En Route with Hank in Japan and the Westerdam

[sunviking90]

7 hours ago, whogo said:

The overcharges are so widespread that I suspect they are deliberate. After 150 years HAL could bill guests properly. If they wanted to.

I agree. I have a real issue with guest relations being unable to remove the charges themselves. Instead a message has to be sent to the beverage department. I experienced the same problem last year. I won’t even get into the HAL minibar erroneous charges that showed up after we disembarked which took me 3 days and about 8 hours on the phone to fix! However on our recent Princess cruise (not perfect in other ways) a couple of beverage charge errors were fixed immediately by guest services themselves.
Loving the trip report so far. You have inspired me to book our first visit to Japan next year! 

[LAFFNVEGAS]

9 hours ago, whogo said:

The overcharges are so widespread that I suspect they are deliberate. After 150 years HAL could bill guests properly. If they wanted to.

I have long suspected it is intentional rather than UN-intentional. There is probably a much larger percentage that do not even look at charges, nor want to manage the process of going through the charges. They figure close enough. It has always been a win win for the Beverage Department. I suspect it is encouraged now more than ever for profit.

[SusieKIslandGirl]

Well, they did get my 6 cents 😁.

Edited March 28, 2023 by SusieKIslandGirl
Auto correct goofed

[Hlitner]

19 hours ago, Aitchgeye said:

[Hlitner]

This morning I noticed another $12.98 drink overcharge.  This time I stopped at the Guest Services desk and noted we had improved from 3 daily overcharges to only 1.  But that would still top $500 over the entire cruise.  They quickly fixed their error.  This latest screw up made little sense since one bar tender charged two drinks (one for DW and one for me) at the same time and price.  Mine went through properly but DW was overcharged.  Is this deliberate incompetence or just plain incompetence?

 

I can’t wait to see what happens when we have our Free Pinnacle meals 😁

[stairMaster]

13 hours ago, whogo said:

The overcharges are so widespread that I suspect they are deliberate. After 150 years HAL could bill guests properly. If they wanted to.

 

4 hours ago, LAFFNVEGAS said:

I have long suspected it is intentional rather than UN-intentional. There is probably a much larger percentage that do not even look at charges, nor want to manage the process of going through the charges. They figure close enough. It has always been a win win for the Beverage Department. I suspect it is encouraged now more than ever for profit.

 

I would advise one to tread very carefully with accusations of HAL employees not only being dishonest but HAL is also turning a blind eye to it.  These are very serious allegations and are grounds for dismissal.  If you have SOLID evidence of this occurring then the correct route is to bring this up with the hotel manager.  Innuendo and speculation is not helpful for anyone.  

[LAFFNVEGAS]

8 minutes ago, stairMaster said:

 

 

I would advise one to tread very carefully with accusations of HAL employees not only being dishonest but HAL is also turning a blind eye to it.  These are very serious allegations and are grounds for dismissal.  If you have SOLID evidence of this occurring then the correct route is to bring this up with the hotel manager.  Innuendo and speculation is not helpful for anyone.  

There is one key word to my post...suspected  possibly look up that definition it is slightly different than accusation...just saying. Although I do SUSPECT and that Upper Management is willing to look the other way.

[Florida_gal_50]

43 minutes ago, Hlitner said:

This morning I noticed another $12.98 drink overcharge.  This time I stopped at the Guest Services desk and noted we had improved from 3 daily overcharges to only 1.  But that would still top $500 over the entire cruise.  They quickly fixed their error.  This latest screw up made little sense since one bar tender charged two drinks (one for DW and one for me) at the same time and price.  Mine went through properly but DW was overcharged.  Is this deliberate incompetence or just plain incompetence?

 

I can’t wait to see what happens when we have our Free Pinnacle meals 😁

I’m hoping you are bringing a second appetizer from the lido.  I so want someone to do this.  Maybe if I had a few drinks I would 😛. 

[cccole]

Your previous comments about HAL have been so negative that I was curious as to why you were taking this 42 day cruise, but when you referenced the previous cruises that were postponed, it made sense.

Hope you have a great cruise.  We always like late dining because late is just our usual dining time. 2 hours seems normal to us for a relaxing and enjoyable dinner.  How fun to dine with passengers from other countries.  Hope you enjoy good company and good food on the rest of your cruise.  Cherie

[Florida_gal_50]

22 minutes ago, stairMaster said:

 

 

I would advise one to tread very carefully with accusations of HAL employees not only being dishonest but HAL is also turning a blind eye to it.  These are very serious allegations and are grounds for dismissal.  If you have SOLID evidence of this occurring then the correct route is to bring this up with the hotel manager.  Innuendo and speculation is not helpful for anyone.  

The problem is that it happens on EVERY cruise I’ve been on lately.  You do the math.

[cruisemom42]

I don’t tend to post much during cruises so if Hank doesn’t mind I’ll just continue to post a few observations from time to time on this thread. The first day and dinner were kind of chaotic and I was thinking “oh no!” But second day much better, I am happy to say. So far Lincoln Center has been a highlight but I am a bit worried as this particular, talented group announced they are departing in two weeks having been onboard a number of months. No word on what or who will replace them. They play together delightfully.

 

I got up at 5:30 am this morning to get a decent number for our timed meetings with Japanese authorities on the day we return from Taiwan. Then back to bed for two more hours lol. As Hank alluded, lots of procedure to keep up with. Also as a note, our passports were taken at embarkation, will be handed back later today, only to be given in again later…. 
 

One other comment re: enrichment. There is one enrichment speaker onboard. He’s given two lectures so far… mostly reading from his slides. He appears to be a retired dentist (?). I’ll say no more. 
 

Hank we may have rubbed shoulders at the Rolling Stone room on night one, the “late night” crew. 😉

 

Dinner last night:

[Florida_gal_50]

2 minutes ago, cccole said:

Your previous comments about HAL have been so negative that I was curious as to why you were taking this 42 day cruise, but when you referenced the previous cruises that were postponed, it made sense.

Hope you have a great cruise.  We always like late dining because late is just our usual dining time. 2 hours seems normal to us for a relaxing and enjoyable dinner.  How fun to dine with passengers from other countries.  Hope you enjoy good company and good food on the rest of your cruise.  Cherie

Yes, don’t say anything negative about wonderful hal.  I like to hear good and bad myself, not the sugar coated version.  I just skip by threads that I’m not interested in.  Easy peasy.

[cccole]

Just now, Florida_gal_50 said:

Yes, don’t say anything negative about wonderful hal.  I like to hear good and bad myself, not the sugar coated version.  I just skip by threads that I’m not interested in.  Easy peasy.

?  

[Hlitner]

12 minutes ago, Florida_gal_50 said:

I’m hoping you are bringing a second appetizer from the lido.  I so want someone to do this.  Maybe if I had a few drinks I would 😛. 

Good point.  Perhaps we could test the 15 drink limit before crawling to

the

PG

[sunviking90]

49 minutes ago, stairMaster said:

 

 

I would advise one to tread very carefully with accusations of HAL employees not only being dishonest but HAL is also turning a blind eye to it.  These are very serious allegations and are grounds for dismissal.  If you have SOLID evidence of this occurring then the correct route is to bring this up with the hotel manager.  Innuendo and speculation is not helpful for anyone.  

Generally I would agree with you and having managed a business, I would be the first to realize how damaging accusations can be. Having said that, this is not a one off or an occasional thing, but a regular occurrence on HAL ships. I have not booked another HAL cruise since my last extremely unpleasant experience trying to prove post cruise that I didn’t drink anything from my minibar. I don’t think this is “intentional” and I don’t blame the front line crew at all, but regular overcharges like this certainly show a lack of will on the part of HAL to train properly, or to put procedures in place to prevent this. They don’t seem to think it’s a priority.

The other concern would be are the crew members getting in trouble when overcharges and errors are reported. I hope not. Why do these corrections always have to go through the beverage department and can’t be handled immediately?

Edited March 29, 2023 by sunviking90

[Florida_gal_50]

10 minutes ago, sunviking90 said:

Generally I would agree with you and having managed a business, I would be the first to realize how damaging accusations can be. Having said that, this is not a one off or an occasional thing, but a regular occurrence on HAL ships. I have not booked another HAL cruise since my last extremely unpleasant experience trying to prove post cruise that I didn’t drink anything from my minibar. I don’t think this is “intentional” and I don’t blame the front line crew at all, but regular overcharges like this certainly show a lack of will on the part of HAL to train properly, or to put procedures in place to prevent this. They don’t seem to think it’s a priority.

The other concern would be are the crew members getting in trouble when overcharges and errors are reported. I hope not. Why do these corrections always have to go through the beverage department and can’t be handled immediately?

Exactly.  One time I got charged well over $100 for drinks from my mini bar.  The only thing I’ve ever drank from my mini bar was water but when I disputed it, I was asked are you sure 🙄.

[mrmoviezombie]

On 3/27/2023 at 11:04 AM, Dr.Dobro said:

If the Tamarind menu will truly be offered in the Canaletto, that is outstanding. Tamarind is by far our favorite dining option.

Totally agree... the Tamarind was the best thing about our last Koningsdam cruise.
Unfortunately, according to the HAL website it's only available on the Westerdam for the Asia itineraries.

 

Tamarind - Cruise Asian Restaurant & Cuisine | Holland America

 

Ships Featuring Tamarind

Dine at Tamarind on the following ships

Eurodam Koningsdam

Nieuw Amsterdam Rotterdam

Westerdam* Zuiderdam*

*Tamarind menu available in Pinnacle Grill on Westerdam Asia itineraries and Zuiderdam Grand World Voyage itineraries.

[cbr663]

5 hours ago, LAFFNVEGAS said:

I have long suspected it is intentional rather than UN-intentional. There is probably a much larger percentage that do not even look at charges, nor want to manage the process of going through the charges. They figure close enough. It has always been a win win for the Beverage Department. I suspect it is encouraged now more than ever for profit.

 

When you consider that there are only 4 Beverage Packages available - 2 alcoholic and 2 non-alcoholic, there isn't a lot of information for any bartender to keep track of.  These are not complex packages at all.  There is no reason whatsoever for repeated billing errors for beverages on the ship.

 

This has been a long and on-going problem on HAL ships.  If HAL wanted to solve it, it would have by now.

[Hlitner]

3 hours ago, mrmoviezombie said:

Totally agree... the Tamarind was the best thing about our last Koningsdam cruise.
Unfortunately, according to the HAL website it's only available on the Westerdam for the Asia itineraries.

 

Tamarind - Cruise Asian Restaurant & Cuisine | Holland America

 

Ships Featuring Tamarind

Dine at Tamarind on the following ships

Eurodam Koningsdam

Nieuw Amsterdam Rotterdam

Westerdam* Zuiderdam*

*Tamarind menu available in Pinnacle Grill on Westerdam Asia itineraries and Zuiderdam Grand World Voyage itineraries.

 Not sure that HAL web site info is accurate.  When we booked onboard they told Us the Taramind menu would

be In Canaletto.  I assume this is another case where the onboard folks do not have a clue as to what is on the web site.

[Beejay4016]

On 3/29/2023 at 9:21 AM, cruisemom42 said:

I don’t tend to post much during cruises so if Hank doesn’t mind I’ll just continue to post a few observations from time to time on this thread. The first day and dinner were kind of chaotic and I was thinking “oh no!” But second day much better, I am happy to say. So far Lincoln Center has been a highlight but I am a bit worried as this particular, talented group announced they are departing in two weeks having been onboard a number of months. No word on what or who will replace them. They play together delightfully.

 

I got up at 5:30 am this morning to get a decent number for our timed meetings with Japanese authorities on the day we return from Taiwan. Then back to bed for two more hours lol. As Hank alluded, lots of procedure to keep up with. Also as a note, our passports were taken at embarkation, will be handed back later today, only to be given in again later…. 
 

One other comment re: enrichment. There is one enrichment speaker onboard. He’s given two lectures so far… mostly reading from his slides. He appears to be a retired dentist (?). I’ll say no more. 
 

Hank we may have rubbed shoulders at the Rolling Stone room on night one, the “late night” crew. 😉

 

Dinner last night:

 

On 3/29/2023 at 9:21 AM, cruisemom42 said:

I don’t tend to post much during cruises so if Hank doesn’t mind I’ll just continue to post a few observations from time to time on this thread. The first day and dinner were kind of chaotic and I was thinking “oh no!” But second day much better, I am happy to say. So far Lincoln Center has been a highlight but I am a bit worried as this particular, talented group announced they are departing in two weeks having been onboard a number of months. No word on what or who will replace them. They play together delightfully.

 

I got up at 5:30 am this morning to get a decent number for our timed meetings with Japanese authorities on the day we return from Taiwan. Then back to bed for two more hours lol. As Hank alluded, lots of procedure to keep up with. Also as a note, our passports were taken at embarkation, will be handed back later today, only to be given in again later…. 
 

One other comment re: enrichment. There is one enrichment speaker onboard. He’s given two lectures so far… mostly reading from his slides. He appears to be a retired dentist (?). I’ll say no more. 
 

Hank we may have rubbed shoulders at the Rolling Stone room on night one, the “late night” crew. 😉

 

Dinner last night:

Wow, that meal has my mouth watering. We join her on the 24th of April for the crossing, and it's been so long for us that I am putting any negative comments in the "I'll think about that tomorrow" basket and enjoying the positives. These lamb chops are a major positive.

[Hlitner]

Ok fans (all one or two of you).  We are back in our suite at 10:50pm (because the ship is essentially shut down).  We have good and bad and will try to be fair after more than a few adult beverages.

 

So far, we are really enjoying the voyage, the crew is terrific, the ship in great shape, etc. etc.  The food has been acceptable but there is no question that HAL has cut-back and does a pretty good job hiding the changes.  My crab cake starter was quite small (but good) despite being the size of a silver dollar.  DW's coconut shrimp was presented with a tiny green salad, but there were only two small shrimp.  I had prime rib for a main, and it was normal HAL, and DW's halibut was good.  

 

Now for the bad.  We are in our cabin at 10:50 because there is nothing else on the ship (unless you want to play slots).  The Step Dancing show was canceled because the ship is moving (you could fool me) which left the dual pianos as the only entertainment after 9 (The Rolling Stone Lounge was dark tonight).  The two pianos were good, did their 3 sets, and went home at 10:45 leaving the ship "dark."  

 

As to HAL accounting, the "fun" continues.  For the 5th time in 3 days, we have been overcharged for drinks (this time in the MDR for a glass of wine).  What should have been a no-charge $11 dollar glass is on our account as a $14.16 item.  If we were keeping track that is about $80 in over changes in only 3 days.  This time I sent a message to Guest Relations suggesting if they cannot deal with this continuous problem, we would like to meet with the Hotel Manager and offer some suggestions.  We would assume these overcharges are happening to many folks to the tune of thousands of dollars per day.  Perhaps I am wrong and DW and I are just the only unlucky folks (out of more than 2000) but I am skeptical.  This ship has an accounting problem (for those with drink packages) and if it is fleet-wide it is a huge issue.  

 

Today we were docked in Naha, Japan, That is on the island of Okinawa and my first visit since 1969 when it was still a US Territory.  DW and I simply walked into the center of town (about 1 mile), strolled on the main shopping street (not impressive) and returned to the ship for lunch.  Others who did a long Best of Okinawa tour enjoyed going to a cave, seeing a garden, etc.  For most folks, this would not be a great port, but kudos to HAL for visiting these places,  

 

Tonight we, again, went to dinner at 7:30, asked to share a table, were seated within 1 minute, and had two Aussie and 2 Brits as tablemates.  Another delightful table, great conversation, and more of what we truly love about cruising.  Ironically, the folks we always see waiting to be seated seem to be those who want 2 tops or who have reservations (they even get beepers).  We have no reservations, like to share, and simply walk up to the host are immediately seated.  As usual, it is not with fellow Americans who are generally dining by 6pm.

 

This cruise has a pretty decent group of Night Owls.  On HAL that means they are awake after 9pm.  Most seem to be Brits or Aussies and we love these folks because they are fun and stay awake past 9pm :).  Too bad that HAL has little entertainment to help out night owls.  In Fifty+ years of extensive cruising we have never been on any ship with so little to offer late night folks.

 

For those who are interested in the formalities on Japan cruises, we have been hit with another "whammy."  Tomorrow, after a day on Ishigaki, everyone must have a face to face with Japanese authorities to "exit" Japan.  Even the Captain seems to be concerned that this be done in time not to mess up dinner (for those who dine at 5pm).  He made a late afternoon announcement warning that the exit immigration process could "take a long time."   The Japanese do this immigration process AFTER we have been in their country, and it is part of what is known as Exit Immigration.  I used to think that only China and Russia cared about folks leaving their country, but we can now add Japan to the list.  We will then move on to our Taiwanese ports after which we will face Japanese Entry procedures (including another face to face) when we return to Japan.  Just part of the travel game...but still quite annoying.

 

Hank

[ghstudio]

too much to read/remember for a full response...but we were on the previous cruise on the Rotterdam, getting off last Monday.  We only had one billing issue....charging us for a large bottle of water which we didn't realize was not on the signature drink package...you have to order multiple small bottles (stupid??).  No other problems and yes, some  bars wanted signatures, others not...and when I ordered over the $11 limit I was always correctly charged.  We found the gallery bar wonderful....we were often the only ones there....even when other bars had no seats.  We actually enjoyed the food...perhaps influenced by the terrible food on our recent Princess cruise.  I discovered that they have a nightly indian menu and that was excellent.  Most of the regular menu items sounded better than they were, but again, heads and shoulders above princess.  We split breakfasts between Lido and the MDR....and we order eggs or omelettes and enjoy salmon and fruit so Lido was fine....with, yes, the usual difficulty of finding a table.  We enjoyed the music groups....the incredible drummer in one venue and the instrumental quartet was also excellent.  Due to the heavy port schedule, the casino was closed quite a bit...and even when open, far far from crowded.  Leaving the casino at 11PM, you walk through what could be a "death ship" to your cabin.....no one in sight anywhere....but this is HAL where the average age is dead (I can say that...I'm old, but almost feel young on HAL.  

 

As far a the K-eta....not needed, in fact we had it and no one even cared.  The long lines at entry to Korea or coming back to Japan weren't.....we pretty much breezed right through but we didn't try to get out early.

 

We really enjoyed the cruise although even a vista suite gets pretty small pretty quickly.  We really noticed that there just weren't crowds....to us, the ship seemed like it was maybe 75% full, even though it was 100% full.  Lines for dinner without reservations at 7-7:30 moved quickly enough.  I don't think it was ever more than 10 minutes to be seated.  Waiter service was excellent...in fact they serve too fast.  I didn't like that they want your dessert order when you order your meal...and quickly learned that if you wanted an after dinner drink with your dessert, you have to order it with dinner.  Our meals always arrived hot....(I won't mention princess again).  

 

HAL did store my sake and return it the last night...but they didn't care or notice that I had a carton of sake in my carry on.  

 

Booked two more cruises on HAL while on board....one on rotterdam, the other on volendam.  We have cruised celebrity heavily but really dislike their new ships and they do the same cruises over and over.  We tried Princess which was excellent pre-covid, but is now far below Celebrity/HAL in most everything. HAL has now become our preferred higher end mass market cruise line.

[POA1]

Thanks Hank! Very informative thread.

[skurvish]

We are on the same cruise as Hank. We are a group of 16. So far none of us have been overcharged for drinks. As a group we don't need to wait long for a dinner table in the MDR. Getting tables for 6 or 8 or even 10 does not seem to be a problem. I can confirm however that getting table space in the Lido is a struggle, even for 2.

[oakridger]

Regarding the MDR waiters asking for your dessert order at the same time as ordering the main meal, I always just nicely say that I will decide after I finish eating.  I have never gotten any pushback on doing that and my dessert was always delivered promptly after I ordered.  I wonder whose idea it was to ask for the dessert orders at the beginning of the meal.  It started before the shutdown.  I have never been in any restaurant in all my travels that wanted that pre order unless you were getting a specialty item such as a souffle that takes longer to prepare.  I think it's tacky!!  

 

~Nancy