Zenith back in the Retreat

[swjumbo]

7 hours ago, cruiseerf said:

We very much enjoy our time in the Retreat/Michaels club lounge.   We book mostly suites however last minute sometimes we do book aqua class or veranda cabins.  We are Both Zenith members at least twice and would like to be clear.   For those that say the Retreat was "never crowded" you must be a Zenith looking for a seat there?   Our experience has been that on day of Arrival and Departure, Many Zenith members hold court in The Retreat/Michaels club.....often inviting their friends and family to depart with them in pre arranged transport.   When we have been onboard and there have been groups of 10+ with people in Various cabin types it makes the Retreat lounge hosts the bad guys explaining the rules everyone knows Before boarding.   Pre Covid Transatlantic we had 28 Zeniths onboard with partners which meant 56 extra people......Michaels club was a horror......no seats, talkers who didn't' know when to shut it, no dress code enforced,   and many Zeniths who felt they owned the ship.  Transatlantic B4 that we had 22 which equated to 49 extras and we had a group in Michaels that was not only disrespectful but also nasty.   After several of these VERY CROWDED transatlantics,  I would say that the Retreat should indeed be kept separate and only for suites.   Zeniths are well taken care of in Tuscan for Brekkie,  Lunch, so many choices, and dinner as well, and Laundry pressing and dry-cleaning is covered.   Too many people in Celebrities program are continually trying to game it.    This is not fair to the people actually paying in Todays $$$ for the services they do not get when the Zeniths are out in full force.   It only takes a few to spoil it for all of us.   

Totally agree and you merely confirm my earlier post.

 

Also, it is not the same as upgrading on an aircraft.

 

On an aeroplane (or airplane lol) you are not taking up room or using the premium facilities. You are given your designated seat/bed and it is yours for the journey. 

If you were travelling with one of the better long haul carriers with a bar up front do you really think you’d be allowed to use it if you were a mega points card holder who was sitting in economy/coach? 

Absolutely not!

Funnily enough, friends in the aviation industry tell me that the most awkward passengers, who think they are someone special, are those who are going on a cruise!

 

[Ipeeinthepools]

21 hours ago, canderson said:

You can be sure if it's a Westinghouse.

 

(Showing our age much?)

 

Probably.  But it's always sad when I think about Westinghouse.  During my formative years, Westinghouse was one of the top "tech" companies of the time with a top research lab and a very diversified set of businesses.  I worked summers during college in the Power Generation division.   But now Westinghouse has been reduced to just a footnote in old time discussions like this.  Just sad.

[Redtravel]

Been sailing on Celebrity for 30+ years. It used to be classless.. service was fabulous regardless of cabin category. There was no excluded area or reserved section for the big spenders.  Inside, Oceanview, and suites. Verandas came later.  Next came concierge. Then aqua. MDR was where everyone ate for most meals.  There were a few specialty dining room with a small surcharge.   We often were assigned to a dining table with a mix of people.  It was better.  Nobody got better treatment.  Everyone was happy. There were no snobby people.  When I read about the people who want to shun the Zenith guests from the Retreat, it made me sad.  

[TeeRick]

On 3/3/2022 at 11:41 PM, swjumbo said:

......I do not want Zenith members thinking they’re better than me. 

 

I have met a few Zenith members who thought they owned Celebrity. I do not want to spend time listening to these people in The Retreat thinking I am not worthy.

I am not a Zenith member and probably will never be one.  I really don't understand your worry about them thinking they are better than you or that you are not worthy.  Zenith, E+, E etc are just loyalty levels based upon the number of cruise nights.  That's it.  They are not in any way status symbols about any comparisons to how you or I feel about ourselves in their presence.  Sorry but I kind of find that a bit strange.

[davekathy]

51 minutes ago, TeeRick said:

I am not a Zenith member and probably will never be one.  I really don't understand your worry about them thinking they are better than you or that you are not worthy.  Zenith, E+, E etc are just loyalty levels based upon the number of cruise nights.  That's it.  They are not in any way status symbols about any comparisons to how you or I feel about ourselves in their presence.  Sorry but I kind of find that a bit strange.

Agree. Same types of accusations about RC Pinnacles.  

[Beachin2]

RC Pinnacles have pretty much ruined the Concierge/Suite Lounge experience for many suite guests on that line - lesson should be learned from that brand.  Don't make the same mistake X. 

 

Give the Z's their own (but separate) preening space if need be.

[davekathy]

9 minutes ago, Beachin2 said:

RC Pinnacles have pretty much ruined the Concierge/Suite Lounge experience for many suite guests on that line - lesson should be learned from that brand.  Don't make the same mistake X. 

 

Give the Z's their own (but separate) preening space if need be.

No fault of the Pinnacles or even the Zeniths. That's all on RC and Celebrity. 

[Spif Barwunkel]

Whether or not Zeniths or Pinnacles or Vikings or Middle Aged Monocled Men in Tweed Jackets are back in the Retreat, makes no difference to me. I'm sure they are good folks whom I will not miss having a drink with, and hopefully they will not be made to feel uncomfortable or unworthy due to being in my presence. 

 

As ridiculous as that may sound to some, it sounds like it fits right in. I personally do not care what your cruising tier or classification is, just don't "make it a point" to let me know. You surely won't know mine. Certainly, there are too many more important reasons to go where we go and do what we do. That coveted uncrowded gathering place is gone because there are more of us going there. Solitude is what cabins are for, no matter the category. 

Edited March 6, 2022 by Spif Barwunkel

[LGW59]

3 minutes ago, Spif Barwunkel said:

Whether or not Zeniths or Pinnacles or Vikings or Middle Aged Monocled Men in Tweed Jackets are back in the Retreat, makes no difference to me. I'm sure they are good folks whom I will not miss having a drink with, and hopefully they will not be made to feel uncomfortable or unworthy due to being in my presence. 

 

As ridiculous as that may sound to some, it sounds like it fits right in. I personally do not care what your cruising tier or classification is, just don't "make it a point" to let me know. You surely won't know mine. Certainly, there are too many more important reasons to go where we go and do what we do. That coveted uncrowded gathering place is gone because there are more of us going there. It's what cabins are for, no mater the category. 

I once made the "mistake" of responding to a poster who asked me a question regarding a cruise we had booked.  In my OP I said for the first time ever we are staying in an upper suite and were so excited.  Well the cruise never happened, would have been Summit, Jan 2021, we know how that worked out.  When I responded to the question about the suite, someone came back and said why do you people who stay in suites feel the need to brag about it, I was like HUH?  I never responded to him though.  Will never be Zenith, E+ or whatever, so will take what I can get, when I can get it.  

[morpheusofthesea]

   At the present time with so few passengers cruising, one would surmise that there would be no need to get up before the break of dawn and chair hog up on deck. But, alas, we have been on cruises every month, but January, for a weeks cruise since restart, and have found it to be a chair hogs' delight. Not only are the chair hogs hogging one lounge, they are now hogging a second (one in the shade and one in the sun) at the same time. The CD (cruise director) even joked that the ship that has a capacity of 6500 guests with only 1000 guests on board can now 'hog' 6 deck chairs at once. Solariums, posted ‘adult only’, are being ignored and unenforced.

   We thought we could 'escape' the chair hogs by booking a cabin on ships that now cater to a "ship within a ship" guests. A secluded area with more 'space' and deck chairs, but that is still not been the case. The "Retreats", "Yacht Clubs" and “Coastal Kitchens” suite venues are even more popular and often book up to capacity. Move-up programs, filling unsold suites have exacerbated the situation and guests are experiencing the same problems of just not enough deck space and chairs for the number of guests. Allowing non-suite paying loyalty program Pinnacles, Zeniths or Diamonds access to suite venues takes all the benefits of exclusivity away, as well as increases wait times for a chair in the lounge or a table for dinner. Booking a suite with a nice balcony solves only half the problem.

Complaining appears to be fruitless. Will try to find that ‘goldilocks’ cruise line/ship that caters to its guests the best. It’s a time consuming process, but some of us just have to ‘leap into this breach’ and sacrifice for the few.

[Beachin2]

1 hour ago, morpheusofthesea said:

   

   We thought we could 'escape' the chair hogs by booking a cabin on ships that now cater to a "ship within a ship" guests. A secluded area with more 'space' and deck chairs, but that is still not been the case. The "Retreats", "Yacht Clubs" and “Coastal Kitchens” suite venues are even more popular and often book up to capacity.  Allowing non-suite paying loyalty program Pinnacles, Zeniths or Diamonds access to suite venues takes all the benefits of exclusivity away, as well as increases wait times for a chair in the lounge or a table for dinner. Booking a suite with a nice balcony solves only half the problem.

Complaining appears to be fruitless. Will try to find that ‘goldilocks’ cruise line/ship that caters to its guests the best. It’s a time consuming process, but some of us just have to ‘leap into this breach’ and sacrifice for the few.

 

Bingo.  This is a capacity and crowding issue.  I don't blame the line for selling upgrades.  They certainly need the revenue considering the last few years.  But when you have either P's or Z's crowding out the folks that actually paid to use the space - that's where I have an issue.

 

Give the P's & Z's their own club room to play in.

Edited March 6, 2022 by Beachin2

[swjumbo]

22 hours ago, TeeRick said:

I am not a Zenith member and probably will never be one.  I really don't understand your worry about them thinking they are better than you or that you are not worthy.  Zenith, E+, E etc are just loyalty levels based upon the number of cruise nights.  That's it.  They are not in any way status symbols about any comparisons to how you or I feel about ourselves in their presence.  Sorry but I kind of find that a bit strange.

Just the same as people who feel the need or show their Elite, Elite+ or Zenith on their profile here!

Sorry but I kind of find that a bit strange too.

[mfs2k]

On 3/5/2022 at 4:48 PM, Redtravel said:

 

Been sailing on Celebrity for 30+ years. It used to be classless.. service was fabulous regardless of cabin category. There was no excluded area or reserved section for the big spenders.

 

cruise lines needed other justifications for charging much more money for higher categories besides square footage and deck number. To maximize profit each higher category and price comes with added features. 
Automobile manufacturers learned this trick a long time ago. Airlines too. 

[mfs2k]

19 hours ago, LGW59 said:

someone said “why do you people who stay in suites feel the need to brag about it?”

I’m staying in a Sky suite for the first time in October on Beyond. Personally I have no desire to brag but I definitely am excited. I want to know everything I can about the experience before I sail and connect with other suite passengers. 

There are so many posts on CC I ignore because the topics don’t interest me now. I’m not currently reading posts about the Galápagos Islands or European ports because that’s not my current focus.
 

I imagine If I wasn’t sailing in a suite I’d be skipping Retreat posts and I wouldn’t be harassing suite guests via CC comments accusing them of bragging. 
There are more than enough posts for everyone here. 

Also, If anything, I’d brag about how much I saved to get into a suite and not how much I paid. 

i know a lot of people like me who get compliments on their designer fashion choices who reply “Thanks!  I got it for $50 at Marshall’s!”   That’s my style.
Snobs don’t do that. 

Edited March 7, 2022 by mfs2k

[Tom-n-Cheryl]

1 hour ago, swjumbo said:

Just the same as people who feel the need or show their Elite, Elite+ or Zenith on their profile here!

Sorry but I kind of find that a bit strange too.

 

I have my cruise CV in my signature. It has started conversations ("I see you were also on the ----, how did that compare to ---", and the like). And, if nothing else, it helps me to remember too --- LOL.

 

I know that there's lots of folks who don't care to see such, and just turn off signatures. I will usually glance at them, and have reached out to others in the past based on something I read there.

 

Tom

[TeeRick]

20 hours ago, LGW59 said:

I once made the "mistake" of responding to a poster who asked me a question regarding a cruise we had booked.  In my OP I said for the first time ever we are staying in an upper suite and were so excited.  Well the cruise never happened, would have been Summit, Jan 2021, we know how that worked out.  When I responded to the question about the suite, someone came back and said why do you people who stay in suites feel the need to brag about it, I was like HUH?  I never responded to him though.  Will never be Zenith, E+ or whatever, so will take what I can get, when I can get it.  

I refer to that type of response "suite envy".  Some people on here think that others staying in a suite seems to be some form of personality type or wealthy or snobbish attitude.  It is simply a buying choice.  Nothing more.  Says next to nothing about the individual except they chose a suite on that particular vacation.  It might be a special occasion one and done.  Or a consistent buying choice.  Who should really care how others spend their own money?  

[TeeRick]

1 hour ago, swjumbo said:

Just the same as people who feel the need or show their Elite, Elite+ or Zenith on their profile here!

Sorry but I kind of find that a bit strange too.

Touche'.    I have it in my signature.  I have not previously really thought about it.  I don't think it is there  to show off or offend anybody but you may choose to think so if you so desire.  I never really thought others here had a problem with that as so many members here have cruise signatures.  No problem.  We are all just people who enjoy cruising.  The more we enjoy it and cruise and spend nights on ships, we advance in a point system which is a reward system (that is less valuable now).  Not a status system IMO.  

[emmas gran]

6 minutes ago, TeeRick said:

I refer to that type of response "suite envy".  Some people on here think that others staying in a suite seems to be some form of personality type or wealthy or snobbish attitude.  It is simply a buying choice.  Nothing more.  Says next to nothing about the individual except they chose a suite on that particular vacation.  It might be a special occasion one and done.  Or a consistent buying choice.  Who should really care how others spend their own money?  

We have sailed insides,  OV only 3 or 4 times, balcony many times and recently suites, we have worked hard for this privilege much the same as how we choose to fly these days on longer flights we turn left. We will never attain the grade higher than we are but who cares --not us

[Redtravel]

Don’t care who you are or your status. Just be polite.  Zenith class people are the most loyal customers. They deserve some rewards. 

[djh]

On 3/4/2022 at 9:11 PM, cruiseerf said:

We very much enjoy our time in the Retreat/Michaels club lounge.   We book mostly suites however last minute sometimes we do book aqua class or veranda cabins.  We are Both Zenith members at least twice and would like to be clear.   For those that say the Retreat was "never crowded" you must be a Zenith looking for a seat there?   Our experience has been that on day of Arrival and Departure, Many Zenith members hold court in The Retreat/Michaels club.....often inviting their friends and family to depart with them in pre arranged transport.   When we have been onboard and there have been groups of 10+ with people in Various cabin types it makes the Retreat lounge hosts the bad guys explaining the rules everyone knows Before boarding.   Pre Covid Transatlantic we had 28 Zeniths onboard with partners which meant 56 extra people......Michaels club was a horror......no seats, talkers who didn't' know when to shut it, no dress code enforced,   and many Zeniths who felt they owned the ship.  Transatlantic B4 that we had 22 which equated to 49 extras and we had a group in Michaels that was not only disrespectful but also nasty.   After several of these VERY CROWDED transatlantics,  I would say that the Retreat should indeed be kept separate and only for suites.   Zeniths are well taken care of in Tuscan for Brekkie,  Lunch, so many choices, and dinner as well, and Laundry pressing and dry-cleaning is covered.   Too many people in Celebrities program are continually trying to game it.    This is not fair to the people actually paying in Todays $$$ for the services they do not get when the Zeniths are out in full force.   It only takes a few to spoil it for all of us.   

We have been loyal Celebrity suite cruisers for years and have met several lovely zeniths in years past.  I’ve never seen them “hold court” in Michaels Club or the Retreat but I have experienced a similar situation on Royal. We pretty much have stopped going to the suite lounges on their ships because of Pinnacles holding court, pulling the majority of chairs over to save them for their Pinnacle friends and parking there from 5:30 pm until 8:00pm. It’s distressing to me if this is now happening on Celebrity. It appears to me that there is a large influx of passengers becoming Zenith,

(we actually became Zeniths last year). This  could cause crowding issues in the suite lounges in the future, especially since Celebrity appears to be filling the suites since the restart. JMO

[CAicruiser]

Don't understand why some American behave this way.They just get jealous what some people get rewarded for.

[TeeRick]

1 hour ago, djh said:

We have been loyal Celebrity suite cruisers for years and have met several lovely zeniths in years past.  I’ve never seen them “hold court” in Michaels Club or the Retreat but I have experienced a similar situation on Royal. We pretty much have stopped going to the suite lounges on their ships because of Pinnacles holding court, pulling the majority of chairs over to save them for their Pinnacle friends and parking there from 5:30 pm until 8:00pm. It’s distressing to me if this is now happening on Celebrity. It appears to me that there is a large influx of passengers becoming Zenith,

(we actually became Zeniths last year). This  could cause crowding issues in the suite lounges in the future, especially since Celebrity appears to be filling the suites since the restart. JMO

Congrats on making Zenith! I have only seen Zenith members be polite and friendly.  I do understand the difference with some issues of Pinnacle members as we also sail RCCL.  But even then, most Pinnacle members are very nice.  I think there is some overcrowding and issues on the special President's Cruise from what I have read here.  Anyway if I am in a suite on a Celebrity ship I hope to meet you in there!

[Spif Barwunkel]

Bottom line, reciprocity between cruise lines is a good thing. Rewarding loyalty is not an obligation but it is necessary to maintain an ever-growing corps of dedicated cruisers who appreciate recognition for their fealty. Those numbers continue to increase thus diluting the significance – in some people’s eyes – of what is offered. With constant efforts to modify and improve the rewards program, Celebrity is damned if they do and damned if they don’t.

 

A singular venue for certain passenger class designations is very appropriate and should be thought of as such. It should not be considered a place where many folks cannot go. Rather, it should be thought of as a locale where some people have earned the privilege to go. Spending a boat load of money and many days and nights beyond the typical cruiser qualifies you for that privilege.

 

I will let X decide how to best serve all of its guests. In the meantime, I will enjoy all public spaces that I can on a Celebrity ship and try my best to get along with everyone. That works for me.

[fstuff1]

On 3/1/2022 at 12:14 PM, Jim_Iain said:

Harris -  That's interesting as I know a number of Zenith's currently at sea and they are not being given access as of last week.     I'll have to ping them and send them a copy of the FAQ.

 

In late January Andrea Shea sent out an email saying they hoped to be able to re-open access to Zeniths but at the current times the Covid distancing limitations prevent that.

 

i just made a reservation on Apex transatlantic on Sat.
the blue chip person said still no on Retreat for zenniths or casino Sapphires. Still $100 obc for compensation

Edited March 7, 2022 by fstuff1

[goofysmom99]

3 hours ago, TeeRick said:

I refer to that type of response "suite envy".  Some people on here think that others staying in a suite seems to be some form of personality type or wealthy or snobbish attitude.  It is simply a buying choice.  Nothing more.  Says next to nothing about the individual except they chose a suite on that particular vacation.  It might be a special occasion one and done.  Or a consistent buying choice.  Who should really care how others spend their own money?  

I think you've hit a bullseye.  While bored watching TV last night, I drilled down on a couple of the snarkiest posters on this thread.  One of the most upset has never cruised in a suite on X, posted he/she never would because of crowding, doesn't think much of zeniths being allowed in Retreat/Michael's Club, then proceeded with an unsuccessful move-up bid. 

 

BTW, I agree that the lounges on Royal were/are ridiculous.  Last time I cruised them, 2014 Norway, there was nowhere to sit in the D or D+ lounges, and lots of rude seat-savers.  After the 2nd night, I quit trying.  The X Happy Hour in the Sky Lounge on TAs (before AI) was nearly as bad the first night, but it's a much bigger space, nice views, high ceilings, so wasn't as claustrophobic.  I travel solo and when I'm told seats are saved, 90% of the time, I sit down anyway, usually saying something like, "I can't wait to meet them."  If their friends ever show up, I may or may not move; depends on my knee and their attitudes. 😉  In my dotage, I've become a cranky old lady with cats who no longer accepts the cr*p I used to.  Definitely one of the benefits of aging.  The seat hogs don't know what to do and sometimes they move, in which case I get to meet lovely people who replace them.  And granted, I don't frequent it often, but I've never, ever seen anyone save a seat in The Retreat/Michael's Club.  Much more classy, less entitled, annoying vibe than Royal.