No drinking in the hot tubs on the Norwegian Jade

[Sparkygirl]

That would be the USPH inspection that is de rigeur when a ship returns to the US after some time away. Unfortunately, this shows that the Jade is not maintaining the USPH culture when away from the US, which NCL used to do, as it needs to become second nature, not something that is "crammed" for like a final exam.

 

 

 

I have often overheard staff discussing the QA process and I often ask about it on my cruises. On my cruises there is usually one day of week that is a mock inspection day (usually see the hotel director and food and beverage director with flashlights in their hands). I do not necessarily view this as the Jade not adhering to USPH rather that the Jade is transitioning from EU home port rules versus US home port rules. The example of the diaper child pool that must be no longer used upon returning to a US home port is a prime example of different rules. NCL has some of the best VSP ratings and reports which I do read before sailing on a particular ship. I do consider the areas where deficiencies were found and if there was immediate resolution or if a longer timeframe was needed.

 

 

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[chengkp75]

I have often overheard staff discussing the QA process and I often ask about it on my cruises. On my cruises there is usually one day of week that is a mock inspection day (usually see the hotel director and food and beverage director with flashlights in their hands). I do not necessarily view this as the Jade not adhering to USPH rather that the Jade is transitioning from EU home port rules versus US home port rules. The example of the diaper child pool that must be no longer used upon returning to a US home port is a prime example of different rules. NCL has some of the best VSP ratings and reports which I do read before sailing on a particular ship. I do consider the areas where deficiencies were found and if there was immediate resolution or if a longer timeframe was needed.

 

 

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If you look at the two systems (VSP and ShipSan), they are remarkably similar, so while there are some facets that differ, the basic philosophy is the same.

 

I realize that you only see the front of house on the weekly "USPH" inspections that NCL does, but if only the HD and F&B are involved, then there is a problem. Ours used to require 20-30 officers and supervisors in teams of two, one member of the team from the area being inspected, and one from a completely different department to provide a fresh set of eyes.

 

I don't think that NCL has markedly better VSP scores than other lines, but also no worse. We worked to the goal back then, that following USPH rules and policies should become second nature, so that when a crew member is stressed by an unusually crowded meal service, or something that breaks down, they don't forget the basics of hand sanitation, for example. This is why the USPH requires that there be a meal service during their inspections, to see whether following procedure is ingrained or something they just practice for the inspections. The goal should be 100% compliance at all times, and should not require multiple, repeated inspections to ensure a passing score.

[hawkeyetlse]

That would be the USPH inspection that is de rigeur when a ship returns to the US after some time away. Unfortunately, this shows that the Jade is not maintaining the USPH culture when away from the US, which NCL used to do, as it needs to become second nature, not something that is "crammed" for like a final exam.

You are reading a lot into what littlelulu01 posted, don't you think? And for the 6 months that the Jade is away from Europe, should they continue to follow the EU rules as second nature?

 

I'm sure the two sets of rules overlap a lot, since they have the same overall goals of safety and hygiene, but there must be a lot of picky details where they differ, and you can't do both at once. It seems normal to me that have to do a lot of preparation for repositioning, and it doesn't necessarily mean they have been neglecting standards for months and are now desperately "cramming".

Edited October 19, 2016 by hawkeyetlse

[david_sobe]

Thanks for the background info on the legalities. However I believe the Jade, Epic, and all Norwegian ships are registered in the Bahamas. For tax avoidance reasons no doubt.

 

@ david_sobe: you should probably avoid NCL if you're fearful of "nasty drunks". I hear there is a new Amish cruise line you want want to look into that. In the pools, hot tubs, or anywhere. They offer unlimited alcohol packages. I had to laugh when I heard you use the phrase "hot tub hog". They should just put more hot tubs on their ships. The Esvape has plenty. Jade is sorely lacking, as is the Epic. Nobody should have to feel crowded on their vacation when they want to use the tub.

 

 

Whatever the excuse for the mega-lame Jade's hot tub **** attitude, the entire ship felt old and geriatric. The decor was Hawaiian which was tacky as hell. It just spoke to putting no effort forth. The entertainment on the Jade, and everything was far inferior to any cruise I've been on.

You should not knock an Amish cruise until you try one. Unfortunately I have not been able to take a cruise lately due to my butter churning accident. But if you can go there are awesome basket weaving classes and they serve the best apple pie for dessert.

[SteveH2508]

You should not knock an Amish cruise until you try one. Unfortunately I have not been able to take a cruise lately due to my butter churning accident. But if you can go there are awesome basket weaving classes and they serve the best apple pie for dessert.

 

The splinters from the oar handles can be a bit off-putting...:rolleyes:

[chengkp75]

You are reading a lot into what littlelulu01 posted, don't you think? And for the 6 months that the Jade is away from Europe, should they continue to follow the EU rules as second nature?

 

I'm sure the two sets of rules overlap a lot, since they have the same overall goals of safety and hygiene, but there must be a lot of picky details where they differ, and you can't do both at once. It seems normal to me that have to do a lot of preparation for repositioning, and it doesn't necessarily mean they have been neglecting standards for months and are now desperately "cramming".

 

Unfortunately, I see this all the time, where ships, from various lines, are away from the US for a season, and then either has a "cram" session on the couple of cruises before returning to the states, or fails the first USPH inspection. Yes, you can do both systems, since there are very, very few areas that contradict in them. One system may be stricter in one area, and one system stricter in another, but neither system will penalize you for doing more than is required by their system.

 

It is the picky details that need to become "muscle memory" for the culture of proper sanitation to work.

[hawkeyetlse]

It looks like they scored 97 on last year's inspection after repositioning to Houston.

 

As always, I appreciate the way you share your knowledge and experience with us here. My only issue is that one passenger mentions overhearing the staff talking about inspections and you conclude that there is an unfortunate culture of neglect on the Jade. Is that fair?

 

Anyway, to get back to the topic at hand, would the inspectors say something if they saw passengers drinking in the hot tubs (not necessarily alcohol, but even a cup of water)?

Edited October 19, 2016 by hawkeyetlse

[david_sobe]

Here is a big party in the hot tub on the NCL Getaway.

[chengkp75]

It looks like they scored 97 on last year's inspection after repositioning to Houston.

 

As always, I appreciate the way you share your knowledge and experience with us here. My only issue is that one passenger mentions overhearing the staff talking about inspections and you conclude that there is an unfortunate culture of neglect on the Jade. Is that fair?

 

Anyway, to get back to the topic at hand, would the inspectors say something if they saw passengers drinking in the hot tubs (not necessarily alcohol, but even a cup of water)?

 

Sorry, not really trying to pick on the Jade, I just see this as an industry failure that is pretty endemic across all ships and lines.

 

I know the USPH was updating their operations manual last year, but I haven't seen the updated manual (not sure if its done yet). Based on the 2011 manual, drinking in the hot tubs isn't an issue for them, and I've never heard of them commenting on it. Actually, drinking water would be a good idea, as the tubs can cause some dehydration.

 

The OP's comment about deflectors installed around the tubs means it is probably an EU requirement.

[detroitlions]

Sorry, not really trying to pick on the Jade, I just see this as an industry failure that is pretty endemic across all ships and lines.

 

I know the USPH was updating their operations manual last year, but I haven't seen the updated manual (not sure if its done yet). Based on the 2011 manual, drinking in the hot tubs isn't an issue for them, and I've never heard of them commenting on it. Actually, drinking water would be a good idea, as the tubs can cause some dehydration.

 

The OP's comment about deflectors installed around the tubs means it is probably an EU requirement.

You seem like the life of the party... Most folks do not have a clue about all the regulations your speaking of.

Back to the point I see it hit and miss on all the cruises I have been on sometimes when things get out of hand I have heard them say no drinks in the hot tub. But I have seen drinking in the hot tub on every cruise I have been on.

Point being all those regulations you pointed out are not the reason at all. Some of the crew get fed up by the drunks in the tub and tell them no more I get it.

[Fred the ferret lover]

Unfortunately, I see this all the time, where ships, from various lines, are away from the US for a season, and then either has a "cram" session on the couple of cruises before returning to the states, or fails the first USPH inspection. Yes, you can do both systems, since there are very, very few areas that contradict in them. One system may be stricter in one area, and one system stricter in another, but neither system will penalize you for doing more than is required by their system.

 

It is the picky details that need to become "muscle memory" for the culture of proper sanitation to work.

 

How can you see this all the time on various ships and various lines? Are you there or just guessing as usual?

[Blondie008]

Their spas have no chemistry. They are nuked with Chlorine or Bromine and they are cold at 98 to 100 degrees.

 

To that other dude, sorry to hear you worked for NCL. We talked to a lot of (very nice) employees and they were very underpaid and not happy. NCL seems like a very cut throat operation.

 

Utter nonsense

Spa's are treated for PH levels as well as the use of Chlorine/or Bromine

There are also treated with de foaming agents, shock treatments and various chemicals to counteract body lotions and perfumes which of course, affect the balance.

For sure, there is indeed "chemistry".

 

The Jade is an old ship, due a refurbishment early 2017 - but recent reports have been actually very positive despite its age.

Surely you researched it prior to booking? You would know its Hawaiin decor - its all out there not news?

Which lines do you "normally" cruise on?

[gwsster]

The fact of alcohol spills in the hot tub mixed with other fluids is gross. Another reason could be a liability issue for the ships. Google hot tub drownings....there is quite a list. It could also be to free up the hot tubs for others to use instead of sitting and drinking for hours. Customers enjoying themselves are not necessarily enjoyable to other passengers or the crew to watch or serve on a cruise. Just sayin'.

[pooh/tigger]

I have been on three Norwegian cruises and the product is substantially different. The Escape and Epic actually have servers to bring you drinks in the hot tubs and pools, but the Jade strictly forbid it. They went so far as to put plastic guards in the hot tubs so you couldn't set your drink down. Staff came around and told us it was forbidden.

 

We found this to be lame. The staff had inconsistent and stupid answers about "US maritime law". Why not on other Norwegian ships?? We were in Greece on a ship which had the port of call of the Bahamas. Nowhere did the US figure into this.

 

We had the Ultimate Beveridge Package but what's the point if you can't enjoy a glass of wine in the pool or hot tub. Stupid!

 

The Jade trip we took was in Greece.

 

It's an old ship retired from Hawaii so all the decor and art is from Hawaii. It's a tired old ship and has a geriatric atmosphere.

 

 

We were on the Jade this past Jan and many people in the hot tubs were drinking.

 

There was one group, I believe a wedding group, who partied in one hot tub every single day and no one ever asked them to get out with their drinks.

[Aquahound]

How can you see this all the time on various ships and various lines? Are you there or just guessing as usual?

 

He is/was a Chief Engineer.

 

Thanks for the background info on the legalities. However I believe the Jade, Epic, and all Norwegian ships are registered in the Bahamas. For tax avoidance reasons no doubt.

 

@ david_sobe: you should probably avoid NCL if you're fearful of "nasty drunks". I hear there is a new Amish cruise line you want want to look into that. In the pools, hot tubs, or anywhere. They offer unlimited alcohol packages. I had to laugh when I heard you use the phrase "hot tub hog". They should just put more hot tubs on their ships. The Esvape has plenty. Jade is sorely lacking, as is the Epic. Nobody should have to feel crowded on their vacation when they want to use the tub.

 

 

Whatever the excuse for the mega-lame Jade's hot tub **** attitude, the entire ship felt old and geriatric. The decor was Hawaiian which was tacky as hell. It just spoke to putting no effort forth. The entertainment on the Jade, and everything was far inferior to any cruise I've been on.

 

Wow. All this is over drinking in a hot tub. I'd hate to see how you react to a real problem. :rolleyes:

Edited October 19, 2016 by Aquahound

[mojomorris]

People in hot tubs are sometimes like chair hogs . . .

occupying the tubs for long periods of time which

inhibits others from "getting a turn".

BUT such is life and that's fine with me.

As one medical person opined:

"A hot tub is just a group of people in a large crock pot set on simmer"

[Laszlo]

People in hot tubs are sometimes like chair hogs . . .

occupying the tubs for long periods of time which

inhibits others from "getting a turn".

BUT such is life and that's fine with me.

As one medical person opined:

"A hot tub is just a group of people in a large crock pot set on simmer"

 

I've seen people coming stumbling out of hot tubs after 45 minutes because they were too stupid to realize your not suppose to be in water of 103 for more than 15 minutes. I have one at home, keep it at 101 and spend no more than 15 minutes in it

[skeeler]

I am of the opinion that you should not have to wait your turn to get into a hot tub. If you're having to do that, you've got a poorly designed ship that needs more hot tubs for its guests. It's the cruise lines fault.

 

That being said I can easily spend 45 minutes in a hot tub no problem. Especially the NCL tubs which are kept at luke warm temp of 98 to 100 degrees tops.

 

If they actually heated those things to the proper temperature people would probably only be able to withstand 15 minutes.

 

There are no living germs in NCL hot tubs. They've been nuked by the ridiculous levels of chlorine: the kind that you can SMELL on your skin for the next 24 hours. Seriously NCL needs to get its tubs under control so that guests can actually enjoy them normally.

[skeeler]

I have only cruised NCL. I wasn't impressed with any of it: the food, the staff, the mass market experience.

 

Does anybody have a suggestion for a better cruise line?

[cle-guy]

I have only cruised NCL. I wasn't impressed with any of it: the food, the staff, the mass market experience.

 

Does anybody have a suggestion for a better cruise line?

 

I've cruised Celebrity exclusively till now and love them. I have booked Epics TA next weekend. So I'll be interested to see the differences.

[chengkp75]

I am of the opinion that you should not have to wait your turn to get into a hot tub. If you're having to do that, you've got a poorly designed ship that needs more hot tubs for its guests. It's the cruise lines fault.

 

That being said I can easily spend 45 minutes in a hot tub no problem. Especially the NCL tubs which are kept at luke warm temp of 98 to 100 degrees tops.

 

If they actually heated those things to the proper temperature people would probably only be able to withstand 15 minutes.

 

There are no living germs in NCL hot tubs. They've been nuked by the ridiculous levels of chlorine: the kind that you can SMELL on your skin for the next 24 hours. Seriously NCL needs to get its tubs under control so that guests can actually enjoy them normally.

 

The chlorine levels are mandated by whichever sanitation program the ship is under, VSP or ShipSan, and must be 3-10ppm. It is not the ship's decision or policy. As for temperatures, ShipSan requires a maximum temperature of 104, which is the optimum breeding temperature for legionella, so nearly all ships will keep their tubs below this temperature.

[mjkacmom]

I am of the opinion that you should not have to wait your turn to get into a hot tub. If you're having to do that, you've got a poorly designed ship that needs more hot tubs for its guests. It's the cruise lines fault.

 

That being said I can easily spend 45 minutes in a hot tub no problem. Especially the NCL tubs which are kept at luke warm temp of 98 to 100 degrees tops.

 

If they actually heated those things to the proper temperature people would probably only be able to withstand 15 minutes.

 

There are no living germs in NCL hot tubs. They've been nuked by the ridiculous levels of chlorine: the kind that you can SMELL on your skin for the next 24 hours. Seriously NCL needs to get its tubs under control so that guests can actually enjoy them normally.

 

Just a FYI, if you want to find uncrowded hot tubs on cruise ships, invest in a spa pass. With over 2000 people onboard, it is not possible to provide enough hot tubs for all. Maybe vacation on land...

[ColinIllinois]

I have only cruised NCL. I wasn't impressed with any of it: the food, the staff, the mass market experience.

 

Does anybody have a suggestion for a better cruise line?

 

 

Go and do some research on the other forums. See if you can find a hot tub that is always going to be open when YOU want it. :rolleyes:

[NLH Arizona]

I have only cruised NCL. I wasn't impressed with any of it: the food, the staff, the mass market experience.

 

Does anybody have a suggestion for a better cruise line?

Crystal Cruise line and in 2020 look into Virgin Cruise Line. Edited October 19, 2016 by NLH Arizona

[shark with a laser]

The entire cruise was ruined, with vague complaints about the ship, food, and service, but the only specifics mentioned are that you can't drink in the hot tubs, the hot tubs aren't hot enough, they have too many chemicals, and there wasn't always a spot available?

 

 

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