Service = Gratuities

[WrittenOnYourHeart]

Then it's not really a tip, it's wages, and it should be paid by the cruiseline. OR, it should be a service charge that everyone pays. RC makes it optional. People who choose to tip as they wish, or even those who don't tip at all, should not feel bad about their choice. If the system isn't working, RC needs to change it.

 

The fact that RC has not changed the system in years, but has increased the 'suggested amount' and added more 'other' workers to the 'tip pool', means that they like how it's working. In other words, 'enough' people are 'tipping', ie subsidizing, that it makes it worthwhile for them. So no one should lose sleep over how they choose to tip.

 

I really don't like the word 'punish', as you have used it here.

 

It IS tips just as in a restaurant your server doesn't get to keep all the money s/he "makes" in tips (true, they ARE a part of wages, but that is across the board even in restaurants, coffee bars, etc. on land - they have to be reported to the IRS just as "regular" pay is) - at the end of the night, those tips are split among others such as the table bussers, the bartender (where applicable - because yes, the bartender is who pulls the soda, water, etc.), and so forth. It is a way of ensuring that all those who have a part in your dining experience benefit from the tips left.

 

I'm sorry if you don't like the word punish, but that is in fact what you are doing when auto grats are removed - penalizing people who you never see but who have a lot to do with your experience. Sometimes the truth hurts.

Edited May 1, 2016 by WrittenOnYourHeart

[marci22]

It IS tips just as in a restaurant your server doesn't get to keep all the money s/he "makes" in tips (true, they ARE a part of wages, but that is across the board even in restaurants, coffee bars, etc. on land - they have to be reported to the IRS just as "regular" pay is) - at the end of the night, those tips are split among others such as the table bussers, the bartender (where applicable - because yes, the bartender is who pulls the soda, water, etc.), and so forth. It is a way of ensuring that all those who have a part in your dining experience benefit from the tips left.

 

I'm sorry if you don't like the word punish, but that is in fact what you are doing when auto grats are removed - penalizing people who you never see but who have a lot to do with your experience. Sometimes the truth hurts.

 

If Royal wants to be sure that everyone is getting paid properly, then they need to charge these fees across the board, in some way. (Calling it 'tips' makes it optional.) Until that time, I don't think anyone has a say in how someone else 'tips'.

[Kynance103]

We are cruising very soon and in the past have pre-paid and on other occasions paid cash on the last night. I don't like the fact that RC now do auto tipping, it should be a individuals choice on who to tip and how much. If RC are that bothered about their staff then pay them more! It shouldn't be the customers responsibility to top up RC's staff's wages. So we will be removing the auto tipping because tipping is a choice. Of course we will be taking cash on board to tip which we have found always goes down well with the staff who served us.

[caribbean sailor]

For quite a while now, service standards have been in decline at Royal Caribbean (since automatic gratuities were introduced??).

 

So, from now on, I shall be having any auto-gratuities refunded on my onboard account.

 

Instead, I will be returning to the old-fashioned method of tipping staff personally (which always used to be a higher amount for us anyway).

 

Have you considered doing the same - perhaps in the hope that service might improve?

 

What I would like to know, is what would you recommend per night for our waiter, asst waiter and cabin steward these days (we are returning to traditional dining from now on).

 

IF I have to stand in line at a bar (as they have cut down on wait staff) I shall also be reclaiming the 18% tip on that too.

 

I would rather it went to the servers in the Diamond Lounge.

 

I guess I'm just getting seriously fed-up with such poor service for what was once a quality experience.

 

 

I don't need Royal to use my money to tip who they please.I always cancel Royal's auto tips,and tip who i please. :rolleyes: :eek:

[matj2000]

I've noticed this too and believe there is one very obvious reason: Now that so many people are buying drink packages, RCCL is not going to pay lots of waiters to run around passing out drinks. Better to make people come get them at a crowded bar and use less booze (and pay less waiters).

 

You are absolutely correct.

 

They get the majority of the liquor/tips paid up front.

 

Then just have the absolute minimum staff to serve it.

 

 

[Mapleleafforever]

Ah the tipping debate continues. :rolleyes:

[Paulette3028]

For quite a while now, service standards have been in decline at Royal Caribbean (since automatic gratuities were introduced??).

 

So, from now on, I shall be having any auto-gratuities refunded on my onboard account.

 

Instead, I will be returning to the old-fashioned method of tipping staff personally (which always used to be a higher amount for us anyway).

 

Have you considered doing the same - perhaps in the hope that service might improve?

 

What I would like to know, is what would you recommend per night for our waiter, asst waiter and cabin steward these days (we are returning to traditional dining from now on).

 

IF I have to stand in line at a bar (as they have cut down on wait staff) I shall also be reclaiming the 18% tip on that too.

I would rather it went to the servers in the Diamond Lounge.

 

I guess I'm just getting seriously fed-up with such poor service for what was once a quality experience.

 

Let me see if I understand your logic. You are going to ask to have the tip removed from a drink you order from a bar, when their is a line of other cruisers. In some way, you feel that the next time you appear at that bar with that bartender, you might get better service from the bartender. Probably not, probably even slower service. The bartender has no control over the amount of people asking for drinks in front of him. Some people do the exact opposite, they give a nice additional tip up front, visit that bar all cruise long when they see that particular bartender and are treated "Royally".

[TripleU]

I've only read a handful of comments, so this may be repetitive, but did you know that the employees have a list in the back of who has removed gratuities? That's what our waiter told us on our last cruise. Since they know - they might just give up on you thinking you're cheap OR they could work harder to try to earn your tip. That probably depends person to person. I prefer to leave the auto-gratuities on and add cash for excellent service at the end.

[nbsjcruiser]

So confusing! :D Is service really that subjective like food? :cool:

 

Personally, I noticed a big decline in service on Freedom of the Seas from my cruise in 2012 to 2015. They are simply doing a lot more with less IMO. The thing is, these same complaints are on ever cruise forum. Even some of the luxury cruise forums.

 

Service on our NCL Getaway cruise in February was noticeably better than on our last few RCI cruises. The food was much better too IMO.

 

Mind you, I did not like the ship and feel the RCI ships are much better designed but that's another argument. :)

[matj2000]

Maybe if they did remove the 18% gratuities on drinks.

 

The bar staff might step it up a bit.

 

With the bev packages and auto-tips.

 

Not much incentives.......

[Paulette3028]

Maybe if they did remove the 18% gratuities on drinks.

 

The bar staff might step it up a bit.

 

With the bev packages and auto-tips.

 

Not much incentives.......

 

Interesting thought for sure.

[kalliekae]

We've been choosing MTD for a few years now and pre-paying tips and have had no difference in service. Therefore I see no need to remove tips at all. Frankly I am relieved not to hand out envelopes any longer the last night, I always found it awkward.

 

If there has been a decline, I believe it's due to having less staff service the same amount of cabins, tables, etc, rather than how the gratuities are paid. At least the ones who stiffed them is probably less than it was before.

 

We do tip the Diamond Lounge bar server generously though.

 

We need a "like" button on CC. I couldn't agree more with your statement.

 

Whenever I see a post about declining or poor service, I have to wonder if we are all talking about the same cruise line(s). We've been cruising since the mid 90's and some perks have certainly gone by the wayside, but we have never had terrible service overall on a cruise. Sure, we have run into a poor waiter here and there, but you can find that anywhere. The op mentioned that he would deduct the 18% tip if he had to stand in line at the bar. Seriously?! Please tell me where and when you have never stood in line for a drink? Do you expect cruise lines to have the crew serve as your personal servants? Sorry, but you must have very different expectations and maybe that's why you find the service to be poor. Personally, I've never been on a bad cruise and never have I felt that I overpaid for a cruise. The crew deserves my tips and will always receive them.

[Tripper10]

Then stay home.

 

Seriously. You're penalizing staff for something that's beyond their control.

 

Plus, 18% on bar bills is not optional.

 

This is perhaps the most ridiculous post I've seen in a while. Here's an idea- how about you move away to your third world country, work your ass off for 18 hours a day, 7 days a week for 6 months straight only to have some cheapskate malcontent jip you because of something beyond your control.

 

Wrong....if you don't take action nothing will change. How RCI pays thier staff is not the customers problem. We all work hard, or not, and I could care less, but if someone is against a policy or program don't participate. If people think service is declining because of auto gratuities then opt out. RCI will change the policy asap if enough people do this and perhaps pay workers a salary like they deserve.

[MNfamilycruiser]

I am European - Scandinavian - Finnish, so forgive me not undestanding properly the tipping etiquette in US.

 

I have understood that basically you're supposed to tip in US restaurants according to the level of service you've experienced. That is: to tip less if the service is poor and tip more if you feel it is great. Somewhere between 10 - 25% on top of the bill, right?

With My Time Dining I can be served by different waiter team each night - some are great and others are not - and all of them get the same tip. It just sounds unfair. I am paying automatically somebody something - dont know how much and to whom and for what service. Weird!

 

And with the "behind the scenes employees" and "those people are also working at Windjammer etc": how would I know if their service is good or bad? Before the auto tipping, we did not deliver tips to those people, right? So did RCI change their salaries somehow?

 

The easiest way for me is to keep the auto tips and just leave it like that, even though for our upcoming Freedom TA we will end up paying more tips than what we are paying for our daughter's cruise.

 

But it still does not keep me from conteplating the weird concept. I can tell based on all these discussins it confuses even natives in US let alone foreigners coming from non-tipping environment.

You do understand the tipping etiquette in the US. The reason it is so confusing and causes so much argument and discussion is that RCI is using a weird hybrid system. It is not really a true tipping system, and it is not really a true service charge system.

 

My guess is that the auto-gratuity system was put into place as they had more worldwide presence. With more of their passengers Americans, they could rely on the true tipping system. At some point that stopped working well - staff weren't being tipped adequately? People were uncomfortable using the tip envelopes when they were unaccustomed to tipping at home?

 

Now? They are pushing the limits by trying to include more behind the scenes people. Having less staff to do the same amount of work etc. It is really a service charge, except they don't call it that and you CAN remove it.

 

Maybe removing the auto gratuities would send a message. I read on another thread that if the employees don't make a certain minimum wage with tips RC has to pay the difference. So if we revert back to tipping the people serving us directly, appropriately to their service, it might make a statement to RC. The behind the scenes people will still get paid the same amount. They never would get extra tips anyway - their wage will not change.

 

Probably need to use the surveys as well - high scores for people who provided excellent service, but always mention if it seemed like they were overworked/not enough staff. (Sorry - it has been a bit since I did a survey - hoping there is a place comment)

[Paulette3028]

 

Probably need to use the surveys as well - high scores for people who provided excellent service, but always mention if it seemed like they were overworked/not enough staff. (Sorry - it has been a bit since I did a survey - hoping there is a place comment)

 

The problem with the survey is it is 'all or nothing' type scale. If you give anything other than a 10 it is as if you gave the employee a zero. That is unfair to both the cruiser trying to be honest and the staff member, as well as what the purpose of the survey should be, which is as a tool to see who are really your best and who of the staff/team need to have more training/assistance to do their job better.

[Rosy1013]

Wrong....if you don't take action nothing will change. How RCI pays thier staff is not the customers problem. We all work hard, or not, and I could care less, but if someone is against a policy or program don't participate. If people think service is declining because of auto gratuities then opt out. RCI will change the policy asap if enough people do this and perhaps pay workers a salary like they deserve.

 

I agree with this. Our tips should be extra money for a job well done, not the basis of the salary for these employees.

[Paulette3028]

I agree with this. Our tips should be extra money for a job well done, not the basis of the salary for these employees.

 

You do not show where you are from.....so not sure if you are American or not....so let me ask....do you tip your servers/wait staff in a restaurant?

 

Everyone in US knows that the hourly wage of waiters/wait staff is generally 50% of the minimum wage (I have heard in some places it is even less) and they rely on tips for the rest of their earnings. The waiter (if smart) even shares the tip with their assistant and the kitchen staff....so that the table can be served as quickly as possible to 'turn over' the table to new guests ASAP. That way they can serve more people in a shift and make more tip money.

 

As restaurant prices have increased due to increases in food products, the tips which are a percentage of the bill have gone up incrementally as well....and sometimes service hasn't changed a darn bit, for the better or worse.

[BonTexasNY]

I agree that service has declined since the imposition of auto-grats.

Not so much in the DR or cabin attendant who have to perform to get an advancement; but with bar and other staff.

 

I prefer to hand my waiter etc cash and more than recommended.

 

Decline in service could it be a result of waiters with more tables to take care of, housekeeping more rooms. Do waiters who work in the WJ daytime and MDR at night get a larger piece of the pie? Just seems to me that RCI is getting much more involved in the tipping issue but then I'm sure it's the same with other cruise lines.

[Kynance103]

Do many people opt out of auto tips? That could be why there is always a big Que at guest services on the first day??

[Paulette3028]

Decline in service could it be a result of waiters with more tables to take care of, housekeeping more rooms. Do waiters who work in the WJ daytime and MDR at night get a larger piece of the pie? Just seems to me that RCI is getting much more involved in the tipping issue but then I'm sure it's the same with other cruise lines.

 

I don't believe there is staff that only works in the WJ. All MDR wait staff have shifts that they have to cover in the WJ. We had our assistant waiter from our MDR table. on our last cruise, saying good morning to us, many days as the "washy washy" attendant outside of WJ.

[Fouremco]

Everywhere you go, service has declined over the past years, whether or not the provider was ever tipped. It's a simple reflection of employers realizing that they can continue to function with less staff, and customers have simply bought into this paradigm. I can still remember when refuelling my car meant that an employee of the gas station put in the gas, washed my windshield and checked my oil. In my books, auto-tipping is simply a red herring when discussing declining service.

 

Room stewards now have more cabins to take care of, wait staff more tables and bartenders more customers. As a result, the service isn't as quick as it once was, and some aspects have been reduced or eliminated. But my observation is that those providing the service work as hard as they ever did to please the passengers. It's the effort they put into it that dictates how I tip, and if the bartender does a good job when I finally reach the head of the line, I'm not going to fault him for the number of people ahead of me.

[jagsfan]

Back when we tipped the last night, we sometimes had tablemates not show up for dinner. Always wondered how they also avoided tipping their stewards.

 

 

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[KansasK]

We usually prepay the gratuities to avoid having our onboard account go up so much each day. This is just our preference. We generally forget about them on board and just enjoy our cruise. We bring cash to tip with for excellent service. I try to relax and just go with the flow. I'm on vacation.

[oldguysandgalls]

Without question, we always tipped and/or in addition to automatic gratuities but how many of the crew / service staff share the total amount of automatic gratuities and do they all share equally?

[Tripper10]

Ah the tipping debate continues. :rolleyes:

 

Thanks you for your input.