Caribbean Princess winches

[good and bad]

Hello you lovely people,

 

Can you help me regarding an engineering question?

 

We travelled on the Caribbean Princess for the first time in July to Norway.

We had a late availability to celebrate our daughter's graduation. There were only inside cabins left, no choice of cabin and we were not told until after booking what the cabin would be. I must emphasise that the pricing was was good, but........

 

The cabin No. E104 held no surprises and was as described but out of a 7 night cruise we had only 2 nights sleep, the second one due to being moved. About an hour or so before berthing we would be woken by a thunderous noise that engulfed the cabin and this would continue until the ship had been secured.

 

We complained but the ship was completely full until someone disembarked in Bergen but we weren't offered that cabin until at 05.30 of our final day at sea my partner went to reception to make a complaint about all of the other noises we had to endure in our cabin...throughout each and every night. This consisted of bleeping, heavy motors running, running and loud bangs. Our complaints were met with incredulity initially but eventually there was an admittance that Princess were aware that some cabins did suffer from noise issues and they were looking at restructuring the prices on these.

 

When I was packing on the final day I found a schematic map of the ship for joining crew and staff and this indicated that our cabin was, on three sides surrounded by crew/staff amenities such as cabins, recreation room, gym etc., etc.,.......which explains the noise disturbance throughout the night.

 

My question is, does anyone know how many winches the Caribbean has....and what sort of sound decibel output would each have? We complained to 'customer services' when we got back and got the kiss-off as usual, partly as we accepted a move to another cabin (for one night) and some small monetary compensation.

 

However, I would still really like to know how these cabins can be marketed without warning passengers about the excruciating noise and the lack of sleep to be expected if they choose to book one of these cabins. I know I do like quiet to be able to sleep and so would be interested to know whether the winches were really *that* noisy......although it was the three of us awake in the cabin so it would be reasonable to assume it WAS noisy!!

 

Any information would be very much appreciated

 

Thank You !!!

[Colo Cruiser]

Hello you lovely people,

 

Can you help me regarding an engineering question?

 

We travelled on the Caribbean Princess for the first time in July to Norway.

We had a late availability to celebrate our daughter's graduation. There were only inside cabins left, no choice of cabin and we were not told until after booking what the cabin would be. I must emphasise that the pricing was was good, but........

 

The cabin No. E104 held no surprises and was as described but out of a 7 night cruise we had only 2 nights sleep, the second one due to being moved. About an hour or so before berthing we would be woken by a thunderous noise that engulfed the cabin and this would continue until the ship had been secured.

 

We complained but the ship was completely full until someone disembarked in Bergen but we weren't offered that cabin until at 05.30 of our final day at sea my partner went to reception to make a complaint about all of the other noises we had to endure in our cabin...throughout each and every night. This consisted of bleeping, heavy motors running, running and loud bangs. Our complaints were met with incredulity initially but eventually there was an admittance that Princess were aware that some cabins did suffer from noise issues and they were looking at restructuring the prices on these.

 

When I was packing on the final day I found a schematic map of the ship for joining crew and staff and this indicated that our cabin was, on three sides surrounded by crew/staff amenities such as cabins, recreation room, gym etc., etc.,.......which explains the noise disturbance throughout the night.

 

My question is, does anyone know how many winches the Caribbean has....and what sort of sound decibel output would each have? We complained to 'customer services' when we got back and got the kiss-off as usual, partly as we accepted a move to another cabin (for one night) and some small monetary compensation.

 

However, I would still really like to know how these cabins can be marketed without warning passengers about the excruciating noise and the lack of sleep to be expected if they choose to book one of these cabins. I know I do like quiet to be able to sleep and so would be interested to know whether the winches were really *that* noisy......although it was the three of us awake in the cabin so it would be reasonable to assume it WAS noisy!!

Any information would be very much appreciated

 

Thank You !!!

 

 

Welcome to Cruise Critic........

 

Was that an inside cabin?

 

We have stayed in one of the (OV) outsides in the first 2 cabins. I think it would be 102/101? We have never experienced the type of noise you describe. We love the location as you can just walk forward a few feet and out the door to the upper Promenade deck area.

 

I think you are wasting your time. Princess has cabins with these type of situations on EVERY ship. Some that are above lounges, some that are below the treadmills etc etc etc. Passengers come and passengers go. They will not restructure the fares on any of these cabins. They will just deal with the issues when they arise onboard as some passengers in the same cabin will not blink an eye. Seems like this might be the reason you joined cruise critic?

 

IMHO

 

We do talk about everything here but its not all complaints.

[good and bad]

Thanks for your very quick response, Keith.

 

No, my partner has been a member since 2011/12 but we moved recently and my partner has completely mislaid his login details.

 

You will see on here I haven't just joined for this issue as I have also asked for advice regarding an upcoming cruise and in particular, Rome, too today.

 

You are correct that ours was an inside cabin immediately adjoining a 'Staff only' door to the side. The outside cabin opposite to ours had a 'corridor' running on one side ending in an 'emergency only' door which presumably lead to the outside.......however. there was no door which lead directly onto the promenade deck available to anyone travelling as a passenger. This is indicated on the deck plans on the Princess site.

 

I am still interested to hear any information regarding winches, as, although not as experienced in cruising as yourself, this was our 8th and we had always had peaceful nights of rest on all the previous cruises.

 

Thanks again for your input.

[Colo Cruiser]

Thanks for your very quick response, Keith.

 

No, my partner has been a member since 2011/12 but we moved recently and my partner has completely mislaid his login details.

 

You will see on here I haven't just joined for this issue as I have also asked for advice regarding an upcoming cruise and in particular, Rome, too today.

 

You are correct that ours was an inside cabin immediately adjoining a 'Staff only' door to the side. The outside cabin opposite to ours had a 'corridor' running on one side ending in an 'emergency only' door which presumably lead to the outside.......however. there was no door which lead directly onto the promenade deck available to anyone travelling as a passenger. This is indicated on the deck plans on the Princess site.

 

I am still interested to hear any information regarding winches, as, although not as experienced in cruising as yourself, this was our 8th and we had always had peaceful nights of rest on all the previous cruises.

 

Thanks again for your input.

 

That door you speak of would led right out to the upper promenade deck. The other door does lead to interior crew space as you mentioned. ;)

We use it on every ship that has that setup and have never had an issue. ;)

Great place to star gaze at night as its pitch black out there.

 

Good luck on gathering winch information. :)

[Thrak]

I have no information regarding the winches but I would expect that cabin - E104 - to be noisy as it's not only right there where the winch and anchor equipment is located but also directly above the Princess Theater. Not a location I would choose but it seems you really didn't have a choice.

 

I agree that Princess "should" discount cabins in this location but I also agree that they almost certainly never will.

[caribill]

When I was packing on the final day I found a schematic map of the ship for joining crew and staff and this indicated that our cabin was, on three sides surrounded by crew/staff amenities such as cabins, recreation room, gym etc., etc.,.......which explains the noise disturbance throughout the night.

 

 

One side of your cabin is to the hallway for that side of the ship.

Another side of your cabin is next to inside cab\bin E106.

A third side is between you and inside cabin E103 with possibly a relatively unused access space between.

 

Only one side of your cabin was against the crew area.

 

Of course, all that noise could have come from that one side.

[skynight]

I believe directly forward of E104 is a crew gym area, some crew cabins and the crew's pool and lounging area. I believe the equipment to drop the anchors as well as let out the mooring lines is on deck 7 under your cabin. And yes this equipment would be loud when operating.

 

Regarding marketing, yes I do believe that conditions like yours in any cabin that has them should be fully disclosed at the time of purchase. This would be honest marketing. Non disclosure is sneaky marketing and does not give good vibes to the company. In Princess' defense they do disclose some physical issues with certain cabins on their deck plans. But to my knowledge, not noise.

Edited August 31, 2015 by sknight

[Steelers36]

I believe directly forward of E104 is a crew gym area, some crew cabins and the crew's pool and lounging area. I believe the equipment to drop the anchors as well as let out the mooring lines is on deck 7 under your cabin. And yes this equipment would be loud when operating.

 

Regarding marketing, yes I do believe that conditions like yours in any cabin that has them should be fully disclosed at the time of purchase. This would be honest marketing. Non disclosure is sneaky marketing and does not give good vibes to the company. In Princess' defense they do disclose some physical issues with certain cabins on their deck plans. But to my knowledge, not noise.

 

I agree. They disclose obstructions and even partial obstructions which can be VERY minor. Why not disclose potential noisy areas? Maybe that would make prospective passengers less likely to book than with visual obstructions?? IDK

[spookyfudge]

I guess you know now why the room was so cheap. Next time, pay more look at the ship layout and have a pleasent cruise!

[tanzer22pilot]

Being on a cruiseship, one must realize that one is on a "ship". Ships require things like engines (in the back of the ship) that make noise. So, for some people, the sounds of the engine is a white noise which allows them to sleep. To others it is a painful reminder that they are on a ship.

 

Sadly, you and your partner picked a spot on the ship where there are other ship noises.

[good and bad]

Thanks for all of the responses.

 

Unfortunately some of my comments have been misunderstood or misconstrued

 

Tanzer22pilot: We did not 'pick' this cabin, it was allocated by Princess and we were not made aware of it's position until after booking.

We were at the very front of the ship......I did not mention engine noise

 

Spookyfudge: The cabin appeared fairly priced, but not significantly more so than another similar cruise to Norway we had previously taken. We took a late availability due to our daughter's receiving her degree award and subsequent graduation.

The ship had only a few inside cabins left and there was no choice over those cabins, Princess allocated AFTER booking so research of the cabin would have been impossible until after booking and then would have been futile

 

Cariill: Most inside cabins are a 'cube' and as such would have 6 'faces' or sides. Our cabin ,on the top, on one 'side' and below it, was embedded i.e. three sides into crew/staff areas,Princess Theatre and a 'void' which we presumed had berthing equipment, anchors etc in it. I apologise for my original terminology

 

Thanks to everyone else.......Colocruiser, sknight, steelers36 and Thrak who replied and tried to constructively answer my questions. I'm surprised that when making a simple request for information that some take offence to that question being asked and blame the paying passenger and not the service 'provider' i.e. Princess, for not disclosing noise issues.

 

Oh, and by the way, I wasn't suggesting a different pricing policy for these cabins......this information came directly from the ship's hotel manager when dealing with my complaint. He informed me that Princess are aware of the issue and that introducing a new price policy for these cabins was an option being considered. I agree that I don't think this will happen as many people such as ourselves would say 'no thanks' and look to book elsewhere.

 

Thanks for your input

[tanzer22pilot]

Being on a cruiseship, one must realize that one is on a "ship". Ships require things like engines (in the back of the ship) that make noise. So, for some people, the sounds of the engine is a white noise which allows them to sleep. To others it is a painful reminder that they are on a ship.

 

Sadly, you and your partner picked a spot on the ship where there are other ship noises.

 

You ALLOWED the choice of cabins by waiting till last minute to book this cruise.

 

There are "other ship noises" such as below a night club or gym, not just the engine area that have been covered here at Cruise Critic.

[ratherbtruckin]

You ALLOWED the choice of cabins by waiting till last minute to book this cruise.

 

There are "other ship noises" such as below a night club or gym, not just the engine area that have been covered here at Cruise Critic.

 

Give me a break! And you "allowed" the 1 day flight delay because you "chose" the fly. And you "allowed" the car accident where you were hit by the drunk driver because you "chose" to drive a car that day. And you "allowed" yourself to get food poisoning because you "chose" to eat out.

 

Just because you don't book a cabin until the last minute doesn't mean you should give up all expectations of a reasonably comfortable cabin. We all know you aren't going to usually get a prime location cabin by waiting until last minute or booking a guarantee, but it shouldn't have major inconveniences far different from similar cabins.

 

I mean by your logic if you go to a crowded restaurant, you should expect the worst food and the worst service because everyone was there before you. Or if you get there are only 5 jars of sauce left on the store shelf and you take one, assume it is spoiled and unedible because you weren't there a few hours ago.

[likeadisguise]

I agree. They disclose obstructions and even partial obstructions which can be VERY minor. Why not disclose potential noisy areas? Maybe that would make prospective passengers less likely to book than with visual obstructions?? IDK

Because cabins are put on categories based on obstructed or non-obstructed, which is an objective measure. Cabins aren't put in categories based on noisy, somewhat noisy, or very quiet.

[Pam in CA]

There are actually quite a few cabins on ships that experience significant noise, from full suites to insides. Such as under the gym, under public deck, with a tender outside the window, next to an elevator shaft, above the stage of a lounge or Princess Theater, directly above the thrusters or stabilizers, etc. How would you disclose or rate all of these possible noise problems? Some people sleep through them and aren't bothered. Others are disturbed.

 

A ship is mechanical and there will often be unexpected noises. Could Princess do something about them? Maybe. Often there's little that can be done. Even if you book a GTY at the last minute, you can always change to a cabin in a different location as long as one is available. Usually, you're not "stuck" with that cabin.

 

If you book directly with the cruise line, you assume responsibility for cabin selection and knowing these ins and outs. That's why it's always a good idea to have a competent TA knowledgeable about Princess.

[Steelers36]

Because cabins are put on categories based on obstructed or non-obstructed, which is an objective measure. Cabins aren't put in categories based on noisy, somewhat noisy, or very quiet.

 

I know - it was just an idea that won't likely ever see the light of day.

 

But smart cruisers find this website and learn the in's and out's to make informed decisions from fellow cruisers with the experience to share. And isn't that great?:cool:

[good and bad]

Thanks everyone,

 

likeadisguise:..........Regarding obstructed and unobstructed windows......these choices do not determine whether you will be woken from sleep several times each and every night. Neither do obstructed or unobstructed windows wake you at 05.30 for a 07.00 docking with heavy engineering noises which cannot be ignored.

 

I would perhaps dispute that these categories of cabin are not totally objective as there are degrees of obstructed views. This is why there are many discussion forums with members pictures of cabin windows,so that people can see what level of obstruction they are happy with if they have a choice of/been able to choose their cabin.

 

Of course noise is different...as some would enthusiastically enjoy being serenaded by Cliff Richards and this would be torture to others. These passengers may want nothing more than to listen to Eminem, whilst the Cliff Richards fan club would be horrified by the noise of rap...........however extremes of noise are recognisable, as the hotel manager admitted, and occur in some (our) cabins and therefore should be given different cabin categories and passengers alerted to this 'feature'.....That is why we have measures of sound, decibels, to measure and determine safe levels of noise. My original query was very specific in that I was asking for any information on how many winches and the decibels of sound these would produce.

 

steelers35:........I agree that this is unlikely to happen too as Princess will keep selling these cabins if they also keep quiet about the noise issues.

 

My original and subsequent posts also explained why we took a late availability.....and anyone who has experienced university in very recent years will understand about degree awards and graduation ceremonies. Frankly I am amazed that because we decided to do something spontaneous for our daughter as a congratulations to her for doing well on a very demanding course that somehow we are to blame for Princess' less than transparent marketing. It must be a very sorry life indeed for those people who have no spontaneity in their lives or think that hard work by one's children doesn't deserved recognition.

 

ratherbtruckin:..........couldn't have put it better myself and you obviously actually read my posts and then used very interesting and funny examples to illustrate my point. The analogy I would have used is buying something on Ebay where the seller has been economical with the truth and the buyer has no right to return the product as they 'allowed' the buyer to fleece them as they were purchasing the product at a lower price than at a regular high street retailer....but yours are much,much better! Thanks for your understanding

 

Pam in CA: Please read my original post....we did not have a choice of cabin therefore we could not 'assume responsibility' for the cabin.

 

Likewise.....please read my original post.....there were no other cabins until Bergen,our last port of call and this was not offered to us until the following day, our last day on the ship.

 

Your comment regarding an experienced TA with a good knowledge of Princess is hardly the point is it? Princess are responsible for the product they sell and not the TA. It should not be a case of being 'in the know'but rather transparency and confidence by Princess in the product it is selling regardless of whichever platform it uses for those sales.

 

Thanks again to everyone for their input and if there is anyone reading who can answer my original questions I would be so grateful.

[DrMark]

You ALLOWED the choice of cabins by waiting till last minute to book this cruise.

 

There are "other ship noises" such as below a night club or gym, not just the engine area that have been covered here at Cruise Critic.

 

He didn't ALLOW a damn thing. Princess failed to disclose the issue with the cabin at any point prior to departure. If Princess had said: "Noisy cabin; some passengers may find the noise level of this cabin objectionable" when he booked (just like they disclose obstructed view), then he could have decided if he wanted it or not.

 

Speaking of which, does anybody know if there is something like "seatguru" for cruise ship rooms?

[Ronnieslady]

He didn't ALLOW a damn thing. Princess failed to disclose the issue with the cabin at any point prior to departure. If Princess had said: "Noisy cabin; some passengers may find the noise level of this cabin objectionable" when he booked (just like they disclose obstructed view), then he could have decided if he wanted it or not.

 

Speaking of which, does anybody know if there is something like "seatguru" for cruise ship rooms?

 

Ship cabinguru would be great. We had a very bad problem on the same ship a few years ago. We were in A751, which is a full suite, that we booked a full year ahead & that we thought would be great for 14 days . It was not, due to a very loud booming bang & vibrating noise every 45 minutes all day & nite. The noise was very scary, even for my DH who is a contractor & used to these kind of things. We complained to the CR desk & our cabin steward. The cabin steward said the last people had complained about the same problem. CR could not move us to a different cabin, since there were no other full suites. I tried to investigate the problem my self, since no one on the ship could figure it out. The people on either side of us did not have the problem. I think it might have been from the pool right above us. The heater going on & off for the pool all day & nite.

Because of this experience I really do feel for the OP.

We learned the hard way of never booking under a pool again. You could not pay me to be in that suite again, yet they have not even downgraded that suite to a vista suite. I posted this info a few years ago here on CC just to warn others, which is all we can do. It is amazing that I have not read anyone else having problems with this same suite, unless they finally fixed the problem, which I find hard to believe.

[tanzer22pilot]

I guess the word responsibility has left our society, as it is easier the blame the ship or cruise line having noisy winches then take the blame that the OP did not do the research about choosing a cabin.

 

If only there was something available to help the OP in this situation. Maybe a site like Cruise Critic would cover such an important subject.

 

http://www.cruisecritic.com/articles.cfm?ID=77

 

"For some reason, most cruise lines assign their nicest and most expensive cabins to the highest decks, usually just below the pool deck (most likely because if you have a window or balcony, you have a more sweeping vista). Still, it's the pool deck that often causes the most noise problems, so if you don't want to hear scraping chairs at the crack of dawn or yee-hawing pool parties until the wee hours, go down a level. In fact, when it comes to noise, the best bet is to select a cabin that is both above and below other cabins. Other pitfalls include service areas adjacent to or above your stateroom; show lounges or bars adjacent to, above or below your stateroom; and self-service launderettes across from your cabin. Other cabins that can be problematic are those that are situated low and at the back (because of their proximity to engine noise, vibration and anchor) or low and forward (because of bow thrusters)."

 

 

Maybe there would be another article about cabin choices?

 

http://www.cruisecritic.com/articles.cfm?ID=1639

 

If you can, identify where crew service entrances are located -- stories of slamming doors day and night are enough for us to check twice. And if the sound of footsteps keeps you up at night, don't book a cabin nearby major promenades or staircases. Another potential peeve is the dinging of elevators, if you're close enough to that area to hear them.

 

Sadly the day of quiet ships are gone (by the way Tanzer22 is a sailboat) and while I can tie up my boat using 3/8" line (under normal conditions) one is not able to tie up a cruise ship the same way. Sorry, if your sleep was interrupted by the "high decibel" winches, but asking Princess to hold off on docking till later in the day or hiring 100 strong men to pull the lines instead of a winch would be the only solution to your cabin choice.

 

May I suggest that next time you take a Princess cruise, sign up for a behind the scenes tour where you will get to see the inner workings of the ship. There is much that goes on behind the paneled door. There are hundreds of people working FOR you and I can guarantee that not one of them thought, "Hey, lets wake up the lads in cabin E104. Turn the winches up to eleven!"

 

Also.

 

As someone above used the analogy of getting bad food at a crowded restaurant, it would be more accurate to say that ome should not go to Chucky Cheese on a Saturday night with the expectation of a romantic fine dining experience.

[rdsqrl]

tanzer, are you having difficultly with basic reading comprehension? The OP has said (repeatedly *sigh*) that s/he had to book a guarantee. Let me define a guaranteed cabin for you: that means you don't select your own cabin; instead, you are stuck with what the cruiseline assigns. Meaning, there's no point to doing any research in advance. Why are you blizzarding this thread with irrelevant and borderline nasty commentary?

[tanzer22pilot]

tanzer, are you having difficultly with basic reading comprehension? The OP has said (repeatedly *sigh*) that s/he had to book a guarantee. Let me define a guaranteed cabin for you: that means you don't select your own cabin; instead, you are stuck with what the cruiseline assigns. Meaning, there's no point to doing any research in advance. Why are you blizzarding this thread with irrelevant and borderline nasty commentary?

 

You are right, we do not book guarantee cabins. Sometimes you win and get upgraded, other times you do not.

 

I do agree with you, that the OP did lose me at the fact that he "had to book a guarantee cabin" on this particular cruise. Guess I did miss that due to the fact that we do not gamble at the casino or with our vacation dollar.

[Colo Cruiser]

Even if you get upgraded you could end up in a cabin with issues, it does not matter. I am sure there are cabins in all categories with issues. Even with research you may not find all issues.

Edited September 2, 2015 by Colo Cruiser

[good and bad]

Thanks again for replies and to rdsqrl for understanding why the late booking and pointing this out to other readers.

 

We had never booked an inside cabin before but as this was the only option left decided to give it a try. The compactness and lack of light wasn't an issue as we spend little time in the cabin as we are 'outdoor' people as much as possible.

 

tanzer22pilot: we are taking a another cruise in 10 days time, our 'main' holiday and did the research on the cabin position etc before booking as this was possible to do. I am not saying that we may not encounter noise on this upcoming cruise, but we do take 'responsibility' on due diligence when it possible to do so. On the issue of responsibility, this is a two way street which includes service providers. Mutual respect IS sometimes lacking in the modern world but that can only be nurtured by everyone playing their part.

I understand about ships a little as my father was a Royal Navy man and I also appreciate how hard cruise ship personnel, particularly those unseen, work to bring us 'the experience' of being on these magnificent superstructures. This is not the issue......the issue is in this instance,Princess but could be any cruise provider being upfront on cabins that have serious noise issues.

Noise is measurable and bedroom noise limits should not exceed 30 decibels. If this is the case passengers should be informed before they book so that they can decide whether they want to proceed with the booking. That is all.

You also mention Chucky Cheese on a Saturday night v fine dining. How about the example of visiting the Crown Grill on any given night only to be served with tough inedible steak, that had been advertised as a 'special' if you paid in advance? Would you not speak with the maitre'd to ask why and expect an honest answer?

 

Ronnieslady: I'm so sorry to hear that you had a bad experience too and now feel guilty that we only booked an inside cabin whilst your problems involved a full suite! Like you, our steward was more than aware about the noise in the cabin and understood our consternation over lack of sleep.

 

DrMark: Thanks for your support and understanding the issue at hand, that we could not choose our cabin, therefore could not research it before

booking.

Before booking we would normally use resources such as http://www.deckplans.com or http://www.******************** or a similar site which I can't locate at present.Is this the type of site you mean when you mention 'Seatguru'?

 

Colo Cruiser: yes you are correct to not always finding the answers, as this thread would indicate:).....but I think many people do try very hard to do their own research before they travel, be it via forums or across internet searches. If nothing else, my post may have alerted others to steer clear of E104 if they want a restful holiday with some sleep involved.

 

Thanks again

[caribill]

 

Cariill: Most inside cabins are a 'cube' and as such would have 6 'faces' or sides. Our cabin ,on the top, on one 'side' and below it, was embedded i.e. three sides into crew/staff areas,Princess Theatre and a 'void' which we presumed had berthing equipment, anchors etc in it. I apologise for my original terminology

 

 

I must admit, I did not think of the ceiling and floor.

 

Under the floor of your cabin could be the area where the anchors are kept and let out.