Does it seem QUIET around here? Have posters quit posting? Or ?

[POA1]

Interesting, as it seems that the post on the FCL are higher this time of the year and of course at March madness.

 

you might want to scroll back and see some good points that people have made. your posts, of course are always fun and informative - but there have been legitimate concerns raised and worthy of reading and listening to.

What's the acronym FCL mean? I'm stumped.

[kazu]

What's the acronym FCL mean? I'm stumped.

apologies - Future Cruise Listing - the listing that we create the Bon voyage threads from.

 

the thread that is done every Friday with the updated listing.

[sail7seas]

This is a good thread and I sure have learned from it.

Some of the folks have a very different view of some things than is my experience.

A few posts are so far from 'my reality' that it literally stuns me. There is some predictability about it but it has certainly been a useful use of bandwidth to read the various comments.

[POA1]

apologies - Future Cruise Listing - the listing that we create the Bon voyage threads from.

 

the thread that is done every Friday with the updated listing.

Thanks. Makes sense now. :) The "slow season" information comes from someone we know who works at Carnival as well as our long time TA. It's also why the CLIA runs National Plan a Cruise Month in October.

[kazu]

Thanks. Makes sense now. :) The "slow season" information comes from someone we know who works at Carnival as well as our long time TA. It's also why the CLIA runs National Plan a Cruise Month in October.

 

My pleasure :)

 

Posting of cruise plans and when they book do not actually correlate of course.

 

so your stats are most likely correct and I do not dispute them. I just know when things pick up for my little job here. No question, the people have not necessarily booked at the same time as when they requested to be added.

Edited October 26, 2015 by kazu

[Host Walt]

The answer to your question is that Cruise Critic is owned by a travel agency and has paid advertisers. Therefore we are not allowed to mention other travel agencies or provide links to other sites that contain advertisements. CC is protecting their paid advertisers. :)

That's not correct. Cruise Critic has no affiliation with any travel agency.

 

A complete explanation of the reason we do not permit referrals to, or discussions of travel agencies can be found in our posting guidelines. I recommend that you click on the link and spend a few minutes learning our guidelines. As always if anything is unclear you are welcome to communicate your questions or concerns to our Community Manager at Community@CruiseCritic.com.

 

Here's one pertinent part of our guidelines as an example (But there's a lot more):

Advertising Is Not Allowed

Cruise Critic has strict guidelines prohibiting blatant advertising, commercial sales and solicitation posts on all of our message boards.

 

Our Cruise Boards are meant to be a cruiser's exchange of advice and tips where cruisers can talk about their travels -- not a marketplace for advertising and selling services. There are thousands of cruise professionals online and if we didn't insist on a non-solicitation policy the cruise boards would be very quickly overrun with nothing but ads.

 

Cruise Critic defines advertising as an individual or company's attempt to generate business or other commercial enterprise, either directly or indirectly, by using our Cruise Board. Solicitation includes, but is not limited to, requests to be E-mailed, the posting of phone numbers for your business, constantly mentioning that you are in the travel business, and the referring to or posting of one's own Web site address.

Edited October 26, 2015 by Host Walt

[Cruiser Andi]

I just got done reading this entire thread and agree with the majority of what's been said. I think it's up to all of us to make this an inviting and welcoming place to come to to get answers or share information.

 

Thanks for all the information as well as some tips on social media manners that I hadn't considered.

[sail7seas]

My pleasure :)

 

Posting of cruise plans and when they book do not actually correlate of course.

 

so your stats are most likely correct and I do not dispute them. I just know when things pick up for my little job here. No question, the people have not necessarily booked at the same time as when they requested to be added.

 

There are also an unknown number of CC'ers, who may or may not even log in, that do not list their cruises with you. You cannot know how many sail how many times without telling you or anyone here. ;)

 

Edited October 26, 2015 by sail7seas

[CaveDiving]

...the time I recommended the Embassy Suites in Ft. Lauderdale to a new CCer. This same hotel is recommended almost every day by people who post in this forum on a daily basis. I was told that anyone who likes that hotel is cheap and lower class...

 

Well, I guess we're somewhat below cheap and lower class as we stay in, and have recommended, the Airport Ramada Inn in FT. Lauderdale (with it's complementary shuttle both from the airport and to the Cruiseport.) I definitely see the Embassy Suites as a cut above.

 

Scott & Karen

[Roz]

Scott and Karen, more power to you! I see Cruise Critic as a place where we can share the range of possibilities with others, and each of us make informed decisions as to what cruise line, ship, cabin, hotel, etc. to choose.

 

Roz

[chefestelle]

That's not correct. Cruise Critic has no affiliation with any travel agency.

 

A complete explanation of the reason we do not permit referrals to, or discussions of travel agencies can be found in our posting guidelines. I recommend that you click on the link and spend a few minutes learning our guidelines. As always if anything is unclear you are welcome to communicate your questions or concerns to our Community Manager at Community@CruiseCritic.com.

 

Here's one pertinent part of our guidelines as an example (But there's a lot more):

 

 

Ah. So I could recommend someone try Viator for competitive pricing on tours because I found a cheaper worry free excursion on there? But if I was the tour operator or I worked for Viator, I couldn't post an ad or link to it. And I could say booking direct with air canada worked out better than booking through flightease? But i couldn't put an air canada ad or link in?

[perditax]

I'm going to go ahead and call B.S. on the "slippery slope" argument posited in the rules, claiming that the site would be "overrun with ads" otherwise. There are other travel forums that don't have such weird rules and don't suffer from this ad avalanche. There's also no explanation given as to why we can't discuss sites that aren't selling anything, unless you count c-fish's couple of bucks cruise-tagging service.

 

Setting all this aside, the "rules" are too long and over-explained (without explaining). A much shorter code of conduct with regards to personal attacks, "victim blaming" and thread derailment--and then enforcing them consistently--would do a world of good.

 

I do not have a competing site or travel agent. I am legitimately frustrated with the arbitrary rules (which are basically information walls) and how difficult it is to have a civil conversation here. I spend half my time here fighting with people who have dogpiled on an OP who had a question or opinion they didn't like, and the rest of it trying to make sense of the morse code people are forced to use due to the info walls.

 

I understand that this post will probably be deleted.

 

P.S. Turn the PMs on. We're (mostly) grown-ups.

Edited October 26, 2015 by perditax

[richstowe]

After over 100 posts there are clearly 2 sides answering the question of why things are quiet on Holland's CC site . (Not even sure that it is all so quite) Some believe that many are turned off by hostile nasty posts . Others feel that there is way too much "moderation" here which makes the site sterile and is leading to a boring site .

 

I am conflicted . Do we want an site where there are a hard core group of people whose "joy" is not discussing cruising but get their fun from attacking others . Do we want a U Tube site where every 2nd comment is a nasty one .

 

On occasion there is too much interference here . The one unpardonable sin is when the umpire is not impartial .

[qsuzi]

After over 100 posts there are clearly 2 sides answering the question of why things are quiet on Holland's CC site . (Not even sure that it is all so quite) Some believe that many are turned off by hostile nasty posts . Others feel that there is way too much "moderation" here which makes the site sterile and is leading to a boring site .

 

I am conflicted . Do we want an site where there are a hard core group of people whose "joy" is not discussing cruising but get their fun from attacking others . Do we want a U Tube site where every 2nd comment is a nasty one .

 

On occasion there is too much interference here . The one unpardonable sin is when the umpire is not impartial .

 

I have had a few threads and comments deleted and the Host provided clarification when I requested so I better understood what does and does not meet guidelines. I thought each removal was fair and appropriate. Maybe I am naive but I think CC would welcome any suggestions for improving how guidance is written or to simply it.

 

Some of the members who are part of the hard core group attacking others, some consistently and for a long time, are also on this thread commenting about too much moderation or we should be made to feel welcome or not subject to negative comments. The real test will be to see if we each put our words into practice and our future behavior reflects our comments.

Edited October 26, 2015 by qsuzi

[WeLoveCruising]

Regarding the cliques, and comments on negative posters:

 

I belong to a number of internet forums, for a variety of interests. What happens here pretty much happens on the other sites, too.

 

I view the people here the same as I might at a cocktail party. Some are going to stay longer. Some will come and go. There will be some I like, and some I dont. Because most of us are anonymous, we say things online more bluntly than we might in person, which can be taken the wrong way.

 

But just like at a party, there are going to be people here that I prefer, those I know better than others, some I dont care for, etc. I tend to read more of the posts from the people I like and trust, and choose not to interact with those I dont.

[SteelMagnolia9]

I've been mostly coming to the HAL forum off and on to see if there is any information posted about the Koningsdam. There's helpful information here, both for new cruisers and those who may not have sailed with HAL recently. For example, I've learned by reading on this forum that Formal Night is now Gala Night and the dress code has been relaxed.

 

No one coming to this forum (or any of the other forums) wants to be rebuked for asking a question or stating an opinion. Civil disagreement can be expected and respected on a number of topics. But there are some that cross the line of civil disagreement in CC forums into a personal attack on someone's opinion or comment. I cringe when I see that happen, but we all need to keep in perspective that it's a reflection on the person who chooses to do this, NOT on the person who was rebuked. A new person or an infrequent poster to a forum will likely not wish to participate after being on the receiving end of this.

 

I've been off and on CC since 2013 and I find that some really 'get in a twist' (I can't come up with the right word, so that's my description) and feel they must, at all costs, defend a particular cruise line in the forums, mostly at the expense of again, rebuking others and telling them they are wrong or worse. Again, I cringe, but also assume some of these posters are social media 'advocates' for a particular cruise line, either working for the cruise line or have some affiliation/agreement with them to respond to negative posts.

 

One final thought to those who post their detailed cruise reviews. I think that the best part of the forums is the cruise reviews. It helps to decide whether to book a particular cruise or it's fun just to follow along and dream about places one may never get to personally experience, but you feel like you are or were there through someone else's review. Please look not at how many comments you receive, look at the number of views.

 

Thanks for listening. My thoughts really apply to all of the forums on CC. Have a great week!

[jtl513]

One final thought to those who post their detailed cruise reviews. I think that the best part of the forums is the cruise reviews.

I gave up on posting reviews when I got tired of defending my opinions, and people doubting what I said because their experience was different. Once I typed up a long review and after re-reading it I could imagine the comments it would get, so I just trashed it. That's sad, because that's what CC is supposed to be all about. :(

.

Edited October 26, 2015 by jtl513

[chefestelle]

I gave up on posting reviews when I got tired of defending my opinions, and people doubting what I said because their experience was different. Once I typed up a long review and after re-reading it I could imagine the comments it would get, so I just trashed it. That's sad, because that's what CC is supposed to be all about. :(

.

 

 

Really?! Defending opinions on your own review?! I'm gob-smacked. I wouldn't mind people making suggestions or telling me why something was just and so but to argue an opinion on a review is mind-boggling! I suspect when I do my live thread for my first HAL crew that I will get helpful explanations and suggestions which will be most welcome. Sniping will not. I hope you go back to writing reviews. I am enjoying the live threads so much it is now my go to coffee read. Even for cruises I doubt I will want to take!

[Lizzie68]

I gave up on posting reviews when I got tired of defending my opinions, and people doubting what I said because their experience was different. Once I typed up a long review and after re-reading it I could imagine the comments it would get, so I just trashed it. That's sad, because that's what CC is supposed to be all about. :(

.

 

That is really sad. I like all the reviews, even the ones that are negative. But I can understand. There have been a couple of times where people have been posting from their cruise, and if they dared to note anything negative, they got piled on. I used to read reviews in the review section, but the trouble with those is there is no opportunity to respond even to outlandish claims. I prefer the ones here where you can ask questions and get follow-up.

 

This has been an excellent thread of thought-sharing, however I notice that a discordant note has now come in with some taking subtle pot shots already at others, or negating opinions such as how we should be more welcoming. Really? There's something wrong with that? (yes I know the comment was aimed at me for saying it). It seems to be the way everything goes at CC these days and therein lies the tale.

Edited October 26, 2015 by Lizzie68

[RocketMan275]

I gave up on posting reviews when I got tired of defending my opinions, and people doubting what I said because their experience was different. Once I typed up a long review and after re-reading it I could imagine the comments it would get, so I just trashed it. That's sad, because that's what CC is supposed to be all about. :(

.

 

Personally, if I were reading a review which described someone's experience (either positive or negative), I would want to know if someone else had a different experience. How else would I know what to expect?

 

I wouldn't be doubting your experience but it is possible that your experience was an aberration and not the norm.

[perditax]

Personally, if I were reading a review which described someone's experience (either positive or negative), I would want to know if someone else had a different experience. How else would I know what to expect?

 

I wouldn't be doubting your experience but it is possible that your experience was an aberration and not the norm.

 

I think there's a line to be walked between:

 

1) "I was on this same cruise and didn't experience the wait you did for the MDR. Sorry you had a bad time."

 

--and--

 

2) "LOL, OP and I must have been on different cruises, I don't know what they're whining about, probably the type of person who is just never happy."

Edited October 26, 2015 by perditax

[3rdGenCunarder]

That is really sad. I like all the reviews, even the ones that are negative. But I can understand. There have been a couple of times where people have been posting from their cruise, and if they dared to note anything negative, they got piled on. I used to read reviews in the review section, but the trouble with those is there is no opportunity to respond even to outlandish claims. I prefer the ones here where you can ask questions and get follow-up.

 

This has been an excellent thread of thought-sharing, however I notice that a discordant note has now come in with some taking subtle pot shots already at others, or negating opinions such as how we should be more welcoming. Really? There's something wrong with that? (yes I know the comment was aimed at me for saying it). It seems to be the way everything goes at CC these days and therein lies the tale.

 

Is it just me, or does it seem that many people who post reviews don't post on the relevant boards? If I read a review of a HAL cruise, it's often from someone I don't "know" at all. I agree that a review posted here can lead to follow-up questions, which is helpful.

[Windsailer]

Is it just me, or does it seem that many people who post reviews don't post on the relevant boards? If I read a review of a HAL cruise, it's often from someone I don't "know" at all. I agree that a review posted here can lead to follow-up questions, which is helpful.

 

I completely understand why people don't post their reviews on the HAL forum. Unless the review is a glowing one then all too often the comments are along the line that "wow, I was on that ship two years ago and the (fill in the blanks) was perfect. You must be mistaken". That's a bit off-putting.

 

If the HAL Cheerleaders would stop making those types of comments the HAL forum would be a much more positive place.

[candbgirl]

There are also an unknown number of CC'ers, who may or may not even log in, that do not list their cruises with you. You cannot know how many sail how many times without telling you or anyone here. ;)

 

 

 

 

 

What does that have to do with anything? Kazu is using her data as it relates to HAL

future cruises. I'm confused by what you mean and how it relates to the discussion.

[RocketMan275]

I think there's a line to be walked between:

 

1) "I was on this same cruise and didn't experience the wait you did for the MDR. Sorry you had a bad time."

 

--and--

 

2) "LOL, OP and I must have been on different cruises, I don't know what they're whining about, probably the type of person who is just never happy."

 

I can't agree more.