The Elbe river 2019 - not just water levels

[notamermaid]

Here is the thread on the Elbe river for 2019.

 

Last year was disastrous for this major river of Europe. Let us hope this year will see fewer problems with water levels and do post us your tips for travel along the Elbe.

 

For past info here is the thread for 2018: https://boards.cruisecritic.com/topic/2516541-the-elbe-river-2018-not-just-water-levels/

 

Will you be on a river cruise this year, sailing the standard itineraries or perhaps even the more unusual route downstream from Magdeburg, past the Havel and towards Hamburg?

 

Looking forward to your comments, past and future cruisers.

 

notamermaid

 

[FuelScience]

Notamermaid,

Your post got my attention. I would love to take a northbound trip on the Elbe. I took a look and for this year none of Nicko’s Elbe cruises from Berlin to Hamburg (or Amsterdam) are set to accommodate English speakers. They do, however have an 8-day cruise—Stralsund-Baltic Islands-Potsdam, that will have a cruise featuring English tours and translation on one sailing in each direction. So an Oder cruise is an option for us English speakers. The most attractive for me would be the Berlin to Amsterdam cruise. Maybe next year they'll add a sailing date for English speakers.

https://www.nicko-cruises.de/en/expose/dreams-of-the-baltic-sea/

[notamermaid]

54 minutes ago, FuelScience said:

Notamermaid,

 

Your post got my attention. I would love to take a northbound trip on the Elbe. I took a look and for this year none of Nicko’s Elbe cruises from Berlin to Hamburg (or Amsterdam) are set to accommodate English speakers. They do, however have an 8-day cruise—Stralsund-Baltic Islands-Potsdam, that will have a cruise featuring English tours and translation on one sailing in each direction. So an Oder cruise is an option for us English speakers. The most attractive for me would be the Berlin to Amsterdam cruise. Maybe next year they'll add a sailing date for English speakers.

 

 

https://www.nicko-cruises.de/en/expose/dreams-of-the-baltic-sea/

Hooray, finally an option on the Oder. Thank you for pointing it out, I will put that in the thread on the Oder which is buried in page X somewhere on this board. There is actually one British operator that offers the Oder as well, need to see if they have any dates for this year.

 

pacmom is going on a cruise with CroisiEurope through Roadscholar along the Elbe northbound through to Amsterdam this year.

 

notamermaid

 

[pacmom]

We are going with CroisiEurope in June, but not with Road Scholar.  We made 3 trips with RoadScholar and decided that we could do it on our own with C.  If no

other English speakers, we will have lovely meals for two.  This is a very interesting itinerary.  We will leave the tour when we arrive in Amsterdam and train to Luxembourg, then Brussels before returning home.  We have been in Ams. quite a few times, so off to new places.

Notamermaid, your info is much appreciated.  Feel that I'm getting to know more about Europe than I ever learned in school.  Thank you for keeping up with these 3 or 4 threads for us.  Pat

 

 

 

 

[notamermaid]

Hello Pat,

Thank you for clarifying about not using Road Scholar this year.  Does this mean you will not have guaranteed guides in English? With guide books and online resources I am sure you will be able to have a similar experience nevertheless. And some locals will be eager to help quite likely as well.

 

Thank you for your kind words. Providing all this info makes me learn things (sometimes re-learn them) but is also giving me an awareness of other parts of the world that sitting in front of a teacher in a classroom cannot provide. Connecting with others of like interests is what makes CC special for me.

 

notamermaid

 

[pacmom]

There will be English speaking guides for those of us with limited fluency in other languages.  Getting really excited about it.

We are coming out a some of the coldest air I have ever experienced, a polar vortex with wind chill in the minus 30s F.  Big warmup coming over the weekend.  Pat

[notamermaid]

This year sees highlighted a somewhat odd combination of history and modernism and that connecting place is Weimar. A town of only modest size it nevertheless has forever gained a place in German (and on a minor scale) European history. Before it lent its name to the newly-formed Republik in 1919, Weimar had already been a place of Enlightenment and learning with Goethe and Schiller the most well-known figures associated with the town. But in 1919 it was also the birthplace of a new school of learning, Bauhaus.

 

100 years of Bauhaus is celebrated this year in grand style in Germany and while such buildings and the idea of Bauhaus can be found all over Germany, the schools focus lay on the Eastern areas of Germany and that is where river cruisers can pick up the trail. Bauhaus moved from Weimar to Dessau on the Elbe and then Berlin. Major works of architecture can be found there. Dessau is also in the process of developing a new museum dedicated to Bauhaus.

 

Weimar is somewhat not so easily accessible from a river cruise being about two hours drive from Dresden. From Bamberg on the Danube it is a little under two hours.

 

This is Weimar: https://www.dw.com/en/weimar-a-small-town-crammed-with-history/g-43085139

 

And this is Bauhaus*: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bauhaus

 

notamermaid

 

*Bauhaus is also the name a German chain of DIY shops has given itself!

[FuelScience]

I noticed that the ships making the Amsterdam to Berlin cruises (CroisiEurope and Nicko) are all 83 meters or less. Does anyone know if larger ships can travel this route?

[notamermaid]

During my research I found one other ship travelling that route which is similar in size, so I suspect there is a restriction in place or a "natural" limitation due to the sizes of locks. If I can confirm thus I will report back.

 

notamermaid

 

[notamermaid]

On 2/12/2019 at 8:49 PM, FuelScience said:

I noticed that the ships making the Amsterdam to Berlin cruises (CroisiEurope and Nicko) are all 83 meters or less. Does anyone know if larger ships can travel this route?

FuelScience,

I have spoken to a representative of the exclusive German booking agent for CroisiEurope. She confirmed that on the Berlin to Amsterdam route, although larger ships can sail stretches of the river, a few locks that are small limit the size of ships. A 110m ship is not possible on the route they sail. We also talked about the problems of the Elbe in 2018. She pointed to the shallow draft of the two paddle wheelers on the Elbe but said that while they sailed for a long time, at the worst of the drought CroisiEurope also had to give up on sailing with them.

 

The ships on the route are small but the cabins are not much smaller than on their regular ships and all have proper beds, not fold-down beds that are sofas during the day. The ships just have fewer cabins.

 

notamermaid

 

 

Edited February 19, 2019 by notamermaid
additional information

[FuelScience]

3 hours ago, notamermaid said:

FuelScience,

I have spoken to a representative of the exclusive German booking agent for CroisiEurope. She confirmed that on the Berlin to Amsterdam route, although larger ships can sail stretches of the river, a few locks that are small limit the size of ships. A 110m ship is not possible on the route they sail. We also talked about the problems of the Elbe in 2018. She pointed to the shallow draft of the two paddle wheelers on the Elbe but said that while they sailed for a long time, at the worst of the drought CroisiEurope also had to give up on sailing with them.

 

The ships on the route are small but the cabins are not much smaller than on their regular ships and all have proper beds, not fold-down beds that are sofas during the day. The ships just have fewer cabins.

 

notamermaid

 

Thanks for taking a look at this. As the "popular" rivers become more crowded, I wonder if there's any incentive for some of the larger lines to build smaller ships to explore these novel routes. It seems like veteran river cruisers would jump on some of these routes if they knew about them.

[notamermaid]

That is certainly a thought. But Viking would not be able to market it as a longship . That is where I see the problem: marketing. With the North-American/British/Australian lines going overboard (no pun intended) with words like "luxury", and size seems to matter more than ever on the Danube, would people jump to the idea of a smaller, more intimate vessel? Those ships are an "inbetween", aren't they? Neither peniche or barge with that personal service and only up to 24 passengers, nor a river cruise vessel large enough to accommodate many extra amenities that the 110m ships and 135m ships so often provide these days. The ships are fully renovated and offer everything one really needs, of course, but I have my doubts about finding the clientele. As you said, the veteran cruisers perhaps.

 

There is one British tour operator offering the route, they charter the MS Johannes Brahms: https://travel.saga.co.uk/cruises/river/where-we-go/german-waterways/secret-waterways-of-germany-berlin-to-amsterdam.aspx

 

And here is one I have never seen before, Kiel to Berlin: https://travel.saga.co.uk/cruises/river/where-we-go/elbe/from-the-kiel-canal-to-berlin.aspx?boardbasis=FB

 

As you might expect, neither the itineraries nor the Johannes Brahms get "luxury" attributed to them. "Elegant" is the term they use for the ship.

 

As a side note: the description of the first itinerary contains the words "negotiates the Schachtschleuse", i.e. the ship will go through a lock that is worth mentioning as a point of interest. Indeed it is, industrial heritage: https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schachtschleuse_Minden

Unfortunately, no English page, but I think it is clear from the text, the lock does limit the size of ships considerably: the usable chamber size is 85m by 10m! Yet the text mentions an additional canal stretch that was built more recently for use by barge traffic.

 

notamermaid

 

 

 

[FuelScience]

3 hours ago, notamermaid said:

That is certainly a thought. But Viking would not be able to market it as a longship . That is where I see the problem: marketing. With the North-American/British/Australian lines going overboard (no pun intended) with words like "luxury", and size seems to matter more than ever on the Danube, would people jump to the idea of a smaller, more intimate vessel? Those ships are an "inbetween", aren't they? Neither peniche or barge with that personal service and only up to 24 passengers, nor a river cruise vessel large enough to accommodate many extra amenities that the 110m ships and 135m ships so often provide these days. The ships are fully renovated and offer everything one really needs, of course, but I have my doubts about finding the clientele. As you said, the veteran cruisers perhaps.

 

There is one British tour operator offering the route, they charter the MS Johannes Brahms: https://travel.saga.co.uk/cruises/river/where-we-go/german-waterways/secret-waterways-of-germany-berlin-to-amsterdam.aspx

 

And here is one I have never seen before, Kiel to Berlin: https://travel.saga.co.uk/cruises/river/where-we-go/elbe/from-the-kiel-canal-to-berlin.aspx?boardbasis=FB

 

As you might expect, neither the itineraries nor the Johannes Brahms get "luxury" attributed to them. "Elegant" is the term they use for the ship.

 

notamermaid

 

Thanks for this. I'm glad to see an English language Berlin to Amsterdam cruise. I agree that the smaller ships have a lot to offer, but they have problems finding customers. My first river cruise was back in 2012 on the old Viking Sky, a smaller ship with no French balconies. It was well maintained and had great service. It sold us on river cruising. In April we'll be on Nicko's MS Casanova. Nicko advertises it as one of their "boutique" ships. The 103 meter ship holds 96 passengers and was built in 2001, but the photos look nice. As we've discussed before, it's one of the few ships that sail the Neckar. We're looking forward to the smaller, more intimate atmosphere. We'll also see how bad my German is!

[notamermaid]

From the Deutsche Welle series Daily Drone, here is another short video. It shows the town of Wittenberge in the state of Brandenburg, not to be confused with Lutherstadt Wittenberg in the state of Saxony-Anhalt. Wittenberg is a standard port on the international itineraries whereas Wittenberge is further North past Magdeburg, and thus not a place visited on many itineraries. The German companies Plantours, Phoenix and nickocruises stop there. Wittenberge's claim to international fame is the fact that it has the biggest free-standing clock tower in mainland Europe. According to wikipedia the clock is lit at night and the time can then be read from up to ca. 12 kilometres away. Wittenberge town and river: https://www.dw.com/en/dailydrone-wittenberge/av-40807886

The tower, which actually belongs to a sewing machine factory: https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Uhrenturm_Nähmaschinenwerk_(Wittenberge)?uselang=de#/media/File:Wittenberge-_Uhrturm.jpg

 

notamermaid

 

 

Edited March 3, 2019 by notamermaid
spelling

[notamermaid]

The rain that had swept over much of Germany a week ago also reached the upper Elbe, causing mild flooding in parts. At Dresden the level peaked a few days ago a little under the first flood warning level of 400cm. Since then the level has gone down and is currently at 280cm. It is forecast to fall slightly.

 

notamermaid

 

[notamermaid]

Dresden river level has fallen to 210cm, which is slightly above the mean. As long as rain upstream in the Czech Republic keeps topping up the level in Summer and Autumn the Elbe shall be well filled and good for sailing. Fingers crossed.

 

At least, it is a good start into the cruising season.

 

Happy sailing.

 

notamermaid

 

[suspaul]

Heading for the Elegant Elbe (Viking) next week.  Hope water levels are good 🤞🏼

[notamermaid]

suspaul,

are you doing a pre- or post-cruise extension with Viking? The one to Poland sounds really interesting.

 

notamermaid

 

[suspaul]

Hi notamermaid, no extensions per se, we begin in Prague with 2 hotel nights, 5 night river cruise and 2 hotel nights in Berlin, this is all with Viking.  After, we are staying in Berlin 3 nights more on our own.

 

i hope your xmas was good, you provided me with help during the drought of 2018, I hope things are much better now.  We did end up cancelling our December 2018 river cruise a week prior to departure and ended up doing our own trip from Prague to Budapest, it was great.

And your asking about the Poland extension, no we’re not doing that as we spent time in Poland a few years ago, it is wonderful, lots to see and do and very much enjoyed it.

[notamermaid]

The standard itinerary then, Prague to Berlin. Would be new territory for me in-between the two cities. Wouldn't mind revisiting Prague for a few hours, despite the crowds. Berlin, there is always lots to see, KaDeWe shopping would be nice. I have a fondness for the village Spandau, wonder if it has changed much since I have been there. Highly recommended the Museum Island, amazing exhibits to keep you busy for days.

Have a great cruise.

 

notamermaid

 

[jpalbny]

We visited Prague and Berlin on our own 2 years ago. We spent 3 days in each. Lots to see and do (and yes, Prague is eternally mobbed with other tourists). In Berlin, we never made it all the way out to Spandau, but it was definitely on Chrystina's to-do list. Next time I guess! Museuminsel is certainly very interesting. Chrystina actually visited West Berlin when she was in college, while the wall was still up. It was nice for her to see the difference.

 

We had thought about renting a car and driving between the two cities, taking a few days to make the journey, and stopping at some of the sights along the way such as Saxon Switzerland, Dresden, and others. But we didn't have enough time to fit that into our trip, so we just took the train.

 

suspaul, where are you staying in Berlin? We stayed in Hotel Casa Camper, which we liked although the location wasn't so exciting. Funny story about that - we had stayed in another Casa Camper in Barcelona over Christmas 2015. When we walked into the one in Berlin 18 months later, I thought the guy at the counter looked familiar. Turns out it was the same guy who had checked us in when we stayed in Barcelona! He'd relocated from Barcelona to Berlin just to greet us there. 😉

 

Hope your cruse goes smoothly and that you post some pictures of Dresden et al to whet my appetite for a visit some day.

[suspaul]

We’ve spent quite a bit of time in Prague and Berlin, both independently and on a river cruise here and there.  We’re definitely Prague-d out, having returned there for a few days this past December however Berlin is always a welcome return for us, so much to see and do whether repeat visits or new places.  

 

Were staying at the Corinthia in Prague, not an ideal location IMHO but it is what it is and is the provided hotel with Viking, as to Berlin the included hotel for 2 nights is the Grand Hyatt, the location isn’t far from Sony Center and is easy enough to get around.  After we’ll move to Hampton Inn @ Alexanderplatz for 3 additional nights on our own, we’re familiar with that area and like it.  Thanks for the heads up on Casa Camper, I’ll look it up for future visits and yes funny about check in guy, small world indeed. 

[AnhaltER1960]

On 4/1/2019 at 6:27 PM, suspaul said:

Heading for the Elegant Elbe (Viking) next week.  Hope water levels are good 🤞🏼

 

They are. Water levels on the Elbe right now are well above the long-time average, but safely clear of flooding level. So enjoy a wonderful cruise.

[notamermaid]

Hello AnhaltER 1960,

 

good to hear from you again. Dresden appears to be still keeping up a good level at 143cm today. Hope it stays that way.

 

We certainly have some bright Easter days we can look forward too!

 

Enjoy the sunshine.

 

notamermaid

 

[AnhaltER1960]

On 4/18/2019 at 1:45 PM, notamermaid said:

Hello AnhaltER 1960,

 

good to hear from you again. Dresden appears to be still keeping up a good level at 143cm today. Hope it stays that way.

 

We certainly have some bright Easter days we can look forward too!

 

Enjoy the sunshine.

 

notamermaid

 

 

Thank you notamermaid for your Easter wishes. It has indeed been a perfect weekend with fine temperatures in the lower 20ies (seventies for the Fahrenheiders), blue sky, fresh green on the trees and in the fields. Congratulations to all, who chose to cruise this weekend on the Elbe (or any other river in Germany and beyond) - you did everything right.

 

While enjoying this Easter, I am starting to get worried on water tables, at least on the Elbe. It had not rained here in the Middle-Elbe-Region for six weeks now and I am starting to pray for rain - not here, but in Bohemia. While the water tables are still ok for cruising, they keep falling. The winter reserves from rain and snowmelt are gone, it now needs rain to keep the water levels up. If ir remains dry, I see trouble for the deeper drafting ships before the end of May (hat is not a political statement), maybe even earlier. 

 

I do not wish our neighbours in the Czech Republic any bad. Just some rain 🙂