Women and children still First?

[world~citizen]

During lifeboat drills I have never heard mention of gentlemen standing aside for women and children to seat in lifeboats first. It never comes up.

 

I note that in the Concordia, some of this was going on according to accounts until panicked men reportedly rushed around and over everyone to secure a position.

 

Perhaps the question is more poignant if there is a list and one bank of lifeboats is inoperable.

 

Could a man take a seat if other women were left onboard? Could a woman leave without her husband? Of course there is no question about children.

 

Despite the new improved and very just equality of the sexes, I suspect the old tradition prevails.

 

Is it still women and children first?

[English_in_Spain]

I would also like to know what happens to the disabled/reduced mobility passengers. Do they get any help or priority?

 

I am not in a wheelchair, I use a walker/rollator, but I would have had real problems when the ship started to list. I would not have been able to stand let alone get to my lifeboat station.

 

[world~citizen]

I would also like to know what happens to the disabled/reduced mobility passengers. Do they get any help or priority?

 

I am not in a wheelchair, I use a walker/rollator, but I would have had real problems when the ship started to list. I would not have been able to stand let alone get to my lifeboat station.

 

 

Really good question.

 

Most people think in terms of an organized evacuation with minimal panic. It seems likely that in many situations as you are in fact, abandoning ship, things are not going to be terribly normal.

 

I would think people in wheelchairs would be in one tough spot.

[Krazy Kruizers]

I never really worried about how I would get to the lifeboat -- but now I am concerned as I, too, will be using a walker/rollator for the first time on a cruise.

[English_in_Spain]

I have been on 3 cruises since I had my mobility problems. In normal circumstances, most people are very helpful and considerate because I cannot use stairs, walk a distance, stand a long time or climb a steep incline.

 

What would happen in this sort of situation? DH is able bodied but is now in his mid seventies. Other passengers are not going to stop and help. Are crew members going to?

 

What would happen to people in wheelchairs if the ship were on its side and there was panic? How would they get to their lifeboats?

 

I have done many cruises but this incident has made me realise how vulnerable I would be.

 

Will it stop me cruising? No. But it has given me a lot to think about

 

[Krazy Kruizers]

My DH isn't able-bodied as he used to be -- so he would not be able to give me all the assistance that I need.

 

Not certain if the crew would be able to help as they have assigned places they have to be at during an emergency.

[trvlcrzy]

To answer the original question, the last time I attended a muster drill on a HAL ship (sadly, it has been too long... April 2010), the men were expected to stand closest to the wall, while women were positioned closer to the rail.

 

So, for those who have sailed more recently, is that still a part of the instructions? I've never been thrilled with being separated from DH, so I do my best to be in the 'back' of the women's section while he is in the 'front' of the men's section.

 

I have since sailed one Princess cruise, but they do the muster drill in lounges... where we are told to assemble for further instructions.

[sapper1]

To answer the original question, the last time I attended a muster drill on a HAL ship (sadly, it has been too long... April 2010), the men were expected to stand closest to the wall, while women were positioned closer to the rail.

 

So, for those who have sailed more recently, is that still a part of the instructions? I've never been thrilled with being separated from DH, so I do my best to be in the 'back' of the women's section while he is in the 'front' of the men's section.

 

I have since sailed one Princess cruise, but they do the muster drill in lounges... where we are told to assemble for further instructions.

It was done the way you describe on the Zuiderdam last August. I, too, make it a point to stand behind the women so I can stand right in front of my husband.

[feathersandnananose]

Women in front at the muster drill has nothing to do with "women first" - it's actually shorter people in front so everyone can see the life vest demonstration!

 

Barb in so cal

[CruiserBruce]

There is a clear announcement during the drill that people with mobility issues will be assisted at all times during an evacuation.

[tompeter]

A passenger from this ship was doing a phone interview on the news yesterday, and indicated "the staff was calm and helpful during the evacuation but the same could not be said for her fellow passengers who were pushing, shoving and acting horribly during the evacuation" Based on her observations it sounded like every person for themselves rather than W/C first...

[bcd2010]

I read in this forum that people with mobility issues should let "them" know (it's not always obvious, esp if there's no walker, cane, wheel chair, etc.), but I'm not sure who "they" are - front desk? crew member at the muster station? Anyone know?

[serene56]

A passenger from this ship was doing a phone interview on the news yesterday, and indicated "the staff was calm and helpful during the evacuation but the same could not be said for her fellow passengers who were pushing, shoving and acting horribly during the evacuation" Based on her observations it sounded like every person for themselves rather than W/C first...

 

 

I think in a real emergency this will always happen.

 

I have a few first timers going with me at the end of the month and needless to say they do not want to go now.

[Himself]

During lifeboat drills I have never heard mention of gentlemen standing aside for women and children to seat in lifeboats first. It never comes up.

 

I note that in the Concordia, some of this was going on according to accounts until panicked men reportedly rushed around and over everyone to secure a position.

 

Perhaps the question is more poignant if there is a list and one bank of lifeboats is inoperable.

 

Could a man take a seat if other women were left onboard? Could a woman leave without her husband? Of course there is no question about children.

 

Despite the new improved and very just equality of the sexes, I suspect the old tradition prevails

 

Is it still women and children first?

 

 

 

 

This is the way it is supposed to be and this is the way we line up in the muster drills.

[bellebaby]

My husband and I discussed this last evening. We decided I would go ahead to safety. He would stay behind and assist the disabled, elderly, women and children. He is able bodied, has first-aid training, and might be needed. It's just the right thing to do.

 

I sometimes travel solo. He hopes by helping others, someone might help me if I was alone and needed assistance.

 

BTW - I might take my 82 year old mother with me in Sept. I thought this incident would impact her desire to go. Not a chance. She said life is too short to worry. Be prepared and carry-on!

 

B

[Randyk47]

It's really hard to say how one is going to react in a situation. Unfortunately I've been involved, kind of being in the wrong place at the right time, in two serious events. One was a substantial earthquake and quite frankly people acted badly. It happened to be in a school and even after all the drills and practices it didn't come off that way and people, including the staff and teachers, literally ran over each other getting out of the building. Second was the attack on the Pentagon on 9/11 and people couldn't have behaved any better by helping one another and not panicking. Somewhere in the neighborhood of 28,000 evacuated the Pentagon that day and there were few injuries related directly to the evacuation process. In my mind it comes down to the perceived threat. In the earthquake there were windows exploding, pieces of the building falling, and the momentary but awful rumbling noise. It felt dangerous. In the Pentagon, at least in our section of the building, there was light smoke in the hallways but no visible fire and no other noises. I think other than the thought of more aircraft coming in there was no immediate notion of danger.

[WriterOnDeck]

BTW - I might take my 82 year old mother with me in Sept. I thought this incident would impact her desire to go. Not a chance. She said life is too short to worry. Be prepared and carry-on!

 

B

 

Great attitude!

[serene56]

It's really hard to say how one is going to react in a situation.

 

 

I believed that I would be calm-- and wait out the emergencies.

 

When we had out earthquake a few months back-- the building swayed and made noise. I paniced- grabbed by pocketbook, got on an elevator, and then stood outside in Downtown where all the high rise buildings are.

 

\After all was over I realized my big mistakes. I do not think when in a panic

[Oceanwench]

I read in this forum that people with mobility issues should let "them" know (it's not always obvious, esp if there's no walker, cane, wheel chair, etc.), but I'm not sure who "they" are - front desk? crew member at the muster station? Anyone know?

 

Several years ago I interviewed a hotel manager aboard a HAL ship regarding various aspects of cruising for people with disabilities.

At that time he told me there are crew members specifically assigned to help those passengers who are disabled.

This, of course, was referring to those in HC accessible cabins, who fill out forms to let HAL know if they'll be bringing aboard wheelchairs, etc.

 

I know DH cannot walk and in an emergency such as the one that happened with the Costa ship, I have no idea how he would be able to get out of the cabin without assistance. And one crew member would not be sufficient to carry him.

[sail7seas]

=world~citizen;3

 

<SNIP>

 

 

Is it still women and children first?

 

I listen closely when at life boat drill despite the many times we have attended.

 

What I have heard said in recent drills has changed from the past and they now say words to the effect of:

 

Please have the tallest persons in the rear and those shorter in the front. Therefore, a taller woman would be in the rear at life boat drill and a shorter man toward the front.

 

I do not think boats are loaded children/women/men. I think the sensitivity and instinct most of us possess would automatically load a child with Mom into a boat before the lineback gent in the rear of the pack. What adult, able bodied person would not load the child? :eek:

 

 

 

My DH isn't able-bodied as he used to be -- so he would not be able to give me all the assistance that I need.

 

Not certain if the crew would be able to help as they have assigned places they have to be at during an emergency.

 

Several years ago I interviewed a hotel manager aboard a HAL ship regarding various aspects of cruising for people with disabilities.

At that time he told me there are crew members specifically assigned to help those passengers who are disabled.

This, of course, was referring to those in HC accessible cabins, who fill out forms to let HAL know if they'll be bringing aboard wheelchairs, etc.

 

I know DH cannot walk and in an emergency such as the one that happened with the Costa ship, I have no idea how he would be able to get out of the cabin without assistance. And one crew member would not be sufficient to carry him.

 

 

DH and I are able bodied but I had a conversation with a Captain about assisting disabled persons in an emergency and he said there are crew assigned to do just that. You should let the office know if you would require assistance and it is noted. Of course, if you are out of the cabin, they would not know where to find you. Hopefully you would encounter crew who would help or a responsible, decent person or persons who see your need and not have to be asked. We have to believe there are decent people who do decent things when they see a need. I have enough faith in fellow man to think two strong guys would pick you up and get you where you need to be.

 

And anyone who knows me here knows I am NO Pollyanna........ :o

 

[RuthC]

I have done many cruises but this incident has made me realise how vulnerable I would be.

Those of us who live alone, and have no family to rely on, already realize how vulnerable we are daily. It's not all that different on a ship.

We have to plan as best we can for emergency circumstances, do for ourselves to the extent we are able, then trust there will be help if and when the time comes that we need it.

Then we have to stop worrying about it and go on living. That's all we can do.

[nana51]

I think there should be help for those with mobility needs and children. Then mothers and fathers and then the single folk last regardless of age. I also would be willing to go last as my children are grown and I have no mobility issues. In this day and age it should be children and their moms first, disabled then no preference.

[mtnmommy]

Whenever we have done the lifeboat drill, the crew have asked my children to stand in front, with me directly behind them. My husband stands in the back. They also note that there are children at this lifeboat station.

[hvsteve1]

I believed that I would be calm-- and wait out the emergencies.

 

When we had out earthquake a few months back-- the building swayed and made noise. I paniced- grabbed by pocketbook, got on an elevator, and then stood outside in Downtown where all the high rise buildings are.

 

\After all was over I realized my big mistakes. I do not think when in a panic

 

Getting in an elevator during an earthquake? That is panic.

 

Some of the accounts of events on the Concordia make it sound as though, when the ship started to list, people ran in circles shouting, "We're all gonna die!" while watching the captain and crew wave goodby from the lifeboats. We'll have to await the formal hearings to see what really happened. There are a lot of confliciting reports and flat out misunderstaings. One that stood out to me was a published complaint that porters and the like were climbing into the lifeboats and taking control. I think these people expected to see officers at the helm. Who do they think is cross trained to operate these boats? They must be under the impression there is a dedicated "lifeboat crew" below decks just hanging out and waiting for the ship to sink.

[jtl513]

Women in front at the muster drill has nothing to do with "women first" - it's actually shorter people in front so everyone can see the life vest demonstration.

I don't think so. If that were true then they would say tall people in back and short people in front, not men in back and women in front. I've been behind tall women and couldn't see the demo. I think think the implication is that the women, in front, would be the first ones to get on the lifeboat.