How does HAL determine if the port is safe for passengers?

[FlaMariner]

Our March South America cruise includes two port calls in Peru and Peru is listed as  "Level 3 Reconsider Travel"  by the USA State Department.

 

But then, so is Hong Kong, Jamaica and Honduras........(just browsing the list today 1/19)

 

Does anyone know what HAL might reference to make the go/no go decision on a port call (not weather issues but civil unrest, riots, etc)?

 

And if we do not stop in Peru, any speculation about what HAL might have in store for us besides the obvious of more sea days (which is never a negative)?

 

 

[seagarsmoker]

Jamaica is also level 3 and we were there on the NA in November last year. It is also on our itinerary in March of this year.  

[Mary229]

The Volendam was in Peru this week.  Reports say they did cancel the Machu Picchu Tours and altered the shuttle locations for Lima/Callao  but that is about it.  I have traveled to South America during uprisings and it tends to be very localized.  If you stay out of the way of the demonstrations it is usually as safe as it is any other day of the year.  They do use escorts if deemed necessary.
 

 For your land based tours off ship I do believe it is best to make those decisions by your own judgement and not depend on the cruise ship’s notification.  

[HALcruiser2001]

14 minutes ago, Mary229 said:

The Volendam was in Peru this week.  Reports say they did cancel the Machu Picchu Tours and altered the shuttle locations for Lima/Callao  but that is about it.  I have traveled to South America during uprisings and it tends to be very localized.  If you stay out of the way of the demonstrations it is usually as safe as it is any other day of the year.  They do use escorts if deemed necessary.
 

 For your land based tours off ship I do believe it is best to make those decisions by your own judgement and not depend on the cruise ship’s notification.  

 

Why did they cancel Machu Picchu?

 

When were your "uprisings"?

Edited January 19, 2023 by bdd123

[Mary229]

12 minutes ago, bdd123 said:

 

Why did they cancel Machu Picchu?

 

When were your "uprisings"?

They canceled MP this week.  There were media reports about disruptions of the rail systems that service the area.  I was there twice once right after Fujimoro fled and there was some civil unrest and once we came across some lingering elements of the Shining Path.   It was never a big deal as we did not involve ourselves nor make any comments.  We paid whatever “tolls” asked and went about our business.

[HALcruiser2001]

30 minutes ago, Mary229 said:

They canceled MP this week.  There were media reports about disruptions of the rail systems that service the area.  I was there twice once right after Fujimoro fled and there was some civil unrest and once we came across some lingering elements of the Shining Path.   It was never a big deal as we did not involve ourselves nor make any comments.  We paid whatever “tolls” asked and went about our business.

 

It must be a pre cruise thing.   No way MP can be done as an port excursion.

[Sir PMP]

Lima is ok, but the problem is always Callao, you have to use a shuttle to get through. Pisco is fine.

[Mary229]

15 minutes ago, bdd123 said:

 

It must be a pre cruise thing.   No way MP can be done as a port excursion.

HAL does quite a few overland tours in South America (and elsewhere) during a cruise.  I am scheduled for one next month where I leave mid cruise and rejoin further along the route.  

[Mary229]

4 minutes ago, Sir PMP said:

Lima is ok, but the problem is always Callao, you have to use a shuttle to get through. Pisco is fine.

On the roll call they reported the typical shuttle stop was changed last minute due to some small civil disturbances 

[FlaMariner]

Back to my original questions.......

 

1 hour ago, FlaMariner said:

Does anyone know what HAL might reference to make the go/no go decision on a port call (not weather issues but civil unrest, riots, etc)?

 

And if we do not stop in Peru, any speculation about what HAL might have in store for us besides the obvious of more sea days (which is never a negative)?

 

[Mary229]

4 minutes ago, FlaMariner said:

Back to my original questions.......

 

 

Go to the Volendam Grand South America roll call. They just left Peru.  People are reporting their daily experiences 

[*Miss G*]

1 hour ago, bdd123 said:

 

Why did they cancel Machu Picchu?

 

 

Hundreds of tourists were stranded in December when demonstrators blocked highways, railroads, and airports.  Tourists had to be helicoptered out of Machu Picchu by the Peruvian Government.  Many hiked 20 miles to a nearby town to get out.  Home videos showed them climbing over boulders and trees where roads used to be. (Watched it on a special report.)  I imagine Peruvian government officials had a chat with other world government officials saying they cannot guarantee their citizens’ safety or retrieval if it happens again.  Ergo… cancellations.

[HALcruiser2001]

9 minutes ago, *Miss G* said:

 

Hundreds of tourists were stranded in December when demonstrators blocked highways, railroads, and airports.  Tourists had to be helicoptered out of Machu Picchu by the Peruvian Government.  Many hiked 20 miles to a nearby town to get out.  Home videos showed them climbing over boulders and trees where roads used to be. (Watched it on a special report.)  I imagine Peruvian government officials had a chat with other world government officials saying they cannot guarantee their citizens’ safety or retrieval if it happens again.  Ergo… cancellations.

 

Thanks. Looked at it.   Looks like a lot of stuff going on there.    Even today.

 

 

[CruiserBruce]

3 hours ago, bdd123 said:

 

It must be a pre cruise thing.   No way MP can be done as an port excursion.

HAL, and other cruise lines do a 3 day, 2 night excursion that departs the ship at one port, and rejoins the ship at another port.

 

For example, this excursion: https://www.hollandamerica.com/en_US/shore-excursions/CA2/25143.html

[dockman]

3 hours ago, bdd123 said:

 

It must be a pre cruise thing.   No way MP can be done as an port excursion.

They offered MP excursions for about two days but the price was more than i paid for entire cruise.....for enough $$ they can and do offer MP

[cruisemom42]

4 hours ago, FlaMariner said:

Does anyone know what HAL might reference to make the go/no go decision on a port call (not weather issues but civil unrest, riots, etc)?

 

I can't say with 100% certainty, but I know from traveling on another cruise line with some fairly unusual itineraries (Syria, anyone?), there are services that travel agencies, groups that offer land tours, and cruises can subscribe to that provide detailed, geographically specific and up-to-date info on situations in problematic areas "on the ground."  I would assume it is someone's job to follow these listings and raise a red flag when the situation reaches a certain level.

 

It's also my understanding the the insurance underwriters can step in and require/demand that a ship not stop in a specific port if they think the ship itself might be at risk.

[Guest ldtr]

5 hours ago, bdd123 said:

 

Why did they cancel Machu Picchu?

 

When were your "uprisings"?

Demonstrations blocking access. The train tracks to get to the town at the base of the mountain is a pretty common target for demonstrations.

Thr President that tried to eliminate their Congress and then got removed from office has resulted in some demonstrations by his followers.

[Guest ldtr]

1 hour ago, dockman said:

They offered MP excursions for about two days but the price was more than i paid for entire cruise.....for enough $$ they can and do offer MP

I booked a 14 day tour of Peru with Gate1, including MP, and air fare from the US for about the same as cruise lines charge for their 2 day excursion.

[Arizona Wildcat]

Ports are always looked at for disruptions that could be either dangerous or restrict access.  Missed Acapulco over an active police situation involving drug cartels, Nicaragua involving a breakdown of government ability to control violence, strikes shutting transportation in Spain and others.  A last minute cancelation is always the decision of the Captain.  Same with weather.

[OlsSalt]

Port safety also considers when there are increases in local crime against cruise passengers to the point they need to do more than warn passengers before disembarking.

 

Montego Bay Jamaica got a strong crime warning once, Callou port vicinity also. St Croix was on and off, due to crime. So it is not just politics; but plain old theft and robberies too.

[dockman]

6 hours ago, ldtr said:

I booked a 14 day tour of Peru with Gate1, including MP, and air fare from the US for about the same as cruise lines charge for their 2 day excursion.

from a year ago

 

For 3 days and 2 nights from the port of Lima to Machu Picchu, a Standard Double is $3499 pp, a Superior Double $4299 pp, and a Superior Single $4899 pp

[knitter]

We missed a stop in Tunisia due to civil unrest.

[HALcruiser2001]

12 hours ago, dockman said:

from a year ago

 

For 3 days and 2 nights from the port of Lima to Machu Picchu, a Standard Double is $3499 pp, a Superior Double $4299 pp, and a Superior Single $4899 pp

$100 Lima to port (RT). $200ppx for the flight to Cuzco. $699ppx for the train.   $200 hotel in Lima, $100 hotel in Cuzco.  Under 50% of what HAL is asking for 2. 

Flying to Lima to Cuzco is the only way to do it in this amount of time and you will likely take one day to deal with Lima, one day to get to MP and back to Cuzco.  Next AM, fly back to Lima, on a bus and you are back on the ship.  If you are overweight, physical disabilities, need O2, be prepared.  Cuzco is 12k' and MP is 8k'.


Those O2 bottles at Walmart would work well.  Most average flat landers have problems just walking around Cuzco.  If you have a chance, warm up walking to Sacsahuamán (above).

I don't find rushed trips like that enjoyable.  I walked the Inca Trail to MP, would like to do it again, but it was a booger.  I had a flight delay so landed late and had to start hiking 15k' passes the next day.  

[amyr]

I was just reading the saga of an Australian couple that landed last night in Lima to join a tour of Peru with a large well known global tour operator.  They thought initially that the Machu Picchu portion might get thrown out, but they kept calling the tour company who kept telling them the tour was a go, and that they should board their flight.  When nobody was there to greet them at the airport they found a fellow traveler that called the tour company who then told them the tour had been cancelled.  They found a place on their own for the night, but now they're just sitting there wondering what to do.

 

I suspect HAL will behave better than the tour company and just find an alternate port or two if the troubles are still happening in March.  

[GeorgeCharlie]

 

In regards to what's happening (and has been happening) have a look at this link.