2for1 cruises and free air - is anybody buying this?

[Paulchili]

When Oceania first started out a few years ago, I remember thinking what a great deal - 2for1 cruises AND free air! It didn’t take me too long to realize that this was just a very clever advertising scheme on the part of a new, upstart cruise line. Touché!

It is like a clothing store taking a $ 100 suit and arbitrarily placing a $ 600 price tag on it. Then they decide to put it on a 50% off sale at $ 300. One would be lead to believe that this is a great deal – getting a $ 600 suit for only $ 300! In reality you are paying 3 times the value of the item.

Oceania’s 2for1 with free air is a little bit like that…

They place an unrealistically high price on their cabins (which none of us would even dream of paying) and then they decide to offer us a “2for1 deal with free air”. This brings down the price of a cabin closer to earth (still higher than most cruise lines), but more realistic. The free air is not free at all – you are paying for it. If one chooses to do one’s own air arrangements, Oceania will give you air credit. Thus it is NOT FREE. It may indeed be a good deal, it may be a better price than many of us can get on our own, but it definitely is not FREE.

Oceania did well with this catch phrase for a long time and has built up a loyal following. I might add for a good reason – their product was “revolutionary” and very good. I am a big fan of Oceania myself.

I don’t know about you, but for me this “2for1 and free air” gimmick is getting tired and old. It’s now time for Oceania to grow up and move on.

I can handle the truth – your fares are not really 2for1 and your air is not really free.

Just give me a competitively and fairly priced cabin; you can add on air packages at extra cost for those interested; you can discount cruises that are not selling well; you can even charge premium for those cruises that are in great demand. Just tell me the truth – I can handle it.

At the prices Oceania is charging for their cruises, I for one do not believe for a second that I am getting a 2for1 deal on my cruise; nor do I believe my air is free.

I would hope not too many of you do either.

[LHT28]

When Oceania first started out a few years ago, I remember thinking what a great deal - 2for1 cruises AND free air! It didn’t take me too long to realize that this was just a very clever advertising scheme on the part of a new, upstart cruise line. Touché!

 

You could check out some other cruise lines & their price structure

I notice Silversea also has cruises marketed at 50% off the brochure rate

RSSC has 2 for 1

Seabourn has 50 % off

 

It is all marketing

It seems to work for all of them;)

[Paulchili]

You could check out some other cruise lines & their price structure

I notice Silversea also has cruises marketed at 50% off the brochure rate

RSSC has 2 for 1

Seabourn has 50 % off

 

It is all marketing

It seems to work for all of them;)

 

I believe you are missing my point.

Those above rates for SS,RSSC & Seabourne are "specials" for cruises that are not selling well. Note that I recommended for O to do the same.

O's 2for1 fares, on the other hand, is their STANDARD fare structure that is really not 2for1 at all; nobody ever pays their "full" double price (at least I hope nobody does). Their 2for1 is really their standard fare and they should call it that, period. They rarely, if ever, discount that (TAs may, but O does not).

I do like O very much, I just have a problem with this 2for1 and free air gimmick.

[meow!]

Whatever the terminology used, in real terms (what you actually pay), at the beginning, in 2004, Oceania had very good pricing. Our 14 day Barcelona to Venice voyage in a balconied cabin was only $3,200 including air (worth quite a bit from the west coast). Booked in 2007, our upcoming 12 day Venice to Athens in the same cabin was $4,200, plus lots more "air taxes", surcharges etc. If you buy that voyage this year 2008, it will have been $4,700 (2 days less for $1,500 per person or some 70+% per diem more). There is also no "deals" for Oceania, unlike most other cruise lines.

 

We have discussed this before, and it is too cumbersome to repeat. Suffice it to say that Oceania has good food, good itinerary and good service, though its price advantage over time may have become a price barrier especially now that the market has soured, unless its management is willing to be more flexible down the road.

[hondorner]

Paulchili, can you name one cruise line, anywhere, in any price strata, that actually charges every passenger the published fare? I believe that all of us understand Oceania's price is simply 50% off an arbitrary number, much the same as other cruise lines charge 15% or 40% or 80% or whatever of some published fare.

 

Of course the air is not "free"; Oceania could hardly stay in business if they gave something away for which they have to pay. However, it is a convenience to know up front what the total cost of a cruise will be including the airfare to get there, unlike most cruise lines that lowball the price without the air, knowing full well that you have to get there somehow, and expecting you to do the leg work to determine the total cost. All of us (at least those of us in the US) are also perfectly aware that we will NOT be paying for the airfare if we do not use it; Oceania willingly offers a credit.

 

It is a marketing tactic, and pretty darn effective, if you ask me. You look at the published price, know that 2 people can sail for that price, and know that there will be no additional charge for the airfare (air taxes and fuel surcharges are another matter, which is confusing to many Oceania newbies).

[Cruise Junky]

I agree that all cruise lines have their gimmicks. However, having said that, we were anxiously awaiting the pricing and itinerary for the 09 Singapore to Sydney cruise. At their Early Bird booking the price per person is $8199 per person and we all know to add taxes, fuel surcharge etc. on that. We really wanted to cruise Oceania!!! Regent is offering a very similar cruise for $8,500 per person, which includes air, all suites and is all inclusive. Doesn't take a rocket scientist to do that math. All this for a 17 or 18 day cruise. We have instead booked Princess...gasp, I know. Sydney to LA, 30 days in a cabin with a huge balcony for $11,000 for two including air. So instead of Singapore and Indonesia, I get New Zealand, Tahiti, Samoa and Hawaii, not that bad of a trade off.

[Leonid]

Seems some of the troops are finally smartening up! Paulchili is one of them. After 32 sailings and 4 more booked on O, I can't see paying the inflated prices for 2010 for the cabins we would usually book. Time will tell if O can sustain their pricing structure. Until then, unless DW really wants to cruise, we will sit out 2010 on O.

[Paulchili]

hondorner:

"Of course the air is not "free"; Oceania could hardly stay in business if they gave something away for which they have to pay."

 

So why call it "free air"? Why not say "air included". They both may mean the same thing, but one statement is honest the other is misleading.

When their offer on "free air" expires after Aug 31st, will they lower the prices (to account for air credit)? I doubt it very much.

 

hondorner:

"You look at the published price, know that 2 people can sail for that price"

 

OK - so call it price per cabin but not 2for1; 2for1 implies that normally you would have to pay twice as much per person (or twice the published price per cabin) and I doubt that anybody ever would.

 

We are not children - don't treat us like children. Call it what it really is.

These advertising tactics are just dated & misleading - that's my point.

I love Oceania (or used to) but I am not fooled by these tactics; if their prices will continue to increase then all inclusive cruises (Regent, Silversea) will offer a better deal.

[Paulchili]

I agree that all cruise lines have their gimmicks. However, having said that, we were anxiously awaiting the pricing and itinerary for the 09 Singapore to Sydney cruise. At their Early Bird booking the price per person is $8199 per person and we all know to add taxes, fuel surcharge etc. on that. We really wanted to cruise Oceania!!! Regent is offering a very similar cruise for $8,500 per person, which includes air, all suites and is all inclusive. Doesn't take a rocket scientist to do that math. All this for a 17 or 18 day cruise. We have instead booked Princess...gasp, I know. Sydney to LA, 30 days in a cabin with a huge balcony for $11,000 for two including air. So instead of Singapore and Indonesia, I get New Zealand, Tahiti, Samoa and Hawaii, not that bad of a trade off.

 

No need to apologize - there is absolutely nothing wrong with Princess.

Your cruise not only has a great itinerary but it also is a very good deal!

Smart choice.

(I hope someone from O is following these discussions and takes notice)

[LHT28]

Regent is offering a very similar cruise for $8,500 per person, which includes air, all suites and is all inclusive.

 

The only price I found for that cruise was $8995 + $425, + 255

http://www.rssc.com/voyage/details.jsp?code=MAR081102&offerId=&page=fares&agencyUri=

So not really much cheaper

 

Glad you found one that suit your needs/wants.

 

That is the bottom line to enjoy your cruise what ever line you choose

 

Lyn

[hondorner]

...I am not fooled by these tactics...

 

And, I'm certainly glad of that. However, I seriously doubt that anyone was ever "fooled" by these "tactics". Your implication is incredibly negative.

[Paulchili]

And, I'm certainly glad of that. However, I seriously doubt that anyone was ever "fooled" by these "tactics". Your implication is incredibly negative.

 

No more negative than "free air", which is anything but free.

I am signing off on this subject.

Happy cruising to all.

[Leonid]

Regarding the "free air" nowhere does O tell you that there large (sometimes), additional fees and taxes if you take their offer. To be totally ethical, there should be a note, however small, that says that additional fess and taxes apply.

There are those people who literally believe everything they read.And then they are shocked when they get hit with additional charges.

[LHT28]

Regarding the "free air" nowhere does O tell you that there large (sometimes), additional fees and taxes if you take their offer. To be totally ethical, there should be a note, however small, that says that additional fess and taxes apply.

 

Like this?

"Air promotion applies to economy, round-trip flights only from select Oceania Cruises U.S. & Canadian gateways and does not include ground transfers, air taxes and air fuel surcharges. Air ticketing fee will apply"

 

http://www.oceaniacruises.com/T_MainContentPage.aspx?PageUID=e0283c3e-a579-45bc-b0f8-90be31125cb2

[Paulchili]

Like this?

"Air promotion applies to economy, round-trip flights only from select Oceania Cruises U.S. & Canadian gateways and does not include ground transfers, air taxes and air fuel surcharges. Air ticketing fee will apply"

 

http://www.oceaniacruises.com/T_MainContentPage.aspx?PageUID=e0283c3e-a579-45bc-b0f8-90be31125cb2

 

 

No, more like this:

"Air is included in price (however, it is not free )" -

Dear passengers, also please note that as it is not free you may get air credit if you choose not to take the "free air" package.

That would be more like it - it's called "Truth in advertising"

It's not the price or the amount, it's the principle. It's misleading, and I suspect intentionally so.

[LHT28]

No, more like this:

"Air is included in price (however, it is not free )" -

.

 

Please re-read LEONID comment . "nowhere does O tell you that there large (sometimes), additional fees and taxes"

 

My posting was in reference to that.

Obviously they do tell you.

[Paulchili]

My personal and final note to all, but especially LHT28 & hondorner,

 

Foremost, please understand that I love Oceania; have cruised with them in the past and will most likely continue to do so (unless their pricing prevents me from doing that).

The purpose of this discussion was to point out what I perceived to be an (intentionally) misleading advertising by Oceania.

I don’t like that. I like to be told the facts straight. It reminds me of being in a car dealership with lines like:

“If you take this car TODAY, you can have it for XY…”We have all been there.

2for1 and 50% off may be the same in price but carries very different implication and connotations.

Even though we all can decipher the “gimmicks” (like “free air”), I don’t like that approach. It assumes I cannot tell the difference. Say it is included, not free.

I know I have gotten testy in some of my replies and I am not particularly proud of that (blame it on the “heat of the moment”, but in reality there is no excuse).

I meant to stir up a heated exchange of ideas. I never meant to disrespect anyone or insult them; I hope I have done neither.

If any of you feel insulted by me, please accept my apologies.

I hope we are all ready to happily move past this onto other more interesting and fun topics – I know I am.

We are here because we love cruising and we’ll continue to do that even if we sometimes disagree.

Paul

PS I will cross post this on a related thread

[Bruin Steve]

My two cents:

 

From the very first time I saw it, I knew "2 for 1, Free Air" was nothing more than a marketing gimmick...

 

Of course, I don't pay attention to brochure rates anyway...I'll typically call my travel agent and say something like:

 

Get me prices for the following three cruises...July 1 Oceania whatever Med 14 nights, July 3 Celebrity whatever Med 14 nights, July 1 Azamara whatever Med 14 nights...inside, window, balcony for each...price with air from LAX and without air..."...

 

I then let her quote me TOTAL prices with all taxes, fees and associated charges...and then I can compare all of the numbers "apples for apples"...

 

THAT is the number I go by...not what is in the brochure or in any advertising...

 

Of course, the problem is that a lot of folks don't do it that way...Some folks pick up a brochure, see the higher brochure prices and scare themselves away...others delude themselves into thinking they're getting a deal better than anyone else is paying...

 

Truth is that "it is what it is"...

 

From my experience, Oceania IS a little overpriced--not enough tto scare me away obviously...I figure they don't have the economies of scale or buying power of some of their competition, their finances are still "start-up" and a little shakier...Everybody has to set their prices based on what it cost them to provide the product and still make a profit...but they also have to try to appear to be competitive...

 

Due to this, I think Oceania is a little sneakier about how it hides costs to the consumer--the added fees and taxes all appear considerably larger than similar costs on other lines...the transfers are always extra/not included...hotel packages are WAY out of whack...shore excursions are higher (for the exact excursions with the same providers in the same ports)...onboard prices (things like drinks and gift shop) are higher...

 

Bottom line is that if you are truly looking for a "bargain", don't look at Oceania...Get the full quote on the cruise you are interested in --with ALL costs and options--and then decide if YOU are willing to pay what they are charging...simple as that...

 

With me, If I like the itinerary and other aspects of the ship, then I consider ALL I'll have to pay and either it works for me or it doesn't...I could have done my upcoming June 2009 itinerary on Princess in July...on the Royal Princess--a similar 30,000 gross ton, 700 passenger ship...and saved a couple of thousand dollars...BUT, that IUtinerary, though it also included Egypt and Israel and a couple other ports of interest, had Santorini, Athens, Sorrento and other ports we'd visited recently rather than Nautica's Tunisia, Crete and Cyprus--which we wanted to visit...So, we chose Nautica based mostly on itinerary...

 

But I am certainly not choosing it based on "2 for 1, Free Air" or any other marketing gimmick...

[Leonid]

Sorry I misspoke . Paulchili said it better than I did. Free air is not free and never will be.

It seems you jump on anything someone says that is not exactly as it should be said. Oh well, at least the message is out there. Don't believe everything a cruise line tells you.

BTW - are you related to Meow. Your posts seem to be along the same lines.:rolleyes:

[meow!]

No, we don't even know who Paulchili is. We haven't spoken except in this Oceania column starting just a few days ago!

 

P.S. Judging from his postings, he (presumably with a name Paul) makes very good sense thougth!

[LHT28]

Sorry I misspoke . Paulchili said it better than I did. Free air is not free and never will be.

 

I never said the airfare was free some of us are smarter than that

You stated "nowhere does O tell you that there large (sometimes), additional fees and taxes"

...they do, see the link in my above post

 

BTW - are you related to Meow. Your posts seem to be along the same lines.:rolleyes:

 

I hope you are asking paulchili and not me:eek:

[LHT28]

Of course, I don't pay attention to brochure rates anyway...I'll typically call my travel agent and say something like:

 

Get me prices for the following three cruises...July 1 Oceania whatever Med 14 nights, July 3 Celebrity whatever Med 14 nights, July 1 Azamara whatever Med 14 nights...inside, window, balcony for each...price with air from LAX and without air..."...

 

I then let her quote me TOTAL prices with all taxes, fees and associated charges...and then I can compare all of the numbers "apples for apples"...

 

THAT is the number I go by...not what is in the brochure or in any advertising...

 

 

I agree with you.

We choose a few cruises then pick the one that suits our needs & pocketbook

No delusions!;)

[caribbeansun]

Steve - I think you are way off the mark with this - consider who is O's parent co. I strongly suspect they have considerable purchasing power and use it to their advantage wherever and whenever possible.

 

From my experience, Oceania IS a little overpriced--not enough tto scare me away obviously...I figure they don't have the economies of scale or buying power of some of their competition, their finances are still "start-up" and a little shakier...Everybody has to set their prices based on what it cost them to provide the product and still make a profit...but they also have to try to appear to be competitive...

 

As to the OP - I also find the silly 2 for 1 stuff pointless. The recent email about it expiring on Aug 31st I thought had to be a joke since that's their standard pricing so what exactly was expiring on Aug 31st? O's promo emails hit the delete folder pretty quickly these days as they are of no value.

[DaveFr]

As to the OP - I also find the silly 2 for 1 stuff pointless. The recent email about it expiring on Aug 31st I thought had to be a joke since that's their standard pricing so what exactly was expiring on Aug 31st? O's promo emails hit the delete folder pretty quickly these days as they are of no value.

I also wish that Oceania (as well as many other cruise lines such as Silversea) would stop advertising so-called discounts from fictitious list prices. I just ignore the list prices and look at the bottom line. However, you are incorrect when you say that 50% of the list price (2 for 1) is Oceania's standard pricing. 50% of the list price is Oceania's standard opening price but after that "promotion" ends, the price usually increases about $200 to $700, depending on the cabin category. As the cruise gets closer, the price usually increases again to about 60% of the list price. Last year I remember seeing a couple of cruises where the fare had increased to 75% of the list price.

 

Here are a couple of examples of increased prices:

 

http://www.oceaniacruises.com/T_MainContentPage.aspx?PageUID=2cc73046-81b0-496a-bbf3-61a615e51b39&CruiseUID=3ca49975-8d2d-4a08-8575-708332b4ecf0, and http://www.oceaniacruises.com/T_MainContentPage.aspx?PageUID=2cc73046-81b0-496a-bbf3-61a615e51b39&CruiseUID=54f74d09-f0f0-485e-9ba5-100c2f568b1a.

 

Dave

[Bruin Steve]

Steve - I think you are way off the mark with this - consider who is O's parent co. I strongly suspect they have considerable purchasing power and use it to their advantage wherever and whenever possible.

 

Apollo may be a $16 billion holding company...but they have some diversified investments not all of which are necessarily doing that well...It doesn't necessaily mean they can drain other companies to put the money into this...They need to have each individual unit perform...

 

As to the economies of scale, what Apollo owns under it's Prestige subsidiary is Oceania, Regent and a 50% share in Norwegian, other than NCL America... still dwarfed compared to the cruise holdings of Carnival or RCI...

 

Of course, if you're correct and their cost is a not a major factor in their pricing, then they'd have no excuse for the price gouging other than greed...If RCI can offer a 14 night Azamara cruise on the same basic ship or Princess can do the same on its old R ships for a particular price, Oceania should be able to match it...They don't...I was giving them the benefit of the doubt.