Amending gratuities - keep them but reduce the amount?

[vmom]

there's a reason Princess calls it a tip ( with the option to adjust ) and not a service charge OR include it in the price...:cool:

 

 

Princess is using the American semantics / American way of handling service charge for most (but not all) cruises. If an Aussie or Kiwi (New Zealander) books a cruise in Australia or New Zealand then the gratuities is build into the fare.

 

In the US, its separated out.

 

A while back HAL did not charge gratuities, stating that gratuities were included, but then their published fares were higher.

 

Americans like to feel like they are getting a deal. Ever notice that on the Princess website or some of the other travel sites, when you book a cruise, the fare is often listed without the ports taxes and fees. Makes it seem cheaper, then when you go to book the cruise, the port fees and taxes are added in and all of a sudden the price jumps up. By separating out the charges it makes the person feel like its a better deal and more likely to sign up.

[Air&Sea]

Why $13.50? And why per person and not per stateroom? Again, we are not averse to tipping for good service anywhere in the world, but not by those amounts and not on a per head basis either!

 

I know it's a bit of a culture clash - cruise lines and indeed America itself don't have a minimum wage, which I personally find disgraceful - but that's why we're trying to find a compromise where we continue to contribute to the pool but at a rate we can afford and still feel is fair.

1. Tipping is EXPECTED in polite society (including cruising). Your service staff will generally be from a 3rd world nation, be a mother or father and be on a one year contract with the cruise line. They work 7 days a week during that year (with no vacation) and work 14-16 hour shifts.

 

2. I started cruising in 1987 and the tipping was as follows: Server, $10/day, Busboy, $7/day, Room attendant, $10/day. I feel that $13/day is MORE than fair. These tips were paid in cash at the end of the cruise.

 

3. Princess (and others) have developed the "Pre-Paid" gratuity as a convenience to the passenger. You no longer have to carry a bunch of cash to use at the end of your cruise. This gives you the option to pay in advance, pay at the end, or not pay at all. Good luck if you want to be "The Ugly ______ (fill in your country of residence)."

 

4. You can bash America (and cruising) all you want. But, at a coffee shop in Germany, I was expected to pay extra for the cardboard sleeve when I bought a coffee to go. It was my "option" to by it or burn my hands. So, no one system is perfect.

 

5. It has been said before, but tipping is one of the variables that you must consider when you create your vacation budget. If $13/day per person causes you to exceed that budget, then you have chosen the wrong vacation. Princess is a mid-range cruise line when it comes to price. There are other less expensive lines to choose from.

 

6. If you feel you are not receiving service that is proportional to your gratuity, it is your responsibility to report that to the Maitre 'D or Ships Purser.

[skynight]

 

I know it's a bit of a culture clash - cruise lines and indeed America itself don't have a minimum wage, which I personally find disgraceful -

 

Just so you know for the future in the U.S. there are Federal minimum wage scales which are the floor. Many States have minimum wages which are higher and many cities also have higher minimum wages than their own States' minimum. In the case of positions such as waiters and bartenders which rely on gratuities as a major part of their compensation the legal minimum wage is usually lower than say a factory worker.

[Croose]

I'd say the only people screwing the staff are the cruise companies.

 

Carnival Corporation made $2 billion in profit last year. TWO BILLION! And yet they pay their staff absolutely pitiful base salaries and leave it up to the customers to pick up the slack. But I'M the one screwing then?! The mind bogfles.

 

Nobody want to respond to this then?

[neverbeenhere]

I’m thinking that contracts are of various lengths, many in the seven month range.

 

If you were tipping those figures in 87, then you were “bringing the cash to the table”. We remember lower amounts, but inflation adjusted, tips and cruising is cheap, cheap, cheap.

[WVBill]

Why $13.50? And why per person and not per stateroom? Again, we are not averse to tipping for good service anywhere in the world, but not by those amounts and not on a per head basis either!

.....but that's why we're trying to find a compromise where we continue to contribute to the pool but at a rate we can afford and still feel is fair.

 

OK - so what do you consider a fair tip for your waiter? How about the assistant waiter? The Buffet Stewards? Your room steward? The other housekeeping staff? What does your concept of a fair tip for all those people add up to?

 

Let's say all of those people who directly support you add up to a count of ten - that's just 13 cents a day each by Princess' recommendation.

 

But you say "Oh, I'm going to slip my room steward some more in an envelope because he gives me good service!" Does that mean you don't think the other housekeeping staff (without who's work your room steward couldn't do his/hers) deserve 13 cents a day?

[nukesubsailor]

I'd say the only people screwing the staff are the cruise companies.

 

Carnival Corporation made $2 billion in profit last year. TWO BILLION! And yet they pay their staff absolutely pitiful base salaries and leave it up to the customers to pick up the slack. But I'M the one screwing then?! The mind bogfles.

If the cruise lines spent more money on wages they would just raise fares to cover the added expense and the customers would still be picking up the slack.

Any customer who does not pay all or part of the automatic gratuity should give the passenger service desk the name of the crew members and the details about the poor service. That way the crew member will get the message that they need to improve. Any customer who does not pay all or part of the automatic gratuity just to save money should wait to cruise until they can afford it.

 

And the cheapskates who can afford it but still don't pay the gratuity just for the pleasure they get by not doing so----I hope in another life you end up working in a hot cruise ship laundry where you never see a passenger much less get a tip for your efforts to make their cruise pleasurable.

 

The auto gratuity should be charged per person and not per cabin. A cabin occupied by 4 people requires more work than a cabin occupied by two people. More towels and linens used. More beds to make.

[vmom]

Nobody want to respond to this then?

 

Not taking the bait. Its just a rationalization to avoid paying the service charge/gratuities.

[MrMan]

Nobody want to respond to this then?

 

 

 

Profits are a good thing, allowing more ships, employing many people. Jobs helps the masses more than welfare ever did. Addressed. Now will you address how you feel reducing the expected and customary tip, ie stealing, is acceptable for the worker. If theft makes one feel better so be it. Also expect to tip 15% to your bartenders. They do a great job

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Forums

[floridalover5623]

Profits are a good thing, allowing more ships, employing many people. Jobs helps the masses more than welfare ever did. Addressed. Now will you address how you feel reducing the expected and customary tip, ie stealing, is acceptable for the worker. If theft makes one feel better so be it. Also expect to tip 15% to your bartenders. They do a great job

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Forums

The price of a drink already includes the tip.

[cruzsnooze]

As the title says, is it possible to change the amount of automatic gratuities while still paying by this method? We feel that $13.50 per person per day is excessive and would NEVER tip this amount normally (not from a tipping culture anyway) but we've no desire to cancel them entirely as we recognise it's a fair way to distribute gratuities amongst all the staff. We can always 'top up' with individual gratuities for any service we feel merits an extra tip - which is, after all, the point of tipping in the first place.

 

If this isn't possible we'll just have to rely on the old envelopes method!

I always go to guest services and reduce my daily to $10 PP PD because that is what I believe actually goes to crew after all the administration fees and other incentives they use our money in the guise of gratuity's for. They do not care or ask any questions at guest services and happily honor your request.

[voljeep]

we've never adjusted the 'hotel charge' - just get that out of the way...

 

we tip the baggage handlers when they take our luggage out of the back of the car for us...we tip the porter if we use one at disembarkation and they take our luggage thru customs , to the parking garage and to our car - best $20 spent on the cruise...

 

we tip our room steward at the start of the cruise with a small note asking for wine glasses, robes, fresh ice and fruit in the afternoons, etc

 

we'll give a buck to the person that takes our order and delivers us a drink by the pool..

 

we'll tip the bartender/servers if we end up going to the same venues, think Crooners and Vines...

 

it's planned for before the cruise, as we take a hundo in $ 1's and some $ 5's

 

we'll tip the room steward again at the end of the cruise depending...

 

 

Now what I hate, not on a cruise ship, but land based, being 'expected to tip 20% on the total bill of $ 200' when we get the same or better service at the Waffle House for a $ 20 tab...

 

jess sprayin':beer-mug:

[san diego sue]

We were on the Queen Mary2, heading from Southampton to NY with few Americans on board Well, the first night I had a question so got on what was a huge line.One after the other people were removing their auto tips. We had our gratuities as an incentive which was nice . We wouldn't have dreamed to remove them if we were paying, no matter what others did.

Last night of cruise gave our Room Steward (female) an additional tip. Told her in additional to normal tips. She looked at us like this was a first for her.So sad.

I wouldn't want to work on any cruise line doing what these over worked individuals do and always having to smile at us.They deserve the auto tips and any extra we can give for the excellent service.

[Island wannabe]

Not taking the bait. Its just a rationalization to avoid paying the service charge/gratuities.

 

Like (wish there was a thumbs up emojii here to add!!)

Edited July 6, 2018 by Island wannabe
spelling

[WVHillbilly]

Nobody want to respond to this then?

 

Sure what a corporation makes in profits is of no concern to me, it's important only to the shareholders who invested their money hoping to increase their investment. Not all profits are returned to the shareholders as a good percentage is generally spent to grow the business (purchase new ships and upgrade older ones).

 

I see cruising as a pretty fair value, most cruises are about $100-150 per person per day. Assuming it's just the two of us, a decent hotel will cost about $150 per day that leaves another $150 for dining/drinks which works out to $25 per meal, then you throw in the entertainment on top of that.

 

For those who oppose tipping to supplement servers income, because they are "not paid a fair wage". My question is how much do servers get paid per hour in countries that don't tip? I ask this as I truly want to know what other consider a fair wage for servers?

[Croose]

Profits are a good thing, allowing more ships, employing many people. Jobs helps the masses more than welfare ever did. Addressed. Now will you address how you feel reducing the expected and customary tip, ie stealing, is acceptable for the worker. If theft makes one feel better so be it. Also expect to tip 15% to your bartenders. They do a great job

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Forums

 

Interesting logic - please explain how making billion in profits while still paying your cabin stewarts a few dollars a day is good business and not theft, but reducing your daily gratuities is a bigger sin.

 

Princess might reduce their profits to 1.5 billion a year or a billion a year while paying a proper wage to their workers. They won't though.

[Croose]

I always go to guest services and reduce my daily to $10 PP PD because that is what I believe actually goes to crew after all the administration fees and other incentives they use our money in the guise of gratuity's for. They do not care or ask any questions at guest services and happily honor your request.

 

Thank you for the first person to actually answer my question rather than moralise and lecture :)

[voljeep]

there is

 

see all 36 smiles...keep scrolling down...(y):beer-mug:

[Island wannabe]

;)

there is

 

see all 36 smiles...keep scrolling down...(y):beer-mug:

 

Love it!!

[StolidCruiser]

Nobody want to respond to this then?

 

You have caught quite a few who can’t resist the juicy tip debate.

 

Why people continue to participate in postings from “new members” whose first post is on such a contentious subject is beyond me. All it does is invite such pot-stirrers to do it over and over, knowing the uproar it will cause.

 

It is a public forum and people can, of course, do whatever they want. It is kind of entertaining, if not redundant, to read when completely bored with nothing better to do.

[neverbeenhere]

You have caught quite a few who can’t resist the juicy tip debate.

 

Why people continue to participate in postings from “new members” whose first post is on such a contentious subject is beyond me. All it does is invite such pot-stirrers to do it over and over, knowing the uproar it will cause.

 

It is a public forum and people can, of course, do whatever they want. It is kind of entertaining, if not redundant, to read when completely bored with nothing better to do.

 

Yes, I agree. While I didn't put any snarky comments into this thread, I did participate. So, I am standing in the front (Hands in pockets) and "Taking the Pledge" "I will (hopefully) never comment on a tipping thread again."

[tonit964]

For many years , Tips were a suggested amount , usually paid personally on the Final night .

Now most every cruise line has gone to putting them on your account .

This has worked out well for guest convenience and especially for the crew who were often missed or skipped out on the Final night by some .

Don't upset what works well and is fair to all employees deserving . Your messing with some hard workers income by removing tips .

 

 

I'm not so sure, I think the people that skipped the dining room on the last night to avoid paying the tips, :mad: now just go to guest services and remove them anyway. Just my thought.

[MTNestr]

I'd say the only people screwing the staff are the cruise companies.

 

Carnival Corporation made $2 billion in profit last year. TWO BILLION! And yet they pay their staff absolutely pitiful base salaries and leave it up to the customers to pick up the slack. But I'M the one screwing then?! The mind bogfles.

 

You’re probably right that if Princess spent their total 2017 profits they would have just enough to pay everyones’ tips. But you need to look further to see what they actually do with their profits.

 

In 2017 they spent 2.94 Billion on capital expenditures - things like new ships and improvements to the existing fleet. In May alone they spent 1.63 billion on capital improvements which is a large portion of the 2 Billion you complain about.

 

Their 2017 Return On Assets was 6.54% while at the same time the NASDAQ went up over 28%.

 

If you think their profits are excessive then buy their stock and share in their profits. You’ll also get an OBC to help pay for those tips though I doubt you will.

Edited July 6, 2018 by MTNestr

[waltd]

Interesting logic - please explain how making billion in profits while still paying your cabin stewarts a few dollars a day is good business and not theft, but reducing your daily gratuities is a bigger sin.

 

Princess might reduce their profits to 1.5 billion a year or a billion a year while paying a proper wage to their workers. They won't though.

And you could cruise with a European cruise line that pays a higher wage and you feel isn't about corporate greed but you choose not to. You still cruise with Princess. Why? Because they are cheaper. And you sit there going Ha Ha I've saved a boat load of money and I can just use the excuse we are not a tipping society and I will save even more money by lowering the tipping to the staff. We get it. You are not the first to come on here with the same lame excuses.

[land lover]

As the title says, is it possible to change the amount of automatic gratuities while still paying by this method? We feel that $13.50 per person per day is excessive and would NEVER tip this amount normally (not from a tipping culture anyway) but we've no desire to cancel them entirely as we recognise it's a fair way to distribute gratuities amongst all the staff. We can always 'top up' with individual gratuities for any service we feel merits an extra tip - which is, after all, the point of tipping in the first place.

 

If this isn't possible we'll just have to rely on the old envelopes method!

 

Not bothering to read posts . But here is my experience, from watching what people do at the guest relations desk. I'll leave my sig on OP so you can see, that I have done a variety of itineraries in the last year or so.

 

Seems...I am at the Guest relations desk a lot on cruises so I have seen many people remove the grats, certainly not as much as 10 years ago but many guests do it. The reason the cruise line sets it up per day on your OBA is so it is more difficult to just remove the whole thing. A lot of times non-Americans are settling their account in US cash and find out they do not have enough so there goes the grats.... Often I have heard people just say I want to only pay $75 total or $5 per day.

 

I always leave the auto tip on.....and if I have exceptional service I write letters of accommodation, while on the ship to the appropriate managers, much better than an extra 50 bucks in my opinion. Also any left over of my OBC can go to the general tip fund....

 

Edit.....Oops...sign didn't make it ...but last year cruised in South East Asia, South America and Europe no TAs so a great mix of Pax from local countries.

Edited July 6, 2018 by land lover