If you Don't Think HAL is a bargain today, Think Again

[RedneckBob]

Hi y'all, Redneck Bob hear.

 

Just the other day I was clearing out, getting rid of or just dusting off some storage boxes in my barn. I opened one box and low and behold there was this Cruise Brochure, Holland America Line, Caribbean cruises 1988-1989. It looked brand new! I opened the brochure to see what ships were around and the prices. HAL has four boats in the Caribbean for the winter of '88-'89; old Noordam, Westerdam, Nieuw Amsterdam and Rotterdam. None of the ships had cabins with balconies; only inside and outside w/windows.

 

Excluding costs for free airfare the Oceanview cabins started at $1,270 pp to $1,795 pp, 7 day cruise. This was the "Economy Fare" between 10/15/88 and 12/10/88. I guess we don't know how good we have it today!

[rucrazy]

14 minutes ago, RedneckBob said:

Excluding costs for free airfare the Oceanview cabins started at $1,270 pp to $1,795 pp, 7 day cruise. This was the "Economy Fare" between 10/15/88 and 12/10/88. I guess we don't know how good we have it today!

fares may indeed may have fallen but so has amenities

[0bnxshs]

1 minute ago, rucrazy said:

fares may indeed may have fallen but so has amenities

You expect more, or even the same, for less?

 

Thanks, Bob, for the reality check.

[Lido deck main]

14 minutes ago, 0bnxshs said:

You expect more, or even the same, for less?

 

Thanks, Bob, for the reality check.

Ditto

[HappyInVan]

FYI, MSC Seaview Yacht Club inside cabin @1299 PP double occupancy. Departing Oct 19 Genoa-Genoa 8D 7N.

 

This is Yacht Club...

 

https://www.msccruisesusa.com/en-us/Cruise-Deals/MSC-Yacht-Club-All-Inclusive-Cruises.aspx

 

https://www.msccruisesusa.com/en-us/Discover-MSC/MSC-Yacht-Club.aspx

 

Customers gain when they get greater value for the same money. Customers lose when they get less value for the same money.

 

 

[rucrazy]

49 minutes ago, 0bnxshs said:

You expect more, or even the same, for less?

 

Thanks, Bob, for the reality check.

My point is you get what you pay for... I had no problem with pricing before... I adjusted by cabin category and length of cruise. 

I for one LOVE amenities...I have a hard time on HAL or Celebrity for that matter when the act costs nothing but seconds of time I still rarely hear "It would be my pleasure"

Edited December 6, 2019 by rucrazy

[*Miss G*]

1 hour ago, RedneckBob said:

Hi y'all, Redneck Bob hear.

 

Just the other day I was clearing out, getting rid of or just dusting off some storage boxes in my barn. I opened one box and low and behold there was this Cruise Brochure, Holland America Line, Caribbean cruises 1988-1989. It looked brand new! I opened the brochure to see what ships were around and the prices. HAL has four boats in the Caribbean for the winter of '88-'89; old Noordam, Westerdam, Nieuw Amsterdam and Rotterdam. None of the ships had cabins with balconies; only inside and outside w/windows.

 

Excluding costs for free airfare the Oceanview cabins started at $1,270 pp to $1,795 pp, 7 day cruise. This was the "Economy Fare" between 10/15/88 and 12/10/88. I guess we don't know how good we have it today!

 

So much for your fun thread!  😂

[iancal]

We view bargain in terms of value for money.  Not simply for price.  We also view it in terms of competitive offerings.

 

Seems to us that lately, base on our preferences, some of the premium lines offer us much better value than many of the mass market cruise lines.  

[Taters]

No one ever paid the list prices.

[VennDiagram]

36 minutes ago, iancal said:

We view bargain in terms of value for money.  Not simply for price.  We also view it in terms of competitive offerings.

 

Seems to us that lately, base on our preferences, some of the premium lines offer us much better value than many of the mass market cruise lines.  

 

Value is very individual.  What provides value to me may not provide value to you.  For example, we recently bought a cheap mass-market new car.    A friend couldn't understand why we would buy such a cheap car, because it will have no trade-in value. 

 

We will drive it until it falls over dead in our driveway. It's trade-in value has no value to us.

[rucrazy]

46 minutes ago, VennDiagram said:

 

Value is very individual.  What provides value to me may not provide value to you.

 

Those are two biggest statements made in a while.

Bravo..

 

Joseph

[Vic The Parrot]

If you want to unload that brochure, I'll buy it from you.  😎

[Billthekid]

If your cruise records are up to date and available it would be interesting to determine which of the cruises that you took, and which one did you like best.  Then look at the price you paid per cruise night and the date of that cruise.  Try to remember what amenities you had on that particular cruise.  Then review cruise prices today and what amenities you no longer receive, then in your own mind determine if in fact you are receiving the same value.  The price may be the same, but the joy may not be.

[BJzink]

4 hours ago, HappyInVan said:

FYI, MSC Seaview Yacht Club inside cabin @1299 PP double occupancy. Departing Oct 19 Genoa-Genoa 8D 7N.

 

This is Yacht Club...

 

https://www.msccruisesusa.com/en-us/Cruise-Deals/MSC-Yacht-Club-All-Inclusive-Cruises.aspx

 

https://www.msccruisesusa.com/en-us/Discover-MSC/MSC-Yacht-Club.aspx

 

Customers gain when they get greater value for the same money. Customers lose when they get less value for the same money.

 

 

Each to his own - I would never consider any megaship -they look like an apartment building on it's side.  Yes, Hal has deleted some amenities, but still love boarding one...

[St Pete Cruiser]

Thanks for sharing Redneck Bob.  Pre Carnival Holland America was pricey by todays standards.  I booked the old Noordam in 2003, an inside room, for $1395 for 14 days and thought I had a real bargain!  The travel agent told me, whenever you can get on HAL for $100 a day pp, grab it.  That N class Noordam's rear end shook badly and was being replaces in the fleet with the new S class ships were a dream come true for Holland America.  Carnival built those beautiful 55,000 ton ships with verandah rooms and deluxe verandah rooms, now Neptune Suites, and made them smaller than the Carnival ships so as not to compete with them.  

I would love for Holland America to build new replacement ships the  S class size (which is about what Viking Ocean ships are), but I don't want to pay the Viking prices.  So I'll enjoy the remaining S and R class for now and go with the bigger ships when the itinerary and prices are right.

[iancal]

We can.  Absolute best was an RCI Radiance 21 day FebéMarch OZ NZ cruise three years ago.  Balcony cabin, prepaid gratuities, and $200 OBC.  Booked two weeks prior to blast off at $85 USD pp.   

 

Second best were three Sept-Oct Celebrity Solstice class Med 10-14 day cruises, balcony cabins each  booked a 5-7 weeks out for just under  $100. pp.  Plus a  Westerdam Carib. verandah  booked for $75. at the last minute in mid Dec.

 

Each of those cruises offered more than what we would probably receive today in terms of service, food quality, entertainment, etc.

Edited December 6, 2019 by iancal

[HappyInVan]

6 minutes ago, BJzink said:

Each to his own - I would never consider any megaship -they look like an apartment building on it's side.  Yes, Hal has deleted some amenities, but still love boarding one...

 

It's acceptable to me only in Yacht Club class. These passengers have priority in everything. I'm told that a block of seats have been reserved for the theater by the concierge. And, you can ask the butler for snacks and drinks.

 

BTW, I would never be a customer of a company that's under probation for environmental crimes.

 

 

[iancal]

Does this include HAL's violations?

 

https://www.cruiselawnews.com/2019/04/articles/pollution/federal-judge-threatens-to-imprison-carnival-executives-for-continued-environmental-crimes/

[Homosassa]

3 hours ago, St Pete Cruiser said:

 

I would love for Holland America to build new replacement ships the  S class size (which is about what Viking Ocean ships are), but I don't want to pay the Viking prices.  So I'll enjoy the remaining S and R class for now and go with the bigger ships when the itinerary and prices are right.

Ah - but when you pay Viking's prices you get the cruise experience that used to be available on HAL thirty years ago.

 

And, after trying Viking last summer, it will be difficult to go back to the cheapen HAL cruise experience.

[leerathje]

16 minutes ago, Homosassa said:

Ah - but when you pay Viking's prices you get the cruise experience that used to be available on HAL thirty years ago.

 

And, after trying Viking last summer, it will be difficult to go back to the cheapen HAL cruise experience.

 

Unfortunately, can't afford Viking, so I guess I'm stuck with HAL. IMO, I'm perfectly fine with HAL.

[*Miss G*]

I wish I could get back the flight experience of 30 years ago but it’s not going to happen.  😜HAL is a top quality experience with excellent value.

[TAD2005]

8 hours ago, RedneckBob said:

Excluding costs for free airfare the Oceanview cabins started at $1,270 pp to $1,795 pp, 7 day cruise. This was the "Economy Fare" between 10/15/88 and 12/10/88. I guess we don't know how good we have it today!

Ran Redneck Bob's prices for an Oceanview cabin through the inflation calculator.  

The $1270 price in 1988 is equal to $2721 in today's US $

The $1795 price in 1988 is equal to $3846 in today's US$.

A 7 day Caribbean cruise today in an OV cabin on HAL is $494 for an OV and $854 for a suite.

Yes, overall quality has been reduced,  but how many of us could afford to plop down $2821 or $3846 these days for a 7 day cruise ?   Prices like that would kill the cruise industry, and would seriously reduce the number of ships available to us today.  The reduced inventory would drive prices even higher.   

So as Redneck Bob said "It ain't so bad these days" !!   

As a comparison, I flew from PHL to SFO in coach on TWA in 1969 for $375 RT.   50 years later, the cost for that same flight is about the same today. 

[RuthC]

56 minutes ago, Homosassa said:

Ah - but when you pay Viking's prices you get the cruise experience that used to be available on HAL thirty years ago.

I would happily try Viking Ocean, even at their higher prices, if only they were more disabled friendly. 
I love the idea of their smaller ships, and the HAL of long ago type experience. 

It is my understanding that someone who uses a scooter on cruises is not accommodated on Viking Ocean ships. Wheelchairs users are, as well as rollators, but not the heavy equipment. 

[RedneckBob]

10 minutes ago, TAD2005 said:

Ran Redneck Bob's prices for an Oceanview cabin through the inflation calculator.  

The $1270 price in 1988 is equal to $2721 in today's US $

The $1795 price in 1988 is equal to $3846 in today's US$.

A 7 day Caribbean cruise today in an OV cabin on HAL is $494 for an OV and $854 for a suite.

Yes, overall quality has been reduced,  but how many of us could afford to plop down $2821 or $3846 these days for a 7 day cruise ?   Prices like that would kill the cruise industry, and would seriously reduce the number of ships available to us today.  The reduced inventory would drive prices even higher.   

So as Redneck Bob said "It ain't so bad these days" !!   

As a comparison, I flew from PHL to SFO in coach on TWA in 1969 for $375 RT.   50 years later, the cost for that same flight is about the same today. 

Thanks for the analysis TAD2005. I was just about to run the numbers myself and you are spot on. In 1987 we sailed on the old Noordam, 7 day cruise in the Caribbean cruise, departing 12/10/87 for $1,100 pp. It was a high end Oceanview cabin. This December 11, 2019, a 7 day cruise on the Veendam, high end Oceanview is $750 pp. Now I know things have changed but not based on pricing. By the way nice to met you on South Pacific cruise last March.

[RedneckBob]

9 hours ago, rucrazy said:

fares may indeed may have fallen but so has amenities

But not that much. Being a frequent cruiser on HAL I have lots of extras that did not exist 30 years ago