For those who do not like the fact that DSC is 100% Discretionary...

[NLH Arizona]

I wonder who that was?

Hey, I've said that same as well, just trying to prove a point that both sides of an issue are the same and say the same things to folks on the opposite side. Edited April 5, 2015 by NLH Arizona

[sparkinator]

That's right, I suggested that people patronize a company that more aligns with their personal feelings, whether that be a more upscale/all-inclusive line or another mass market line that's got stricter policies. Less reason to be agitated over choices others make.

 

What I didn't do was call people scumbags, cheapskates, toads, or otherwise talk down in a judgmental tone.

 

Just from the subject of your posts, how could you claim any moral high ground to "talk down in judgmental tone?" I don't think anyone finds your position morally compelling or virtuous. Although it may be legal.

 

I can go out and file for bankruptcy and eschew all of my financial commitments. It would be perfectly legal, but many may find it morally apprehensible. People do lots of things that may be legal, but not ethical. Just because a contract says you can do something, doesn't necessarily make it moral, it just makes it legal. You claim that a contract supercedes what the website states, and that does make it legal, but not virtuous.

[ldlewis45]

I'm a full believer in "if you can't afford a tip or service charge, you can't afford the service/amenity." I support NCL's DSC policy, but that doesn't mean that I support the JUSTIFICATION that some passengers use to adjust/negate it. Like some other people on this thread have said, just because you have the ability to do something, that doesn't mean you should do something. I treat the DSC as part of the cost of the cruise. If I got service that was distinctly sub-par, then I would adjust it. I'm not going to do it just because I can, though.

 

Also, "when in Rome, do as Romans do." That means, when I'm dining in the US, I tip based on the customary tipping rate (or if the gratuity is already added to the check, I go with that). When I'm dining in Europe, I tip depending on the local custom. For me, the DSC is distinctly less than what I would tip if I was tipping every person that assisted me.

[ldlewis45]

No joke, at the beauty salon and supermarket couple of weeks back - "I didn't know Norwegian had a website, i just book with my travel agent"; me: "Umm...they do, its ncl.com....". Yeah, gotta give benefit of the doubt, not everyone is smart like us...:o:(

 

I'm certain anyone under a certain age is going to be familiar with how the internet works, and know that all major companies have websites. They would have to be living under a rock, otherwise. I mean, my mother is 70, and even she knows that all major businesses have websites. She won't use them (apparently, that's what I'm for, lol, since she still calls me to make her online payments), but that's a different story.

[legion3]

So the only way not to pay the DSC is not to cruise NCL?

 

Is this correct?

 

The only way to adjust the DSC at my discretion for terrible service is also never to sail on NCL so I can avoid my "obligation" to "pay the crews salary".

[Out to sea!]

Six pages and no one has answered the question yet.

 

That's because you really have no question. :rolleyes:

[Out to sea!]

On page 3 you said you have no problem with the policy. I think your subsequent posts paint a different picture altogether. Clearly you take offense to people removing DSC at their discretion. If it bothers you very much why not take a cruise line where the service fees are baked in and/or not refundable?

 

One can have no issue with a policy while stilling having issues with people who manipulate a policy for their own financial gain.

[maywell]

I'm certain anyone under a certain age is going to be familiar with how the internet works, and know that all major companies have websites. They would have to be living under a rock, otherwise. I mean, my mother is 70, and even she knows that all major businesses have websites. She won't use them (apparently, that's what I'm for, lol, since she still calls me to make her online payments), but that's a different story.

 

Believe it or not, one was in her 30's (around the same age as me) and other was around 40-50's - Again, I have to give benefit of the doubt, not everyone is good at looking up information on the web. Now understanding the information, is a different story...

Edited April 5, 2015 by maywell

[Casino Comp Chick]

This is my contract wording

 

© Service Charges: Certain members of Carrier’s crew are compensated by a combination of salary and incentive programs that are funded in part by the service charge paid by each Guest. The charge , which is automatically added to your onboard account and subject to adjustment at your discretion, is intended to reward service provided in all departments and job categories and is distributed to employees according to Carrier's evaluation of job performance. A portion of the service charge collected by Carrier is also used for fleet-wide crew welfare programs.

[GEORGET]

Count me in. I will tip in cash according to what I believe is an appropriate amount. $3 PP PD for the cabin steward and approx $3 PP PD for EACH meal in the dining room and $2 PP PD for buffet meal. That's about $10 PP PD. I won't be using room service at $7.95 per order. It doesn't matter to me what anyone says or does, it's their choice to make but I thought I'd share my intentions since you asked.

 

just a Question

 

you state that you give $2 pp in the buffet is this for Breakfast and/or Lunch?

 

if so who do you give it to? as on our last cruise we had to serve ourselves find a seat and get our own coffee/water. never seen $4+ bucks lying among dirty crockery.

[sjbdtz]

froggit i totally support your statement well said

 

 

This ALWAYS confuses me...

 

 

If the fares were increased to include the 'service', then you'd have no recourse for poor service...and the crew wouldn't need gratuities to motivate themselves (this is not my opinion...I'm expressing what confuses me).

 

So many argue that DSC means the crew are unmotivated because they already know they're getting paid.

 

Wouldn't a "fair wage" have the exact same effect?

[GEORGET]

I have been lucky enough to cruise a lot over far too many years.

 

the trouble is that cruises lines need new cruisers to fill the expanding number of ships.

These newbies wont know what DSC, or any other letter combination means, or what it is for.

they just see the base price.

it is a bit like our budget airlines showing flights from $10

 

For us Brits it is not in our nature to pay a tip everytime we go to the bar, so 18% will cause a moan.

The same applies to room servce we would not tip a $5 pizza delivery $8

Actually in some ways it is an embarressment as we do not know the right amount (usually 10% in a eating house). So that is why the charge is helpful.

 

i can understand a young couple with children sharing an inside cabin bulking at a $50 a day charge that they had not accounted for.

 

It would solve all problems if it was included in the Base price because we would be happy and the Americans can tip extra if they want to.

the staff would be over the moon

my pennies worth

Edited April 5, 2015 by GEORGET

[backsbanny]

excuse me but we dont see the facts here..crews are PAID to do their job regardless of tips.Tips is not a salary!!Tips should be given only for exceptional service for sth way above the norm for sth that makes you they deserve the tip..If any emploee anywhere is motivated only with tips then he is not a good emploee he is not professional...This is the same for all the jobs anywhere for every occupation..If i go to a restaurant and have a lousy service or just a standard service i will NOT TIP AT ALL.IF the service is Phenomenal then i WILL TIP.If anyone says that without tips someone is not going to serve you correctly make up your bed etc then this person SHOULD be immediately get fired..because he doesnt do his her job correctly...When i pay NCL thousands of dollars for a vacation i EXPECT good service even having paid DSC or not.I have always prepaid DSC but once i REDUCED it because the service was not as it should be..Have i ever tipped more??Once there was a steward that went the extra mile for me making me a magical vacation and showing me that he really was PROUD of what he did and how he worked..The last day when i left the cabin i had an envelope for him with 300usd inside..Thas was a phenomenal service from him to my family and that brought him a phenomenal Tip along with a Vacation Hero card..

[GEORGET]

This ALWAYS confuses me...

 

 

If the fares were increased to include the 'service', then you'd have no recourse for poor service...and the crew wouldn't need gratuities to motivate themselves (this is not my opinion...I'm expressing what confuses me).

 

So many argue that DSC means the crew are unmotivated because they already know they're getting paid.

 

Wouldn't a "fair wage" have the exact same effect?

 

On Costa the staff are assessed by the cruise comments and management checks, if they recieve bad reports are given a warning and if they do not improve leave.

On thomson the staff are the best we have had and they are on a fixed wage and tips are included in the price.

j

[SteveH2508]

This ALWAYS confuses me...

 

 

If the fares were increased to include the 'service', then you'd have no recourse for poor service...and the crew wouldn't need gratuities to motivate themselves (this is not my opinion...I'm expressing what confuses me).

 

So many argue that DSC means the crew are unmotivated because they already know they're getting paid.

 

Wouldn't a "fair wage" have the exact same effect?

 

Coin is not the only motivator - job retention and getting rehired can be quite motivational too. I am sure the cruise lines have some form of 'policy' about re-hiring staff which relates to their previous performance appraisals.

 

IMHO it is a logical fallacy that tipping causes motivation therefore non-tipped workers are not motivated. There have been several academic studies that show that performance-related pay in many industries achieve a negligible increase in productivity - in fact PRP schemes can actually de-motivate staff (think impossible to meet targets etc..)

Edited April 5, 2015 by SteveH2508

[smeyer418]

I hate tipping threads. There are some people who will remove the DSC because they can. Its their money and they do have the power. It doesn't make it right. Some of the problem is that the suggested amount used to be pretty clear as to whom it was going to. That is no longer true. Its also unclear about what happens when the DSC is removed. The recent pronouncements by NCL doesn't make it clear either. I have the power to exceed the posted speed limit. rarely will that result in a ticket or an accident.

 

In the past I was a strong proponent on leaving it on except if you had a service issue. I haven't changed my mind yet but I am coming pretty close to and I will say why later.

 

Whether its in the fare or in a DSC its you who are paying it anyway. The remuneration to the service crew(traditionally tipped or tipped out) is not in the fare now, its mostly in the DSC.

 

But you do have the power to remove it and tipped the vassals and have them kiss you ring. I don't either want that or do it(although most of the time I leave extra).

 

We take the grandkids with us 4 in a room. They like room service and going to get pizza and ice cream. their breakfast in the room is cereal and milk(and yes I can get it from the buffet and have it in the room for them). NCL makes getting the pizza for them hard. They don't want a whole pie. Its a waste to order one. they want one or two slices. On hated Carnival pizza is available for pick up at all times.

so if they make me pay for cereal with a service change every day(and not for the extras), the chances are I won't pay almost $8 for room service each time they want milk and cookies...and I may take it off the DSC too...

[luddite]

excuse me but we dont see the facts here..crews are PAID to do their job regardless of tips.Tips is not a salary!!Tips should be given only for exceptional service for sth way above the norm for sth that makes you they deserve the tip..If any emploee anywhere is motivated only with tips then he is not a good emploee he is not professional...This is the same for all the jobs anywhere for every occupation..If i go to a restaurant and have a lousy service or just a standard service i will NOT TIP AT ALL.IF the service is Phenomenal then i WILL TIP.If anyone says that without tips someone is not going to serve you correctly make up your bed etc then this person SHOULD be immediately get fired..because he doesnt do his her job correctly...When i pay NCL thousands of dollars for a vacation i EXPECT good service even having paid DSC or not.I have always prepaid DSC but once i REDUCED it because the service was not as it should be..Have i ever tipped more??Once there was a steward that went the extra mile for me making me a magical vacation and showing me that he really was PROUD of what he did and how he worked..The last day when i left the cabin i had an envelope for him with 300usd inside..Thas was a phenomenal service from him to my family and that brought him a phenomenal Tip along with a Vacation Hero card..

 

nononoyouareveryconfused

thecrewisnotpaidasalarybythecompnayrathertheyarepaidviatheServiceChargethatisaddedtoyouronboardbillitisanunadvertisedpartofthefare

[DirtyDawg]

I hate tipping threads.

But they are entertaining in a NASCAR big pileup sort of way.;)

 

We started cruising when it was the stuffing the envelopes thing at the end of the cruise. At first I just thought of it as a little weird quirky practice of the cruise industry. Then it changed to the DSC/daily auto-tips thing, which is another weird quirky way to tip. Hey, as long as I know in advance I'm OK with any system. If they want to make the DSC mandatory, fine. If they want to keep it as is, fine. If they want to include it in the price, fine. If they to make us pay in only Bitcoins, fine. I've got a whole lot more important things to worry about then tipping on a cruise ship, like where did that bunny hide all those Easter Eggs.:p

[legion3]

nononoyouareveryconfused

thecrewisnotpaidasalarybythecompnayrathertheyarepaidviatheServiceChargethatisaddedtoyouronboardbillitisanunadvertisedpartofthefare

 

What? :cool:

[legion3]

nononoyouareveryconfused

thecrewisnotpaidasalarybythecompnayrathertheyarepaidviatheServiceChargethatisaddedtoyouronboardbillitisanunadvertisedpartofthefare

 

I didn't hire the crew, I can't fire the crew, I shouldn't have to pay the crew, NCL should pay the crew a wage. DSC should supplement that wage and tips should be for good service...not just service.

 

 

Since I have no contractual relationship with the crew and it's pay why should I pay the crew directly?

[elsbarre]

New to NCL. Sorry... What's DSC?

[Out to sea!]

I didn't hire the crew, I can't fire the crew, I shouldn't have to pay the crew, NCL should pay the crew a wage. DSC should supplement that wage and tips should be for good service...not just service.

 

 

Since I have no contractual relationship with the crew and it's pay why should I pay the crew directly?

 

Should and Do are two entirely different things. You already know they don't do this so if you pull your DSC you KNOW you are screwing the staff out of part of their expected earnings. It doesn't matter whether anyone here thinks it is right or not, that is the consequence of their actions.

[legion3]

Should and Do are two entirely different things. You already know they don't do this so if you pull your DSC you KNOW you are screwing the staff out of part of their expected earnings. It doesn't matter whether anyone here thinks it is right or not, that is the consequence of their actions.

 

So the crew gets no pay checks? No wages? And all they get is DSC?

 

So if NCL gives the promotion for free gratuities (in their minds DSC) do the crew not get paid anything for a standard 2 person cabin?

 

If say a family of 4 does the DSC and only the first two get that promotion and the second two go free? NCL gives its crew half-pay?

[luddite]

I didn't hire the crew, I can't fire the crew, I shouldn't have to pay the crew, NCL should pay the crew a wage. DSC should supplement that wage and tips should be for good service...not just service.

 

 

Since I have no contractual relationship with the crew and it's pay why should I pay the crew directly?

 

Customers pay the crew. Same as in any business, the company doesn't pay the bills, taxes and fees-the customers do.

 

What they should do and how it is have no actual reality.

 

On a positive note, thanks for the well-written yet inaccurate posting. It is always nice when folks make a basic stab at using good writing skills.

[luddite]

New to NCL. Sorry... What's DSC?

 

The Service Charge that pays the crew.