Jeans in the dining room and other last minute attire questions

[Aquahound]

I love it when people tell me what I am implying. I believe that my words and accompanying photo were specific.

 

This thread is like that interminable committee meeting that just won't die.

 

It's funny how people act, isn't it? I can just imagine some judgmental person on board rolling their eyes at that guy in your picture and saying to their other half "Well, I never. He's not allowed to wear those jeans"......and then after being reminded that he is dressed according to the rules saying; "Oh, in that case, he looks really good." ;):D

[Tennessee Titan]

Oh well, another 8 pages.....

I only read this to see what was new (not much).

A few things: something no one mentioned this time, what time you eat; early dining tends to be less observant (I hate to even use the word).

Someone mentioned tablecloths, covered chairs, fine china, silverware--they don't do that stuff any more. Steward uniforms aren't even different.

Jeans - everyone's concept of jeans is different. Mine (purely personal, no insult or affront is to be intended or implied) -Jeans are blue (period). I do not like the distressed look at all, ever..

My bottom line - wear what YOU are comfortable with, mind your own business (and hope everyone else does)!

[iancal]

MYOB is great advice!

[Sea girl 23]

Oh well, another 8 pages.....

I only read this to see what was new (not much).

A few things: something no one mentioned this time, what time you eat; early dining tends to be less observant (I hate to even use the word).

Someone mentioned tablecloths, covered chairs, fine china, silverware--they don't do that stuff any more. Steward uniforms aren't even different.

Jeans - everyone's concept of jeans is different. Mine (purely personal, no insult or affront is to be intended or implied) -Jeans are blue (period). I do not like the distressed look at all, ever..

My bottom line - wear what YOU are comfortable with, mind your own business (and hope everyone else does)!

 

The bygone days of HAL are just that.Bygone. Dress up,dress up to what the level of you're comfortable with.Easy.

[MajMom96]

I totally agree. There's nothing wrong with wanting a certain decorum maintained aboard HAL ships. I don't get wrapped around the axle on what other people wear, but I do like that lines like HAL maintain decent guidelines rather than going the way of NCL. Nothing against NCL...I just don't think MDRs that allow shorts are appropriate for a line like HAL.

 

 

 

And yes, the folks pushing for casual can be just as pushy as those who are strict about the rules. Heck, just look at post counts on this thread to see who is most pushy of their own opinions. ;)

 

 

 

Excellent addition to this thread. I love your last comment, the score for the most “pushy” definitely goes to the casual! And I agree. I have nothing against those who want to be casual 24/7 on their cruise. I just point them to the cruise lines that cater to that philosophy like NCL and Carnival. I think if you choose a more upscale cruise line, I believe you should accept and agree to follow their dress code guidelines.

[MajMom96]

Oh well, another 8 pages.....

I only read this to see what was new (not much).

A few things: something no one mentioned this time, what time you eat; early dining tends to be less observant (I hate to even use the word).

Someone mentioned tablecloths, covered chairs, fine china, silverware--they don't do that stuff any more. Steward uniforms aren't even different.

Jeans - everyone's concept of jeans is different. Mine (purely personal, no insult or affront is to be intended or implied) -Jeans are blue (period). I do not like the distressed look at all, ever..

My bottom line - wear what YOU are comfortable with, mind your own business (and hope everyone else does)!

 

 

 

I’m not sure which ships you’ve been on, but all the HAL ships I’ve been on definitely have cloth tablecloths, fresh flowers, and fine china in the MDR.

[MajMom96]

Not at all. Deferring to what the cruise line actually says it requires when talking about what the cruise line requires is the exact opposite of putting forward personal preference.

 

This message may have been drafted using voice recognition. Please forgive any typos.

 

 

Just to be clear on the dress code for HAL, I have copied it below. This is from their “Know Before You Go” pamphlet. I think it is important to note that these are NOT identified as guidelines, but are actually stated as “not permitted” or “required”. The MDR is considered a fine dining restaurant. For gala evenings, I would also argue that “slacks” are not “jeans”. But I stated in my original post, it is up to the Matre’d as to whether they enforce this code, but I think the code is pretty clear. If sharing this makes me part of the “fashion police”, then so be it. But I’m just advocating that everyone should just follow HALs published dress code and enjoy your cruise. After all, they do say “know before you go”.

 

“Most evenings: smart casual attire is appropriate. Shorts, pool/beachwear, distressed jeans and men’s tank tops are best left to the daytime and are not permitted in fine dining restaurants.

 

Gala nights evoke the grand traditions of cruising as guests dress to impress for special events on board, including a five course gourmet dinner in the main dining room. For gentlemen, collared shirts and slacks are required in all fine dining restaurants. For ladies, dressy attire is appropriate, dresses, skirts, and slacks are all acceptable”.

[Tennessee Titan]

I’m not sure which ships you’ve been on, but all the HAL ships I’ve been on definitely have cloth tablecloths, fresh flowers, and fine china in the MDR.

Recently??

Oosterdam Koningsdam

[navybankerteacher]

It seems those who criticize the “fashion police” are doing exactly what they are accusing the “fashion police” of doing....”implying that their personal preference” for not dressing appropriately should prevail. It’s just two sides of the same coin.

 

In reading these threads, it does seem that there are far more posts complaining about "fashion police" than there are which seem to reflect a "fashion police" attitude. Simply expressing a personal preference for a more formal ambience is JUST THAT: expressing a preference - which seems to upset a lot of people.

 

Granted, there are a few --- very few --- which actually refer negatively to people who dress casually, yet in accordance with the relaxed set of suggestions. Such negative reference is self-absorbed and anti-social.

 

However the larger number of people who criticize those who simply express preference for a more formal ambience - calling them "fashion police" are equally self-absorbed and anti-social - attempting to shame those with other preferences into silence.

[MajMom96]

In reading these threads, it does seem that there are far more posts complaining about "fashion police" than there are which seem to reflect a "fashion police" attitude. Simply expressing a personal preference for a more formal ambience is JUST THAT: expressing a preference - which seems to upset a lot of people.

 

 

 

Granted, there are a few --- very few --- which actually refer negatively to people who dress casually, yet in accordance with the relaxed set of suggestions. Such negative reference is self-absorbed and anti-social.

 

 

 

However the larger number of people who criticize those who simply express preference for a more formal ambience - calling them "fashion police" are equally self-absorbed and anti-social - attempting to shame those with other preferences into silence.

 

 

 

Well said!

[MajMom96]

Recently??

 

Oosterdam Koningsdam

 

 

 

I’ve not been on the Oosterdam but I cruised on the Koningsdam in Feb and the Nieuw Amsterdam in May. Both had cloth tablecloths, nice china, and fresh flowers on the tables in the MDR.

[MajMom96]

Thats the problem with finger pointing, three point back at you.

 

 

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I’m not sure I understand your meaning.[emoji848]

[bUU]

Just to be clear on the dress code for HAL, I have copied it below.

I posted it twice today already. The question is whether you're reading it, recognizing the words "required" and "not permitted", and accepting that that's what matters.

 

 

This message may have been drafted using voice recognition. Please forgive any typos.

[bUU]

However the larger number of people who criticize those who simply express preference for a more formal ambience - calling them "fashion police" are equally self-absorbed and anti-social - attempting to shame those with other preferences into silence.

If you think anyone in this thread had said one word opposed to people expressing their preference then you're seeing things. The objections to the "fashion police" posted in this thread all are aimed at judgementalism and the attempt to project those personal preferences as if they are the rules of the cruise line. I have said myself that my preference is much more formal than the requirements. Nobody has said one word against me expressing my preference for more formal attire. Nobody. But I'm expressing my preference in terms of what I wear. Maybe that's why nobody is saying one word against me expressing my preference.

 

This message may have been drafted using voice recognition. Please forgive any typos.

[MajMom96]

I posted it twice today already. The question is whether you're reading it, recognizing the words "required" and "not permitted", and accepting that that's what matters.

 

 

This message may have been drafted using voice recognition. Please forgive any typos.

 

 

 

It’s time to [emoji443][emoji443]Let it go, let it go....[emoji443][emoji443]. 🤣🤣 Nice chatting with everyone and I doubt no one changed anyone else’s mind. We’re all still on the same side we were on when the thread started. 🤣🤣 Until the next time, happy cruising!

[bUU]

However, over time the discussion has changed. It used to be that, with only minor exception, only the "fashion police" would have a say about this. Not so any longer.

 

This message may have been drafted using voice recognition. Please forgive any typos.

[KroozNut]

I wonder why it is that every time I click on this topic there are always 2-3 NEW pages of comments.

 

 

Yes, I know it is a rhetorical question... it's a (gasp) 'Jeans in the MDR' thread! ;)

[KroozNut]

"Smart casual" is an ambiguous term. HAL has given a definition for everyone to follow. So it doesn't matter if someone is wearing jeans with a jacket or not.

 

Q: Are jeans allowed?

A: Jeans without holes, tears or embroidery are welcome on most evenings in all restaurants, but on Gala Nights jeans are only allowed in the casual dining restaurants.

 

Yes, but it's what you wear WITH those jeans that counts, and is really what we're talking about here. Jeans with a collard shirt and sports jacket, blazer or otherwise (for example) is a far cry from jeans, t-shirt and a ball cap worn backwards..

[KroozNut]

I keep forgetting that the cruise line has resolved this matter definitively already, putting jeans firmly in the scope of "smart casual".

 

Jeans and 'What',;) I think is the crux of the discussion at this point... and that is a wide open topic!

[KroozNut]

I love it when people tell me what I am implying. I believe that my words and accompanying photo were specific.

 

But they didn't support your original premise, in any way stretch or form. There

in lies the rub Sorry...;)

[SetAnOpenCourse]

Well said!

I agree, navybankerteacher summed things up well.

[smokinmike]

Wow! This is pretty weird.

 

 

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[DallasBiskit]

Wow! This is pretty weird.

 

Totally weird.

[bUU]

Jeans and 'What',;) I think is the crux of the discussion at this point... and that is a wide open topic!

Except it isn't. Going back to what the cruise line wrote, for a third time...

 

"Shorts, pool/beachwear, distressed jeans and men’s tank tops are best left to the daytime and are not permitted in fine dining restaurants."

 

The "fashion police" have already demonstrated that they will put forward their own personal preference (about jeans) as if their preference was the rule, even though the cruise line has explicitly stated that jeans that are not distressed are appropriate for smart casual nights. They will continue putting this kind of misinformation because they see no other way to get their way except through deception. However, again, the cruise line has made clear, with regard to the "and 'What'" you claimed was a "wide open topic". No pool/beachwear; no men’s tank tops. There is is in black and white. As I said before, if you'd wear it to the pool, then don't wear it to the dining room.

 

Wow! This is pretty weird.

What you're seeing is the attempt by some to put their personal opinion forward as the rule so often hoping others begin to believe it, and people who are of the same mind working together to repeat the misinformation so often in an attempt to project the impression that their opinions are the rules instead of the actual rules. Yes, it is becoming more common for people to do that as the news media now works that way, by default. Each channel seems to have a set of analysts who "comment" on the news, spinning it their way and thereby trying to make it seem like their preferences are truth instead of just preferences. And the American people are gobbling it up. Just look at how popular those news sources are as compared to the news sources that just stick with the facts, and that just stick to the actual rules as they are written. Talking heads saying what people want to hear get far bigger ratings than those who might just report what happened or what's written down in some law or rule.

[iancal]

If you follow HAL's guidelines, ignore the busybodies, and focus on enjoying your cruise everything will be just fine.