Why is there a dress code if it is just a suggesting

[Big_G]

So for those who want to play James Bond on vacation please go for it. Just keep in mind that RCI is not going to require its other paying passengers to be part of your fantasy.

 

I personally prefer the Joker. :D

 

[Sitzmark]

I personally prefer the Joker. :D

 

 

Interesting, he does have the requisite jacket and tie. I had been thinking about a zoot suit with giant shoulder pads and a ridiculous hat.

[LMaxwell]

I had been thinking about a zoot suit with giant shoulder pads and a ridiculous hat.

 

You wouldn't be the first. I've seen that before. Some people pull it off quite well.

[grab007]

Seeing the Joker brought to mind that maybe dressing for dinner is kind of like being invited to a Halloween party. You don't have to wear a costume but it might be more fun if you do!

[SeagoingMom]

Though I haven't entered my dog in this fight, I am at a loss to understand how it is that some posters can say that what others wear should not affect anyone, just because it does not affect them (or at least they claim it doesn't...) As this thread clearly points out, it is up to every one of us as individuals to decide whether or not we are affected in some way by what we see around us. No one can dictate what someone else should think or feel.

 

There is a reason why, for example, cruise ships, hotels, stores and shopping centers, concert halls -- all sorts of venues-- decorate their walls with pretty colors, hang beautiful paintings, carefully choose upholstery and drapery fabrics, even set out nice white tablecloths and elegant stemware and china on the dining table. It is because people notice these things! It is called "atmosphere," and even the folks who claim they don't notice it are affected by it without realizing it. It sets a mood. (Like candles on a birthday cake, holiday decorations around the house, or black clothing at a funeral.)

 

All humans who are not visually impaired notice, at least to some extent, the beauty or lack thereof, of their surroundings. If this were not so, every place we went would be dull gray with no decorations at all (like a prison.) Cruising is a social activity in that we all see other people on board. When we are in the public areas of a ship, we ourselves -- what we wear, how we behave -- become part of the atmosphere that the cruise line tries to make as aesthetically pleasing as possible to enhance the cruise experience. To say that the sartorial choices of others make absolutely no difference to anyone is philistinism, and to say that the aesthetics of these choices should not make a difference to anyone, is overstepping one's bounds.

 

Whether folks choose to be aesthetically pleasing in their dress may be debated (obviously!), and how much any individual is affected positively or negatively by others' clothing choices varies widely. But it goes against human nature to say that how others look never matters, and it is certainly beyond any individual's scope to say it should not matter to someone else.

[WishIwerethere]

Though I haven't entered my dog in this fight, I am at a loss to understand how it is that some posters can say that what others wear should not affect anyone, just because it does not affect them (or at least they claim it doesn't...) As this thread clearly points out, it is up to every one of us as individuals to decide whether or not we are affected in some way by what we see around us. No one can dictate what someone else should think or feel.

 

Good post.

 

But I really would like to wear flip flops with my smart casual.

[grab007]

Qed

Edited May 13, 2014 by grab007

[LetsGetWet!]

Though I haven't entered my dog in this fight, I am at a loss to understand how it is that some posters can say that what others wear should not affect anyone, just because it does not affect them (or at least they claim it doesn't...) As this thread clearly points out, it is up to every one of us as individuals to decide whether or not we are affected in some way by what we see around us. No one can dictate what someone else should think or feel.

 

There is a reason why, for example, cruise ships, hotels, stores and shopping centers, concert halls -- all sorts of venues-- decorate their walls with pretty colors, hang beautiful paintings, carefully choose upholstery and drapery fabrics, even set out nice white tablecloths and elegant stemware and china on the dining table. It is because people notice these things! It is called "atmosphere," and even the folks who claim they don't notice it are affected by it without realizing it. It sets a mood. (Like candles on a birthday cake, holiday decorations around the house, or black clothing at a funeral.)

 

All humans who are not visually impaired notice, at least to some extent, the beauty or lack thereof, of their surroundings. If this were not so, every place we went would be dull gray with no decorations at all (like a prison.) Cruising is a social activity in that we all see other people on board. When we are in the public areas of a ship, we ourselves -- what we wear, how we behave -- become part of the atmosphere that the cruise line tries to make as aesthetically pleasing as possible to enhance the cruise experience. To say that the sartorial choices of others make absolutely no difference to anyone is philistinism, and to say that the aesthetics of these choices should not make a difference to anyone, is overstepping one's bounds.

 

Whether folks choose to be aesthetically pleasing in their dress may be debated (obviously!), and how much any individual is affected positively or negatively by others' clothing choices varies widely. But it goes against human nature to say that how others look never matters, and it is certainly beyond any individual's scope to say it should not matter to someone else.

Yep, great post, very well stated.

 

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[aloha of the seas]

See, them's fightin' words, both here and onboard ship. *sigh*

 

And thats the whole problem with this subject whenever it is brought up. Nobody can agree. When I started sailing back in the 70's seeing everybody all dressed up on formal night was really nice. My wife liked going out with her husband all dressed up beside her. Over the next 40 years a lot has changed. I still enjoy dressing up for formal night(I wore suits for many years at work, so a tux is so much a better option for me). But now I can understand how people might not want to get dressed up. On the other side of the coin, I want the people who are considering shorts to think if they could get into a fashionable restaurant back home in a pair of shorts. Most of these restaurants require a jacket and tie. On a cruise you are not having a Happy Meal at McDonalds. You are dining in a quality restaurant. Most of the time we are allowed to dress casual. But that still does not mean shorts. On the formal nights I can live with even an open collared shirt if worn with a jacket. I have seen men with string ties or bandanas.

 

In conclusion, times have changed and we need to accept the way other people think. The new Quantum class ships have a formal dining room. It would be nice if all ships could have that and maybe someday all ships will. Good Sailing, Murf

[Sitzmark]

Though I haven't entered my dog in this fight, I am at a loss to understand how it is that some posters can say that what others wear should not affect anyone, just because it does not affect them (or at least they claim it doesn't...) As this thread clearly points out, it is up to every one of us as individuals to decide whether or not we are affected in some way by what we see around us. No one can dictate what someone else should think or feel.

 

There is a reason why, for example, cruise ships, hotels, stores and shopping centers, concert halls -- all sorts of venues-- decorate their walls with pretty colors, hang beautiful paintings, carefully choose upholstery and drapery fabrics, even set out nice white tablecloths and elegant stemware and china on the dining table. It is because people notice these things! It is called "atmosphere," and even the folks who claim they don't notice it are affected by it without realizing it. It sets a mood. (Like candles on a birthday cake, holiday decorations around the house, or black clothing at a funeral.)

 

All humans who are not visually impaired notice, at least to some extent, the beauty or lack thereof, of their surroundings. If this were not so, every place we went would be dull gray with no decorations at all (like a prison.) Cruising is a social activity in that we all see other people on board. When we are in the public areas of a ship, we ourselves -- what we wear, how we behave -- become part of the atmosphere that the cruise line tries to make as aesthetically pleasing as possible to enhance the cruise experience. To say that the sartorial choices of others make absolutely no difference to anyone is philistinism, and to say that the aesthetics of these choices should not make a difference to anyone, is overstepping one's bounds.

 

Whether folks choose to be aesthetically pleasing in their dress may be debated (obviously!), and how much any individual is affected positively or negatively by others' clothing choices varies widely. But it goes against human nature to say that how others look never matters, and it is certainly beyond any individual's scope to say it should not matter to someone else.

 

So which is it? Do I cause your feelings and emotions? Or are you responsible for your own? In your post you managed to take both views and in doing so take neither.

 

It's funny that with that long winded attempt to sound sophisticated, it really doesn't say much and is just another example of petty name calling and hyperbole. Philistines, lol.

[BamaGuy44]

Though I haven't entered my dog in this fight, I am at a loss to understand how it is that some posters can say that what others wear should not affect anyone, just because it does not affect them (or at least they claim it doesn't...) As this thread clearly points out, it is up to every one of us as individuals to decide whether or not we are affected in some way by what we see around us. No one can dictate what someone else should think or feel.

 

There is a reason why, for example, cruise ships, hotels, stores and shopping centers, concert halls -- all sorts of venues-- decorate their walls with pretty colors, hang beautiful paintings, carefully choose upholstery and drapery fabrics, even set out nice white tablecloths and elegant stemware and china on the dining table. It is because people notice these things! It is called "atmosphere," and even the folks who claim they don't notice it are affected by it without realizing it. It sets a mood. (Like candles on a birthday cake, holiday decorations around the house, or black clothing at a funeral.)

 

All humans who are not visually impaired notice, at least to some extent, the beauty or lack thereof, of their surroundings. If this were not so, every place we went would be dull gray with no decorations at all (like a prison.) Cruising is a social activity in that we all see other people on board. When we are in the public areas of a ship, we ourselves -- what we wear, how we behave -- become part of the atmosphere that the cruise line tries to make as aesthetically pleasing as possible to enhance the cruise experience. To say that the sartorial choices of others make absolutely no difference to anyone is philistinism, and to say that the aesthetics of these choices should not make a difference to anyone, is overstepping one's bounds.

 

Whether folks choose to be aesthetically pleasing in their dress may be debated (obviously!), and how much any individual is affected positively or negatively by others' clothing choices varies widely. But it goes against human nature to say that how others look never matters, and it is certainly beyond any individual's scope to say it should not matter to someone else.

 

Of course people notice their surroundings, that's a lot fairly pretentious words expended to state the obvious. The only argument is whether it's my fellow passengers' job to provide the atmosphere or the cruise line's? I'll go with the cruise line since they're the ones I'm paying to provide my vacation.

 

They do encourage the passengers to help with the atmosphere by making suggestions on what people wear. Most people follow the suggestions. Some don't. Does that detract from the atmosphere? Apparently not much since it's clear the cruise lines are responding to requests for less formality, not more.

 

But thanks for your thoughts and for bolding the really really important parts so we Philistines didn't miss anything ;)

Edited May 13, 2014 by BamaGuy44

[reney313]

Been there. Done that. I've read these posts a million times. But after a few glasses of wine during a formal benefit this evening (on a MONDAY!), I feel I should comment.

 

Seriously, I think those that go on a cruise and expect formal wear (tux or suit with tie) are trying to have a cruise compensate for their impression of a luxurious vacation. Sure, you are wined and dined on a cruise. You have stateroom attendants that attend to your every need. But you are still on a cruise ship.

 

I'm not young or old--I'm 41 (I think I still qualify for the '40 is the new 30' adage). I started cruising at the tail end of the "golden years" of cruises, I guess. It seems to me it was the mass market lines, post the ocean crossing days, that invented formal night. I've researched a lot of the luxury ships and they don't even have "formal" night. Many remain resort casual throughout the duration. The fact is, most professionals go on vacation for the ability to lose their suits and dresses.

 

I dress nicely in the MDR. It was my upbringing. But I do not wear a formal gown. I have enough of that home, like tonight. And at home, I can assure you I am dining in much nicer venues than the MDR.

 

My boyfriend is a snob. You wouldn't know that because he refuses to wear pants anywhere. 5 weddings in 2 years and the man wore jeans with a sport coat and dress shirt to 4 of him after being chastised for the pants I made him wear to the first of the five. Our friends are all professionals and socialites in this large metropolis of Springfield, MO. But they truly only want to see him in nice dark jeans. They know he's being fake if he isn't. So making him dress in jeans to eat at the MDR is impossible. It's just not going to happen. I pack them for some stupid reason and they never leave the hanger until repacking the suitcase. He is dressed neatly. As a matter of fact, the picture in my avatar is formal night with him, my dad (RIP), my dad's wife and me on an Alaska cruise. *I will note, my boyfriend did not accompany us for dinner that night.

 

You'll notice my dad is wearing a *gasp* suede blazer. He lives in Texas. That's formal, and the man did attend a lot of formal gatherings. He did leave his boots and hat at home though...to his chagrin.

 

What really is the big deal? I read a lot of people concerned about short shorts, baseball caps, and the like. I don't see that in the MDR. Maybe I just don't pay attention.

[Ocean Boy]

Something of an arrogant post. Why should someone who wants to follow the suggested rules be ridiculed in such a manner, James Bond indeed. I do not believe anyone deserves such derogatory remarks no matter how they choose to dress.

 

Arrogant, ridicule, and derogatory? Maybe that is what you got out of the post but none of that is what was intended. LMaxwell above explained it pretty well. I don't need to repeat what he stated quite well.

[Redrobo]

Arrogant, ridicule, and derogatory? Maybe that is what you got out of the post but none of that is what was intended. LMaxwell above explained it pretty well. I don't need to repeat what he stated quite well.

 

Missed the little bit about Fantasy, I'll stand by my post thanks.

[Aquahound]

Every year I see fewer Tux's on formal and I would not even wear one on a short cruise, I think most of the people that do not dress up just are not used to going to upscale resturants, not that MDR is that upscale.

 

If I may...down here in Key West, we have plenty of upscale restaurants and I eat out at least once a week. Walk into any of them in the evening and guess how people are dressed? Typically, it's a nice pair of shorts with a silk or linen shirt, and boat shoes with either short socks or no socks at all.

 

Granted, I understand most cruisers are not from Key West, but I think the north can learn a lesson from our more laid-back attitudes. ;)

 

BTW...I do adhere to the suggested dress code on cruises though. But that's because we don't get to dress up very often...and it doesn't require going outside to get from my room to the restaurant. :)

[WishIwerethere]

Now this thread is getting way too snarky and philosophical. :(

 

Let's get back to cut off shorts, pajama pants, tee shirts with slogans, baseball caps and tobacco spitting people whose number of teeth match their IQ. :D

[Ba' Datz]

. Most of the time we are allowed to dress casual. But that still does not mean shorts. On the formal nights I can live with even an open collared shirt if worn with a jacket.

In conclusion, times have changed and we need to accept the way other people think.

 

We are always allowed to dress casual. How many times does it need to be repeated that the dress code is only a suggestion

 

It is nice that you can "live" with a open collared shirt with a jacket. What do you do when you see someone without a jacket?

 

You yourself say that the times are a changin' so why don't you accept what the other person thinks?

Edited May 13, 2014 by badatz

[Ocean Boy]

Missed the little bit about Fantasy, I'll stand by my post thanks.

 

I guess you know my intentions better than I do. Post away and you are welcome.

[LetsGetWet!]

Been there. Done that. I've read these posts a million times. But after a few glasses of wine during a formal benefit this evening (on a MONDAY!), I feel I should comment.

 

The fact is, most professionals go on vacation for the ability to lose their suits and dresses.

 

My boyfriend is a snob.

 

Our friends are all professionals and socialites in this large metropolis of Springfield, MO.

LOL, yep, definitely sounds like the wine talking there!

 

You need to understand the difference between facts and the opinion you stated there!

 

And then you brag about your boyfriend being a snob and about your circle of "socialite" friends in the "large metropolis" of Springfield, MO - which has about the same population as the Dallas suburb I happen to live in! :D Thanks for the chuckles though!

 

 

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[deedeetoo]

And then you brag about your boyfriend being a snob and about your circle of "socialite" friends in the "large metropolis" of Springfield, MO - which has about the same population as the Dallas suburb I happen to live in! :D Thanks for the chuckles though!

 

Putting down someone's hometown is generally not considered a good strategy for winning them over to your side, especially when your side has been trying to claim it is more cultured, better mannered, and has more respect for other people.

[LetsGetWet!]

Putting down someone's hometown is generally not considered a good strategy for winning them over to your side, especially when your side has been trying to claim it is more cultured, better mannered, and has more respect for other people.

Bragging about your partner being a snob and how all your friends are "socialites" isn't a great strategy either... I found it pretty amusing!

 

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[CruiseTobey]

So which is it? Do I cause your feelings and emotions? Or are you responsible for your own? In your post you managed to take both views and in doing so take neither.

 

It's funny that with that long winded attempt to sound sophisticated, it really doesn't say much and is just another example of petty name calling and hyperbole. Philistines, lol.

 

Yep, great reply, very well stated. I was thinking the same things.

 

One more point: If the MDR is so fancy, why do they use the same dishes and flatware on non-formal nights? Of course, the cloth napkins are always provided so one can wave them in the air while the waiters sing and parade around the room... Very posh.

[rutgersgirl27]

I don't think dressing up or down makes anyone cultured. I do think that when they say "suggested", it doesn't mean "sure... go ahead and do what you like." It's meant to create a certain atmosphere, and to guide those who aren't familiar.

 

Personally I think flat out ignoring the suggested dress code means that a person is not being respectful of their surroundings, vs those people who genuinely interpret suggested dress in a different way. Dark jeans with an ironed polo to me means an attempt to meet the standard because you are intentionally wearing something that is clean and neat. There's a difference between that and people who are genuinely going out of their way to ignore the suggestion.

[CruiseTobey]

Dark jeans with an ironed polo to me means an attempt to meet the standard because you are intentionally wearing something that is clean and neat. There's a difference between that and people who are genuinely going out of their way to ignore the suggestion.

 

Excellent point. And I would wager that there are very few who want to intentionally "rock the boat" (pardon the pun) when choosing how to dress. Most just want to feel comfortable and have a relaxing dinner with their family and friends.

 

In practice, there is little if any actual controversy on board the ship. Unfortunately, the anonymity of a message board appears to give some the courage to foist their opinions on whoever will listen. But that is their right, and I'm okay with that.

[debbs0723]

I have been on only 4 cruises so far but I can say that it sure seems to be much more of an issue for those of us not currently vacationing on board a ship right now than those who are. There are so many people in the Mdr. I don't know the average number but it is A LOT. From what I have seen, true formal attire is the least common followed by cocktail attire. Church type and business casual seems to be the most common, while I see very few shorts and beach type clothes.

 

I joined this thread for mere entertainment purposes because reading the posts is as entertaining as watching an episode of Intervention.

 

Debbie

 

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