Hal-la land not so grand any more.

[RuthC]

Notice that OP is MIA.

Actually, that's not true. It was OP's post today that bumped this thread back to p.1 after almost three weeks.

Fair is fair, and your comment was not.

[cruisemom42]

To get $699 in cruise services in1995 dollars it would cost you approx $1200 today, yet it is only costing us $799. How does HAL do it?

 

 

(According to one of those online - time/value calculators)

 

But don't kid yourself that the $799 is buying the same cruise experience as the $699 in 1995. It's comparing apples and oranges.

[bUU]

No. It's comparing apples to smaller apples. Makes sense that they'd be lower in price adjusted for inflation.

 

This message may have been entered using voice recognition. Please excuse any typos.

[Tennessee Titan]

I would be happy to share our experiences but won't do so here,

as the cheerleaders would dispute everything I say.

Not cheerleaders, just those whose glass is half full rather than half empty........

[johnmik1]

People don't dispute what you say, when they offer their own differing experiences or mitigating explanations.

 

When one maligns an entire ship based upon their own unfortunate set of circumstances, it is reasonable to expect others to come to that ship's defense if their experiences had been otherwise. That does not make them cheerleaders, just those who feel obligated to balance the sweeping claims.

 

Sorry you personally had a bad cruise on this ship. Clearly you did.

Clearly,I never said I had a bad cruise,as there is no such thing!I said that the HAL standards have deteriorated so badly that we would probably be cruising elsewhere in the near future!

[OlsSalt]

Clearly,I never said I had a bad cruise,as there is no such thing!I said that the HAL standards have deteriorated so badly that we would probably be cruising elsewhere in the near future!

 

I won't put words into your mouth, but that sounds to me like a bad cruise. A bad, unhappy cruise. So long.

[Tatka]

I am not sure HALs quality went down. We saw some glaring service issues on our first out of two cruises with this company in 2004 on Zuiderdam. There was clear understaffing issue in both housekeeping and restaurant department, as well as waiter's training issues.

 

Actually our last year cruise on Veendam was almost perfect in this regard.

We also didn't see any worsening of food quality.

 

We feel that HAL can improve in some departments, but enjoy overall atmosphere and experience.

 

Unfortunately with HAL discontinuing Caribbean runs out of northeast and only sending older ships to Bermuda it is difficult for us to sail with this company more

Edited May 2, 2017 by Tatka

[johnmik1]

I won't put words into your mouth, but that sounds to me like a bad cruise. A bad, unhappy cruise. So long.

Whatever!

[bennybear]

Thanks Ruth for always being the voice of reason and noting that the OP posted recently.

My two cents we are all entitled to our opinions.

I too would like to know about the Noordam as we will be sailing on her again in a few weeks.

 

As to Cunard, loved the ship and the service but the MDR food did not measure up IMO to HAL or Princess. I guess you have to be in a grill suite for at least double the price.

[OlsSalt]

......

Unfortunately with HAL discontinuing Caribbean runs out of northeast and only sending older ships to Bermuda it is difficult for us to sail with this company more

 

Sending the "older" HAL ships to Bermuda seems like a clear advantage to me, since they are smaller and are allowed to dock much closer. That would be an incentive for to choose them while HAL still operates these older, smaller ships on this route like the Veendam.

[Tatka]

It would be an incentive if there was no maintenance problems with older ships.

We loved Veendam, but we had so many problems with plumbing that finally had to change cabins, then problem started in new cabin.

Letter was sent that HAL has state of art plumbing system and how important not to throw things into toilets, but we didn't throw anything! And we never had this problem on any other ship.

Also water pressure was weak and temperature inconsistent.

We are pretty easygoing, but all this was a problem.

 

And while I understand more convenient docking in Bermuda (although we like West End), Caribbean sailings are abandoned (Princess abandoned this market too :( )

[Hlitner]

We will not attack the OP (which is actually against board guidelines) but rather will stick to what was implied versus our own experience. To a great degree we do agree with the OPs overall assessment...that HAL has cut back in too many areas. Since we do a lot of cruising (on several different lines) the cut backs have definitely impacted our own booking habits. There are times we will book with another cruise line, instead of HAL, because our own list of pros/cons favor the other line. We still book with HAL, because despite many cutbacks it is still a pretty good cruise line and we often love the HAL itineraries. We will readily admit that we now go on HAL with lowered expectations...and with good cause.

 

Have to smile at some of the posts because our next HAL cruise is on the "Rottendam" which has been our least favorite ship (of any cruise line) since our last Rottendam cruise (Jul 2011). At that time there were many physical problems on that vessel and we really hated the aft deck "bird bath" which replaced the pool (so they could cram in a few more cabins). But this is 6 years later and we shall see if some things have improved (we know the bird bath is a permanent fixture). Recent reviews here on CC are mixed (at best) and generally not very flattering. As to Lancal's comment (we have seen this before) which essentially says, if one has issues they should go elsewhere...we do not agree. For us its a balancing act. We have wanted to do the VOV itinerary for a few years..and it just so happens this is the vessel that HAL has on that popular cruise.

 

So, in the interest of a great itinerary....we will hold our nose and head back to the Rotterdam. We really hope that things will be vastly improved....but if its not we will just "roll with the waves" and have a great time. We already know that some of entertainment (Barry from Boston and the BB King show) are in tune (pun intended) with our taste. So if the ship still sucks (physically) we will drink away our sorrows during the evening hours :).

 

Hank

[OlsSalt]

Has HAL "cut back" or just not charged more to keep the the same things? Costs of everything has gone up, but they did get a bonus recently with the drop in fuel prices. But that also means we did not have to face the additional fuel surcharge either.

 

Pet peeve: I wish people would stop saying immediately saying things got "cut back" unless they can show the actual budget demands or compensatory improvements that also factor into these decisions made by HAL or CCL.

 

Additionally, for those facing plumbing issues in their cabin - you are part of a larger system so anyone on your circuit who abuses the plumbing will affect your cabin too. Same with the A/C - anyone leaving their balcony door open can impact others on their same ventilation circuit - and these cabins may not even be adjoining or on the same deck.

[Tatka]

I understand circuit issue, and I know it was not our fault, but it was a big inconvenience. And water temperature issues. We just don't want to experience it more.

We would love to have Eurodam or at least Zuiderdam class here in northeast, sailing to warmer waters.

[Tampa Girl]

I understand circuit issue, and I know it was not our fault, but it was a big inconvenience. And water temperature issues. We just don't want to experience it more.

We would love to have Eurodam or at least Zuiderdam class here in northeast, sailing to warmer waters.

 

Is FLL really that difficult to reach? Most of us have to travel hundreds or thousands of miles to reach our port. Having once traveled from NYC to Puerto Rico in December, I would never travel the NE coast of the U.S. in the winter months again. If the weather is bad for flying, I would take the train

[Tatka]

My husband doesn't fly over US, so yes, we made about 6 drives to Florida since he stopped flying.

It is tiring, so most of the time lately we sail out of Boston, NY or New Jersey.

Occasionally for something really exciting we drive to Fort Lauderdale.

[RuthC]

Has HAL "cut back" or just not charged more to keep the the same things?

HAL has cut back. No quotation marks; no two ways about it; no denials. HAL has cut back.

Those of us who have sailed HAL for a very long time know just how much they have cut back.

[OlsSalt]

HAL has cut back. No quotation marks; no two ways about it; no denials. HAL has cut back.

Those of us who have sailed HAL for a very long time know just how much they have cut back.

 

There were two parts to the question. Speaking as one who has sailed now only for a long time; not very long time.

 

I suspect HAL had mainly bunk beds a very, very long time ago too. Maybe even bathroom down the hall. I suspect HAL is no longer paying the same wages they did a very long time ago, or facing the same labor pool competition.

 

So are these "cuts", or are they just not charging what they would need to charge in order to retain the same offerings from a very long time ago.

[RuthC]

So are these "cuts", or are they just not charging what they would need to charge in order to retain the same offerings from a very long time ago.

Call them anything you like. They are cuts. Not everything that has been cut out cost money, but is gone anyway. That is a cut.

[Hlitner]

There were two parts to the question. Speaking as one who has sailed now only for a long time; not very long time.

 

I suspect HAL had mainly bunk beds a very, very long time ago too. Maybe even bathroom down the hall. I suspect HAL is no longer paying the same wages they did a very long time ago, or facing the same labor pool competition.

 

So are these "cuts", or are they just not charging what they would need to charge in order to retain the same offerings from a very long time ago.

 

We often agree with your posts, but this time your logic escapes me :). By your reckoning, if HAL only served gruel for lunch you would be happy as a clam and would post "they haven't raise their cruise prices in the past 2 weeks!"

 

The cost of a cruise is simply based on supply vs demand. Celebrity can get more per passenger day (compared to HAL) because they have a much better product in the Caribbean. On the other hand, HAL can charge a lot more per passenger day for their annual Voyage of the Vikings because the itinerary is popular and demand is good (or course HAL has continued to use small ships on this itinerary to limit supply).

 

We could list lots of "cut backs" that have happened in the past 5 years on HAL. They are real and are facts. The cruise lines hope they can cut back (and save money) and do it in a way that is little noticed by the cruisers. To some degree they do succeed. For example, most cruise lines (including HAL) have vastly reduced the volume of food served in their MDR's....and most passengers have adjusted without a whimper. On the other hand, we remember when the LIdo buffets (at lunch) would always have bowls of large/jumbo cold shrimp! Now, you might find a shrimp salad (with tiny shrimp). Where they used to have a dozen kind of cheese on the buffet...now there might be 3 or 4....and they will often be less expensive cheeses. We used to love having our omelets made with real eggs. Now, you get homogenized and pasteurized eggs poured out of a carton. The last time we were on HAL (Zuiderdam) I actually asked the omelet cook in the Lido if she would make me an omelet with real eggs. She quickly said no (even though there were real eggs within reach) and then quietly added that she was no longer allowed to use real eggs in omelets. They still use them for overeasy and eggs benedict since they have no choice. Oh and lets not forget fresh squeezed Orange Juice. Up until about 2 years ago you could always find it in the Lido...but no more!

 

So what happens to cruisers with all these cut-backs. Some of us start taking more and more cruises on the better (and more expensive) cruise lines...or find other mass market lines that have fewer cut-backs. In our case, the only reason we continue to cruise on HAL is because of their great itineraries. Its a trade off where we must lower our expectations for food...to get the itinerary. It also means we are booking HAL less...and other cruise lines more. And that could all change tomorrow as each line continues to reinvent themselves.

 

Hank

[bUU]

Its a trade off where we must lower our expectations for food...to get the itinerary. It also means we are booking HAL less...and other cruise lines more. And that could all change tomorrow as each line continues to reinvent themselves.

Except they're not: They're all doing exactly what each other are doing: Reading the marketplace and striking the best balance based on the research revealing consumer sentiment and behaviors.

[OlsSalt]

We often agree with your posts, but this time your logic escapes me :). By your reckoning, if HAL only served gruel for lunch you would be happy as a clam and would post "they haven't raise their cruise prices in the past 2 weeks!"

 

The cost of a cruise is simply based on supply vs demand. Celebrity can get more per passenger day (compared to HAL) because they have a much better product in the Caribbean. On the other hand, HAL can charge a lot more per passenger day for their annual Voyage of the Vikings because the itinerary is popular and demand is good (or course HAL has continued to use small ships on this itinerary to limit supply).

 

We could list lots of "cut backs" that have happened in the past 5 years on HAL. They are real and are facts. The cruise lines hope they can cut back (and save money) and do it in a way that is little noticed by the cruisers. To some degree they do succeed. For example, most cruise lines (including HAL) have vastly reduced the volume of food served in their MDR's....and most passengers have adjusted without a whimper. On the other hand, we remember when the LIdo buffets (at lunch) would always have bowls of large/jumbo cold shrimp! Now, you might find a shrimp salad (with tiny shrimp). Where they used to have a dozen kind of cheese on the buffet...now there might be 3 or 4....and they will often be less expensive cheeses. We used to love having our omelets made with real eggs. Now, you get homogenized and pasteurized eggs poured out of a carton. The last time we were on HAL (Zuiderdam) I actually asked the omelet cook in the Lido if she would make me an omelet with real eggs. She quickly said no (even though there were real eggs within reach) and then quietly added that she was no longer allowed to use real eggs in omelets. They still use them for overeasy and eggs benedict since they have no choice. Oh and lets not forget fresh squeezed Orange Juice. Up until about 2 years ago you could always find it in the Lido...but no more!

 

So what happens to cruisers with all these cut-backs. Some of us start taking more and more cruises on the better (and more expensive) cruise lines...or find other mass market lines that have fewer cut-backs. In our case, the only reason we continue to cruise on HAL is because of their great itineraries. Its a trade off where we must lower our expectations for food...to get the itinerary. It also means we are booking HAL less...and other cruise lines more. And that could all change tomorrow as each line continues to reinvent themselves.

 

Hank

 

Never works when anyone puts words into other people's mouths. Or even gruel. Though the benefit would be at least this would not be cruise where one would worry about gaining weight. As Monty Python would say ........

 

Interesting point about VOV - we signed last year to grab our spot on the 2017 VOV because of its reputation for selling out quickly. Yet now just 3 months before sailing there are still plenty of unsold classes of cabins according to the HAL website. Only the lanai one way and the Vista suites the other way are declared sold out. All cabins remain available for the full 38 day segment.

 

Is this global economic canary in the mine shaft we should be paying attention to? Or did this formerly popular HAL cruise finally get priced out the current market place.

[kazu]

We will not attack the OP (which is actually against board guidelines) but rather will stick to what was implied versus our own experience. To a great degree we do agree with the OPs overall assessment...that HAL has cut back in too many areas. Since we do a lot of cruising (on several different lines) the cut backs have definitely impacted our own booking habits. There are times we will book with another cruise line, instead of HAL, because our own list of pros/cons favor the other line. We still book with HAL, because despite many cutbacks it is still a pretty good cruise line and we often love the HAL itineraries. We will readily admit that we now go on HAL with lowered expectations...and with good cause.

 

Have to smile at some of the posts because our next HAL cruise is on the "Rottendam" which has been our least favorite ship (of any cruise line) since our last Rottendam cruise (Jul 2011). At that time there were many physical problems on that vessel and we really hated the aft deck "bird bath" which replaced the pool (so they could cram in a few more cabins). But this is 6 years later and we shall see if some things have improved (we know the bird bath is a permanent fixture). Recent reviews here on CC are mixed (at best) and generally not very flattering. As to Lancal's comment (we have seen this before) which essentially says, if one has issues they should go elsewhere...we do not agree. For us its a balancing act. We have wanted to do the VOV itinerary for a few years..and it just so happens this is the vessel that HAL has on that popular cruise.

 

So, in the interest of a great itinerary....we will hold our nose and head back to the Rotterdam. We really hope that things will be vastly improved....but if its not we will just "roll with the waves" and have a great time. We already know that some of entertainment (Barry from Boston and the BB King show) are in tune (pun intended) with our taste. So if the ship still sucks (physically) we will drink away our sorrows during the evening hours :).

 

Hank

 

Hank, I just got off the Rotterdam and the "bird bath" area is very nice because of the excellent service there. If you are lucky enough to have Jay and Lester, you will be amazed by the service - and not just for drinks.

 

I'm not sure what you are looking for but we found the Canaletto to be very good (and I am NOT a Canaletto fan by nature). They even had the pepper mill out ;)

 

Pinnacle was quite good as well.

 

Our stewards were punctual and efficient and pleasant.

 

MDR overall was ok. There were a couple of nights I didn't care for (why we headed to the Canaletto on one night) but overall, it was quite decent and desserts were good in a lot of cases!

 

BBKings was very good. If you have the same group, I think you should be pleased.

 

If you have a major concern and I can help, happy to.

 

Service was good on board -good to VERY good.

 

I hope you have a good cruise.

[Tatka]

In some reason we found MDR food on Veendam last year to be better than on Zuiderdam 13 years ago. Buffets were pretty good too. Although I find strange that buffet worked from 5 to 8;30 pm and then reopened at 10:30. We like to visit buffet couple of hours after our dinner, but not at 10:30.

[RedneckBob]

Not for nothing, but aftet 40+ Hal cruises I find the Company has done more cutting than improving. Staffing is down, food quality is down, service has slipped, equipment is not so great. No niceties anymore on Hal. They have turned to cheap, cheap, cheap. I rate the Cruise Line no better than 3-Star, maybe less. Time to seek other travel options. If you don't agree, I really don't really care about any snotty remarks in rebuttal, than you very much.

 

We are in the same boat, not to play on words. Sailed on HAL past 40 years and seen all the changes. Have drifted to other cruise lines with newer ships; more competitive. For example Celebrity has many cruises that include free drinks, free tips and generous cabin credit for under $150/day for a balcony. As far as your comment "cheap, cheap, cheap", I just looked up cost of 2017 Voyage of the Viking cruise and it was far from cheap; $260-$280 per person per day for an inside cabin ! Way back in 2012 I paid $125 per day for an inside.