LIVE from "Iceland's Natural Beauty" -- All Sailings, 2021

[Rappersmom]

6 minutes ago, KarNog said:

Being quarantined unnecessarily is a concern. But I hardly expect Viking to send emails to all her passengers with a warning any more than I'd expect United to send emails warning of the possibility of a plane crash. I honestly don't mean this to come off as snark.  We simply cannot be forewarned of every possible incident. Again, we knew the possibility of cancellations and interruptions and infection when we booked our trips. 

I don't think anyone expects emails. But since it's Iceland policy that anyone on a bus with a positive person is automatically quarantined, that should be noted somewhere on myvikingjourney so that people can make up their own minds whether that's a risk they are willing to take. There are alternatives.

[DaveSJ711]

22 minutes ago, Dukefan said:

The question that I ask was why wouldn't you want to know if you have Covid and why wouldn't you want to know if the people you are around have Covid?   It has nothing to do with hospitals doing daily testing.   I repeat for clarity "Why wouldn't you want to know if you have covid?" - "Why wouldn't you want to know if the people you are around have Covid?"   Especially if all you had to do was spit is a tube everyday!

You said, quote, "I really have trouble understanding the complaints about daily testing." I gave you the medical reason, i.e., that this frequency of testing is medically unnecessary. I assume hospitals know something about what is medically necessary and what is not.

 

As to your questions: I would be fine with an initial test, upon boarding, that shows I don't have Covid. That information and my vaccinated status would give me peace of mind. After that, I don't need to know, day in and day out, whether the guy in the cabin next to mine has Covid. He's fully vaccinated, too; he tested negative, too; and he and I will wear masks and socially distance around each other.  

[KarNog]

6 minutes ago, Rappersmom said:

I don't think anyone expects emails. But since it's Iceland policy that anyone on a bus with a positive person is automatically quarantined, that should be noted somewhere on myvikingjourney so that people can make up their own minds whether that's a risk they are willing to take. There are alternatives.

It's a moot point. When you agreed to the Passenger Ticket Contract, you agreed to quarantine if and when Viking felt it was in the best interest of everyone. "in our sole discretion"

; (10) confinement of Passengers to cabins (both Passenger’s own Cabin and cabins specially used for isolation), quarantine or emergency disembarkation of Passenger if, in our sole discretion, such steps are necessary to prevent or slow the spread of COVID-19;

Their boat, their rules.

Edited August 15, 2021 by KarNog

[travelordie]

We're on the August 28th sailing.  On My Viking Journey for this cruise, the following appears:

 

Pre-Cruise Embarkation Requirements

Important information regarding your embarkation port travel requirements including travel registration, health testing and vaccination requirements.

 

However, when I click on Learn More regarding pre-cruise embarkation requirements, the following appears:

 

Page not found

 

Is anyone else having this problem?

[rbslos18]

9 minutes ago, KarNog said:

It's a moot point. When you agreed to the Passenger Ticket Contract, you agreed to quarantine if and when Viking felt it was in the best interest of everyone. "in our sole discretion"

; (10) confinement of Passengers to cabins (both Passenger’s own Cabin and cabins specially used for isolation), quarantine or emergency disembarkation of Passenger if, in our sole discretion, such steps are necessary to prevent or slow the spread of COVID-19;

This is not about Viking's quarantine policy which is acceptable and reasonable. It is about Iceland's policy which overrides Viking's protocol. This information should be shared by Viking so we can make intelligent decisions.

Edited August 15, 2021 by rbslos18

[KarNog]

4 minutes ago, DaveSJ711 said:

You said, quote, "I really have trouble understanding the complaints about daily testing." I gave you the medical reason, i.e., that this frequency of testing is medically unnecessary. I assume hospitals know something about what is medically necessary and what is not.

 

As to your questions: I would be fine with an initial test, upon boarding, that shows I don't have Covid. That information and my vaccinated status would give me peace of mind. After that, I don't need to know, day in and day out, whether the guy in the cabin next to mine has Covid. He's fully vaccinated, too; he tested negative, too; and he and I will wear masks and socially distance around each other.  

I'm glad for daily tests. That's why I'm sailing with Viking and not with Carnival or Disney or DaveSJ711's cruise line.

[Rappersmom]

1 minute ago, KarNog said:

It's a moot point. When you agreed to the Passenger Ticket Contract, you agreed to quarantine if and when Viking felt it was in the best interest of everyone. "in our sole discretion"

; (10) confinement of Passengers to cabins (both Passenger’s own Cabin and cabins specially used for isolation), quarantine or emergency disembarkation of Passenger if, in our sole discretion, such steps are necessary to prevent or slow the spread of COVID-19;

No. It's not a moot point. If you know the specifics of the rules you have some control over whether you want to put yourself in that situation. If you know that bus rides present an additional risk of quarantine you can choose not to take a bus ride. If you feel that overall there is too much risk, you can choose to cancel the trip. If you decide to chance it, then yes, Viking is in charge.

 

[firefox33]

I agree.

My only complaint is regarding the recent “bubble order” imposed by Viking.  I have asked for clarification.  This what I have sent to Viking.

 

Vikings email of August 4, 2021 stated the following:

 

“ Dear Viking Guest,

 

This message is to advise you of a change to what was previously communicated regarding independent exploration in Iceland.

 

On August 2, 2021, the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) updated the travel advisory level for Iceland to a "Level 3." As a result of this change, we do not expect that independent exploration will be permitted. Therefore only Viking-operated shore excursions will be allowed during your voyage. Rest assured, we will offer a range of shore excursions, including sightseeing, special interest and active tours, and each one will be hosted by an experienced guide. We continue to monitor the situation and will notify you of any changes.

 

If you have any questions regarding this matter, please call Reservations at 1-855-300-3970, Monday through Sunday, 5:00 AM to 7:00 PM, PT. 

We look forward to welcoming you on board. 

Sincerely, 

Viking”

 

However the Iceland government has not changed its COVID limitations regarding activities of any kind per the following statement :

 

“August 10, 2021 Ministry of Health, Ministry for Foreign Affairs

COVID-19: Current restrictions on gatherings extended to August 27

Iceland’s Minister of Health has decided, in accordance with the recommendations of the Chief Epidemiologist, to extend the current regulation on restrictions on gatherings due to COVID-19 by two weeks. The general limit of gatherings will be 200 persons and one metre social distance rule will remain in place.

 

Since the end of June there has been an uptick in domestic infections due to the spread of the Delta variant. Most cases are among fully vaccinated individuals showing little or no symptoms. Current restrictions were announced on July 23 and took effect two days later. They were supposed to remain in force until August 14 but have now been extended for further two weeks.”

 

As a result of this there has been no increased limitations on “independent exploration” imposed by Iceland as assumed in Viking’s email of August 4., and therefore we assume independent exploration will be allowed as has been the past.

Please confirm in writing.

Thank you,

I have been told I will have a response tomorrow.

[DaveSJ711]

3 minutes ago, KarNog said:

I'm glad for daily tests. That's why I'm sailing with Viking and not with Carnival or Disney or DaveSJ711's cruise line.

Stop the snark, please. My line is Viking. I have the right to comment on a practice that, IMO, is medically unnecessary. I also have the right to go on a cruise notwithstanding that practice. The rights aren't mutually exclusive. 

Edited August 15, 2021 by DaveSJ711

[KarNog]

1 minute ago, Rappersmom said:

No. It's not a moot point. If you know the specifics of the rules you have some control over whether you want to put yourself in that situation. If you know that bus rides present an additional risk of quarantine you can choose not to take a bus ride. If you feel that overall there is too much risk, you can choose to cancel the trip. If you decide to chance it, then yes, Viking is in charge.

 

The rules are very specific in that Viking will decide if and when passengers are to be quarantined. They cannot list every incident in which quarantine may be required because they simply don't know yet. That's why the phrase, in our sole discretion, is in place.

[KarNog]

1 minute ago, DaveSJ711 said:

Stop the snark, please. My line is Viking. I have the right to comment on a practice that, IMO, is medically unnecessary. I also have the right to go on a cruise notwithstanding that practice. The rights aren't mutually exclusive. 

But that IS why I chose Viking. I trust them to do the best for me. I don't trust the other cruise lines. 

[Rappersmom]

Just now, KarNog said:

The rules are very specific in that Viking will decide if and when passengers are to be quarantined. They cannot list every incident in which quarantine may be required because they simply don't know yet. That's why the phrase, in our sole discretion, is in place.

It's not in their sole discretion. Iceland overrules that. And they can list what they do know for sure with a caveat that things change. No one expects them to list what they don't know yet. Of course.

[Packer Fan!]

It may well be that Viking is required by Iceland to report the number of Covid cases on board when they arrive at each port.  As we’ve learned from reading previous posts, the port authorities can at any time close the port to arriving ships.  In any event the question of daily testing is moot since it a currently required by all passengers and crew.  

[KarNog]

1 minute ago, Rappersmom said:

It's not in their sole discretion. Iceland overrules that. And they can list what they do know for sure with a caveat that things change. No one expects them to list what they don't know yet. Of course.

I'd think their sole discretion is partly based on what's allowable by the host and partly based on their liability to their customers among other factors. Viking cannot override Iceland's requirements and expect to be welcomed into port.

[Dukefan]

9 minutes ago, DaveSJ711 said:

You said, quote, "I really have trouble understanding the complaints about daily testing." I gave you the medical reason, i.e., that this frequency of testing is medically unnecessary. I assume hospitals know something about what is medically necessary and what is not.

 

As to your questions: I would be fine with an initial test, upon boarding, that shows I don't have Covid. That information and my vaccinated status would give me peace of mind. After that, I don't need to know, day in and day out, whether the guy in the cabin next to mine has Covid. He's fully vaccinated, too; he tested negative, too; and he and I will wear masks and socially distance around each other.  

Every one of the folks that tested positive fro Covid on a Viking Cruise tested negitive when they boarded.  The fact that they tested positive later shows why daily testing is good.   The fact that there has been no evidence of a positive person starting a Covid cluster on a Viking ship I believe demonstrates the advantage of contact tracing and quaranrine.   With regard to hospitals doing daily testing, I believe it is more a question of staffing and other resources instead of it being a best practice.  I will explore this more with some of my friends that are senior folks at the Duke Universary Medical Center. 

 

As a matter of reference, the reason that I took three Covid tests over a five day period was that one Covid test, may not demostrate whether you have Covid or not depending on where you are in the virus cycle.  

 

I know the ship has all vacinated passengers but unfortunately the communities the passengers visit have children in them too young to get the vacine.  I personally would not want to have Covid and spread it to a child.

[LindaS272]

13 minutes ago, KarNog said:

The rules are very specific in that Viking will decide if and when passengers are to be quarantined. They cannot list every incident in which quarantine may be required because they simply don't know yet. That's why the phrase, in our sole discretion, is in place.

What happens if I am confirmed to be a close contact with a guest who tests positive?
Viking’s policy is that close contacts who are fully vaccinated do not have to quarantine. This policy is in line with current CDC guidelines. However, a different approach may be required when in a destination, depending on the local situation at the time.

 

And the point here, despite your snark, is that Viking is not being transparent about how Iceland’s policies, in this case, will impact pax.

[Heartgrove]

The chairman of Viking had a news release dated December 11, 2020  announcing that they would be doing daily PCR testing.

[Rappersmom]

8 minutes ago, KarNog said:

I'd think their sole discretion is partly based on what's allowable by the host and partly based on their liability to their customers among other factors. Viking cannot override Iceland's requirements and expect to be welcomed into port.

I don't think anyone expects that or is anyone arguing that. Of course Iceland has ultimate authority. Asking for a little transparency in communications is not questioning anyone's authority to make the decisions they do. Nor are we saying anyone in particular should not go to Iceland or shouldn't take a bus ride. That's an individual decision, preferably made with accurate information. Enjoy your trip

[KarNog]

1 minute ago, LindaS272 said:

What happens if I am confirmed to be a close contact with a guest who tests positive?
Viking’s policy is that close contacts who are fully vaccinated do not have to quarantine. This policy is in line with current CDC guidelines. However, a different approach may be required when in a destination, depending on the local situation at the time.

 

And the point here, despite your snark, is that Viking is not being transparent about how Iceland’s policies, in this case, will impact pax.

Perhaps you're misinterpreting the last sentence. "depending on the local situation" could mean that Covid cases are rising quickly and they feel it's in the best interest to impose more strict regulations to prevent spread on the ship among their passengers. Nothing in that sentence specifies that Iceland has made a proclamation or a change in their requirements.

[KarNog]

27 minutes ago, travelordie said:

We're on the August 28th sailing.  On My Viking Journey for this cruise, the following appears:

 

Pre-Cruise Embarkation Requirements

Important information regarding your embarkation port travel requirements including travel registration, health testing and vaccination requirements.

 

However, when I click on Learn More regarding pre-cruise embarkation requirements, the following appears:

 

Page not found

 

Is anyone else having this problem?

Mine's working on Chrome.

[KarNog]

My dear husband works with the public every day, seven days a week. Oh, if only I could test him daily for his own peace of mind!  

[DaveSJ711]

5 minutes ago, Dukefan said:

The basis for my approach to Viking's daily testing is (as I have stated in at least two other times - (I'm not being "snarky" here - just factual) that I want to know if I have Covid so as to not give it to others and I would like to know if the people around me have Covid.   If I could spit in a tube at home every morning when I wake up and have it picked up and tested (and all my friends and the people I'm around could), I would do it in a minute but unfortunately the resources don't exist to make that happen.

 

I understand your personal feelings about testing. It's your right to have those feelings. What I don't understand, however, is your belief that hospitals don't follow best practices when they don't require daily testing. That's a different issue altogether -- and why I asked about the basis for your belief about the hospital approach. 

Edited August 15, 2021 by DaveSJ711

[LindaS272]

1 minute ago, KarNog said:

Perhaps you're misinterpreting the last sentence. "depending on the local situation" could mean that Covid cases are rising quickly and they feel it's in the best interest to impose more strict regulations to prevent spread on the ship among their passengers. Nothing in that sentence specifies that Iceland has made a proclamation or a change in their requirements.

You haven’t been keeping up with the escalation of Iceland’s requirements vis-a-vis Viking. With the first positive case, Viking stated they had an agreement with the Icelandic Health Authority, then another part of the government stepped in and  denied landing in all remaining ports. Viking actually communicated about that situation, after the fact.

 

With quarantining in regard to an entire bus (or buses) with one (or two) positive cases, there was no public communication to my knowledge. So no, I’m not “misinterpreting” the sentence about the local situation. The overarching point, which does not seem to be registering, is that Viking is not being transparent with its customers. We’ve already seen the information from medical professionals that daily testing is not medically necessary; Iceland states at Covid.is that it’s not necessary to test close contacts on land unless they have symptoms; and nowhere does Viking communicate that only in Iceland does the “local situation” dictate that an entire bus needs to be isolated “so that Covid will not spread on the ship”. Viking’s policy with regard to close contacts is pretty clear to me!

[IWantToLiveOverTheSea]

47 minutes ago, KarNog said:

I'm glad for daily tests. That's why I'm sailing with Viking and not with Carnival or Disney or DaveSJ711's cruise line.

Even a very small Windstar ship had a positive recently, though just one.  It was cruising in Greece, so no quarantine, other than positive person and travel partner. 

[KarNog]

Just now, LindaS272 said:

You haven’t been keeping up with the escalation of Iceland’s requirements vis-a-vis Viking. With the first positive case, Viking stated they had an agreement with the Icelandic Health Authority, then another part of the government stepped in and  denied landing in all remaining ports. Viking actually communicated about that situation, after the fact.

 

With quarantining in regard to an entire bus (or buses) with one (or two) positive cases, there was no public communication to my knowledge. So no, I’m not “misinterpreting” the sentence about the local situation. The overarching point, which does not seem to be registering, is that Viking is not being transparent with its customers. We’ve already seen the information from medical professionals that daily testing is not medically necessary; Iceland states at Covid.is that it’s not necessary to test close contacts on land unless they have symptoms; and nowhere does Viking communicate that only in Iceland does the “local situation” dictate that an entire bus needs to be isolated “so that Covid will not spread on the ship”. Viking’s policy with regard to close contacts is pretty clear to me!

The overarching point is that Viking doesn't have to be more transparent with its customers. Repeatedly, it's been stated that they have the sole discretion to do as they please. 

Many of their customers apparently are satisfied with their decisions. If the majority become dissatisfied, Viking will change its policies or sail off into the sunset alone.