HAL, not as dirty as most but Princedam gets an 'F'

[voyageur9]

Interesting report on just how badly -- or otherwise -- the major cruise lines pollute the air and water; including sewage treatment and use of 'dirty' fuel oils.

 

HAL ranks third overall, behind Disney and Princess. HAL's mark of B-minus is unchanged from last year in the Friends of the Earth report http://libcloud.s3.amazonaws.com/93/3d/a/2562/2012_cruise_ship_report_card.pdf

 

Of the 148 ships ranked; Oosterdam, Westerdam and Zuiderdam got As while Rotterdam and Prinsendam flunked with Fs.

[rucrazy]

Thanks that was an interesting read...

 

Joseph

[CruiserBruce]

As one might expect, older ships with older, very hard, or nearly impossible to replace older technology score poorly. Newer ships with the more modern technology do much better.

[vicocala]

I really wonder about these groups though. What would cause more pollution, 5,000 people going jointly on a cruise or 5,000 people driving cars, eating separate meals and using all those sewage facilities.

 

I suspect the cruises are much more Eco friendly.

[kazu]

I really wonder about these groups though. What would cause more pollution, 5,000 people going jointly on a cruise or 5,000 people driving cars, eating separate meals and using all those sewage facilities.

 

I suspect the cruises are much more Eco friendly.

 

OH my and into this thread a little light shines:D

don't you know that common sense is not permitted;):D

I don't know what would work out to be the worst in all honesty nor where the break even point is - but thank you for making me feel better about my next cruise on the prinsendam:):)

[vicocala]

OH my and into this thread a little light shines:D

 

don't you know that common sense is not permitted;):D

 

I don't know what would work out to be the worst in all honesty nor where the break even point is - but thank you for making me feel better about my next cruise on the prinsendam:):)

 

Glad to be of service mame! Seriously, I watched a film while on Monarch of the Seas about this subject and what RCCL does and they recycle and/or reuse almost everything. I am sure Carnival Corp. does the same.

 

It isn't only Eco friendly but economically it makes so much sense as well.

[Krazy Kruizers]

Very interesting information here.

Thank for the link.

[KirkNC]

As one might expect, older ships with older, very hard, or nearly impossible to replace older technology score poorly. Newer ships with the more modern technology do much better.

 

Yes not rocket science to me.

[Modern_Viking]

As one might expect, older ships with older, very hard, or nearly impossible to replace older technology score poorly. Newer ships with the more modern technology do much better.

 

True, but I think the ports of call served by the ship also matter.

 

Vista class ships often visit places like Seattle or Vancouver with shore power available, and those ships get clean air credit for that. The Prinsendam visits many places that just don't have the resources or need to install that equipment (or perhaps don't even have the extra electric power). Thus, the Prinsendam loses some points on that.

 

Although, age and size certainly make life tougher for the Prinsendam.

[BruceMuzz]

So are you pointing the finger at those cruise lines who continue to operate old inefficient ships - or are you blaming the passengers who continue to book cruises on those old inefficient ships, thus encouraging the cruise lines to continue operating them?

[jaguarstyper]

Vista class ships often visit places like Seattle or Vancouver with shore power available, and those ships get clean air credit for that. The Prinsendam visits many places that just don't have the resources or need to install that equipment (or perhaps don't even have the extra electric power). Thus, the Prinsendam loses some points on that.

Yes, this is true. But, what everyone seems to lose sight of is that all electricity needs to be generated and distributed. Its not just magically available at the port in Seattle. Somewhere, there is probably a coal burning power plant generating the electricity, which is delivered potentially hundreds of miles across lossy and inefficient copper wires to the port. There is an environmental impact associated with all electricity and energy. Just because people do not see the smoke coming from the ship's funnel, they assume the electricity is pollution free. I read the same rhetoric from the people who champion electric cars. They try to insist the cars generate zero emissions. While that may be true, they never seem to acknowledge the emissions of the coal smoke belching power plant that shipped the electricity, quite inefficiently and at a great loss, to the car's environmentally tragic batteries.

 

Oh well, what do I know?

[CruiserBruce]

So are you pointing the finger at those cruise lines who continue to operate old inefficient ships - or are you blaming the passengers who continue to book cruises on those old inefficient ships, thus encouraging the cruise lines to continue operating them?

 

I am doing neither, at least not intentionally. I am saying the conclusions should be very obvious, for the reasons I stated. I think it also documents well the progress ship construction has made.

[jaguarstyper]

I am doing neither, at least not intentionally. I am saying the conclusions should be very obvious, for the reasons I stated. I think it also documents well the progress ship construction has made.

I think the conclusions are biased to support their agenda.

[gentlemancruiser]

It was an intersting article. However, the author made several comments about things that 'could happen' which to me at least, comes across as being sensationalistic or theory much like the local weather man who says there could be a horrible storm with high winds and snow, but then tomorrow comes and nothing happens. Much like listening to a Michelle Bachman speech.

 

If you are truly credible you need to talk about what IS happening. Cruise lines invest MILLIONS of dollars into reducing waste, pollution and carbon every year but it's never reported on or talked about by enviromentalist.

 

Could someone please show me the proof of swimmers getting sick, show me the sewage being dumped.

[thyme2go]

Yes, this is true. But, what everyone seems to lose sight of is that all electricity needs to be generated and distributed. Its not just magically available at the port in Seattle. Somewhere, there is probably a coal burning power plant generating the electricity, which is delivered potentially hundreds of miles across lossy and inefficient copper wires to the port. There is an environmental impact associated with all electricity and energy. Just because people do not see the smoke coming from the ship's funnel, they assume the electricity is pollution free. I read the same rhetoric from the people who champion electric cars. They try to insist the cars generate zero emissions. While that may be true, they never seem to acknowledge the emissions of the coal smoke belching power plant that shipped the electricity, quite inefficiently and at a great loss, to the car's environmentally tragic batteries.

 

Oh well, what do I know?

 

You might live where coal produces your electricity, but Seattle and the NW have electricity coming from dam's (it rains there), wind power and solar power. Seattle has made a committment to lessening impacts on it's people and the environment with the ability for cruise ships to hook up at dock. That isn't just an electrical issue...the ships don't run their engines which produce particulate emissions while docked. It's important to look at this from more than one piece of information......and this article was an overview to create a simple curve and information for cruisers--should they care about these issues. Some people do care, others don't.

[jaguarstyper]

You might live where coal produces your electricity, but Seattle and the NW have electricity coming from dam's (it rains there), wind power and solar power. Seattle has made a committment to lessening impacts on it's people and the environment with the ability for cruise ships to hook up at dock. That isn't just an electrical issue...the ships don't run their engines which produce particulate emissions while docked. It's important to look at this from more than one piece of information......and this article was an overview to create a simple curve and information for cruisers--should they care about these issues. Some people do care, others don't.

You're absolutely right! Washington's electric generation from hydroelectric is 84%, more than 10 times the national average. Electric generation from wind is 9%, also 10 times the national average. All very good, indeed! Washington state is miles ahead of the rest of the country and should be commended for their commitment to clean electricity production. Unfortunately, the rest of the country and the world sits at around 6.5% and .8% for hydroelectric and wind power generation. Perhaps Seattle wasn't the best example for my rant. :o

[thyme2go]

You're absolutely right! Washington's electric generation from hydroelectric is 84%, more than 10 times the national average. Electric generation from wind is 9%, also 10 times the national average. All very good, indeed! Washington state is miles ahead of the rest of the country and should be commended for their commitment to clean electricity production. Unfortunately, the rest of the country and the world sits at around 6.5% and .8% for hydroelectric and wind power generation. Perhaps Seattle wasn't the best example for my rant. :o

 

 

Thanks jaguarstyper, for the update.......I just didn't want apples (Washington, of course!) and oranges in the same bin! :D

[vicocala]

For those who are interested in making the United States and other countries energy independent as well as being a leader in clean coal and other initiatives instead of supporting envirionmental groups who waste so much money and dare I say it energy in protests, may I suggest making a donation to the various colleges and universities departments for energy conservation and research.

 

And no I am not affiliated with any such colleges or universities, just a taxpayer who wants ecology taken out of the political realm and into actual activities to make things better, as well as a taxpayer.:D