tipping on Seabourn ???

[Flamin_June]

Last week, I watched a fellow in R2 hand the maître d' a $20 bill for seating him. And I am seeing more and more of this dreadful behavior.

 

I would hope that the Maitre d' refused the tip.

 

As someone once said to me "money can't buy friendship and money can't buy loyalty, but money can reward good service."

 

If you have had particularly good service you may wish to reward it, but that should be something private between you and the employee, and should take place when you take your leave. One does not expect to offer money as an incentive for preferential, or perhaps just efficient, treatment in a 'luxury' establishment.

 

Like many, we do leave our stewardess a tip, but we have had exceptionally pleasant and helpful stewardesses. Tipping should be entirely at your discretion, if you feel you want to reward someone for giving you exceptional service.

[FKGirl]

We agree tipping is a personal decision!! When we see crew members in port having a nice afternoon off we secretly pay their lunch bill. The look on their faces is priceless. We never tell.

Pay it forward!!!

 

We ran into a couple of exceptional crew members as we were ashore, on the beach in St. Barts last year. I wondered aloud if the beach bar had on-the-sand service. Apparently, they did not, so I went to the bar and got two beers and brought them over to the crew... They were stunned. (And enjoyed a moment of feeling what it is like to be on seabourn!)

[Keith1010]

I wanted to comment about the cultural aspect of tipping.

 

Yes, Americans in general tip on and and a lot has to due with the fact that when we go to restaurants, etc the wait staffs salary is based mainly on receiving tips. We tip for other things as well from the salon to a taxi.

 

However, that does not mean that all Americans are not discreet when it comes to tipping.

 

In other words I have seen people blatantly not use discretion in the way they tip by flashing wads of money as a couple of posters said but most people don't and that includes most people who are used to tipping on land and at the same time I have seen some people who normally do not tip on land for most things act indiscreetly as well.

 

In short, whether I tip or not you will never know because I believe it is a personal decision and should be handled discreetly for a wide range of reasons.

 

Just my opinion but I never like to generalize about people.

 

Finally, I am always amazed that people get upset over this topic. Whether I tip or not is really my own business and not anyone else's. And the same is true for each of you.

 

When people ask me about tipping on ships I always just explain what the policy is so they understand that, but in the end tell them that they have to decide what makes sense.

 

Even on land when people ask well how much should they tip their guide for an excursion I also believe that is a personal decision. Each person should do the research for the country they are in and then do what they think makes sense.

 

Keith

[Roxburgh]

Regardless of the cultural aspect, I think that, for some people, the act of tipping is a power and/or status thing.

[frantic36]

Tothesunset has a good point about cultural differences. I think Seabourn was wise to go with the general no tipping policy as this way people from various cultures can work within their boundaries. I think the main point to remember is fairness and discretion. Also definitely mentioning names on questionaires are very helpful to reward good service.

 

If you do wish to tip the crew fund works as they put it towards special events to all the crew. You will receive a thank you note on behalf of all the crew for this.

 

If you wish to give a thank your stewardess or others it is your choice and I am sure in truth many of us may do so but as markham mentioned it is best done out of sight of others.

 

I think the staff are lovely and go out of their way and are so pleasant without any expectation of a tip. When I give a donation to the crew fund it is at the end of my cruise and the crew were not aware of my intentions until then.

 

Julie

[Keith1010]

Sure some people think the act of a tip gives them certain rights but the reality is that most people don't think this way.

 

Look, the reality is that some people think they are entitled but people are people and when you cruise on a cruise ship you will meet all sorts of people. Many you will like and some you won't. Tip or no tip.

 

Keith

[adoctor]

"Tipping is neither required nor expected". That's the policy. Why is it so difficult?

Crew fund for those who simply can't (culturally)resist.

[oregon50]

"Tipping is neither required nor expected". That's the policy. Why is it so difficult?

Crew fund for those who simply can't (culturally)resist.

 

It seems so simple.

[Keith1010]

It is simple. But it is still a personal choice if someone wants to still tip and why it bothers someone is beyond me. :)

 

I worry about myself. I really don't worry about what others do when it comes to tipping, drinking, eating, touring or whatever they care to do. They can decide for themselves.

 

Keith

[wripro]

My personal feeling is that a donation to the crew welfare fund is the best way to reward EVERY CREW MEMBER who works hard to make your cruise a good experience, not just the ones with whom we come into contact. Tips are included in the fare and those who feel the need to tip extra are doing it to make themselves feel good. I keep making the analogy that alcohol is also included in the fare yet no one seems to ask if they need to pay for their drinks.

[turtlemichael]

It is simple. But it is still a personal choice if someone wants to still tip and why it bothers someone is beyond me. :)

 

I worry about myself. I really don't worry about what others do when it comes to tipping, drinking, eating, touring or whatever they care to do. They can decide for themselves.

 

Keith

 

Keith, one of the reasons people get upset when others tip in a situation where it is not the apparent "norm", as on luxury liners, is because they feel that their level of service will be reduced. They crew dealing with guests are hard-working and human. The fear is that if they look after X just that little better because he tips, then I will miss out. I'm not saying whether that is a correct assumption but it will be there for some people.

 

I recall, on an early non-luxury line cruise I did, a guest announcing at the table that he had tipped the butler $200 "up-front" to make sure he and his family were "looked after". I recall someone else at the table saying "there goes the service for the rest of the people in your section."

[oregon50]

It is simple. But it is still a personal choice if someone wants to still tip and why it bothers someone is beyond me. :)

 

I worry about myself. I really don't worry about what others do when it comes to tipping, drinking, eating, touring or whatever they care to do. They can decide for themselves.

 

Keith

 

The culture on Crystal was to tip. Same as Carnival, MSC, NCL, RCI. I know it's a hard habit to break when Crystal switched policy and I'm betting 80% of the regulars have not changed their tipping protocol.

When you are on Seabourn, it's a different culture. Try to adapt. IMO, rewarding individuals with cash creates expectations. That is my sole objection to tipping. It creates the expectation that others will do the same. It's just the nature of animals....and humans.

[Keith1010]

The culture on Crystal was to tip. Same as Carnival, MSC, NCL, RCI. I know it's a hard habit to break when Crystal switched policy and I'm betting 80% of the regulars have not changed their tipping protocol.

When you are on Seabourn, it's a different culture. Try to adapt. IMO, rewarding individuals with cash creates expectations. That is my sole objection to tipping. It creates the expectation that others will do the same. It's just the nature of animals....and humans.

 

Please note that I have sailed a wide range of lines including lines such as Seabourn and Silversea so I really understand this.

 

And I have sailed lines where tipping was requested as well as Crystal that has transitioned.

 

I just don't concern myself with what others do. I guess some people do. I don't.

 

Keith

[Keith1010]

Keith, one of the reasons people get upset when others tip in a situation where it is not the apparent "norm", as on luxury liners, is because they feel that their level of service will be reduced. They crew dealing with guests are hard-working and human. The fear is that if they look after X just that little better because he tips, then I will miss out. I'm not saying whether that is a correct assumption but it will be there for some people.

 

I recall, on an early non-luxury line cruise I did, a guest announcing at the table that he had tipped the butler $200 "up-front" to make sure he and his family were "looked after". I recall someone else at the table saying "there goes the service for the rest of the people in your section."

 

I fully understand your point and can understand why some might feel this way.

 

I also do believe that some people believe that if they tip and they tip up front that somehow that will give them an edge and better service and that applies to lines that have tipping and lines that don't.

 

My own view though is different.

 

When sailing lines that request tipping all I can say is that I never tipped up front. I think it's silly but again that's a personal decision too. I have never felt that impacted the service levels my wife and I received. Personally, I don't think it really impacts the service levels that those who tip up front but certainly that is my opinion and it is obviously not fact based.

 

I do believe in treating the crew with respect and kindness and that includes not being demanding, and saying thank you. I do that as part of the golden rule and I find that if you treat people nicely they likely will treat you nicely.

 

I do agree with Henry and some of the other that it is nice to touch the entire crew or as many people as you can. There are various ways to do that and I certainly applaud that.

 

I also believe in recognizing one or more individuals. Ways to do that include the survey and also thank you cards that go to that person, maybe an entire department and note of appreciation about people that also go to their supervisor or to the person responsible for their entire department. We do this not for anything in return. I also believe that there are other things that we might do whether that is giving out candy on Valentine's Day, or whatever we think might put a smile on someone's face.

 

In the end all of this is a personal choice.

 

Sure some people do things for ulterior motives and while I don't condone that this is what they choose to do.

 

We certainly don't. Yes, my Mother taught me well. Oh, my Father did too.

 

And when someone asks me about this subject on or off the ship on a line that does recommend tips or on a line that does not recommend tips I share with them the facts but in the end I tell them it is a personal choice.

 

Again, I just don't worry about things I cannot control and I don't worry that if someone does something and I don't I will be treated as a "second class" citizen.

 

Again, if someone asks is tipping necessary on inclusive lines my answer is no. If someone say they understand but should they tip one or more people I say it's not necessary but that it is a personal choice and do what you want to do. I just think it is a personal decision.

 

I've come to realize that life is short. I want to have the best time on our cruises as we can. I just don't sweat the little things in life and that includes what people do or don't do whether that is what clothes they wear, or what approach they take to tipping.

 

Keith

[2SailingNomads]

I totally agree with the comments regarding: tipping is not expected, and if one feels so inclined it is a personal choice. Our first Seabourn cruise we tipped no one, it was "not expected" was our understanding and we had great service the whole time. On subsequent sailings, based on what I heard from some others, we discreetly left something for our stewardess - after we departed the last day so as to not be "expecting" anything in return, but it was only on occasions when we received service that exceeded our expectations. We have discreetly, when no one was around taken care of a few others who really, IMO, did something special and went out of their way. Giving a little to the crew fund is also a way to express your thanks, but as others have said, it is a personal matter and I believe when I board the ship the 5 * expected service it is what we are paying for.

[Emperor Norton]

The culture on Crystal was to tip. Same as Carnival, MSC, NCL, RCI. I know it's a hard habit to break when Crystal switched policy and I'm betting 80% of the regulars have not changed their tipping protocol.

When you are on Seabourn, it's a different culture. Try to adapt. IMO, rewarding individuals with cash creates expectations. That is my sole objection to tipping. It creates the expectation that others will do the same. It's just the nature of animals....and humans.

 

But the service on Crystal outside of the dining room was excellent in their tipping days.:rolleyes:

 

Oh, wait, it wasn't. You had a number of employees who would skulk about and do nothing most of the cruise. The last few days they'd try to buddy up to you in an effort to get a tip. I'd rather not see that on Seabourn.

[Keith1010]

But the service on Crystal outside of the dining room was excellent in their tipping days.:rolleyes:

 

Oh, wait, it wasn't. You had a number of employees who would skulk about and do nothing most of the cruise. The last few days they'd try to buddy up to you in an effort to get a tip. I'd rather not see that on Seabourn.

 

I have not seen employees sulk on Crystal when tipping was in place nor now when all inclusive was in place. For that matter I have not seen this on any cruise line I have sailed.

 

I have no idea what this has to do with the discussion and about whether or not a passenger wants to tip someone even if it is not required nor expected.

 

Keith

[Roxburgh]

The 'no tipping' culture on Seabourn is, for us, one of the main attractions of the line. And I think that this is a healthy culture because it takes in to account the international nature of Seabourn cruisers while promoting a staff-guest relationship which is not based on the expectation of monetary reward for outstanding service.

 

One of the great things about the service and relationship with Seabourn staff is that there is no subservience. You can have a laugh, make a few jokes, even be the butt of a gentle joke yourself and yet the service is still great. I would hate it if a tipping culture gained ground so that service started to be based on expectations of a future tip rather than on the sheer professionalism of the staff.

 

And do we really want a situation where American guests - who have a tipping culture - get better service than Australian ones (for example) who do not?

 

We pay a lot to cruise with Seabourn. It isn't cheap. So it is a reasonable expectation by us, the customers, that Seabourn remunerate their staff properly so that they can do their jobs without becoming reliant on the generosity of the tipping passengers.

[Roxburgh]

"I could go on against tipping, but let’s leave it at this: it is irrational, outdated, ineffective, confusing, prone to abuse and sometimes discriminatory. The people who take care of us in restaurants deserve a better system, and so do we."

 

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/09/04/dining/leaving-a-tip-a-custom-in-need-of-changing.html?src=un&feedurl=http%3A%2F%2Fjson8.nytimes.com%2Fpages%2Fnational%2Findex.jsonp&_r=0

[wripro]

I bet the same people who disregard the no tipping policy are the ones who complain about others disregarding the dress code!!!!

[Keith1010]

I really think this is making a mountain over a mole hill.

 

Several people have already said that they give to the Crew Fund (this is still a gravity) and that they give to their Stewardess and all I know is that these types of gratuities have been given by some people since we first sailed Seabourn because that is what we were told on this very board before we took our first Seabourn Cruise in 2004 and also what others told me on the ship. At the same time I am sure many didn't do this.

 

Not sure what the issue is but I guess if people didn't worry about something then things would be boring.

 

As to people who flaunt money there are very few of those that I see on any inclusive line or for that matter on a line where gratuities are recommended . But as I said when you sail with lots of people you are going to see things that a few people do that you might not agree with from not washing their hands in the rest room to standing almost in your face when you are trying to conduct a conversation with people at the front desk.

 

I have never felt that someone was treated better than I was treated because of how they tipped.

 

Keith

[purpleally]

Agree with this.

 

I did complete ours, but memory (or lack of) plays a part too. Once I'm home and away from the ship, details are easily forgotten. We received it about a week after the cruise had ended. There were a couple of crew names that we just couldn't remember any longer.

 

Near the end of my cruise I have a notepad and I ask crew how to spell thir name(s). I tell them I want to write something good about them in the review

[juicyjuju]

The 'no tipping' culture on Seabourn is, for us, one of the main attractions of the line. And I think that this is a healthy culture because it takes in to account the international nature of Seabourn cruisers while promoting a staff-guest relationship which is not based on the expectation of monetary reward for outstanding service.

 

One of the great things about the service and relationship with Seabourn staff is that there is no subservience. You can have a laugh, make a few jokes, even be the butt of a gentle joke yourself and yet the service is still great. I would hate it if a tipping culture gained ground so that service started to be based on expectations of a future tip rather than on the sheer professionalism of the staff.

 

And do we really want a situation where American guests - who have a tipping culture - get better service than Australian ones (for example) who do not?

 

 

 

We pay a lot to cruise with Seabourn. It isn't cheap. So it is a reasonable expectation by us, the customers, that Seabourn remunerate their staff properly so that they can do their jobs without becoming reliant on the generosity of the tipping passengers.

 

Well said. We take the QM2 sometimes between the UK and the U.S and the staff are more subservient, more tip-driven, while still doing an excellent job, don't get me wrong. It feels different, although it's hard to explain.

I like the civilized atmosphere on Seabourn where you don't have to think about tipping all the time. I grew up in the UK and the thought of pressing cash into someone's hand is so vulgar I can't do it. Many of the staff are European and may find it vulgar too, which isn't to say they don't need to have a good income like everyone else, but having people press $20 bills into their hands and then having to thank them profusely for it is not the way most people want to make a living. Whenever a cash tip is in order for something I have my husband do it since he is American :)

Last month we were in Stockholm. We took a taxi and I paid by credit card when we reached our destination since it was a longish trip. I told the driver (who was British) to charge me a certain amount that was about ten percent higher than what the meter said to tip him. He waved me off and only charged the exact amount on the meter. Likewise last year we took a car service in London that charged fifty pounds for the trip. My husband gave the driver ten pounds as a tip but he wouldn't take it and gave it back it to him, which was actually an awkward moment. My point is tipping is very cultural, can cause offense and causes me anxiety! Some people are grateful for a tip, some people are insulted or embarrassed and you can't always tell in advance which situation it's going to be.

We always make a donation to the crew welfare fund. I almost never tip our stewardess because I never ask for anything from her.

[markham]

When I first visited Japan in the early 80s I got a lesson in a top Tokyo hotel about tipping that will never wear off.

 

To the Japanese tipping degrades the worker. I imagine that they don't like to feel purchased and further indebted to the tipper vis-a-vis other guests. So rather than insult anyone I rely on Seabourn to keep things simple, fair and above-board for everyone.

 

That makes sense. Customs elsewhere e.g. on Seabourn wannabe lines are irrelevant since no tipping/none expected is Seabourn policy. So if someone is scraping about for tips he or she is not working for Seabourn. In fact, I only tipped the stewardess since we were on board for several weeks and I traded shopping stories on occasion so I knew that shopping was her poison. I thought a small tip, something special and personal, would go over. She was delighted and so was I.

 

Happy sailing!

[lildan]

Personally I always treat people as equals no matter what their job...I talk to them like they are a friend. The staff on Seabourn are excellent at their jobs and I have always found that they appreciate me for being me as much as I appreciate them. It is a two way action. Nuff said.