was about Celebrity's deal with "Top Chef" nothing to do with your observations. What gives?

 

The interview was only the spark to a thought process I was trying [obviously badly] to reflect in the post.

 

I have been reading so many complaints on this forum about cutbacks in food and music, about loud music, about cutbacks in Elite perks, about changes in the Captains Club, etc. -- that I have begun to question whether my 2015 bookings were a mistake.

 

I have also been having trouble figuring out what Celebrity thinks they are doing with all these changes.

 

The interview with the chef gave me the idea [it wasn't in the article, it was an original thought that I had] that maybe all these recent changes are not just random floudering by a clueless leadership team but actually fit into a pattern where each change is designed to appeal to a particular segment of target audience.

 

I'm not sure that my idea is correct [that's why I said "I think"], and even if I'm right I'm not sure it will work. But it makes me feel better about Celebrity than thinking they only want "young, affluent Americans in urban areas like New York City, Los Angeles and Chicago" as mentioned in the CC news item about Cruise Shipping Miami -- which would leave me out.

 

So the intent of the post was to be positive.

 

I still don't know if Celebrity wants me as a customer. But after the instant flaming on this thread, it seems pretty clear that many of Celebrity's loyal passengers don't want me to join them.

 

Sorry for intruding on a private party.

[Oville]

http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showpost.php?p=41727434&postcount=9

 

So far we have michael's club on the century dedicated 24 hours (see the above post) and on the infinity where it was reserved until 7PM on the 2/16 cruise (that's last month). You might also check http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showpost.php?p=42033467&postcount=25 because apparently it's not even consistent on the infinity. I think that pretty much supports my assertion that they actually do have different/inconsistent hours.

 

As far as feedback, I've only been on the infinity since the new mission for michaels' club...and i can only report what I saw (I think the most I ever saw in there at one time was 2) and what I heard from some suite guests during the cocktail hours (I guess you'll have to trust me on that).

 

I'm not trashing it....I'm just reporting on how it appears to be working as reported here and experienced so far.

 

So based on your one cruise, what? Your earlier comment was about Michael's Club remaining unused after the conversion for suites and Zenith members.

[Biker19]

There's no denying that most people think free drinks (especially alcohol) is a great deal. Who wouldn't want free drinks? As long as we don't think about what else it's coming out of.

 

I think overall, a free unlimited alcohol package is an unwise thing to offer. The more often they do this, the more it's likely to attract the type of customers that will use it excessively, racking up $1000+ in costs. As that cost structure to the cruise line rises, they're gonna have to make up for it in other ways. And that will disproportionately hit the customers that don't drink a lot.

 

But that's the thing, that $1000+ beverage package "costs" Celebrity less than $100. And as you said, that free perk is what brings folks (maybe one of the demographics Celebrity is going for) onboard. Do you think it's a coincidence that as the number of given away beverage packages has gone up the number of servers to give away those beverages has gone down? I not sure what's saving Celebrity more money: cutting back on servers to save salaries, or cutting back on the the number of people giving away freebies. ;)

Edited March 14, 2014 by kemenyg

[Orator]

Back to the topic: Celebrity does have a plan. The goal of the plan is to raise profits in order to increase the bottomline. After all, Celebrity and its parent company, RCL are public, for profit companies.

Now,do they have a plan for accomplishing their goal? Appears to meto be a "yes".

They appear to be developing a focus on attracting the high spending, high profit passenger. The newly announced top suite perks(unlimited internet, premium drink packages,Michael's Club, etc.will all come at a price. Look for fares to increase not only to cover the costs of the new perks, but add a bit of profit as well. My Crystal Ball, without any direct evidence to support it, tells me that they will probaby make a Classic Drink Package,or some version of it, standard and increase cabin price to cover cost and use that as an incentive to get people to upgrade to a Premium Package at a higher price and profit margin. There have been and will continue to be cost reductions gained from staffing changes.They will also control costs by ending things like the Brunch. They've done this on Connie cruises already. This is a plan and a direction. Only time will tell if it's the best plan and best direction. Of course, this is all my opinion and others may differ.

[richsea]

The interview was only the spark to a thought process I was trying [obviously badly] to reflect in the post.

 

I have been reading so many complaints on this forum about cutbacks in food and music, about loud music, about cutbacks in Elite perks, about changes in the Captains Club, etc. -- that I have begun to question whether my 2015 bookings were a mistake.

 

I have also been having trouble figuring out what Celebrity thinks they are doing with all these changes.

 

The interview with the chef gave me the idea [it wasn't in the article, it was an original thought that I had] that maybe all these recent changes are not just random floudering by a clueless leadership team but actually fit into a pattern where each change is designed to appeal to a particular segment of target audience.

 

I'm not sure that my idea is correct [that's why I said "I think"], and even if I'm right I'm not sure it will work. But it makes me feel better about Celebrity than thinking they only want "young, affluent Americans in urban areas like New York City, Los Angeles and Chicago" as mentioned in the CC news item about Cruise Shipping Miami -- which would leave me out.

 

So the intent of the post was to be positive.

 

I still don't know if Celebrity wants me as a customer. But after the instant flaming on this thread, it seems pretty clear that many of Celebrity's loyal passengers don't want me to join them.

 

Sorry for intruding on a private party.

 

Perhaps it was the way that you framed the original post. I know when I read it, & followed the link to the interview, I expected to see the subjects in your post be expanded upon by the Celebrity chef. Instead, what I read was a food interview. You were certainly not clear in your original post, that you were only posting your opinion. Had you made that more clear, I think you would have gotten a different response from many.

Also, as a CC host, I would hope that you have a thicker skin than that.

[dbsb3233]

But that's the thing, that $1000+ beverage package "costs" Celebrity less than $100. And as you said, that free perk is what brings folks (maybe one of the demographics Celebrity is going for) onboard. Do you think it's a coincidence that as the number of given away beverage packages has gone up the number of servers to give away those beverages has gone down? I not sure what's saving Celebrity more money: cutting back on servers to save salaries, or cutting back on the the number of people giving away freebies. ;)

While my understanding is that alcohol sales are a cruise line's biggest (sometimes ONLY) profit center, I suspect it's not quite up in the 900% range. As you alluded to, the cost structure to serve drinks includes a lot more than the cost of the alcohol, it includes the servers, and the deliveries to the ports, and the taxes, and the storage, and the facilities, etc. etc.

 

We also have to remember that the "cost" to such a promo isn't just what it costs to provide those drinks, it also includes the loss of alcohol sales revenue that they'd be getting if people didn't have the free package. And that may be the biggest cost of all, considering how some people rack up HUGE alcohol bills on these cruise ships.

[dbsb3233]

Back to the topic: Celebrity does have a plan. The goal of the plan is to raise profits in order to increase the bottomline. After all, Celebrity and its parent company, RCL are public, for profit companies.

Now,do they have a plan for accomplishing their goal? Appears to meto be a "yes".

They appear to be developing a focus on attracting the high spending, high profit passenger. The newly announced top suite perks(unlimited internet, premium drink packages,Michael's Club, etc.will all come at a price. Look for fares to increase not only to cover the costs of the new perks, but add a bit of profit as well. My Crystal Ball, without any direct evidence to support it, tells me that they will probaby make a Classic Drink Package,or some version of it, standard and increase cabin price to cover cost and use that as an incentive to get people to upgrade to a Premium Package at a higher price and profit margin. There have been and will continue to be cost reductions gained from staffing changes.They will also control costs by ending things like the Brunch. They've done this on Connie cruises already. This is a plan and a direction. Only time will tell if it's the best plan and best direction. Of course, this is all my opinion and others may differ.

I would guess they would have a hard time trying to roll beverage packages into the base cruise fare. That would make their base cruise fares uncompetitive with other cruise lines in their general cruise category.

 

Now, if they were trying to shift into being a "premium" cruise line like some of the high-end small ship companies, maybe that would work. But I'd think that would need to be all or nothing. Cater totally to them, or to the general cruising public. But just "creeping" there with higher base fares than the competition seems like a recipe for failure, as most customers would find such higher base fares uncompetitive and immediately look elsewhere. With ships this size, I don't think they could afford to do that.

[Orator]

I would guess they would have a hard time trying to roll beverage packages into the base cruise fare. That would make their base cruise fares uncompetitive with other cruise lines in their general cruise category.

 

Now, if they were trying to shift into being a "premium" cruise line like some of the high-end small ship companies, maybe that would work. But I'd think that would need to be all or nothing. Cater totally to them, or to the general cruising public. But just "creeping" there with higher base fares than the competition seems like a recipe for failure, as most customers would find such higher base fares uncompetitive and immediately look elsewhere. With ships this size, I don't think they could afford to do that.

 

Yes, and that's the risk they might be taking if they increase fares in a way that makes them non competitive with the non premium lines. I've heard some say that they are leaving Celebrity for Oceania.Don't know the numbers, but that could be the audience that Celebrity needs to lure back. Have heard some Senior Staff on several ships say that Celebrity customers are telling them on comment cards that they want Celebrity to become"alli nclusive". I would disagree with this approach, but many have posted in the past they they favor that direction. "This is what customers are telling us" seems now to be the company line to justify any change.

[harz99]

The day Celebrity go all inclusive will be the day I stop sailing with them. I well remember enjoying Azamara until they went AI with huge price increases, never sailed with them since.

 

Sent from my GT-I9300 using Forums mobile app

[hcat]

so far we are sticking with Celebrity but cruising less frequently... hoping the loud and rap music stops, and peace and quiet returns to the outdoor pool for early in the day... we will then book more again

 

the drinks packages do indeed attract folks for many reasons. I do not drink but love the teas etc and all in a cabin must have it--so it pays for us so dh can get his beer and whatever else.. anyhow....we would not pay extra for it-- only get it if its a perk..while giving up some OBC.

 

However , I agree with OP that there is a signifcant core that has crossed to Celeb b/c of drinks package from other lines (you can read their cruise histories at bottom of posts), and they sure do seem to get their money's worth...last few roll calls have been more about the drinks than the cruising! fortunately we have not observed bad behavior on board .....

 

we love AQ and BLU and would never be happy going back to MDR.. It is very true as OP says that many of these cabins are not in the best location under an active deck--same strategy as was undertaken to entice folks to take the overhang cabins on M class-- they created Concierge class and filled them!!

 

Life is ever evolving so we'll see how Celeb can deliver a great cruise and stay special!!! Better music would be a good start...

Edited March 15, 2014 by hcat

[gimletgal]

[quote name=Waterlily777

On several occasions' date=' Michael Bayley has said that he felt that Celebrity fares were too low and that he intended to drive them up, and so he has. When you add cutbacks in product and service to higher prices, I think that can be a very volatile combination. Stir into the mix those initiatives that are intended to change the onboard culture in an significant way, and the results may be unpredictable.

 

I think that Celebrity cruisers, by and large, are well-travelled, discerning people, with a broad world-view, regardless of their age or other demographic factors. I don't think that Celebrity can keep cutting back while raising prices with this group of people. And who is this group that Celebrity thinks it is marketing to...an inexhaustible supply of 40-somethings that stay at the Ritz Carlton, cruise 3-4 times a year, enjoy music all over the ship that is uncomfortably loud, and who don't notice, or don't care, when prices go up while product and service standards diminish. All the 40-somethings that I know are much smarter and more worldly-wise than that. They enjoy quality and good value too, and they know it when they see it. (And you know what, they are all at the peak of their careers, working really, really hard, and don't have time for 3-4 cruises a year. Now those 50-somethings, they are another issue ;). And I don't know what the panic is anyway, those 40-somethings will be 50-somethings soon enough. :D)

 

I don't think Celebrity can be all things to all people, and I think some of the recent changes are simply not helpful. The bulk of these changes will not attract any of the 40-somethings that I know, but do run the risk of alienating much of the current loyal client base. I would like say that I am encouraged by Celebrity's intention, reported by "Celebrity Cruises", (the official Celebrity rep to these boards), that they are prepared to review the loudness-of-the-music issue. And I do commend them on the content of the revisions to the Captain's Club loyalty program.

 

Excellent post, waterlily777! I have not sailed with Celebrity for almost a year now and am anxious to experience all of the "changes" next month when I spend 10 nights on the Constellation. I will board with an open mind and am hoping that "changes" have not been such that I will no longer count X as being my #1 cruise line.

[wallie5446]

so far we are sticking with Celebrity but cruising less frequently... hoping the loud and rap music stops, and peace and quiet returns to the outdoor pool for early in the day... we will then book more again

 

the drinks packages do indeed attract folks for many reasons. I do not drink but love the teas etc and all in a cabin must have it--so it pays for us so dh can get his beer and whatever else.. anyhow....we would not pay extra for it-- only get it if its a perk..while giving up some OBC.

 

However , I agree with OP that there is a signifcant core that has crossed to Celeb b/c of drinks package from other lines (you can read their cruise histories at bottom of posts), and they sure do seem to get their money's worth...last few roll calls have been more about the drinks than the cruising! fortunately we have not observed bad behavior on board .....

 

we love AQ and BLU and would never be happy going back to MDR.. It is very true as OP says that many of these cabins are not in the best location under an active deck--same strategy as was undertaken to entice folks to take the overhang cabins on M class-- they created Concierge class and filled them!!

 

Life is ever evolving so we'll see how Celeb can deliver a great cruise and stay special!!! Better music would be a good start...

We so look forward to sailing with ya'll in Nov on the 11 day Equinox, you will find most if not all of the opinions are unfounded.

[hcat]

Fortunately for us we sail frequently on the Celeb ships..(now mostly S class) and have done so for many years.

 

Our opinions are formed by our own experiences... Every cruise is a bit different and diff to each cruiser as well. But it is fun to chat about it.

 

we look forward to sailing with you too--we have a friendly roll call going!