Noro - The Dreaded Word

[Dobby_The_Ship_Elf]

When I board I carry a can of Glen 20 disinfectant, rubber gloves and my own wipes (chux) in my carry on to 'blitz' my state room items such as TV remote, all horizontal surfaces, curtain chains, etc etc <don't labour the point>.

 

When I hear about a ship having an outbreak of Noro on the ship I hear the staff carry out a 'deep clean' when next in port.

 

I read endless posts about the hand sanitiser used onboard being non effective against Noro.

 

I get the fact that soap and water is the only thing effective against Noro, does this mean I am wasting my time using disinfectant and should start washing my room down with soap & water from floor to ceiling ????

 

What I would like to know is when a ship has a Noro outbreak, what do the crew use to do a 'deep clean' and where do I get some of the same stuff ????

 

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[Times Prince]

.Let the crew do the cleaning, wash your hands when entering or exiting your room, and enjoy your cruise.

 

The stuff the crew uses makes a cabin uninhabitable for a while, and they have to use a lot of protection while cleaning.

[Aus Traveller]

Great that you are cleaning your cabin, but it won't make any difference to your getting noro. If the previous inhabitants had noro, it would have been cleaned before you board.

 

Noro can only enter your body through your mouth or nose - not through your skin. If there is an alert for noro, don't handle your food. Sorry, to say that it means you should not pick up a bread roll with your hands unless you can be 100% sure your hands are totally sanitized.

[Elitein85days]

The crew uses bleach when sanitizing for noro. The hand sanitizers aren’t usually effective against noro, but bleach works (from what I’ve read).

[Griller]

The crew uses bleach when sanitizing for noro. The hand sanitizers aren’t usually effective against noro, but bleach works (from what I’ve read).

 

Those yellow buckets you see around the ship contain a solution of Virox.

 

A one-step disinfectant cleaner based on proprietary hydrogen peroxide (AHP®) technology to deliver fast and effective cleaning performance. Product is both virucidal and bactericidal.

 

 

Disinfection requires a five-minute contact time. Also provides broad-spectrum sanitizing on hard surfaces in 30 seconds.

 

Its made by a Canadian company.

[bronzey214]

Purell makes a spray that kills Feline Calicivirus/Murine norovirus (non-enveloped viruses similar to norovirus) in 30 seconds. Leaves a little bit of residue but does not require gloves/masks and has no harsh fumes. Also does not require rinsing.

 

This is much better than the previous sprays that take up to 5-10 minutes. I bought a box of three from Amazon and broke one down into smaller bottles to spray.

[elfinmagic]

Great that you are cleaning your cabin, but it won't make any difference to your getting noro. If the previous inhabitants had noro, it would have been cleaned before you board.

 

Noro can only enter your body through your mouth or nose - not through your skin. If there is an alert for noro, don't handle your food. Sorry, to say that it means you should not pick up a bread roll with your hands unless you can be 100% sure your hands are totally sanitized.

 

OK but you do not know If someone else has picked up the same roll and put it back - people will do this

[chengkp75]

In my experience, the most common agent used against noro on the ships is Virkon. This is an industrial strength germicide, and as with all the agents used by the ship, in the strengths required to kill noro, it is diluted from concentrates, and these concentrates are typically not available to the general public. Virkon is a very common agricultural disinfectant. It's use requires proper personal protective gear like rubber gloves, tyvek suits and respirators when being fogged onto surfaces. Fogging of disinfectants like Virkon will also sanitize soft surfaces like upholstery, carpets, and drapes. It also increases the contact time on all surfaces, which is the real key to killing the virus, concentration of active ingredient and contact time.

 

As for soap and water, just know that this does not "kill" noro. Soap is not a disinfectant, it is a lubricant. Think about it, soap is made from animal fat and lye. What handwashing does is loosen skin cells that have the virus on them by friction (which is why "vigorous hand washing" is always recommended), and the copious amount of water rinses the still alive virus down the drain. Soap acts as a lubricant to break the surface tension of the skin cells and make it easier to rinse them away.

 

So, unless you are planning on taking the shower head and drenching down the cabin after scrubbing all the surfaces with soap and water, this will do nothing to remove noro. Even trying to use towels to wipe up after washing will not work, as you would only be able to touch a surface once with each part of the towel, without risking redepositing virus back on the surface.

 

If wiping down your cabin makes you feel better, then by all means go ahead and continue to do it. It will eliminate other viruses and bacteria, but most likely not noro.

 

Lots of people say that the key to not getting noro is to not touch your face. My experience has been that a more common, and more often overlooked, means of transmission is eating with your hands. If your hands have touched anything contaminated, when you pick up the burger, the burger is now contaminated, and you are shoving noro right down your throat. If you worry about noro on a cruise, or there is evidence of GI illness onboard, eat everything (burgers, fries, pizza) with utensils and not your hands.

[chengkp75]

Purell makes a spray that kills Feline Calicivirus/Murine norovirus (non-enveloped viruses similar to norovirus) in 30 seconds. Leaves a little bit of residue but does not require gloves/masks and has no harsh fumes. Also does not require rinsing.

 

This is much better than the previous sprays that take up to 5-10 minutes. I bought a box of three from Amazon and broke one down into smaller bottles to spray.

 

While FCV has been used as the standard test for effectiveness against noro, there are some questions as to how closely it resembles noro in reaction to disinfecting agents. If Purell's product was actually as effective as they say, why have they not registered it with the EPA (for surface disinfectants) or the FDA (for hand sanitizers) for registration as an effective agent against noro (current lists from both departments don't show any Purell product). With as much hoopla as noro outbreaks get, if they had a truly effective agent, they would surely register it to be able to say they are the first and only registered consumer product effective against noro, per the EPA or FDA.

[USCcruisecrazy]

According to the Center for Disease Control and Prevention, any alcohol-based hand sanitizers will work. That can be in a liquid, gel, or wipe form. The major difference between Noro Virus and many other similar viruses is that it can live for a longer period of time on any surface.

 

Be cautious and wipe your room down with an alcohol-based wipe when you first get on board, use an alcohol-based sanitizer (either found on the ship or your personal stash...I use both), and don't put your hands in your mouth or on your food unless you know your hands are clean.

 

Other than that, enjoy your cruise...odds of catching the virus doing these things is pretty slim.

[chengkp75]

According to the Center for Disease Control and Prevention, any alcohol-based hand sanitizers will work. That can be in a liquid, gel, or wipe form. The major difference between Noro Virus and many other similar viruses is that it can live for a longer period of time on any surface.

 

Be cautious and wipe your room down with an alcohol-based wipe when you first get on board, use an alcohol-based sanitizer (either found on the ship or your personal stash...I use both), and don't put your hands in your mouth or on your food unless you know your hands are clean.

 

Other than that, enjoy your cruise...odds of catching the virus doing these things is pretty slim.

 

No, they don't. The say:

 

"If soap and water aren’t available, use an alcohol-based hand sanitizer. These alcohol-based products can help reduce the number of germs on your hands, but they are not a substitute for washing with soap and water."

This means that hand sanitizers may reduce the number of virus on your hands, but that, again, unless you use a paper towel to wipe the sanitizer off your hands (and they typically don't have enough "wet time" to have an effective contact time, you are merely moving the virus around. This is why they say sanitizers are not a substitute for hand washing, because washing will rinse the live virus off your hands, while the wipe will not kill the virus nor will it remove live virus unless cleaned off.

As for using alcohol wipes:

• "Clean and disinfect contaminated surfaces
  After throwing up or having diarrhea, immediately clean and disinfect contaminated surfaces using a bleach-based household cleaner as directed on the product label. If no such cleaning product is available, you can use a solution made with 5 tablespoons to 1.5 cups of household bleach per 1 gallon of water."
  

That is from their website here: https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=2&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0ahUKEwiGxbKNra_XAhWL4CYKHVZcDMwQjBAILTAB&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.cdc.gov%2Ffeatures%2Fnorovirus%2Findex.html&usg=AOvVaw0dvZsk9eEEFY64gp1uiUZc

Again, alcohol wipes will tend to move the virus around, but it will not kill the virus once on the wipe, and re-contacting the surface with a wipe that has already been wiped across the surface runs the risk of redepositing the virus, in a live state.

[Redwing55]

It's eye opening to me that as much of an issue Noro is to some, how much mis-information those "in the know" seem to spread. Almost as bad as Noro. With today's internet, one would think that reliable effective answers can be found, yet I still see advice offered for Noro control that won't really impact the virus all that much.

[Alaskanb]

https://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=2450876

[Katgoesonholiday]

Sorry if I’m being a bit obtuse here, but surely it doesn’t matter how well you clean your own cabin if the cabins around you have issues? The cabin attendants don’t change cleaning cloths between cabins, do they? So the cloth used to wipe down your bedside table has likely been used to wipe down the bedside table of at least three or four cabins around you. Would you insist on cleaning EVERY DAY after your cabin attendant has been through? Ugh!

 

We practice frequent hand washing, avoid touching our faces, and eat with cutlery in the main restaurants. That’s the extent of it and it works for us.

[USCcruisecrazy]

 

"If soap and water aren’t available, use an alcohol-based hand sanitizer. These alcohol-based products can help reduce the number of germs on your hands, but they are not a substitute for washing with soap and water."

.

Thanks Captain Obvious...I didn't mention in addition to washing your hands because that seems like a logical first step for anyone with half a brain. Besides, I was talking about limiting the risk by sanitizing your room. Appreciate the attack mode you went into, though. Have a nice day!

[chengkp75]

Sorry if I’m being a bit obtuse here, but surely it doesn’t matter how well you clean your own cabin if the cabins around you have issues? The cabin attendants don’t change cleaning cloths between cabins, do they? So the cloth used to wipe down your bedside table has likely been used to wipe down the bedside table of at least three or four cabins around you. Would you insist on cleaning EVERY DAY after your cabin attendant has been through? Ugh!

 

We practice frequent hand washing, avoid touching our faces, and eat with cutlery in the main restaurants. That’s the extent of it and it works for us.

 

The cloth they clean your tables and hard surfaces with either have a sufficiently strong bleach solution, or Virkon, which will kill any virus that is picked up by the cleaning rag in the previous cabin. Their bucket of cleaning solution is tested frequently for concentration. And, when a cabin is identified as having a GI ill passenger, the cleaning materials for that cabin are segregated, and sent to the laundry in red bags for washing in the special red bag washing machine (higher temps, longer wash cycle, higher concentration of disinfectants).

[chengkp75]

[/font][/color]

Thanks Captain Obvious...I didn't mention in addition to washing your hands because that seems like a logical first step for anyone with half a brain. Besides, I was talking about limiting the risk by sanitizing your room. Appreciate the attack mode you went into, though. Have a nice day!

 

They also don't say that "any alcohol based hand sanitizer will work", which in the context of this thread is to mediate the noro virus, and they don't say that. Also, they don't say that using a bleach wipe will limit your risk by "sanitizing" your room.

[Aus Traveller]

OK but you do not know If someone else has picked up the same roll and put it back - people will do this

This can't happen. In the dining room the waiters offer bread rolls from a basket and put the one roll on your plate using tongs. We don't pick up bread rolls in the buffet. If there is a red alert for noro, I forego bread rolls altogether because I would usually pick up a piece of the roll with my hands. If there is a red alert, passengers cannot touch the food in the buffet - staff do the serving.

[Aus Traveller]

Lots of people say that the key to not getting noro is to not touch your face. My experience has been that a more common, and more often overlooked, means of transmission is eating with your hands. If your hands have touched anything contaminated, when you pick up the burger, the burger is now contaminated, and you are shoving noro right down your throat. If you worry about noro on a cruise, or there is evidence of GI illness onboard, eat everything (burgers, fries, pizza) with utensils and not your hands.

Someone else singing my song:D. In our 70 or so cruises, many have had a red alert for noro. When that happens, we don't touch our food with our hands. It means we give up bread rolls because we would look a big odd eating it with a knife and fork. So far we have avoided the dreaded noro on a cruise ship. We did contract it when we were having a resort holiday with our young children. We didn't know what the illness was, but with us cleaning up after the children, soon all five of us were ill.:loudcry:

[RDC1]

[/font][/color]

Thanks Captain Obvious...I didn't mention in addition to washing your hands because that seems like a logical first step for anyone with half a brain. Besides, I was talking about limiting the risk by sanitizing your room. Appreciate the attack mode you went into, though. Have a nice day!

 

The only person I see going into attack mode is you. All he did was not an opinion contrary to yours in a straight forward, non-aggressive fashion.

[Times Prince]

Someone else singing my song:D. In our 70 or so cruises, many have had a red alert for noro. When that happens, we don't touch our food with our hands. It means we give up bread rolls because we would look a big odd eating it with a knife and fork. So far we have avoided the dreaded noro on a cruise ship.

29 cruises for us, many with noro onboard (alert goes into effect when as few as 13 passengers are identified as having it). Have eaten bread rolls on every one. What we do is before meals we wash our hands in our cabin, and don't touch any surfaces with our hands, including railings and elevator controls. So far we have avoided noro.

 

The ship's Doctor always recommends washing hands as the best deterrent. It seems to work for us.

 

As an aside, the stewards will also stop using vacuum cleaners when there is a noro alert in progress to avoid any cross contamination of cabins.

[laughing husky]

Originally posted by USCcruisecrazy According to the Center for Disease Control and Prevention, any alcohol-based hand sanitizers will work. That can be in a liquid, gel, or wipe form. The major difference between Noro Virus and many other similar viruses is that it can live for a longer period of time on any surface.

 

Be cautious and wipe your room down with an alcohol-based wipe when you first get on board, use an alcohol-based sanitizer (either found on the ship or your personal stash...I use both), and don't put your hands in your mouth or on your food unless you know your hands are clean.

 

Other than that, enjoy your cruise...odds of catching the virus doing these things is pretty slim.

 

 

The problem with alcohol based hand sanitizers is that it will dry out your skin...and it cause micro cracks in the surfaces that allow bacteria/viruses to enter. Your skin is your biggest organ and the best protection against disease. Just wash your hands....frequently with a mild soap...I have been on 40+ cruises...never been sick, never had Noro, and have practiced medicine for 25 years......You are more likely to get it in a super market from a basket or someone coughing than you will from a ship...

[justafem]

I might be lucky in my allergies. I'm allergic to fur and dander (and we've always had pets, that I touch), which means, from an early age, I learned not to touch my face, where the breakouts are the most prevalent and noticeable.

 

Most people touch their faces hundreds of times a day, unconsciously, I've taken that number down considerably.

[mellon1]

Sorry if I’m being a bit obtuse here, but surely it doesn’t matter how well you clean your own cabin if the cabins around you have issues? The cabin attendants don’t change cleaning cloths between cabins, do they? So the cloth used to wipe down your bedside table has likely been used to wipe down the bedside table of at least three or four cabins around you. Would you insist on cleaning EVERY DAY after your cabin attendant has been through? Ugh!

 

We practice frequent hand washing, avoid touching our faces, and eat with cutlery in the main restaurants. That’s the extent of it and it works for us.

 

I guess I assumed they would change cloths, especially to stop spreading anything.

[c-boy]

so my take away from all this is I can't/shouldn't french kiss my wife after she eats @ the buffet and goes to the casino