Delta Bankruptcy

[Globaliser]

Even with a 15% reduction of domestic capacity, it pretty negligible with a network the size of Delta's.

For the peace of mind of Jimbo in Ma., the OP, would it be fair to say that not all of the 15% reduction would happen at once, anyway? It'll be done over a period of time, which means that his October flights should still be reasonably safe.

[eroller]

For the peace of mind of Jimbo in Ma., the OP, would it be fair to say that not all of the 15% reduction would happen at once, anyway? It'll be done over a period of time, which means that his October flights should still be reasonably safe.

 

 

I would say you are absolutely correct. Delta's October schedule is already finalized, crews have their schedules, etc. I don't see a lot changing.

 

Even if some flights are canceled (after October), it's not like Delta is going out of business so you won't be left stranded. You will be protected on another Delta flight or given other options.

 

My best advise is to confirm and reconfirm those flight arrangements. The vast majority of people will not be affected, but it's possible that some people might have flight changes as things move forward.

 

Ernie

 

ps - OT but is anyone else absolutely frustrated with these boards? Half the time you can't get on, and whenever I try to "reply with quote" it locks up my internet explorer. I think I'm going to have to take a break posting until they get it cleared up.

[DanJ]

I would assume when an airline states it's "owns" a plane, that it might actually be mortgaged?

 

Ernie

 

An official from NW earlier this year (admitedly, in the $40-$45 oil times) said, when asked why they still fly the old DC-9's, paraphrasing,"We own them outright. No loans or leases. They are an economical plane to use in the markets we do when we don't have to pay ownership costs".

[nosnobunny]

I'm another one with an October flight booked. If I was flying a major route, I wouldn't be the least bit concerned. However, I am flying Buffalo to Melbourne FL. Am I concerned? Ohhh just a wee bit. At least it's driveable if need be. :(

Beth

[Lois R]

Hi, I will be checking my flights again for sure Ernie;) Just checked again.

They are there.

 

And to your other question.......

YES, YES, YES, the boards have been AWFUL lately:eek:

I post on my upcoming Roll Call and sometimes on the fashion boards

but that is about it:rolleyes:.

It is definitely frustrating.

[hdawson]

http://www.forbes.com/markets/2005/09/14/airlines-bankruptcy-delta-air-0914markets15.html?partner=aoltix

 

Interesting.

 

EDIT: Just received CNN News Update and ABC. Delta files.

 

WSJ says that SONG also filed. I would have thought they would be included with DAL.

 

News breaking fast. Looks like Northwest also filed.

[twscott1961]

Hello,

 

For the most part, I don't understand the details about all of this. All I know is we have a flight out of CVG this Saturday to JFK to Barcelona. I wonder if we will make it? I felt pretty good about it, till I read some of your posts. Only time will tell. In our area Delta is a main carrier, and we would hate to lose it. By the way, we return Venice to JFK to CVG on 10/01/05. If we can't make it back we will just stay in Italy, and that would'nt hurt my feelings at all!

[kenandlaura06]

I will just continue to check my Song flights regularly.

[Globaliser]

News breaking fast. Looks like Northwest also filed.

Please remind me not to go to Meriill Lynch the next time I need investment advice!

Merrill said a Northwest Airlines bankruptcy isn't as likely as the other two, but is nonetheless growing in probability and would support a call for the removal of 100 to 200 aircraft from the domestic market due to record high fuel prices.

 

"We now estimate 60% probability of [a] Northwest Chapter 11 filing prior to Oct. 17," Merrill said.

Puh-leeze! It was almost a done deal over the weekend and pretty muhch a dead cert after Monday's defaults. :D

[kenandlaura06]

Please remind me not to go to Meriill Lynch the next time I need investment advice!Puh-leeze! It was almost a done deal over the weekend and pretty muhch a dead cert after Monday's defaults. :D

 

Yeah, good advice from Merrill!

[gambit57]

Glad to hear others think the October flights won't change much. That's all I care about really. I'm flying LAX to ATL (Delta's hub) and then ATL to FLL. I can't imagine Delta cutting those flights. After my flight, I could care less if all the legacy carriers went under.

 

In California, Southwest is a viable option to anywhere I fly. If bankruptcy lets the legacy carriers to copy Southwest, I think that's a great thing for passengers.

[Lois R]

Hi Codex:)

Quote

 

"Glad to hear others think the October flights won't change much. That's all I care about really. I'm flying LAX to ATL (Delta's hub) and then ATL to FLL. I can't imagine Delta cutting those flights. After my flight, I could care less if all the legacy carriers went under."

 

I am flying your route the other way. Jacksonville to ATL to LAX~lets hope

we both are able to fly!;)

 

Did you receive an email from Delta? I got one today saying flights and itineraries are still in place.

 

I will be checking more often than not though. I leave 3 weeks from Sunday!

[WASUP]

I have not gotten an email from Delta and we fly with them 11-16...any reason?

[Lois R]

Hi, do you have your email set up with them? It was probably a "form email"

(it was) and at the end there was a comment about not replying back to it.

[gracecarmo]

How does one set up emails from Delta? We have flights in Oct. and I have to keep checking their web site daily for any updates. Would be easy if they would contact me...

 

Grace

[caviargal]

How does one set up emails from Delta? We have flights in Oct. and I have to keep checking their web site daily for any updates. Would be easy if they would contact me...

 

Grace

 

Are you a Skymiles member? If so, make certain your email address is on file and also entered into your flight record.

 

I get constant emails from DL.

 

CG

[greatam]

In California, Southwest is a viable option to anywhere I fly. If bankruptcy lets the legacy carriers to copy Southwest, I think that's a great thing for passengers.

 

If the legacy carriers copy Southwest, a lot of business flyers, myself included, will REVOLT.

 

I do NOT want to be treated as if I am on a bus. I like the airport clubs. I like the priority check in lines for elite status FF.

 

I absolutely HATE the idea of self seating. I hate the attitudes of a lot of Southwest passengers. A lot act no better than if they were on Greyhound. Lots of drunks, stupid people pleading to be let on the plane when they are late to the airport, arguments ALL the time with the gate agents, ticket agents, etc. And their prices certainly are NO bargain. The cheap fares are usually sold out within days of schedule being available.

 

I have to fly PHX/Los Angeles a few times a month, usually with no notice. I could drive-I am almost halfway between PHX and Ontario. Sometimes I do. And sometimes I have to fly. America West gets most of my business. When I do fly Southwest, I grit my teeth. It is an ORDEAL. If time allows, I will fly AA through Dallas, just to get to LA, and ALWAYS at a better price than Southwest.

 

Maybe Southwest works for the leisure flyer, but it sure doesn't work for this business traveler.

 

Globaliser,

 

I just read this morning's Transport Topics. Northwest filed MAINLY to unload the pension liability and relieve the mechanic's union fight. Evidently not so much lack of operating capital.

 

Sure puts AA and Continental in unfavorable positions. I would hate to think that bankruptcy filings are being made simply to unload pensions onto us the taxpayers. But it certainly seems that that is much the case.

[gambit57]

Hi Codex:)

 

I am flying your route the other way. Jacksonville to ATL to LAX~lets hope

we both are able to fly!;)

 

Did you receive an email from Delta? I got one today saying flights and itineraries are still in place.

 

I will be checking more often than not though. I leave 3 weeks from Sunday!

 

No e-mails. Only e-mail I ever got from them was when I booked the tickets confirming my reservation. I just check the website pretty much daily to make sure nothing has changed. They've gotta have my e-mail since they've e-mailed me once already, but I haven't gotten anything since. Keeping my fingers crossed for all of us.

 

greatam: sorry to hear you've had such bad experience. Guess you're a heavy frequent flier. I fly SW for business too, mainly cuz they're so convenient and easy to deal with when changes are needed. I'm not a heavy flier though. Most routes have a very orderly time schedule and i've found it generally quite easy to fly standby or simply change my reservation when flying during business hours. It only gets full and harder during weekends and early mornings/nights in my experience. All the complaints you've had about SW (rude guests, nasty employees, etc) have been my experience on the legacy carriers (United, Delta, American, etc). It'd be nice to be able to pick seats and maybe have a lounge, but considering how much less hassle I get from them otherwise, I live with it. We just have vastly different experiences I guess.

[Globaliser]

Globaliser,

 

I just read this morning's Transport Topics. Northwest filed MAINLY to unload the pension liability and relieve the mechanic's union fight. Evidently not so much lack of operating capital.

 

Sure puts AA and Continental in unfavorable positions. I would hate to think that bankruptcy filings are being made simply to unload pensions onto us the taxpayers. But it certainly seems that that is much the case.

If so, it's a shocking abuse of Chapter 11. Almost worse than UA's residence there for almost 3 years.

 

I also find it very distasteful that a company can choose to dump its pension liabilities and yet stay in business. You would have thought that the minimum requirement for a company to leave its liabilities to a residual public sector guarantor would be that it has gone out of business, not that it simply chooses not to play ball any more.

[mommyto2girls]

We fly Song all the time and 2 weeks ago they changed our flights from LGA to Tampa in November to stopover flights in Atlanta, we would have had no knowledge of this except I went on line to pick my seats with my skymiles number. I called and asked why we were not notified of the cancellation of our original flight and the change to the stopover in Atlanta. They told me we would have been notified 2 weeks before our flight which is their policy. The irony of this is that there is an earlier flight that day non-stop that we were not even given the option to take. I argued for about 5 minutes and we were re-booked on the non-stop flight. Bottom line..keep checking your flights.

[chipster]

According to one board member on Flyertalk.com, changes are showing up for December and beyond. I checked our February flight to Cancun and the flight numbers and times are different, but not by much. Although it doesn't show on our actual itinerary yet. I would imagine these changes will take a little time to get into the system, but definitely keep checking your flights. And remember, if the schedules change drastically, you can get a full refund.

[greatam]

If so, it's a shocking abuse of Chapter 11. Almost worse than UA's residence there for almost 3 years.

 

I also find it very distasteful that a company can choose to dump its pension liabilities and yet stay in business. You would have thought that the minimum requirement for a company to leave its liabilities to a residual public sector guarantor would be that it has gone out of business, not that it simply chooses not to play ball any more.

 

Globaliser,

 

The abuse goes on all the time in the transportation business. Consolidated Freightways was probably the largest abuser. Dumped huge teamster pensions onto the US taxpayer and some to the Union.

 

Before they filed Chapter 7, CF started a new company-Conway (CWX). Non-union, 401K's instead of pensions, etc. etc. Same equipment, different signage. In fact, at one of their auctions, a "non-affiliated company" purchased docks and equipment and LEASED it to Conway.

 

I have seen trucking companies file on a Friday and within 2 weeks, start a new company.One guy in Iowa I personally know has bankrupted 5 companies in 20 years. He currently has 47 trucks, hauling meat, running coast to coast.

 

And the railroads road bankruptcy laws to glory in the 80's.

 

If they were a union company, they all dumped their pensions.

[DanJ]

According to one board member on Flyertalk.com, changes are showing up for December and beyond. I checked our February flight to Cancun and the flight numbers and times are different, but not by much. Although it doesn't show on our actual itinerary yet. I would imagine these changes will take a little time to get into the system, but definitely keep checking your flights. And remember, if the schedules change drastically, you can get a full refund.

 

Yeah, fortunately I caught that news this morning. Nothing really drastic for us, although at first, their website wasn't showing any flights from Flint to Cincinatti. Almost was ready to change to an Atlanta connection. This afternoon I was able to get things straightened away, at least until the next changes. The CVG-LAX flights have been changed to 737-800's from 757's, so we had to pick new seats.

 

For the flight home, our ATL-FNT flights leaves an hour earlier than before, so that's a bonus, as it will be a long day anyway, with a 2 hour drive home after.

 

I'm not bothering to print these tickets out yet though, since I'm sure there will be another dozen or so changes by then LOL.

[dog]

When I spoke to a Delta agent today she told me they were re scheduling flights & times etc. and to call back Monday to do my seat selection, as things would be changing for my March flight ( Toronto-Atlanta-San Juan )

[Globaliser]

I hear that the situation is so dire that in their in-flight magazine this month, they couldn't afford to print the last nine clues to the crossword puzzle. ;)