Tipping on Seabourn, acceptable though not expected..or not?

[Kevnzworld]

Kevin, the culture on Seabourn and other so called luxury lines has been to not tip individuals. But you, and many others bring your own ideas on how to operate with total disregard to what was established many years ago.

 

It's fine, because the whole concept of what SB was at one time is totally different than where it is heading.

 

Really? :)

I've been travelled on many luxury lines for years, Regent, Paul Gaugin etc. now Seabourn. I'm certainly accustomed to land based five star hotel etiquette across the globe as well. I'm retired, mid fifties and have been traveling six months a year for over a decade, often but less frequently prior to that. But I digress

 

Ok, I can say that because of this thread, I will donate to the crew welfare fund going forward. I will also selectively and discreetly give an additional gratuity to those that I feel are deserving. I will, as I have in the past use the comment card to mention all those that gave me better than expected service.

I'm not sure where Seabourn was, but I certainly know where it's heading....and I like it ( see my upcoming cruise line up ). I enjoy the new Odyssey class ships and I look forward to sailing on the Encore's inaugural cruise Athens to Singapore next year. Thomas Keller should be a good new addition.

[Tillylovesseabourn]

Some tip, some don't.

 

However, the one thing that comes across, yet again, is that certain cc members who come on to this forum seem hell bent upon changing the rules on SB, something that has run perfectly well WITHOUT them for many years.

 

Whatever the subject, whether it be dress code, tipping, or something else, it is always the same fraction of obtuse individuals who seem to pay absolutely no attention to the advice of others, or the recommendations of Seabourn.

 

For them the rules do not clearly apply!!

[Kevnzworld]

Some tip, some don't.

 

However, the one thing that comes across, yet again, is that certain cc members who come on to this forum seem hell bent upon changing the rules on SB, something that has run perfectly well WITHOUT them for many years.

 

Whatever the subject, whether it be dress code, tipping, or something else, it is always the same fraction of obtuse individuals who seem to pay absolutely no attention to the advice of others, or the recommendations of Seabourn.

 

For them the rules do not clearly apply!!

 

 

Please post the "rule" that forbids giving a gratuity to a crew member and I'll happily abide by it as I do other rules ( smoking, dress codes etc )

" Tipping is neither required or expected " is the written policy, and is far different.

I respect those with an honest difference of opinion and preference. We all have those, and this is a place to share them. That's why I posted the query.

I don't respect the condescending, self righteous , and arrogant proclamations from those that believe their personal interpretation of a policy is a rule that others should follow or be denigrated. They mistakenly believe that their ideas are culturally or otherwise superior to those whom they differ with.

It is a lot of fun to read their comments though...:)

As Markham wrote " Happy Sailing ".

[Tillylovesseabourn]

Please post the "rule" that forbids giving a gratuity to a crew member and I'll happily abide by it as I do other rules ( smoking, dress codes etc )

" Tipping is neither required or expected " is the written policy, and is far different.

I respect those with an honest difference of opinion and preference. We all have those, and this is a place to share them. That's why I posted the query.

I don't respect the condescending, self righteous , and arrogant proclamations from those that believe their personal interpretation of a policy is a rule that others should follow or be denigrated. They mistakenly believe that their ideas are culturally or otherwise superior to those whom they differ with.

It is a lot of fun to read their comments though...:)

As Markham wrote " Happy Sailing ".

 

Kevin, you have clearly misinterpreted the comment,as it was not aimed at you, so thankyou for your condescent.

.

As i wrote, some tip, some don't, personal preference isnt it?

 

However, as i commented certain posters do seem to post in order to be deliberately obtuse and poke fun at those who follow the guidelines and wish to do so in order to preseve what SB stands for. It just shows a lack of manners towards others.

[Mr Luxury]

kevnsworld,

 

By all means tip everyone you find gives you exemplary service on Seabourn.

That would probably be a lot of folks, and I bet they are all delighted to receive your dosh. The Seabourn product is delivered by some of the best crews on the seas. As for me, I tip my stewardess and the crew fund. That's it.

 

I suppose that this tipping business is a cultural thingy. I know that many Americans like to tip as they do at home- whether it is expected or not. But the norm at Seabourn is different - as per their brochure, their longstanding policy and as supported through many other passengers' comments here.

 

A perfect example of a no tipping situation is a country like Japan where tips are generally returned to the donor due to Japanese tradition and consensus that tipping degrades the worker. The idea is that good service is the norm, something that people in the service industry are trained to do and nothing extraordinary that deserves special recognition. When you know this you would logically alter your approach to tipping there.

 

You have spent a lot of time on mass market lines like Celebrity where for all I know people work for tips and their salaries are lower for that reason. It follows that Celebrity crew know returning tippers when they see them and prioritize them over others for more service and more tips.

 

But Seabourn is not Celebrity and I, for one, hope it stays that way! Staff on Seabourn ships don't work for or expect tips. As for Seabourn passengers, we get that too and so we prefer the simplicity and dignity the current policy affords us.

 

That's how I see it, at least.

 

Happy sailing!

 

 

Markham,

I agree whole heartedly agree with your post.

 

There is often this problem when mass market cruisers sail on Seabourn,it might take them a little time to settle into a luxury line that gives excellent service without crew chasing the punters for a tip.

Very tacky business indeed.

Edited June 23, 2015 by Mr Luxury

[diebroke]

It seems there are 3 schools of thought on this issue.

 

1. People who choose to tip (probably mostly Americans) & many of whom say it’s nobody’s business whether they tip or not & nobody should tell them what to do with their money.
   
2. People who choose not to tip individually (many of whom give to the crew welfare fund) and don’t care what anybody else does.
   
3. People who choose not to tip individually (many of whom give to the crew welfare fund) & are concerned about others tipping for fear it changes the on-board culture &/or potentially reduces service for those who choose not to tip. There is no hard evidence that this happens, but it is not a totally illogical fear, and if it did happen, I think it would be a bad thing for my Seabourn experience.
   

The conflict on these threads seems to be between schools 1 & 3.

 

On another note, I once had a discussion with a Seabourn waiter about tipping while we were docked next to a mega ship. He said tips on the mass market ships were a huge part of their income and that he could make almost as much money with tips on one of these ships as he makes on Seabourn without tips. He also said he doesn’t have to work quite as hard on the mega ships because the large crew size allows a little more flexibility & efficiency in crew scheduling. He said he chose Seabourn because of the “family” atmosphere stemming from the much smaller number of crew. He made those comments while we were on one of the little sisters. Don’t know if it applies to the larger Seabourn ships.

[Mauzac]

Interesting thread.

 

I am new to CC and new to cruising (first cruise on SB next February)

 

I chose SB because tipping is not expected, when I was narrowing down my choices of cruise I looked only at cruise lines where tipping was included or it was not expected.

 

I know nothing of a Crew Welfare Fund - can someone enlighten me? How much is one expected or would want to put in?

 

I just know I will find it refreshing not to tip (I hasten to add, of course I do tip if it is expected anywhere such as in the US) but I just want to be on a cruise where money doesn't talk, and where we are all equal and best tables or better service isn't reserved for those who tip the most! Perhaps I'm naive!

[lincslady]

Mauzac - have no fear; you do not need to tip anyone, or give to the Crew Fund unless you so wish, and what you give is entirely up to you if you do.

 

To our mind, Seabourn is the most democratic of the 'luxury' lines, no one has a Butler, and we never notice differentiation in how people are treated.

 

It does seem as if more people are giving individual tips; I would prefer it if they did not, but it is their choice. Just do not want staff to begin to expect it, as could happen in the future.

[Mauzac]

Thanks LincsLady, that's just what I wanted to hear :)

[Pendle Witch]

We have cruised with Seabourn twice and will do again this Sept. We have never seen or heard anything about the crew welfare fund, neither have we ever seen anyone tipping.

The staff have always given excellent service and never looked as though expecting a tip, unlike most other cruise lines where they are practically lining up on your last evening.

As Seabourn says it is not expected, but there will always be people who feel they want to, and this I feel could make a difference in the long run,, I know it is up to the individual but why rock the boat??

[Mauzac]

"If it ain't broke, don't fix it" comes to mind :D

 

Thanks PendleWitch

[dhill]

Oh boy here we go If you feel like tipping then just do it .It is nobodys elses business but yours.I don't get it if someone wants to tip then just tip why do you need everyone elses approval:confused:

[Able Seaman H]

There is often this problem when mass market cruisers sail on Seabourn,it might take them a little time to settle into a luxury line that gives excellent service without crew chasing the punters for a tip.

Very tacky business indeed.

 

We're trying :)

 

The whole tipping on a cruise ship is engrained to the point where it is the stuff of legend. When Royal Caribbean took away the pre-printed envelopes in favour of pre-paid gratuities given directly to crew (supposedly !) it caused uproar and continues to do so.

 

I can only say that at no point on a SB ship have I ever felt the crew were chasing tips. They do a sterling job because they have pride and realise they represent the pinnacle of cruise ship excellence.

 

I also enjoy the relaxed ease which comes from being looked after by people as equals rather than subservients.

 

Henry :)

Edited June 25, 2015 by Able Seaman H

[oregon50]

We're trying :)I also enjoy the relaxed ease which comes from being looked after by people as equals rather than subservients. Henry :)

 

Excellent post, this line in particular.

[markham]

Well said, Mr Luxury!

 

... And that's what differentiates Seabourn from the mass market lines: its people who are employed and trained to deliver a style of service that wins our business.

 

So when Seabourn says tipping is not expected I tend to believe them. And so if you agree you won't inadvertantly upset the dynamic by going against the policy and tip on Seabourn ships.

 

At least that's how I see it. And while I do tip several people on Cunard crossings (in addition to what's on my onboard account), I restrict tipping on Seabourn to my stewardess.

 

Happy sailing!

[softsands]

“Tipping is neither required nor expected – service simply to delight you. Our award-winning staff is driven only by their sincere desire to please.” Am I missing something? I don’t think it could be any clearer. When we sail on Seabourn, we are purchasing a package which includes luxurious suites, world class dining, unrivaled service, plus complimentary fine wines & spirits. It is all incorporated into the price we pay. I personally think it is irresponsible for guests to disregard this policy and tip staff.

Don’t get me wrong – I am a generous tipper. At the same time I try to be cognizant of what the situation dictates. If I am in a country where service is included in the bill and gratuities are not common, then I do not tip. I will take the time to research what is the norm and adhere to it. In other words, I avoid inserting our North American standards into the mix. It really is beginning to get out of control. I know people who think they have to tip everyone – even plumbers!

We are taking our grandchildren on a Disney cruise this summer where it is customary to give gratuities in recognition of service. However, even Disney has acknowledged that the tipping rigmarole has become rather onerous. Instead of our having to going through the process of stuffing envelopes with cash, Disney will automatically add the suggested gratuity amounts to our onboard account.

I personally dislike being in those awkward situations where everyone has their hands out. It is one of the reasons I choose the Seabourn experience – it has all been taken care of and paid for in advance. I am “neither required or nor expected” to even think about it!

After saying all of this, I must admit that if I am in a port and see something that I know a particularly exemplary staff member would enjoy, I will buy it as a gift for them. But this is the exception, not the norm.

 

I have no issue being irresponsible in this way. No staff I've ever extended a gratuity to at SB has put their hand up and asked me to stop being irresponsible either.

[softsands]

Please post the "rule" that forbids giving a gratuity to a crew member and I'll happily abide by it as I do other rules ( smoking, dress codes etc )

" Tipping is neither required or expected " is the written policy, and is far different.

I respect those with an honest difference of opinion and preference. We all have those, and this is a place to share them. That's why I posted the query.

I don't respect the condescending, self righteous , and arrogant proclamations from those that believe their personal interpretation of a policy is a rule that others should follow or be denigrated. They mistakenly believe that their ideas are culturally or otherwise superior to those whom they differ with.

It is a lot of fun to read their comments though...:)

As Markham wrote " Happy Sailing ".

 

Stop being irresponsible, will ya'?:D

[Pingus]

I have no issue being irresponsible in this way. No staff I've ever extended a gratuity to at SB has put their hand up and asked me to stop being irresponsible either.

 

Actually I have:

On our 15 day Amazon-FLL cruise one of the assistant Maitre D's went out way and beyond at every venue we encountered her, and resolved a lot of problematic situations for others with ease and elegance. At the end we commended her on her performance and (a one-only and extremely discreetly) wanted to reward her with a tip, which she flat-out refused. As she put it; to her this was enjoying the challenges in a rewarding job, and she would much more appreciate a positive guest comment evaluation to SB rather than any financial contribution.

 

And in general: SB IS my cruiseline of choice because of and NOT in spite of their non-tipping policy. ;P

[Kevnzworld]

Actually I have:

On our 15 day Amazon-FLL cruise one of the assistant Maitre D's went out way and beyond at every venue we encountered her, and resolved a lot of problematic situations for others with ease and elegance. At the end we commended her on her performance and (a one-only and extremely discreetly) wanted to reward her with a tip, which she flat-out refused. As she put it; to her this was enjoying the challenges in a rewarding job, and she would much more appreciate a positive guest comment evaluation to SB rather than any financial contribution.

 

And in general: SB IS my cruiseline of choice because of and NOT in spite of their non-tipping policy. ;P

 

For clarification. I luv Seabourn for a variety of reasons, the crew being on top of the list. Re: the comments above..the Asst Maître D might be an officer, they don't and shouldn't accept gratuities. ( though I did see one accepting gladly ).

For the record, besides my cabin attendendent i " tipped " two crew members. One , the hostess ( which created the original controversy in this thread ) and a bartender . I did this at the END of the cruise, so it wasn't to receive any special treatment during the cruise or hugs, or thank you's after... I will never see either again.

The bartender was leaving the ship to start a restaurant in Columbia with another Seabourn employee...this was a going away wish you luck gift.

The hostess was also leaving the ship due to pregnancy...the gratuity was to thank her for her friendship.

I appreciate learning about the " crew fund ". I will donate to that going forward. I already commend crew members on the comment card...

But I will still continue to give out selective gratuities to crew, discreetly.

Why? Because I think it's the right thing to do...and for me, that's all I really care about.

Edited June 26, 2015 by Kevnzworld

[Chairsin]

While I was the one who originally called attention to Kevnzworl's mention of tipping crew in his Quest review I have since refrained from posting additional comments as if often the case with some of these topics things have quickly spiraled from a healthy debate to a contentious war of words. My reason for highlighting the actions of the OP were in no way motivated by any hope that by noting the logic behind why this is problematic behavior in a "no tipping" environment it would change the behavior of this cruiser while on Seabourn. In my experience on CC people rarely change their minds on contentious subjects; rather they dig in and things get ugly with name calling. So for this reason I have until now refrained from making additional comments. But let me here address those new to Seabourn or those about to embark on their first Seabourn cruise. The no tipping policy works because the crew are well compensated and thus don't need to focus their attentions on those big tippers. All passengers receive wonderful service and this creates a very high, even level of service for all. It is one of the hallmarks of Seabourn but this system will break down if more and more people feel the need ( for whatever motivation) to tip a select few. Make a point of tracking down the Hotel Manager if there is a person whom you feel has been a shining star and sing their praises. This is worth far more to those on board than some dollars stuffed on an enveloped and discreetly ( or not) palmed off. And as to why some have not heard of the Crew Fund -- don't feel bad you are not alone. I had been on a few SB cruise before I knew it existed. There is a good reason why this is neither mentioned nor noted anywhere in Seabourn documents and publications. It is purely discretionary and they want to keep it that way. I believe they are smart enough to realize that once they publicize it it would risk becoming a shadow obligatory tipping system. So new cruisers now you know and can make up you own minds as to whether a true no tipping policy makes your cruise more enjoyable and how to reward good service in that environment. The choice is yours.

[lincslady]

Very well expressed, Chairsin, and I think at this point with these comments it would be good to draw a line under this thread, no one needs to say more.

[Pingus]

For clarification. I luv Seabourn for a variety of reasons, the crew being on top of the list. Re: the comments above..the Asst Maître D might be an officer, they don't and shouldn't accept gratuities. ( though I did see one accepting gladly ).

 

For the record: She was not an officer.

Secondly: We did commen on her positive and up and beyond efforts to the Hotel Manager. I will not be surprised if we on an upcoming cruise find her in a more senior position.

[oregon50]

Chairsin, Great post!

[frantic36]

Very well said Chairsin and totally agree with your post.

 

Julie

[2SailingNomads]

There is a good reason why this is neither mentioned nor noted anywhere in Seabourn documents and publications. It is purely discretionary and they want to keep it that way.

Exactly right! I was on the same cruise as the OP and on the last day when I went to make my donation the Asst. Purser was surprised I knew such a thing existed.