Oversold Cruises.

[Selion]

On 4/29/2023 at 3:42 PM, oskidunker said:

Thanks. I would be booking business. 

Keep in mind flight credits are usually only valid for 12 months from the date ticket was issued.  If you booked your flight today, May 1, 2023, then cancel the flight, your flight credit is only valid until May 1, 2024.  Some airlines require travel to be completed before the credit expiration.  Read up on the specific airlines' flight credit rules before booking.

[CCWineLover]

On 4/27/2023 at 11:28 AM, deec said:

we are retired and usually quite flexible....I hope they oversell one of our cruises and contact us!

Same here Dee!

We'll take any offer that comes up - especially ones that others don't want and can't take.

 

[flare3192]

we were surprised last night to get the offer but there was no availability to replace the cruise until next year or 2025. We really needed more time to figure out how we could do it so they found others. it is only a week before the cruise and we are leaving in 4 days. We had scheduled things a walking tour of the amalfi coast after so we would have had to still go but change the air -- where we fly into and the date. Then we had other private guides in some of the ports -- they could be cancelled without penalty but these people have kept their schedule for us and I was not sure about cancelling. If we had only scheduled the cruise it would have been great but it would have been a huge headache to try to reschedule everything. But I wish I had considered this post more carefully earlier. We could have been ready to change.

[zalusky]

I just got one of these offers on my Italy cruise.  Incredible!!!  We are now rebooked for 2025.

Now to find something maybe non-cruise to do this year. 

[CCWineLover]

4 hours ago, zalusky said:

I just got one of these offers on my Italy cruise.  Incredible!!!  We are now rebooked for 2025.

Now to find something maybe non-cruise to do this year. 

Great job Zalusky!  I wish we would get one of those offers.  I'd jump at it in a minute!!

[DGHOC]

Brilliant stuff Zalusky!

We're on a Scenic Scandinavia in mid June but we'd jump at the opportunity too!

[leishirsute]

On 4/25/2023 at 10:18 AM, longterm said:

We took advantage of one of these offers a couple of years ago; we went from a 5-day cruise in a standard DV cabin to a penthouse junior suite, 11-day cruise, and $1500 in cash. A very sweet deal!

Do they refund to the travel insurance as well?

[longterm]

52 minutes ago, leishirsute said:

Do they refund to the travel insurance as well?

I would guess not; we didn't have travel insurance for that cruise.

 

At any rate, insurance policies are totally separate from Viking cruises, so you'd have to ask your insurance carrier. We don't use TripMate (we found a much better company) so if this were to come up, I'd ask them, but I would assume that a travel policy is NOT going to transfer if we decided to defer a trip.

[SantaFe1]

59 minutes ago, leishirsute said:

Do they refund to the travel insurance as well?

Over the course of the pandemic, I have found that I can keep the policy and change the dates from those of a canceled cruise to the dates of a new cruise.  And if I had booked timely and had pre-existing condition coverage, that transferred with the policy.  

 

[Sunflower & The Scientist]

We too have just changed the dates, as long as you make the change within a certain time frame.

[CCWineLover]

1 hour ago, SantaFe1 said:

Over the course of the pandemic, I have found that I can keep the policy and change the dates from those of a canceled cruise to the dates of a new cruise.  And if I had booked timely and had pre-existing condition coverage, that transferred with the policy.  

 

We have done the same thing multiple times.

That is a big reason we don't use TripMate (in addition to the much greater cost).   One cruise we rescheduled 3 different times and to different itineraries and our insurance just carried over each time.  The good thing, as was stated, is that the pre-existing condition kept transferring along too!

 

With Viking's cruise transfer capability, one of the techniques we use is to take advantage of the $25 deposits.  Since insurance costs rises with the age at booking, especially after age 70, we book a "dummy" cruise as far into the future as possible at $25 apiece, get the insurance and pre-existing.  That locks in the lower price.   Then over the next several years, we can transfer that dummy cruise to a cruise we really do want, transfer the insurance, and effectively have the insurance price at a lower price than the age we are at when we actually take the cruise.

Edited May 13, 2023 by CCWineLover

[zalusky]

4 hours ago, leishirsute said:

Do they refund to the travel insurance as well?

 

Here is the deal offered to me which can change based upon their current needs.  I don't know if this was custom for our sailing.  The Viking agent indicated it was specifically a problem with our stateroom category.

 

• Complete refund of existing cruise
• Move booking to new sailing does not have to be same itinerary but in my case had to be less than 18 days.  We picked the same itinerary.
• They discount the new sailing by the amount of the refund.  So if you currently have a 14 day and replace with an 18 day or more expensive sailing it might cost a little more.
• New Tripmate Insurance was less because they are only insuring medical and very little dollar amount.
• New stateroom is in the next higher category if available:  PV1 to PS1 in our case
• Silver Spirits package included
• If you previously booked air with Viking they match that on new sailing IE: Business to Business

 

[deec]

2 hours ago, CCWineLover said:

We have done the same thing multiple times.

That is a big reason we don't use TripMate (in addition to the much greater cost).   One cruise we rescheduled 3 different times and to different itineraries and our insurance just carried over each time.  The good thing, as was stated, is that the pre-existing condition kept transferring along too!

 

With Viking's cruise transfer capability, one of the techniques we use is to take advantage of the $25 deposits.  Since insurance costs rises with the age at booking, especially after age 70, we book a "dummy" cruise as far into the future as possible at $25 apiece, get the insurance and pre-existing.  That locks in the lower price.   Then over the next several years, we can transfer that dummy cruise to a cruise we really do want, transfer the insurance, and effectively have the insurance price at a lower price than the age we are at when we actually take the cruise.

CC WineLover   We also have done that but it is getting hard for me to keep track of moving cruises and insurance...keeping track of how much insurance I have already paid for ( we only insure deposit so that the pre-existing is covered until final payment is due)!  I need Pam's spread sheet skills.  Insurance is getting to be a big part of the expense of our trips.

[FetaCheese]

Zalusky -- A very generous deal !

[leishirsute]

On 5/13/2023 at 12:59 PM, CCWineLover said:

We have done the same thing multiple times.

That is a big reason we don't use TripMate (in addition to the much greater cost).   One cruise we rescheduled 3 different times and to different itineraries and our insurance just carried over each time.  The good thing, as was stated, is that the pre-existing condition kept transferring along too!

 

With Viking's cruise transfer capability, one of the techniques we use is to take advantage of the $25 deposits.  Since insurance costs rises with the age at booking, especially after age 70, we book a "dummy" cruise as far into the future as possible at $25 apiece, get the insurance and pre-existing.  That locks in the lower price.   Then over the next several years, we can transfer that dummy cruise to a cruise we really do want, transfer the insurance, and effectively have the insurance price at a lower price than the age we are at when we actually take the cruise.

Buying the insurance with the $25 deposit is key.  In the course of paying my $25 deposit, being quoted a travel insurance cost and then opting to pay for travel insurance when full payment was due, Viking removed the travel insurance from the invoice which stated I opted out of travel insurance.  Upon receipt of the invoice via email, I immediately called Viking (about 30 minutes after first call) and asked why they stated I opted out of travel insurance when I stated I would pay it when full payment was due.  They said travel insurance cost is not locked in so they had to remove it from the invoice.  Then the said the cost had gone up $200/person if I wanted to buy it.  All within 30 minutes.

Edited May 15, 2023 by leishirsute

[CCWineLover]

1 hour ago, leishirsute said:

Buying the insurance with the $25 deposit is key.  In the course of paying my $25 deposit, being quoted a travel insurance cost and then opting to pay for travel insurance when full payment was due, Viking removed the travel insurance from the invoice which stated I opted out of travel insurance.  Upon receipt of the invoice via email, I immediately called Viking (about 30 minutes after first call) and asked why they stated I opted out of travel insurance when I stated I would pay it when full payment was due.  They said travel insurance cost is not locked in so they had to remove it from the invoice.  Then the said the cost had gone up $200/person if I wanted to buy it.  All within 30 minutes.

I never never use Viking insurance.  
it costs too much, it’s too inflexible, and why get it via the same company that sells the cruise.  Bad personal business practice.

 

with a good 3rd party insurance you won’t have thes issues and can easily do what I suggested.

[leishirsute]

8 minutes ago, CCWineLover said:

I never never use Viking insurance.  
it costs too much, it’s too inflexible, and why get it via the same company that sells the cruise.  Bad personal business practice.

 

with a good 3rd party insurance you won’t have thes issues and can easily do what I suggested.

ONe experience I had with Travel Insurance purchase from the same company offering the trip is that when I had difficulties getting reimbursed by the travel insurance company, the trip company stepped in and acted as an advocate for me and managed to get my full coverage reimbursed,

[marrashadow]

On 4/25/2023 at 9:47 PM, CurlerRob said:

 

Jim, I too come from the "old math" school, but I'm going to quibble with yours a bit, and weigh in on the pros and cons of overbooking (from the sellers' side).

 

First, if two of us have both booked a cabin and paid up at PIF date, but the cruise line only has one cabin available, they are going to have to refund one of us without question. That means they only have one fare guaranteed - refunding the other is not a "minus one" in my view (especially if they have been able to kite the funds for 6 or 12 months). Deciding to offer a subsequent free cruise (plus whatever else) is clearly a "minus one", but a choice the line makes to avoid an irate pax (for whom there is ultimately no cabin.

 

The benefit of overselling is that the cruise line has better odds of filling all cabins at the list price - when someone drops out, there's another of us in line who is contracted at the original price - maximal revenue. The better the line is at predicting the dropout / oversell rate, the fewer potential irate pax they have to try and buy off. Most companies that use this strategy are rich in data about what happens and generally good at placing their bet - sometimes they do get it wrong and out come the "would you like to reschedule" offers. We've all seen the airlines do this at the gate - and may have seen the very painful result when they don't get enough takers!

 

Not overselling means the line will be exposed at PIF time (which for Viking occurs at least twice). There are always going to be multiple dropouts when it's time to pony up - that can leave the line with a sizable percentage of empty cabins to try and fill. Worse, potential pax who were interested would have seen that the cruise was sold out earlier and may never come back for another look post PIF dates, reducing the available market. As well, pax already signed up are unhappy that they can't get the new, great deal.

 

Consider that if 20% of pax dropped out at PIF time, the line has to take action (likely discounts) to fill those slots. Taking a hit on 20% of inventory is a lot more painful that giving away a couple of cabins when you guess poorly on oversells. Had they chosen to overbook by 20%, the equation would balance perfectly and the line would continue happily on with a full ship at the original prices.

 

Overselling is clearly a common business strategy in the transportation and hospitality business (ref. hotels) - rather than being dumb, I've always thought it was the organization's best choice between two tough alternatives.

 

All that said, I shudder at the thought of the cruise lines moving to dynamic pricing such as the airlines have. Just imagine the screaming on all the CC boards! Cheers. 🍺🥌

Equally your booking time changes the price dramatically so customer A books cruise in height of pandemic 2 years out company is losing cash left and right and worried they are going to sink. They start offering deal busters at half normal cost, free air, discounted extensions, and a refund guarantee. On the side the company purchases risk insurance for fares sold from a business insurance company so if that fee is refunded they get reimbursed. So customer A hits all in for their cruise at 3500 per person waiting 2 years and Viking gets to use that money to recover from loses. Customer B wasn't booking at all until just recently because he finally feels ok about travel. Viking hits him with 5500 per person without discounted airfare, and no guarantee,  so all in he is close to 7k per person. So who does the company want in that room? If company refunds customer A it gets the insurance to kick in which pays the customer refund and gets a much higher price for same room. So it gives customer A an offer they can't refuse and still ends up on top with an extra couple grand per person for that room and just pushes the already paid reservation back a bit. Actually quite smart business wise.  They aren't losing anything with these deals they are increasing revenue and cash flow. Remember those flights are group purchased probably with a similar airline strategy that they sold those tickets when they were tanking in revenue so they likely paid less for those too which also gives them a boost though that one is temporary cause flight cost increases will eat that back up in rebooking.

[marrashadow]

Also once they refund customer A that risk free guarantee is gone so if they cancel that new date they get nothing.

[LindaS272]

3 hours ago, marrashadow said:

Also once they refund customer A that risk free guarantee is gone so if they cancel that new date they get nothing.

Not if Customer A had insurance other than TripMate and just transfers it to the new date.

[marrashadow]

I don't believe an insurance company would insure a free trip. Remember as the customer you already received a full refund and the trip for free.

[LindaS272]

2 hours ago, marrashadow said:

I don't believe an insurance company would insure a free trip. Remember as the customer you already received a full refund and the trip for free.

The way we travel there’s a lot more than just the cruise involved. Sure, if the “free” trip is all inclusive with airfare and pre- & post-extensions. But we almost always do our own air and our own extensions—so yes, our insurance is going to cover the extras on the trip that are not just the “free” cruise. Not to mention the need for medical or trip interruption if you have to come home early.

Edited May 18, 2023 by LindaS272

[CCWineLover]

3 minutes ago, LindaS272 said:

The way we travel there’s a lot more than just the cruise involved. Sure, if the “free” trip is all inclusive with airfare and pre- & post-extensions. But we almost always do our own air and our own extensions—so yes, our insurance is going to cover the extras on the trip that are not just the “free” cruise. Not to mention the need for medical or trip interruption if you have to come home early.

Good points, Linda.

We are the same way.  The medical, evacuation, and trip interruption are the most important things for us.  Yes, it would be painful to lose $10K or so, but we want to avoid having $250K medical/evacuation bills!!

[ropomo]

This may be common knowledge, but for those that don't take the time to read the details of the trip insurance they buy, "Medical Evacuation" doesn't necessarily mean what you think it means. Many policies state in the coverages, that Medical Evacuation is transport to the nearest hospital or qualified medical facility, not necessarily home. Again, reading the policy before purchasing is critical to ensure that you are getting what you think you are.

[marrashadow]

So I am unsure if those who don't book Viking air would get the offer and if an insurer would give you back the funds if you took a buy out? As far as if the rescheduled free trip is your own air then yes, obviously that could be insured and of course medical can be purchased separately so yeah that's different all together. I was specifically speaking of the rescheduled "free" cruise not being insured so if something happened you'd loose it.