What would you do about "scaled back" cruise?

[sail7seas]

Most of the mass cruise lines do this and have done so for years. Large groups bring in a lot of money and that is always the bottom line. The cruise that we encountered the worst experience from a huge group was a number of years ago and nothing has changed. We have experienced other somewhat smaller groups through the years which were a little bothersome but not extremely so.

 

Ads to asking the group leader what they thought would be impact of their group on other guests not a part of their group. I'd be very surprised if it was even a consideration for them. Their focus is getting the best price and most benefits for their group. They are not particularly concerned about anyone not in their group.

 

Edited July 20, 2015 by sail7seas

[Khaos WolfKat]

Can't believe it was so disappointing. Sailing up the inside passage is like sailing through a painting that gets prettier by the day. Then a chance to land on glaciers, take a floatplane, catch a salmon or Halibut. Watch whales breaching

See eagles sitting in trees. Etc etc

 

Sitting in a theater listening to a lecturer and missing the above?

 

Did you do anything on this cruise?

 

People cruise for many different reasons. Lots of people can't afford to book excursions or choose not to for other reasons, and count on the on-board activities, which are advertised as being available as part of the experience being paid for, to take the place of these optional outings. Additionally, there are only so many hours in a day that most people want to watch the sights.

 

The bottom line is that when a company promises you a specific set of options/activities, for which you pay, and then makes said things unavailable to you for no good reason, there is a huge problem.

 

Why do you feel the need to belittle the OP for being upset at not being able to spend their vacation, that they paid for, as they liked and were promised that they could?

[Wakepatrol]

People cruise for many different reasons. Lots of people can't afford to book excursions or choose not to for other reasons, and count on the on-board activities, which are advertised as being available as part of the experience being paid for, to take the place of these optional outings. Additionally, there are only so many hours in a day that most people want to watch the sights.

 

The bottom line is that when a company promises you a specific set of options/activities, for which you pay, and then makes said things unavailable to you for no good reason, there is a huge problem.

 

Why do you feel the need to belittle the OP for being upset at not being able to spend their vacation, that they paid for, as they liked and were promised that they could?

 

Never mind just call it a mulligan and give him his whole fare back.

[hattack]

In order to feed the expanded capacity of cabin berths & vessels....cruise lines are marketing their product to "non traditional " potential guests (who might not consider cruising as a vacation option) utilizing affinity group bookings...any large group that can generate more than 30% of a ships capacity on any given sailing...is potentially a future prospect for a much more lucrative full charter....the other by product is that the cruise lines track how many of the 1st timers onboard due to the group, return as regular guests for future sailings

 

The other marketing tool that cruise lines are using to increase share is the introduction of the next generation state of the art mega ships (i.e. NCL Breakaway Class or RCI Quantum Class) which are designed to offer multiple dining options, smaller public venues for better utilization, more entertainment options and volume discounts which will appeal to both large groups and individual bookings...if 1 venue is reserved on the Getaway, there are still 18 other options to choose from so the case of someone being "denied" access to a specific venue due to a group reserving it for a private event, becomes less potent....

 

Large groups are almost always handle by experienced TA's who by working with the cruise lines will benefit sell large groups to mega ships because of the greater number of options it offers to the group members along with the common affinity theme during the week of sailing...this leaves older ships like the Westerdam, which has fewer venues and guest options to appeal to much smaller groups and those individuals looking for the "traditional" sailing experience of past decades

[philsuarez]

I was about to state the obvious and suggest that if you can't beat them then join them. This would give you full access to everything. After doing some research I then discovered that Inspiration are a Christian travel group. Each to their own but this really would not appeal to me.

[SoCal Cruiser78]

Sadly what you describe happens on most main line cruise companies and it a great inconvenience to those not a part of the group...What irks me is even is directly asked, most cruise lines will not answer directly and advise how large the group is or usually will not even confirm there is a group. The reason for that is obvious...

 

I have experienced a greatly scaled back cruise due to a large group also. Many public areas such as the library, lounges, theatre, etc. didn't have the usual onboard activities (movies, bridge, etc.) as these rooms were used for group meetings and activities. In addition, large outdoor areas (decks and pools) were blocked off as well.

 

I personally feel that cruise lines should have to announce groups that are large enough to be occupying ANY normally available venues exclusively, or having special privileges such as priority boarding. IMO, pax in the group should be paying a premium for these benefits, and those not in the group should have a similar reduction in their fares.

 

Shame on the cruise lines for making it so difficult for us to determine if a cruise we are contemplating spending our hard-earned money and vacation time on will be diminished by a large group :(.

 

I will get off my soapbox now :).

[SoCal Cruiser78]

To the OPs question; I would itemize the events and venues that you would normally have attended and utilized and couldn't, and assign a % value to each of your total fare. I other words, if the total of "missed" activities and unavailable venues subjectively reduced your enjoyment of a $5000 cruise by 20%, then ask for a $1000 refund.

 

I have no idea how HAL will respond, but at least you are presenting them with a well-considered proposal, and giving them an idea of what would be acceptable to you.

[Khaos WolfKat]

To the OPs question; I would itemize the events and venues that you would normally have attended and utilized and couldn't, and assign a % value to each of your total fare. I other words, if the total of "missed" activities and unavailable venues subjectively reduced your enjoyment of a $5000 cruise by 20%, then ask for a $1000 refund.

 

I have no idea how HAL will respond, but at least you are presenting them with a well-considered proposal, and giving them an idea of what would be acceptable to you.

 

I think this is one of the best ideas yet!

[cruz chic]

To the OPs question; I would itemize the events and venues that you would normally have attended and utilized and couldn't, and assign a % value to each of your total fare. I other words, if the total of "missed" activities and unavailable venues subjectively reduced your enjoyment of a $5000 cruise by 20%, then ask for a $1000 refund.

 

I have no idea how HAL will respond, but at least you are presenting them with a well-considered proposal, and giving them an idea of what would be acceptable to you.

 

My guess is that the op might see something like an obc for a future cruise for something on the $200 to $250 range. I'd be shocked if it was anything more but I'd be happy to be wrong.

[Fouremco]

Ads to asking the group leader what they thought would be impact of their group on other guests not a part of their group. I'd be very surprised if it was even a consideration for them. Their focus is getting the best price and most benefits for their group. They are not particularly concerned about anyone not in their group.

I have personal experience contacting the organizer of a group sailing on the same cruise and I found her to be very helpful. She fully understood my concerns and addressed all of the issues openly. Clearly, the organizer's focus must be on the needs of the group, but that doesn't mean that they are oblivious to the potential impact on other passengers. I would never attempt to have an organizer change plans to lessen the impact of the group on my cruise activities, but I wouldn't hesitate to contact a group to gather information.

[sail7seas]

I think this is one of the best ideas yet!

 

I think that a great idea. :)

 

 

 

 

 

I have personal experience contacting the organizer of a group sailing on the same cruise and I found her to be very helpful. She fully understood my concerns and addressed all of the issues openly. Clearly, the organizer's focus must be on the needs of the group, but that doesn't mean that they are oblivious to the potential impact on other passengers. I would never attempt to have an organizer change plans to lessen the impact of the group on my cruise activities, but I wouldn't hesitate to contact a group to gather information.

 

 

 

When we went to Crows Nest the first night of our cruise, the organizer of the group was standing in the doorway as we walked up the stairs. Organizer saw we were not wearing group identity badges and told us we did not belong there, were not welcome and should leave immediately. I do not consider that to be understanding, cooperative, or helpful. The message was made very clear. I will not share what followed. :D

 

Edited July 20, 2015 by sail7seas

[kazu]

I can just imagine what followed ;)

[hattack]

In my experience in being a part of a large Jazz group on a regular sailing on several occassions, the CD staff and the Group leader work together to miniumize the impact for all sides...on a regular sailing, most public venue rooms are dark after 1130 pm and most bars & discos have very few guests past midnight....most of our Jazz concerts and activities were scheduled to start after 11 pm...the CD assigned members of the cruise staff to nicely explain the situation, the overwhelming number of guests who were up at that late hour understood and quickly realized by finding a seat outside of the venue they could enjoy the music and having a waiter bring them a drink....the lagniappe was on full days at sea, our group slept in late (11 am) which left the lido deck buffett and pool empty for use by the guests that were not a part of our Jazz group

 

Human nature, being what it is, there were only a **few** loud complaing guests (who as it turned out are not Jazz fans) who demanded compensation in the form of OBC towards their S&S account because they were "denied" access to a venue that would have been dark and empty anyway...go figure...if a group reserves an area for a private event, that opens up other areas of the ship that are less congested

 

It just so happen we had to skip our final port due to high seas and the CD was forced to improvise a last minute schedule for an unplanned full day at sea...the Jazz Musicians offered to do a free performance and some music related workshops in the atrium for **all ** guests in the spirit of teamwork (very well received by the non Jazz group guest that attended)....funny aspect I saw a few of the same complainers from earlier in the week, at the guests service desk complaining that they were "denied" access

of the use of the atrium so they could sit and enjoy the silence...my point, try as one might, the poor CD can't 100% please all guests but they try very hard every week to find common ground

[doublebzz]

...my point, try as one might, the poor CD can't 100% please all guests but they try very hard every week to find common ground

 

Wasn't it Lincoln who said: "You can please all of the guests some of the time and some of the guests all of the time but you can't please all of the guests all of the time".

 

Of course, there weren't many entertainment venues on cruise ships during Lincoln's time.

[Hlitner]

Somebody mentioned they were surprised that their Personal Cruise Consultant (PCC) did not warn them of a large group on their cruise. But the reality is that PCCs work for the cruise line (they are simply order takers/sales personnel with a nice title) and are not normally permitted to give out information on groups. On the other hand, a decent cruise/travel agent who is aware of a group booking can (and sometimes) warn their clients. We have had this happen twice over a period of years. But even the best cruise agents will not always be aware of group bookings so (as we mentioned earlier) a cruise needs to perform their own "due diligence" by doing some searches on the internet.

 

Hank

Edited July 20, 2015 by Hlitner

[kazu]

Somebody mentioned they were surprised that their Personal Cruise Consultant (PCC) did not warn them of a large group on their cruise. But the reality is that PCCs work for the cruise line (they are simply order takers/sales personnel with a nice title) and are not normally permitted to give out information on groups. On the other hand, a decent cruise/travel agent who is aware of a group booking can (and sometimes) warn their clients. We have had this happen twice over a period of years. But even the best cruise agents will not always be aware of group bookings so (as we mentioned earlier) a cruise needs to perform their own "due diligence" by doing some searches on the internet.

 

Hank

 

Same with my TA Hank, she contacted me to warn me that she feared that the Asia cruise I had booked would be chartered out from under us.

 

I thought that was a very nice touch.

[sail7seas]

Somebody mentioned they were surprised that their Personal Cruise Consultant (PCC) did not warn them of a large group on their cruise. But the reality is that PCCs work for the cruise line (they are simply order takers/sales personnel with a nice title) and are not normally permitted to give out information on groups. On the other hand, a decent cruise/travel agent who is aware of a group booking can (and sometimes) warn their clients. We have had this happen twice over a period of years. But even the best cruise agents will not always be aware of group bookings so (as we mentioned earlier) a cruise needs to perform their own "due diligence" by doing some searches on the internet.

 

Hank

 

In the particular instance I reported in this thread, we were using a TA. This was before I used PCC. We thought that TA excellent and they served us very well for many land trips as well as cruises. They went out of business which prompted me to go to PCC.

 

Funny this time, a PCC was blamed when they were not even involved. :)

 

[hattack]

Depending upon the language in the contract a group may not officially be a group to the cruise line until the final payment is made, so more than likely your PCP or cruise general sales agent will not have access to that specific request by design...unless one has a specific booking number associated with their personal account, the cruise line will not release other information...also if a group fails to meet it's contractual final payment date the group may be cancelled

 

One of the major reasons for working with a professional experienced travel agency is that they know large groups or full charters have a tendency to book a particular cruise line, ship or time of year and they track that information to share with their clients...for instance if they have a client interested in booking the NCL Pearl on a given week in 2016, the TA knows that Sixthman charters the Pearl during certain periods...IMHO a TA that you have a history with is still the way to go...no way does an individual who books a cruise once a year have access to extensive information that a TA does,..if one rely's on forums like Cruise Critics for the definitive go to source, one may not be receiving the full picture

[kazu]

Depending upon the language in the contract a group may not officially be a group to the cruise line until the final payment is made, so more than likely your PCP or cruise general sales agent will not have access to that specific request by design...unless one has a specific booking number associated with their personal account, the cruise line will not release other information...also if a group fails to meet it's contractual final payment date the group may be cancelled

 

One of the major reasons for working with a professional experienced travel agency is that they know large groups or full charters have a tendency to book a particular cruise line, ship or time of year and they track that information to share with their clients...for instance if they have a client interested in booking the NCL Pearl on a given week in 2016, the TA knows that Sixthman charters the Pearl during certain periods...IMHO a TA that you have a history with is still the way to go...no way does an individual who books a cruise once a year have access to extensive information that a TA does,..if one rely's on forums like Cruise Critics for the definitive go to source, one may not be receiving the full picture

 

Now where is that LIKE button?

[bwaz]

Yikes! I checked themecruisefinder for our upcoming Alaska cruise. We dodged a bullet. Theme cruises all around us but not our sailing as far as I can tell.

 

We had a large group, I think a car club, with us on the Oosterdam some years ago. Not too much of a problem for us, but I remember our table mate disappointed that the daily movie she was looking forward to was not going to happen because the group had exclusive use of the theater.

 

Sent from my LG-D801 using Forums mobile app

[cruiseJMO]

Ugh!!!! I would be so upset. I've never thought to do an internet search for large groups onboard the ship. My search skills don't seem to be that good anyway. But, I think the cruise line should at least inform their other guests. They sold you an experience that was very altered. And as someone else had mentioned, things were taken away from the regular cruisers to benefit this large, favored group. That's just not right; especially since you weren't informed ahead of time.

[kazu]

Large groups can affect a ship or not affect a ship. Back, in a time far, far way I was part of a large group on the old Nieuw Amsterdam (when I fell in love with HAL). All our meetings were usually in the show room and other than a Lido presentation by speakers (and the people were welcome to join in if they wanted), we had little effect on the cruise.

 

How do I know this? Because so many of the people on the cruise that were NOT part of our group came up to our organizer and asked which ship the next one would be on as they wanted to be part of it. We were younger (but not rambunctious - this was a corporate thing after all) but we knew how to have fun.

 

So, don't dismiss all groups - many do not affect your cruise. Others will affect it.

 

It is good to research, but longer cruises usually mitigate the risk and honestly when I did the only 7 day cruise in a VERY long time, I never even thought to check ;)

[Lizzie68]

I think that a great idea. :)

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

When we went to Crows Nest the first night of our cruise, the organizer of the group was standing in the doorway as we walked up the stairs. Organizer saw we were not wearing group identity badges and told us we did not belong there, were not welcome and should leave immediately. I do not consider that to be understanding, cooperative, or helpful. The message was made very clear. I will not share what followed. :D

 

 

I have to ask this again as for some reason my question has been removed and there was nothing that merited that.

Simple question - what did you do? Personally I would have taken offence at someone other than an officer or crew member barring my way, especially in that manner.

[nana51]

My husband would have been VERY unhappy with only having a late show option. This is a man who in the best of times is fast asleep by 10:00 p.m., usually 9:00. Years of getting up at 5:00 has made him an early to bed early to rise kind of guy. I stay up late but I prefer the early show and then chocolate cake in my cabin while in my jammies. We would have been very upset.

[SoCal Cruiser78]

A bit off-topic: As a sidebar to this topic, I am wondering that the longest cruise that any of you CCers have encountered that had a large group onboard? I have seen them on 3-7 nighters, but can't recall them on anything longer.

 

I am wondering if booking a true 14 nighter, for example, would be less likely to have a group onboard than a cruise sold as two 7-night segments.