Updated drink package information

[Boytjie]

11 minutes ago, mcrcruiser said:

They are not the only ones & there  are  thousands upon thousands whom have lost their small business during this  pandemic . I personally resent the fact that cruise lines raise prices & cut back  simultaneously  . Keep doing that & those once happy  cruisers will be looking else where to spend their post taxed hard earned monies   . There are many different sized pocket books out there & one size don't fit all . Even now ships are sailing with far less pax than pre pandemic levels & it is not just because of cruise fares alone .Add in hassles of  flying today , high cost of pre & or post cruse hotel stays , general high inflation in the USA , the pre cruise medical hoops & now you can see the reality of the future of the cruise industry ;which imo is not a business I would invest my dollars into  

 

A lot of things have become more expensive due to the pandemic, like food and gas; resenting business for having to do that to stay in business is rather obnoxious. Cruise ships are sailing at reduced capacity for safety sake, not to price gouge you.

Funny how you seem more upset about the cruise lines and less so with the airlines and hotels... everything is more expensive, you either accept that or change how you want to travel and vacation.

 

[kazu]

21 minutes ago, mcrcruiser said:

Trust me We have flown all over the world but when there are physical restraints  flying is then not a option any longer . One day you may get there yourself  

 

When we get there, we won’t be cruising.  We can’t get to any cruise ship unless we fly 😉 

 

21 minutes ago, mcrcruiser said:

Candidly I really do not care what the cruise lines endured during the pandemic . They are not the only ones & there  are  thousands upon thousands whom have lost their small business during this  pandemic . I personally resent the fact that cruise lines raise prices & cut back  simultaneously  . Keep doing that & those once happy  cruisers will be looking else where to spend their post taxed hard earned monies 

 

 

Many places have raised prices to cover the costs of precautionary measures and covid impacts. Prices have gone up.  Period.  IE:  My hairdresser’s prices rose and I understood.  Groceries have risen.  Dental costs have increased.  The list is pretty long.  Costs are up - it’s not just cruise lines.  We’re all paying for the pandemic and it’s implications on many businesses, transportation and backlogs.

[sambamama]

I sympathize with the cruise lines' positions, but a contract is a contract. It's legally binding. A company can't change the terms unilaterally. HAL changed its terms about water, soda and wine. I get that, and I understand that. They added COVID tests. I get that and I'm glad and I understand that. But you can't legally go back in time and unilaterally change contract terms. And that is what HAL has done and that is what airlines and travel companies have done when they, afterwards, changed full refunds to vouchers that expired. You call it whining. I call it standing up for consumers. If we are entitled to a drink worth $11, then 15 x 11 =$165. You think 11 sodas totals $165? Or if it's $9, then 15 x $9= $141. Let me have the equivalent of $141 a day. Then for any cruises after this, well, fair is fair. HAL has its new policy. I can choose to buy it or not. I am not whining-I am pointing out what I was sold and what I am now given. 

[mcrcruiser]

4 minutes ago, Boytjie said:

 

A lot of things have become more expensive due to the pandemic, like food and gas; resenting business for having to do that to stay in business is rather obnoxious. Cruise ships are sailing at reduced capacity for safety sake, not to price gouge you.

Funny how you seem more upset about the cruise lines and less so with the airlines and hotels... everything is more expensive, you either accept that or change how you want to travel and vacation.

 

Should this pandemic last a lot longer you will see more than cruise lines fail .  . Not only the political restrictions  but the supply chain problems world wide . BTW ,your words not mine ,I knew that hotels & airlines fares rose ;but have incomes kept up with the hideous effects of inflation ?  then try to see what seniors on fixed incomes need to contend with because of inflation induced by reckless government 

[Boytjie]

1 minute ago, mcrcruiser said:

Should this pandemic last a lot longer you will see more than cruise lines fail .  . Not only the political restrictions  but the supply chain problems world wide . BTW ,your words not mine ,I knew that hotels & airlines fares rose ;but have incomes kept up with the hideous effects of inflation ?  then try to see what seniors on fixed incomes need to contend with because of inflation induced by reckless government 

 

I do believe that a portion of price increases are in fact due to wages being increased, some of it to a shortage of workers. It is all kinda supply and demand, you know. So you think "reckless government" is responsible for inflation? Oy.

[mcrcruiser]

8 minutes ago, sambamama said:

I sympathize with the cruise lines' positions, but a contract is a contract. It's legally binding. A company can't change the terms unilaterally. HAL changed its terms about water, soda and wine. I get that, and I understand that. They added COVID tests. I get that and I'm glad and I understand that. But you can't legally go back in time and unilaterally change contract terms. And that is what HAL has done and that is what airlines and travel companies have done when they, afterwards, changed full refunds to vouchers that expired. You call it whining. I call it standing up for consumers. If we are entitled to a drink worth $11, then 15 x 11 =$165. You think 11 sodas totals $165? Or if it's $9, then 15 x $9= $141. Let me have the equivalent of $141 a day. Then for any cruises after this, well, fair is fair. HAL has its new policy. I can choose to buy it or not. I am not whining-I am pointing out what I was sold and what I am now given. 

The problem with many on these threads is  their own tunnel vision . They can't or won't   walk in someones shoes  . Imo it is their way or the highway & that is what  this HAL board has become   instead of eduction with caring 

 

 You are 1000% correct & I agree totally 

[Daniel A]

10 hours ago, KAKcruiser said:

It was my impression that there was always a 15 drink limit for alcoholic drinks but no limit on nonalcoholic drinks like coffee and soda.  When did this change?

That was what I bought and paid for.  When I compared the Signature and Elite drink packages they were exactly the same except for the higher cost per drink limit in Elite.  I know this because I needed to find out how to upgrade to Elite as DW likes vodka martinis and I needed to know if I needed the Elite package to cover the cost of her drinks.  Everything was the same except the $15 vs $11.  If I had seen that the Signature package limited the drinks to 15/day for all drinks and Elite was 15/day for alcohol only and soft drinks were unlimited above the 15 drink limit I wouldn't have had a question at all which package I would prefer.

 

 

[sambamama]

I bought a drink package that gave me unlimited nonalcoholic drinks for my cruise. Of course, that cruise has been cancelled over and over. I just want what I bought. I would not expect any drink package in the future to be the same. Yes, I am well aware of what the cruise industry is going through. I am very aware of how difficult it is for them. However, HAL hasn't helped itself much lately. They could have announced the change in the drink package with an email. They could have stated that cruises booked prior would still have the old package. 

[Daniel A]

24 minutes ago, kazu said:

Many places have raised prices to cover the costs of precautionary measures and covid impacts. Prices have gone up.  Period.  IE:  My hairdresser’s prices rose and I understood.  Groceries have risen.  Dental costs have increased.  The list is pretty long.  Costs are up - it’s not just cruise lines.  We’re all paying for the pandemic and it’s implications on many businesses, transportation and backlogs.

There is a difference between raising prices and changing the terms of what you get after you have paid.  Would you be as understanding if HAL wrote to you and said you now have to pay a fee to use the elevators on your next cruise or you were limited to just one plate at meals?  (Oh, you want dessert?  That will be an additional charge but we won't tell you that in advance you'll just see it at the end of your cruise.)  Would you accept the Cadillac dealer giving you a Chevrolet after you paid for an Escalade?

[Sea42]

23 minutes ago, sambamama said:

I bought a drink package that gave me unlimited nonalcoholic drinks for my cruise.

Have you requested a refund due to the change in the package you purchased?

[kazu]

26 minutes ago, Daniel A said:

There is a difference between raising prices and changing the terms of what you get after you have paid.  Would you be as understanding if HAL wrote to you and said you now have to pay a fee to use the elevators on your next cruise or you were limited to just one plate at meals?  (Oh, you want dessert?  That will be an additional charge but we won't tell you that in advance you'll just see it at the end of your cruise.)  Would you accept the Cadillac dealer giving you a Chevrolet after you paid for an Escalade?

 

I guess I am looking at it differently as the written terms hadn’t changed on mine.  I booked my cruise where I have the SBP well over a year ago and the terms of the SBP specifically said up 15 drinks per day at the time.  The word unlimited was not in the wording of my SBP so I do not see it as a change of terms .  Instead it appears that the original terms are now being enforced.  JMO

[Daniel A]

23 minutes ago, kazu said:

The word unlimited was not in the wording of my SBP so I do not see it as a change of terms .  Instead it appears that the original terms are now being enforced.  JMO

Where the word unlimited appeared was in the description of the Quench package.  The description of the Signature package stated that it included the benefits of the Quench package plus 15 alcoholic drinks per day.

 

Per HAL's previous FAQ's on Beverage packages:

 

ELITE PACKAGE

Only $59.95 per guest/per day*

Enjoy all the benefits from our Quench and Signature Packages and more! With the Elite Beverage Package you can enjoy all drinks menu priced $15 and under including Dale DeGroff’s Original Cocktails!

 

 

SIGNATURE PACKAGE

Only $54.95 per guest/per day*

Our Signature package includes everything from our Quench Package along with your favorite premium beers, spirits, cocktails, and wines by the glass priced $11 and under.

 

 

QUENCH PACKAGE

(NON-ALCOHOLIC)

Only $17.95 per guest/per day* Quench your thirst with our nonalcoholic package which includes an unlimited variety of premium coffees such as espresso and cappuccino, juices, Coca-Cola™ products, our signature mocktails, Red Bull, and bottled waters 500ml and under.

 

The emphasis was added by me.  As you can see, the word "unlimited" clearly appears in the description of the Quench package which is included with the Signature package, so yes, it is certainly a change in the terms of the package I purchased.

 

To see this for yourself, click here:

Frequently Asked Questions | Holland America

 

 

[figmentdj]

"If I had seen that the Signature package limited the drinks to 15/day for all drinks and Elite was 15/day for alcohol only and soft drinks were unlimited above the 15 drink limit I wouldn't have had a question at all which package I would prefer."

 

So after all that, where did we land on this. Elite=15/day for alcohol  and unlimited soft drinks? yes or no

[kazu]

14 minutes ago, Daniel A said:

Where the word unlimited appeared was in the description of the Quench package.  The description of the Signature package stated that it included the benefits of the Quench package plus 15 alcoholic drinks per day.

 

Per HAL's previous FAQ's on Beverage packages:

 

ELITE PACKAGE

Only $59.95 per guest/per day*

Enjoy all the benefits from our Quench and Signature Packages and more! With the Elite Beverage Package you can enjoy all drinks menu priced $15 and under including Dale DeGroff’s Original Cocktails!

 

 

SIGNATURE PACKAGE

Only $54.95 per guest/per day*

Our Signature package includes everything from our Quench Package along with your favorite premium beers, spirits, cocktails, and wines by the glass priced $11 and under.

 

 

QUENCH PACKAGE

(NON-ALCOHOLIC)

Only $17.95 per guest/per day* Quench your thirst with our nonalcoholic package which includes an unlimited variety of premium coffees such as espresso and cappuccino, juices, Coca-Cola™ products, our signature mocktails, Red Bull, and bottled waters 500ml and under.

 

The emphasis was added by me.  As you can see, the word "unlimited" clearly appears in the description of the Quench package which is included with the Signature package, so yes, it is certainly a change in the terms of the package I purchased.

 

To see this for yourself, click here:

Frequently Asked Questions | Holland America

 

 

 

Thanks.  I can now see where the unlimited is coming into play    I was looking at the SBP wording on my booking and not the Quench package.

[kazu]

10 minutes ago, figmentdj said:

"If I had seen that the Signature package limited the drinks to 15/day for all drinks and Elite was 15/day for alcohol only and soft drinks were unlimited above the 15 drink limit I wouldn't have had a question at all which package I would prefer."

 

So after all that, where did we land on this. Elite=15/day for alcohol  and unlimited soft drinks? yes or no

 

From my reading of the Elite package offered for purchase on my cruises, I would say no.

This is what I saw when I pretended I was considering buying it.  

 

 

Note - it says up to 15 drinks per day.

 

Edited to say - you could email HAL to get confirmation one way or the other and if they say unlimited, print off the email and take it with you.

[CruiserBruce]

2 hours ago, mcrcruiser said:

The problem with many on these threads is  their own tunnel vision . They can't or won't   walk in someones shoes  . Imo it is their way or the highway & that is what  this HAL board has become   instead of eduction with caring 

 

 You are 1000% correct & I agree totally 

And some people ONLY blame others for everything, and never look in the mirror.

[Daniel A]

1 hour ago, figmentdj said:

So after all that, where did we land on this. Elite=15/day for alcohol  and unlimited soft drinks? yes or no

 

57 minutes ago, kazu said:

 

From my reading of the Elite package offered for purchase on my cruises, I would say no.

Note - it says up to 15 drinks per day.

Edited to say - you could email HAL to get confirmation one way or the other and if they say unlimited, print off the email and take it with you.

If you send an e-mail about the Elite package and get a response, please post the response here.

 

Thanks.

[sambamama]

I will certainly write HAL and ask that the terms of the STP package that I booked be allowed as I booked my cruise the end of 2000, used all my FCC and paid another $515 as well. My cruise has been paid in full for over 9 months now, and it won't sail now for another 15 1/2 months.

[Overhead Fred]

14 hours ago, mcrcruiser said:

The problem with many on these threads is  their own tunnel vision .

 

Pot, may I introduce you to Kettle? 

[figmentdj]

13 hours ago, sambamama said:

I will certainly write HAL and ask that the terms of the STP package that I booked be allowed as I booked my cruise the end of 2000, used all my FCC and paid another $515 as well. My cruise has been paid in full for over 9 months now, and it won't sail now for another 15 1/2 months.

I was going to call and write as well but not sure what email to address to use as the topics suggested didn't list "inconsistent verbiage"😉 seriously, what address do I use?

 

[Daniel A]

23 minutes ago, figmentdj said:

I was going to call and write as well but not sure what email to address to use as the topics suggested didn't list "inconsistent verbiage"😉 seriously, what address do I use?

Two days in a row, I have tried to find out using the chat feature on the HAL homepage.  Nobody ever connects.

[roxybear135]

31 minutes ago, figmentdj said:

I was going to call and write as well but not sure what email to address to use as the topics suggested didn't list "inconsistent verbiage"😉 seriously, what address do I use?

 

I sent in a help request online, and emailed Gus Antorcha, the email address on the HAL Facebook page, and my PCC about this.  Zero response.  So no idea who to email next but let us know if you miraculously get a response from HAL about this issue.

[figmentdj]

48 minutes ago, roxybear135 said:

I sent in a help request online, and emailed Gus Antorcha, the email address on the HAL Facebook page, and my PCC about this.  Zero response.  So no idea who to email next but let us know if you miraculously get a response from HAL about this issue.

Well, I called HAL CSR and after a couple of tentative explanations and some on holds, she verified that Elite is 15 alcoholic and unlimited non-alcoholic. I feel 75% positive about this. That said, the rep even said take any verbiage you have to back this up. I plan on taking the brochure  you sent and point out the first paragraph in the frequently asked questions, igniting the discrepancies in the terms and conditions. Of course, first hand knowledge in the upcoming weeks will be most helpful.

1968873714_071521-BeveragePackage.pdf

[Daniel A]

1 hour ago, figmentdj said:

Well, I called HAL CSR and after a couple of tentative explanations and some on holds, she verified that Elite is 15 alcoholic and unlimited non-alcoholic. I feel 75% positive about this. That said, the rep even said take any verbiage you have to back this up. I plan on taking the brochure  you sent and point out the first paragraph in the frequently asked questions, igniting the discrepancies in the terms and conditions. Of course, first hand knowledge in the upcoming weeks will be most helpful.

1968873714_071521-BeveragePackage.pdf 1.19 MB · 10 downloads

It is repeated in the middle of the purple section containing the terms and conditions.

[figmentdj]

30 minutes ago, Daniel A said:

It is repeated in the middle of the purple section containing the terms and conditions.

It is inconsistent in the terms and conditions. As we've pointed out before: 

 

Quench, Signature and Elite Packages have a daily limit of 15 Beverages. The Signature Package includes all beverages up to $11 in value and counts all zero-proof beverages towards the daily limit. Elite Package includes all beverages up to $15 in value and includes unlimited Zero-Proof beverages.

 

It's probably lazy proofing but its caused quite the confusion especially when you add the inconsistent verbiage on the website as well.

 

Edited October 5, 2021 by figmentdj