navybankerteacher Posted April 29, 2019 #126 Share Posted April 29, 2019 1 hour ago, sft429 said: Ah, so when there is strict gun control and the homicide rate is low - it's because of gun control. Where there is strict gun control and the homicide rate is high - it's because of something else... How did you come up with this - I merely pointed out that the US stands out among economically developed countries - by having a much higher homicide rate — one that approaches the rate in gang-ridden societies. I am not advocating taking away all guns : rather strictly limiting access to guns which have no utility beyond killing people: rapid fire weapons, with large magazines, loaded with armor-piercing bullets; and requiring people who want to possess (and carry) sporting/hunting weapons to demonstrate the maturity and mental stability to use them responsibility. I am not interested in wasting my time discussing this topic with people who seem to believe that there is any rational justification for permitting mentally impaired or immature individuals to freely possess instruments whose only purpose is to kill humans. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sft429 Posted April 29, 2019 #127 Share Posted April 29, 2019 22 minutes ago, navybankerteacher said: How did you come up with this - I merely pointed out that the US stands out among economically developed countries - by having a much higher homicide rate — one that approaches the rate in gang-ridden societies. So you remove whole continents from the homicide comparisons to support your argument. Can we leave our gang related homicides out of the equation? If it's fair to leave countries out then we can leave Chicago and a few other cities out. 1 22 minutes ago, navybankerteacher said: I am not advocating taking away all guns : rather strictly limiting access to guns which have no utility beyond killing people: rapid fire weapons, with large magazines, loaded with armor-piercing bullets; and requiring people who want to possess (and carry) sporting/hunting weapons to demonstrate the maturity and mental stability to use them responsibility. You're very cavalier with my rights. And I think you missed a couple gun control trigger words there. 22 minutes ago, navybankerteacher said: I am not interested in wasting my time discussing this topic with people who seem to believe that there is any rational justification for permitting mentally impaired or immature individuals to freely possess instruments whose only purpose is to kill humans. Your imagination is getting the best of you here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
navybankerteacher Posted April 30, 2019 #128 Share Posted April 30, 2019 (edited) As mentioned, I am not interested in wasting time with people who seem to believe that there should/can be no limitations on the immature or mentally impaired possessing weapons whose only real purpose is killing their neighbors. The longer the fanatics resist ANY controls, the more certain it will be that controls WILL finally be imposed - probably much more invasive than the modest ones reasonably suggested. I’m out of here. Edited April 30, 2019 by navybankerteacher Missing point Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lifes-a-beach Posted April 30, 2019 #129 Share Posted April 30, 2019 (edited) You’re probably right that some lawmakers will continue to impose stricter controls on some weapons. However, I don’t believe a day will come when invasive controls will be imposed and suddenly criminals and the mentally ill will comply. To date, and in a number of cities, there have already been very invasive controls and criminals and the mentally ill still acquire and use firearms in the commission of crime. Until It can be demonstrated that those of us who are not criminals would be safer without our defensive weapons in the face of criminals who have offensive weapons I seriously doubt that those of us who are not criminals will voluntarily disarm. I know I won’t. Edited April 30, 2019 by lifes-a-beach Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SRF Posted April 30, 2019 #130 Share Posted April 30, 2019 10 hours ago, navybankerteacher said: I am not interested in wasting my time discussing this topic with people who seem to believe that there is any rational justification for permitting mentally impaired or immature individuals to freely possess instruments whose only purpose is to kill humans. Who has advocated that?????? You do realize, that in the US, the same people who are all for more gun laws (in addition to the more than 27,000 such laws already on the books) are the same ones the prevent inclusion of mental health issues into searches prior to firearms purchase? And also have weakened ability to commit someone or get them proper help? And that the mother of the Sandy Hook shooter tried to get someone to get her son help, and was refused on all fronts????? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SRF Posted April 30, 2019 #131 Share Posted April 30, 2019 10 hours ago, navybankerteacher said: I am not advocating taking away all guns : rather strictly limiting access to guns which have no utility beyond killing people: rapid fire weapons, with large magazines, loaded with armor-piercing bullets; and requiring people who want to possess (and carry) sporting/hunting weapons to demonstrate the maturity and mental stability to use them responsibility. You obviously do not know or understand the wide range of firearms competitions available. And who should determine the maturity and mental stability to own firearms? Who in the government do you trust to do so? And how do you prove a negative (that some doesn't have an issue)? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aquahound Posted April 30, 2019 #132 Share Posted April 30, 2019 (edited) 21 hours ago, Host Grandma Cruising said: I know you NRA people don’t want to hear comparative arguments... Edited....Never mind. Edited April 30, 2019 by Aquahound Not worth it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grandma Cruising Posted April 30, 2019 #133 Share Posted April 30, 2019 I’ve just been looking at this website https://www.indexmundi.com/facts/indicators/VC.IHR.PSRC.P5/rankings which lists homicide rates per 100,000 population. US is 83rd out of 192 countries, with a rate of 4.9 per 100,000. Countries with higher rates include such law abiding countries as Yemen, Eritrea, Nigeria, the Congo etc. Even countries such as Iran & Libya have lower homicide rates than the US. The majority of European countries, who have strong gun laws, have a homicide rate of 1 or less per 100,000. That’s about a fifth of the rate in the US, so don’t try to say strong gun laws don’t lower homicide rates. I agree it’s not the only thing that matters, but it is clearly the most important. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sft429 Posted April 30, 2019 #134 Share Posted April 30, 2019 1 hour ago, Host Grandma Cruising said: .....<snip........ so don’t try to say strong gun laws don’t lower homicide rates. I agree it’s not the only thing that matters, but it is clearly the most important. Explain the 30 or so countries with a rate of at least 6 times the US rate (over 30/100,000), and with strict gun control, if gun control is "clearly the most important" thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dkjretired Posted April 30, 2019 #135 Share Posted April 30, 2019 15 hours ago, navybankerteacher said: As mentioned, I am not interested in wasting time with people who seem to believe that there should/can be no limitations on the immature or mentally impaired possessing weapons whose only real purpose is killing their neighbors. The longer the fanatics resist ANY controls, the more certain it will be that controls WILL finally be imposed - probably much more invasive than the modest ones reasonably suggested. I’m out of here. Nobody's resisting any controls, we are just looking for controls that actually work and not feel good laws that only punish the law abiding. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cruzaholic41 Posted April 30, 2019 #136 Share Posted April 30, 2019 3 hours ago, Host Grandma Cruising said: I’ve just been looking at this website https://www.indexmundi.com/facts/indicators/VC.IHR.PSRC.P5/rankings which lists homicide rates per 100,000 population. US is 83rd out of 192 countries, with a rate of 4.9 per 100,000. Countries with higher rates include such law abiding countries as Yemen, Eritrea, Nigeria, the Congo etc. Even countries such as Iran & Libya have lower homicide rates than the US. The majority of European countries, who have strong gun laws, have a homicide rate of 1 or less per 100,000. That’s about a fifth of the rate in the US, so don’t try to say strong gun laws don’t lower homicide rates. I agree it’s not the only thing that matters, but it is clearly the most important. Isnt it your job as a Host to prevent political discussions rather than add fuel to them? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grandma Cruising Posted April 30, 2019 #137 Share Posted April 30, 2019 8 minutes ago, Cruzaholic41 said: Isnt it your job as a Host to prevent political discussions rather than add fuel to them? I don’t consider this to be a political discussion - it’s certainly related to travel and to safety. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dkjretired Posted April 30, 2019 #138 Share Posted April 30, 2019 Wow, been on Cruise Critic from beginning, if anyone doesn't think this is a political discussion I have a bridge for you to buy in Brooklyn. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grandma Cruising Posted April 30, 2019 #139 Share Posted April 30, 2019 Politics is about political parties. In the UK and in most of Europe gun law is nothing to do with political parties Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dkjretired Posted April 30, 2019 #140 Share Posted April 30, 2019 59 minutes ago, Host Grandma Cruising said: Politics is about political parties. In the UK and in most of Europe gun law is nothing to do with political parties Bridge is still for sale. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lifes-a-beach Posted May 10, 2019 #141 Share Posted May 10, 2019 She dead... https://www.caymancompass.com/2019/04/24/woman-on-trial-for-firearms-violation-dies/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ggtjr Posted June 3, 2019 #142 Share Posted June 3, 2019 If you want to see what happens, watch LOCKED UP ABROAD! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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