Cruising Without a Vaccination

[harkinmr]

8 hours ago, Heymarco said:

Will the 95% rule be based on booking or boarding. For example, a ship has capacity for 200 unvaccinated passengers and a line allows booking for that (children , cough cough). Then let’s say ship doesn’t fully book to capacity and ship will be 1000 vaccinated passengers short. What then? 
 

Please leave comments about if children and unvaccinated passengers should cruise aside. Just trying to understand how the CDC allowance would work in practice. 
 

Bookings.  The point of the limitation is to insure 95% of all passengers who board are vaccinated. 

[CI66774]

49 minutes ago, coffeebean said:

I was vaccinated at a GMR site in central Florida. I have saved the bar code and registration confirmation emails they sent me for my vaccinations. I'm hoping if I show those emails and my CDC card that will be enough for my proof of vaccination. If not, we are all screwed if there is no state wide data base that proves our vaccinations.

 

I wish DeSantis was not so head strong against having some sort of proof of vaccination. This is a political move and it does not help the residents of Florida at all. I understand his wanting to ban the ability of private businesses of requiring proof of vaccination in order for them to provide service. I get that. But.....we need proof to be able to travel internationally. We need proof to be able to cruise. When is DeSantis going to address THOSE issues for Florida residents?

There are huge privacy implications with setting a statewide health database, etc. Moreover, there are both fed and state medical privacy laws that could be implicated by any database, etc. I, for one, am glad DeSantis is considering the slippery slope of privacy issues. International travel doesn’t trump individual liberties and privacy. That being said, I foresee some type of form (akin to getting shots to travel to certain countries now) used when entering those countries that require it.

[hernando52]

2 hours ago, rebeccac said:

I sure hope my vaccine card is enough.  That is all I have.  I got my shots at Walmart.  I am currently uninsured (next month I will have coverage, thank goodness).  There was no insurance company or doctor to receive confirmation.  As far as I know, there is no state wide system in Florida to keep track of vaccines.  If my card doesn't work, it will make life very difficult for me.  

I live in FL and I was vaccinated at Publix.  I contacted my county health dept. if these vaccines would show up on my immunization documents and they said yes.  I like to carry my one piece of paper with me that shows all of my immunizations since moving to FL 17 years ago.  Perhaps you can contact your county health dept. with your question and see if your immunizations are recorded there... 

[B Midged]

51 minutes ago, CI66774 said:

There are huge privacy implications with setting a statewide health database, etc. Moreover, there are both fed and state medical privacy laws that could be implicated by any database, etc. I, for one, am glad DeSantis is considering the slippery slope of privacy issues. International travel doesn’t trump individual liberties and privacy. That being said, I foresee some type of form (akin to getting shots to travel to certain countries now) used when entering those countries that require it.

Privacy concerns?  Why would you care if someone could potentially find out if you were vaccinated?  

[winterbliss]

2 hours ago, CI66774 said:

There are huge privacy implications with setting a statewide health database, etc. Moreover, there are both fed and state medical privacy laws that could be implicated by any database, etc. I, for one, am glad DeSantis is considering the slippery slope of privacy issues. International travel doesn’t trump individual liberties and privacy. That being said, I foresee some type of form (akin to getting shots to travel to certain countries now) used when entering those countries that require it.

Slippery slope... couldn't agree more. And yet.. seemingly few are concerned about this issue as well. I'm just wondering at this point, is there anything that anyone will so no, this doesn't sound ok to? 

[rhapsodybluezz]

2 hours ago, hernando52 said:

I live in FL and I was vaccinated at Publix.  I contacted my county health dept. if these vaccines would show up on my immunization documents and they said yes.  I like to carry my one piece of paper with me that shows all of my immunizations since moving to FL 17 years ago.  Perhaps you can contact your county health dept. with your question and see if your immunizations are recorded there... 

Thank you. I was wondering about that so I have contacted my county health department online and submitted a request to have them email me my immunization records. 

[mscdivina2016]

2 hours ago, winterbliss said:

Slippery slope... couldn't agree more. And yet.. seemingly few are concerned about this issue as well. I'm just wondering at this point, is there anything that anyone will so no, this doesn't sound ok to? 

What exactly is the issue?

Even whether you vote or not in an election is public record.

 

What privacy issue is there exactly?????

Did John Doe of anywhere USA get a covid shot?  Yes/no

 

If you go into a business that states "masks are mandatory" you either wear a mask or don't go in.

In the future a business may say "Only vaccinated people are allowed to enter" if you don't have a shot you don't go in and that's a right a business can exercise.

 

Steve

 

It takes a village but every village has an idiot!

Edited May 1, 2021 by mscdivina2016

[Stallion]

Every state and territory has a state registry-they sometimes use a different name. I posted a list yesterday for all 50 states. The "registry" is required by the federal government in the case of a national health emergency and mandatory reporting of all vaccinations are required in order for a state or territory to participate in the federal vaccination program-and all states are. There is a 25 page data sharing agreement detailing the sharing of vaccination data and the use of such information which I also posted.

 

Ah I found it through google-this thread at the link has the foregoing information spread out over a few pages

 

https://boards.cruisecritic.co.uk/topic/2778917-july-start/page/5/

 

Edited May 1, 2021 by Stallion

[ChutChut]

2 hours ago, mscdivina2016 said:

What exactly is the issue?

Even whether you vote or not in an election is public record.

 

What privacy issue is there exactly?????

Did John Doe of anywhere USA get a covid shot?  Yes/no

 

If you go into a business that states "masks are mandatory" you either wear a mask or don't go in.

In the future a business may say "Only vaccinated people are allowed to enter" if you don't have a shot you don't go in and that's a right a business can exercise.

 

Steve

 

It takes a village but every village has an idiot!

The issue is very complex - not simple as you seem to think. There are layers of medical record privacy laws in states (I know - HIPPA doesn't apply here) that could prohibit businesses, etc. from asking for/obtaining any medical information from you as a condition of service. Businesses are free to limit/prohibit as they wish as long as no fed OR state laws are violated. States may pass laws that prohibit businesses from discriminating against customers based upon vaccination status. Some businesses provide essential goods/services and prohibiting a percentage of residents from obtaining those essential services due to their vaccination status probably wouldn't withstand judicial scrutiny. This is NOT a simple issue and businesses CANNOT just do what they want.

[ChutChut]

6 hours ago, B Midged said:

Privacy concerns?  Why would you care if someone could potentially find out if you were vaccinated?  

Try this - how about if I got the HPV vaccination as a young adult? What about if there is an HIV vaccination in the future? It's my private medical information neither you nor anyone else has the right to force me to reveal it. What about HIV status? What if a business mandates everyone be HIV-negative before entering? Or mandates you be vaccinated for tuberculosis? How about mandating everyone be vaccinated for the flu before entering, etc.? Sexually transmitted disease status (Herpes Simplex can be transmitted through a cut finger, etc.? Alcohol rehab status given you could drive drunk and kill someone, etc.? This is a slippery slope.

[winterbliss]

2 hours ago, mscdivina2016 said:

What exactly is the issue?

Even whether you vote or not in an election is public record.

 

What privacy issue is there exactly?????

Did John Doe of anywhere USA get a covid shot?  Yes/no

 

If you go into a business that states "masks are mandatory" you either wear a mask or don't go in.

In the future a business may say "Only vaccinated people are allowed to enter" if you don't have a shot you don't go in and that's a right a business can exercise.

 

Steve

 

It takes a village but every village has an idiot!

What exactly is the issue? Is that a rhetorical question?

[Oxo]

Do employers still require a drug test before you are hired? 

Been out of the workforce for over 20 years. Just asking. 

[complawyer]

28 minutes ago, winterbliss said:

What exactly is the issue? Is that a rhetorical question?

i for one have no problem with this. if someone asks me if ive been vaccinated, i proudly answer yes, my wife, son, daughter, and grandson have all had both their pfizer shots.

 

if it gets me onto the cruse ship with little or no hassles, i'm all for it.

 

i dont care who knows or has my vaccination info.

[mscdivina2016]

1 hour ago, ChutChut said:

The issue is very complex - not simple as you seem to think. There are layers of medical record privacy laws in states (I know - HIPPA doesn't apply here) that could prohibit businesses, etc. from asking for/obtaining any medical information from you as a condition of service. Businesses are free to limit/prohibit as they wish as long as no fed OR state laws are violated. States may pass laws that prohibit businesses from discriminating against customers based upon vaccination status. Some businesses provide essential goods/services and prohibiting a percentage of residents from obtaining those essential services due to their vaccination status probably wouldn't withstand judicial scrutiny. This is NOT a simple issue and businesses CANNOT just do what they want.

This is a world wide pandemic

 

There are no laws regarding anything really yet.  It seems the CDC has put a vaccinated requirement into their future plan to allow cruising. So how can the CDC mandate something that you think should be private?

 Same way the CDC is telling a foreign company they cannot provide their goods and services. Our government can do what ever they want.  Landlords can't evict people for not paying rent?  This covid thing is deadly and I get back to my original question.

 

What exactly is wrong with "Are you vaccinated?"  yes or no?

 

Right now Georgia businesses have a posting of something like....f you come in here and catch Covid, tough you cannot sue anyone....

I know if I ran a business like a surgical center for cosmetic procedures I would only want vaccinated people in it.

It will be years worth of court challenges for many things.  Just wait till the CDC eviction moratorium is declared unconstitutional.  Telling private property owners what they can and cannot do yet still making them pay property taxes and mortgage payments.

Steve

[coffeebean]

10 hours ago, B Midged said:

Privacy concerns?  Why would you care if someone could potentially find out if you were vaccinated?  

That is exactly my question too. IMHO, being vaccinated is not anything that needs to be kept private when it comes to public health and safety.

[coffeebean]

4 hours ago, ChutChut said:

Try this - how about if I got the HPV vaccination as a young adult? What about if there is an HIV vaccination in the future? It's my private medical information neither you nor anyone else has the right to force me to reveal it. What about HIV status? What if a business mandates everyone be HIV-negative before entering? Or mandates you be vaccinated for tuberculosis? How about mandating everyone be vaccinated for the flu before entering, etc.? Sexually transmitted disease status (Herpes Simplex can be transmitted through a cut finger, etc.? Alcohol rehab status given you could drive drunk and kill someone, etc.? This is a slippery slope.

You make it more complicated than it needs to be. Covid has caused a global pandemic. Covid is the only disease in the last  100 years that should require proof of vaccination. There is no slippery slope.

[coffeebean]

3 hours ago, complawyer said:

i for one have no problem with this. if someone asks me if ive been vaccinated, i proudly answer yes, my wife, son, daughter, and grandson have all had both their pfizer shots.

 

if it gets me onto the cruse ship with little or no hassles, i'm all for it.

 

i dont care who knows or has my vaccination info.

I'm with you there. I would shout it from the rooftops that I have had both Moderna shots. I'm very proud of my vaccination status against a disease that has caused a global pandemic.

[hallux]

Here's a thought - when the cruise line submits the manifest to DHS for immigration/security checks, it also gets bumped against the CDC database and verified if the proper number of people have been vaccinated (yes, the CDC DOES know if you've been vaccinated no matter where you got the shot).  The cruise line never knows who is or isn't vaccinated, just if they have the correct numbers.  However, there becomes a logistical issue if there aren't enough vaccinated to cover the 95% requirement, they would need to find a way to bump some unvaccinated people.

[ericfromri]

16 hours ago, Oxo said:

Do employers still require a drug test before you are hired? 

Been out of the workforce for over 20 years. Just asking. 

any job that has any responsibility.  i wish we could deport all of these druggies.. 

[ericfromri]

10 hours ago, hallux said:

Here's a thought - when the cruise line submits the manifest to DHS for immigration/security checks, it also gets bumped against the CDC database and verified if the proper number of people have been vaccinated (yes, the CDC DOES know if you've been vaccinated no matter where you got the shot).  The cruise line never knows who is or isn't vaccinated, just if they have the correct numbers.  However, there becomes a logistical issue if there aren't enough vaccinated to cover the 95% requirement, they would need to find a way to bump some unvaccinated people.

how about bumping all of them.  the only thing that makes sense is 100%.

[roger001]

6 minutes ago, ericfromri said:

any job that has any responsibility.  i wish we could deport all of these druggies.. 

I was an air traffic controller for 38 years.  And for the last 20 or so, about once every 2 or 3 months, the pee in the bottle lab techs would show up and we would have to go into the bathroom with escort and be observed peeing in the bottle.   Tell me employment can't mandate conditions of employment....

[ericfromri]

8 minutes ago, roger001 said:

I was an air traffic controller for 38 years.  And for the last 20 or so, about once every 2 or 3 months, the pee in the bottle lab techs would show up and we would have to go into the bathroom with escort and be observed peeing in the bottle.   Tell me employment can't mandate conditions of employment....

same here but every month, not random.  i would have happily done it every day to get rid of the bad apples.  not 1 person where i worked ever tested positive during my career at my locations but i can tell you it required a sci clearance to begin with and that alone would weed out 99% of bad people. 

Edited May 2, 2021 by ericfromri

[roger001]

1 minute ago, ericfromri said:

same here but every month, not random.  i would have happily done it every day to get rid of the bad apples.  not 1 person where i worked ever tested positive. 

Happy to say as far as I know we never had one either.  

[electro]

11 hours ago, hallux said:

Here's a thought - when the cruise line submits the manifest to DHS for immigration/security checks, it also gets bumped against the CDC database and verified if the proper number of people have been vaccinated (yes, the CDC DOES know if you've been vaccinated no matter where you got the shot).  The cruise line never knows who is or isn't vaccinated, just if they have the correct numbers.  However, there becomes a logistical issue if there aren't enough vaccinated to cover the 95% requirement, they would need to find a way to bump some unvaccinated people.

So cruises would be limited to US citizens/residents only.

[mscdivina2016]

6 minutes ago, electro said:

So cruises would be limited to US citizens/residents only.

Right now, yes!

That's what they are doing in Italy now.

But 100 percent vacinated is exactly that. If we are all protected than no one needs to worry.

If not, I would want to know the cabin I am about to occupy whether the previous occupant was or wasn't vaccinated.

It's easy to tought your great safety plan and protocols on paper but we all know it's not really happening to the full extent. It's smoke and mirrors.

Steve