Is HAL done with Traditional look?

[Happily@Sea]

The market is going in two main directions: behemoth floating entertainment diversionary ships that overwhelm and subsume any destination they reach, and smaller, high-end luxury ships beyond the average vacationer price point.

 

HAL can position itself right where it is right now and control an important third part of the cruise ship market: human scale midsize ships, fewer distraction frills that have nothing to do with ocean travel, high connection to the ocean going experience itself, travel for enrichment, and not over-whelming interesting ports around the world, at an accessible price point.

 

Long live HAL.

 

 

I agree completely.

 

When I mentioned earlier that if HAL went to graphics on their bows - I would find another line or go back to riverboats; I don't mind if other lines want graphics. But to me, if HAL would go down that road - I would think they have lost perspective of where their place is in the mass-market venue. That would send me looking somewhere else.

 

We already have enough mega-ships, 'fun' ships, and small luxury ships,. We need HAL to fill that itinerary niche that Cunard does well, [but has too few ships on offer at a convenient times and length of journey].

[cruisemom42]

The market is going in two main directions: behemoth floating entertainment diversionary ships that overwhelm and subsume any destination they reach, and smaller, high-end luxury ships beyond the average vacationer price point.

 

HAL can position itself right where it is right now and control an important third part of the cruise ship market: human scale midsize ships, fewer distraction frills that have nothing to do with ocean travel, high connection to the ocean going experience itself, travel for enrichment, and not over-whelming interesting ports around the world, at an accessible price point.

 

Long live HAL.

 

I am with you on this as long as we also add that the ships are well-maintained and functional.

 

HAL's older fleet gets more dings than just about any other line for which I read reviews in terms of basic issues like plumbing and HVAC.

 

Despite reassurances, I would be very reluctant to book on some of these ships currently. Now if HAL were to commit some $$$ to doing major updates and maintenance to these ships, I would consider them.

 

I was very close to booking an October 2019 cruise on Prinsendam, which was yanked out from under me by the sale. The offered replacement was the Rotterdam (at Prinsendam prices, I might add....) and with a slightly altered itinerary due to Rotterdam not being able to make the same ports.

 

While I might be willing to put up with a few quirks on a ship with so many other things going for her, I really don't want those quirks on what is not a 'cheap' cruise by any stretch....

[OlsSalt]

I am with you on this as long as we also add that the ships are well-maintained and functional.

 

HAL's older fleet gets more dings than just about any other line for which I read reviews in terms of basic issues like plumbing and HVAC.

 

Despite reassurances, I would be very reluctant to book on some of these ships currently. Now if HAL were to commit some $$$ to doing major updates and maintenance to these ships, I would consider them.

 

I was very close to booking an October 2019 cruise on Prinsendam, which was yanked out from under me by the sale. The offered replacement was the Rotterdam (at Prinsendam prices, I might add....) and with a slightly altered itinerary due to Rotterdam not being able to make the same ports.

 

While I might be willing to put up with a few quirks on a ship with so many other things going for her, I really don't want those quirks on what is not a 'cheap' cruise by any stretch....

 

You must spend a lot of time on other cruise line blogs and websites to be so up to speed about their onboard "maintenance" issues. What you claim as a major HAL "failing" is also subjective, situational and not universal to the cruise line by any objective standard. But since you are primed to be bothered by any possible incident on a HAL ships, best you do put your money somewhere else.

[kevingastreich]

Really, is there anyone out there who really believes that potential cruisers weigh the cruise line logo motif and/or the color of the ship's hull etc. in their decision making process?

.

I chose HAL initially because I liked the dark blue hull as opposed to the white ones of other lines. I like(d) the traditional look so the answer to your question is yes.

[Nymich]

The market is going in two main directions: behemoth floating entertainment diversionary ships that overwhelm and subsume any destination they reach, and smaller, high-end luxury ships beyond the average vacationer price point.

HAL can position itself right where it is right now and control an important third part of the cruise ship market: human scale midsize ships, fewer distraction frills that have nothing to do with ocean travel, high connection to the ocean going experience itself, travel for enrichment, and not over-whelming interesting ports around the world, at an accessible price point.

 

 

This is a great post! Send it to HAL LOL

[iancal]

Agree with cruisemom42. For exactly the same reasons. We never consider HAL's older ships. Most especially for warmer climates. Why take a chance when there are so many other great choices in the marketplace?

 

We have had more than one TA give us the same advice based on customer feedback.

[cruisemom42]

You must spend a lot of time on other cruise line blogs and websites to be so up to speed about their onboard "maintenance" issues. What you claim as a major HAL "failing" is also subjective, situational and not universal to the cruise line by any objective standard. But since you are primed to be bothered by any possible incident on a HAL ships, best you do put your money somewhere else.

 

A dismissive post in response to a genuine concern. Are you just trying to drive folks away from HAL? You know I'm no troll. I have a HAL history and am interested in a future vision for the line such as you laid out. Why the harsh response?

[OlsSalt]

A dismissive post in response to a genuine concern. Are you just trying to drive folks away from HAL? You know I'm no troll. I have a HAL history and am interested in a future vision for the line such as you laid out. Why the harsh response?

 

You earned it: You wrote, after being "dismissive" about reassurances to the contrary:

 

HAL's older fleet gets more dings than just about any other line for which I read reviews in terms of basic issues like plumbing and HVAC.

Despite reassurances, I would be very reluctant to book on some of these ships currently. Now if HAL were to commit some $$$ to doing major updates and maintenance to these ships, I would consider them.

[Boatdrill]

What you are describing is Sanctuary area. This is not a viewing area.

The Ruby Princess (and her sister ships and close sister ships - Grand class) is one of the most sea views friendly ships ever built.

There is a spectacular front viewing deck forward, a unique bow to stern promenade. Fantastic views are open from the rear observation deck.

 

Happy cruising!

 

You're right. It was the Sanctuary area on Deck 17, and I could barely see the ocean through the clutter of various structures. I'm used to more open viewing on top decks. I did see one of the aft viewing areas, on Deck 16 , which was a small deck space behind Curtis Stone's restaurant and Adagio. I regret that I didn't see the areas you mention.

[Boatdrill]

Take a look at the just released artist renderings of the Princess new-build.

VERY 'Celebrity'. And Princess is making some changes that def. seem to reflect that they are actually listening to their customer feedback.

 

 

From Travel Weekly (8/1/2018) https://www.cruiseindustrynews.com/cruise-news/19431-cruise-ship-orderbook-hits-new-record-at-113-ships-268-854-berths.html:

"The Princess ships will be bigger, however, with capacity for 4,300 guests at 175,000 tons. Before that, Princess will take delivery of three newbuilds from Fincantieri in 2019, 2020 and 2022, built on the Royal Princess platform with capacity for 3,600 guests. "

 

Is this what Princess customers are asking for ? ( I don't know, just asking)

[cruisemom42]

You earned it: You wrote, after being "dismissive" about reassurances to the contrary:

 

HAL's older fleet gets more dings than just about any other line for which I read reviews in terms of basic issues like plumbing and HVAC.

Despite reassurances, I would be very reluctant to book on some of these ships currently. Now if HAL were to commit some $$$ to doing major updates and maintenance to these ships, I would consider them.

 

Sheesh. Not worth responding further. In your world view, apparently, if one is not 100% willing to believe that all posted instances of passengers having cabin issues are 'ship happens' then one is 'dismissive'.

[POA1]

I fondly remember everyone on CC freaking out about the Zuiderdam when she launched. I think it was the Joe Farcus interior and the huge size.

[OlsSalt]

From Travel Weekly (8/1/2018) https://www.cruiseindustrynews.com/cruise-news/19431-cruise-ship-orderbook-hits-new-record-at-113-ships-268-854-berths.html:

"The Princess ships will be bigger, however, with capacity for 4,300 guests at 175,000 tons. Before that, Princess will take delivery of three newbuilds from Fincantieri in 2019, 2020 and 2022, built on the Royal Princess platform with capacity for 3,600 guests. "

 

Is this what Princess customers are asking for ? ( I don't know, just asking)

 

Since Princess operates under the CCL umbrella which presents only consolidated earnings for all their ships and not for individual cruise lines, one can assume this is how CCL thinks they will make more money overall.

 

Maybe they chose Princess to grow large, Seaborn to stay small and maybe, just maybe, keep mid-size HAL as the Golidlocks Just Right Size cruise line.

 

The fate of the new Maadam InDepth cruise options will be very telling. I appreciate there is room for HAL to least try this option within the CCL family. Otherwise they are just Pontiac, Buick and Oldsmobile competing with each other. The irony being Buick is selling successfully purely on nostalgia and tradition ........ but only in China. So there is a marketing niche for nostalgia and tradition.

[SetAnOpenCourse]

For those who sometimes do not sail HAL due to maintenance issues as reported on this Internet forum, along with a travel agent’s comments, I ask, do you have a figure in mind as to the chance that you will experience this issue? I don’t deny that there could be maintenance problems at this moment, but I just don’t see how a grave concern about it can be generalized to the extent that it applies to all older ships in the fleet. So I’m wondering, are you thinking there’s a 5%, 10%, 20%, ??% chance that you’d be affected?

[iancal]

Just about every mass market cruise line has a few 'dogs' in the line up.

 

The fact that HAL has it's share is not a knock on the cruise line. I suspect even the most biased HAL cheerleader would agree that some HAL ships are better than others, some are in better condition than others. Some are well past their sell by date. No different than other cruise lines.

 

So why get so agitated and defensive about it?

 

HAL is, after all, only a for profit corporation. Not your first born.

 

So, when it comes to selecting a ship. Why would we bother with an older ship in any cruise line that has reports of maintenance issues when we could just as easily another newer or better maintained ship that we believe has a lower probability of issues. More than once we have been steered away from specific ships on various cruise lines thanks to the advice of a good TA (based upon feedback to her from her clients). So would we do a Veendam through the Panama canal? No way. But we would not do an NCL Star or Sun either.

 

Sometimes that TA advice might take the form of have you considered this or that ship instead. Once you get to know a good one he or she will come out and say it straight.

Edited August 2, 2018 by iancal

[Sea girl 23]

I fondly remember everyone on CC freaking out about the Zuiderdam when she launched. I think it was the Joe Farcus interior and the huge size.

 

Seems to happen with every new ship...been following(but not posting)on these boards for a while,and remember the initial reactions to the Koningsdam. Good times[/sarcasm]

 

She has her fans though-having been on the Westerdam multiple times,I have more than a little bit of a soft spot for *her*. :cool:

[AncientWanderer]

Since the plumbing issues are being discussed here...

Our experience with plumbing issues is that our bathroom has flooded during our last two HAL cruises — two different ships and through no fault of ours. It was quite gross and will affect our future cruise choices. I’d note that we book the balcony staterooms.

 

I’m not naming the ships because perhaps remedies have been put in place and I don’t want to put the pox on the ships.

[OlsSalt]

For those who sometimes do not sail HAL due to maintenance issues as reported on this Internet forum, along with a travel agent’s comments, I ask, do you have a figure in mind as to the chance that you will experience this issue? I don’t deny that there could be maintenance problems at this moment, but I just don’t see how a grave concern about it can be generalized to the extent that it applies to all older ships in the fleet. So I’m wondering, are you thinking there’s a 5%, 10%, 20%, ??% chance that you’d be affected?

 

1% chance. Depends on whether you are sailing with passengers who insist on flushing wet wipes down the toilets or sail towards the equator when one no longer can live in a 68 degree hermetically sealed cocoon.

 

Depends on whether you think a "delayed flush" toilet is a "non-working" toilet". You need to drill down a bit on the "complaints" before you assign numerical scores, because definition of maintenance issues is all over the place.

 

We have had occasional "issues" but they were quickly remedied or also put into context that were situationally appropriate. If there is no mental flexability to respond to time, place and manner of any of these issues, then one can assume one will have a 100% incidence of "maintenance" issues while on board HAL ships.

 

Let the familiar Greek chorus of floating buckets of rusted bolts begin. PS there is no way you can ever assign a percentage -- you can only know your own tolerance levels when, not if, "ship happens". Just like one whiff of cigarette smoke can also be a deal killer. To claim no other cruise line has these complaints is folly. Or else someone can explain why there was a very funky smell always at the same spot on the promenade deck of the Crystal Symphony.

[JRG]

If the "Traditional Look" is the Yum-Yum Man, Dutch-oven night and Hat night then I think they are done with it. We were never into those types of things but it never bothered us that others did.

[OlsSalt]

If the "Traditional Look" is the Yum-Yum Man, Dutch-oven night and Hat night then I think they are done with it. We were never into those types of things but it never bothered us that others did.

 

Activities are not necessarily traditions. Making ginger available after meals is a sea going tradition. No matter how it gets served. I doubt providing paper Dutch hats is a long-standing sailing tradition either. But it was a short-lived activity.

[iancal]

The other thing we never do is try to make excuses for a vendor-any vendor. At the end of the day we do not know the facts nor do we have any reason whatsoever to defend any vendor. Does not matter if it is a cruise line, hotel chain, airline, or auto manufacturer.

 

Seems to me that forever trying to make excuses for, or glossing over, cruise line deficiencies, any one, is more like being a tout than a good customer. Same as consistently claiming that you preferred cruise line is the best for everyone. That is silly. It comes down to personal preferences. We shake our head at people on the various cruise line forums who take this approach. We don't understand it. That is how we view it.

[POA1]

It's that one orange button on the shirts that freaks me out. I think I'm going to buy a packet of orange buttons to take on our next cruise. I'll just hand them to people and say, "Hey, I think you dropped this." (That way there'll be no doubt that I'm that guy. :D

[Sea girl 23]

The other thing we never do is try to make excuses for a vendor-any vendor. At the end of the day we do not know the facts nor do we have any reason whatsoever to defend any vendor. Does not matter if it is a cruise line, hotel chain, airline, or auto manufacturer.

 

Seems to me that forever trying to make excuses for, or glossing over, cruise line deficiencies, any one, is more like being a tout than a good customer. Same as consistently claiming that you preferred cruise line is the best for everyone. That is silly. It comes down to personal preferences. We shake our head at people on the various cruise line forums who take this approach. We don't understand it. That is how we view it.

 

Also?I don't think HAL is going to add water slides,etc. I cruise to travel and see the world. I'm pretty "go go go" when I'm on vacation. How sedate(or not) a ship is is irrelevant.Even libraries aren't that quiet anymore!:D

[rkacruiser]

I fondly remember everyone on CC freaking out about the Zuiderdam when she launched. I think it was the Joe Farcus interior and the huge size.

 

Sailing on Zuiderdam during her early years, I didn't mind the increase in size. I did like having an affordable veranda stateroom and the mid-ships exterior elevators. I did not care for the "bordelo red" color scheme in some of the public rooms--whomever chose that color.

[POA1]

Sailing on Zuiderdam during her early years, I didn't mind the increase in size. I did like having an affordable veranda stateroom and the mid-ships exterior elevators. I did not care for the "bordelo red" color scheme in some of the public rooms--whomever chose that color.

That's Joe Farcus, Carnival's former lead designer. As you may recall, the Zuiderdam was supposed to be year round Caribbean and targeted at a younger demographic.

 

From the photos I've seen since the drydocks and refurbs, it's a much more sedate now.

 

I liked the Waterford seahorse in the Atrium. Is it still there?