SS Future Re-Open Plan: Timing, Testing Needs??!!

[A Tucson Guy]

I don't post very often but this thread and the most current posts are very eye opening. We are still booked for Thanksgiving 2021 Dubai to Mumbai but I really wonder where things will be by then. The thought of being stranded in a remote foreign country (maybe because of a faulty test result) and not being able to get home easily is tough to swallow. Granted lost money is important but not as important as being denied back on the ship and having to fend by ourselves to get back home is a lot more important than the lost $$$$$$$$$$. Thanks for all the great info on these posts and I will keep lurking!!

[alexandria]

Terry,

 

Appellate court decisions concerning enforceability of unilateral modification clauses in contracts have been varied.  As a general rule, those clauses are not enforceable unless the other party has notice of the proposed modification and assents to the proposed modification.  So I believe a passenger would have a strong case that a proposed modification by Silversea to which the passenger does not agree is void and that the terms of original contract apply.

 

But the issue then becomes the same issue I mentioned concerning Silversea's refusal to abide by the terms and conditions of the Cruise with Confidence policy in effect at the time of booking.  How do you enforce the contract?  As you noted, the contract as to US passengers provides that any action must be filed in US District Court in the Southern District of Florida.  Given that and the overall high expense of litigation, how many passengers will be willing to spend the time and money to litigate the issue?

 

But I suspect the more likely scenario is that Silversea does NOT modify the passage contract and the provisions providing for no refund, credit or compensation in the event of denied boarding or early disembarkation would apply.  And as noted, every cruise line has similar language in their cruise contract and in almost all cases (at least for the policies I have reviewed), travel insurance will not provide coverage for such an occurrence.  So unless the cruise industry (or individual lines) creates and funds a program to provide assistance and compensation, refund or credit for such passengers, all of the risks will be borne by the passenger and none by the cruise line.  At this point, considering what the cruise industry has reported about future bookings, I see it as being very unlikely that the cruise industry would take such steps but instead will just accept a certain amount of lost future business.   And for those passengers who accepted FCC in lieu of a cash refund, most have now passed the "point of no return" and they no longer have the ability to obtain a refund if they do not wish to incur such risks.

 

Unfortunately, the "Cruise with Confidence" marketing has hidden and obscured the significant financial risks involved for such Silversea passengers, who in most cases have spent five figures (or more) on their future cruise booking(s).

Edited September 29, 2020 by alexandria

[TLCOhio]

14 minutes ago, alexandria said:

Terry, Appellate court decisions concerning enforceability of unilateral modification clauses in contracts have been varied.  As a general rule, those clauses are not enforceable unless the other party has notice of the proposed modification and assents to the proposed modification.  So I believe a passenger would have a strong case that a proposed modification by Silversea to which the passenger does not agree is void and that the terms of original contract apply.

Unfortunately, the "Cruise with Confidence" marketing has hidden and obscured the significant financial risks involved for such Silversea passengers, who in most cases have spent five figures (or more) on their future cruise booking(s).

 

Appreciate these great legal details, comments and follow-up from super savvy alexandria.  You mentioned, wisely, the "Cruise with Confidence" marketing.  BUT, how legally-enforceable would be such "marketing/sales" puffery by Silversea??  My guess in a Federal courtroom, that such selling "SPIN"  on a website would not hold up on behalf of the customer.  It will be the contract that dictates the limits as to your protections and any potential "rights"!!  

 

Most cruise lines have significant "small print" and pointed disclaimers built into their contracts.  That would make the sales "talk" not holding up fully to benefit the customer if it went to a law suit. Correct to point out that if you would be losing $10-20K in cruise payments, it would NOT always be "cost-effective" to spend three or four times that amount of your upfront cash to hire experienced lawyers to do such legal battle in Miami under the highly-restrictive Federal court rules for these types of case and claims.   

 

From the San Francisco Chronicle and the AP newswire early this afternoon, they had this headline: “Greece: Cruise ship cleared to go after COVID scare” with these highlights: “Health inspectors in Greece said Tuesday that an emergency docking order for a cruise ship near Athens can now be lifted after crew members suspected of having been infected with COVID-19 tested negative. The Maltese-flagged Mein Schiff 6, carrying more than 1,500 people, was rerouted from a Greek island cruise and ordered to sail to the port of Piraeus after sample testing of the crew indicated that 12 staff were positive for coronavirus but asymptomatic. Gkikas Magiorkinis, a member of the government's pandemic expert committee, said that all 12 crew members tested negative Tuesday, using rapid and confirmatory tests, along with 24 other people they had come into contact with. Officials at the Merchant Marine Ministry said the cruise ship would remain in Piraeus, near the Greek capital, overnight. The ship was expected to continue its journey Wednesday after port authorities had received formal notification of the health inspection.”

 

Ah, that old and challenging question of testing!!  Not all forms and types of testing are perfect and 100% accurate.  Testing is clearly important, but as has been documented previously, there can be variations in results and some lack of perfection depending on the techniques, applications, processing, etc., etc.  Not simple or easy??!!

 

Full story at:

https://www.sfgate.com/news/article/Greece-Cruise-halted-for-COVID-tests-latest-are-15605477.php

 

THANKS!  Enjoy!  Terry in Ohio

 

Venice: Loving It & Why??!!  Is one of your future desires or past favorites? See these many visual samples for its great history and architecture.  This posting is now at 88,754 views.

http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=1278226

[Bucephalus53]

I'd prefer the Cruise route for my first time in an area, but....it now makes more sense to just fly into London for example, rent a car and set up in B&B's around Great Britain for a couple weeks. It is likely less expensive...and definitely less risky of an investment. 

[alexandria]

8 minutes ago, TLCOhio said:

 

Appreciate these great legal details, comments and follow-up from super savvy alexandria.  You mentioned, wisely, the "Cruise with Confidence" marketing.  BUT, how legally-enforceable would be such "marketing/sales" puffery by Silversea??  My guess in a Federal courtroom, that such selling "SPIN"  on a website would not hold up on behalf of the customer.  It will be the contract that dictates the limits as to your protections and any potential "rights"!! 

 

Good question.  Yes, some marketing is considered "mere puffery" when the language is subjective and which no reasonable person would take literally.  The Cruise with Confidence policy, and the marketing of such, is not mere puffery.  And in the case of the Cruise with Confidence policy (particularly the April 8 version) it certainly appears (and I believe a strong legal argument can be made) that such policy was not merely marketing but a modification of the applicable provisions of the cruise contract.  Note the announcement reads "Our New Cancellation Policy" and then in detail revises and amends the cancellation provisions in the cruise contract. 

 

Certainly they "marketed" and "promoted" this modification in order to induce customers to book, but I believe the language of the policy conveys an actual modification to the cancellation provisions of the contract.  Otherwise, if it was not intended to replace and modify the existing terms of the contract, then you may be talking about wire, mail and computer fraud (considering the various methods Silversea used to make such representations) which is serious criminal conduct.  I don't claim such to be the case.

[UKCruiseJeff]

26 minutes ago, alexandria said:

 

Good question.  Yes, some marketing is considered "mere puffery" when the language is subjective and which no reasonable person would take literally.  The Cruise with Confidence policy, and the marketing of such, is not mere puffery.  And in the case of the Cruise with Confidence policy (particularly the April 8 version) it certainly appears (and I believe a strong legal argument can be made) that such policy was not merely marketing but a modification of the applicable provisions of the cruise contract.  Note the announcement reads "Our New Cancellation Policy" and then in detail revises and amends the cancellation provisions in the cruise contract. 

 

Certainly they "marketed" and "promoted" this modification in order to induce customers to book, but I believe the language of the policy conveys an actual modification to the cancellation provisions of the contract.  Otherwise, if it was not intended to replace and modify the existing terms of the contract, then you may be talking about wire, mail and computer fraud (considering the various methods Silversea used to make such representations) which is serious criminal conduct.  I don't claim such to be the case.

 

Hi,

 

My understanding is that in very simple terms the main difference between UK./EU and US consumer law is that if and when an American consumer agrees to buy a service or product that has a catchall small-print clause that in simple terms states that when the customer proceeds with purchase he agrees that the company can make any change to the contract it wishes and that the customer is bound by those changes because of that clause.  In the UK/EU such a term is unenforceable and consumers can ignore it. 

 

My understanding therefore of the consequence of that clause is that in the case of a cruise company they can make almost any changes they wish and have no obligation to refund or compesate.  They can do as they wish almost wihout limit. So they could change the embarkation and end ports with all stops in between if they wish.  They can change the length of the cruise.  They can change the dates of the cruise.  My understanding is that although such decisions may have reputational consequences - a US customer has little recourse if such a clause in is in the small print.  In the UK/EU the customer would be entitled to a refund and compensation where appropriate.  This impression has been rather reinforced by US consumer lawyers I have discussed this with over the years.

 

Is that impression in your view wrong?

 

Jeff

[alexandria]

13 minutes ago, UKCruiseJeff said:

 

Hi,

 

My understanding is that in very simple terms the main difference between UK./EU and US consumer law is that if and when an American consumer agrees to buy a service or product that has a catchall small-print clause that in simple terms states that when the customer proceeds with purchase he agrees that the company can make any change to the contract it wishes and that the customer is bound by those changes because of that clause.  In the UK/EU such a term is unenforceable and consumers can ignore it. 

 

My understanding therefore of the consequence of that clause is that in the case of a cruise company they can make almost any changes they wish and have no obligation to refund or compesate.  They can do as they wish almost wihout limit. So they could change the embarkation and end ports with all stops in between if they wish.  They can change the length of the cruise.  They can change the dates of the cruise.  My understanding is that although such decisions may have reputational consequences - a US customer has little recourse if such a clause in is in the small print.  In the UK/EU the customer would be entitled to a refund and compensation where appropriate.  This impression has been rather reinforced by US consumer lawyers I have discussed this with over the years.

 

Is that impression in your view wrong?

 

Jeff

 

Again, only speaking as to general principles of US law, a fine print clause that allows a company to unilaterally make any changes they wish to the contract is NOT generally enforceable (see my discussion a few posts above). 

 

However, as to some of the points in your second paragraph concerning changes to ports of call, dates or the cruise and such, there is an already existing provision of the US contract that addresses those issues (pages 13-14 of the contract I attached a few posts above).  So no contract modification would be necessary for the changes you mentioned in your second paragraph.

[alexandria]

Terry,

 

To follow up my post on the Cruise with Confidence policy, I left out what is probably the best indication that the policy is in fact an amendment to the contract.  That being the language used in their media releases and on their website which references the Cruise with Confidence policy. 

 

The operative language used by Silversea being:

 

"Read Silversea’s temporary amendment to its cancellation policy:
https://www.silversea.com/temporary-amendment-to-cancellation-policy.html"

 

So Silversea itself calls it an "amendment to its cancellation policy" (their cancellation policy appears in the contracts) and their labeling of the policy as noted in the link "temporary amendment to cancellation policy."  So it is clearly....an amendment.  In the courtroom, I would refer to that as "the smoking gun."  😉

[UKCruiseJeff]

4 minutes ago, alexandria said:

 

Again, only speaking as to general principles of US law, a fine print clause that allows a company to unilaterally make any changes they wish to the contract is NOT generally enforceable (see my discussion a few posts above). 

 

However, as to some of the points in your second paragraph concerning changes to ports of call, dates or the cruise and such, there is an already existing provision of the US contract that addresses those issues (pages 13-14 of the contract I attached a few posts above).  So no contract modification would be necessary for the changes you mentioned in your second paragraph.

 

Hi,

 

Your points in the second paragraph if I understand you correctly rather confirms my exact point. 

 

The booking form is considered in the UK/EU to be an essential and unvariable component of the contract and it will state the dates of the cruise and ports to be visited.  In the UK/EU this cannot be changed without the consent of the customer.  In the US it can be changed because the fine print in the general terms permits the company to make those changes without the consent of the customer.  In the UK/EU we have those exact same terms but they can be ignored because in the UK/EU the customer has the right to be consulted and cancel with a full refund if they choose.

 

This is correct isn't it?

 

Jeff

[alexandria]

3 minutes ago, UKCruiseJeff said:

 

Hi,

 

Your points in the second paragraph if I understand you correctly rather confirms my exact point. 

 

The booking form is considered in the UK/EU to be an essential and unvariable component of the contract and it will state the dates of the cruise and ports to be visited.  In the UK/EU this cannot be changed without the consent of the customer.  In the US it can be changed because the fine print in the general terms permits the company to make those changes without the consent of the customer.  In the UK/EU we have those exact same terms but they can be ignored because in the UK/EU the customer has the right to be consulted and cancel with a full refund if they choose.

 

This is correct isn't it?

 

Jeff

 

Sorry, but as much as I'd love to wear a powdered wig and barrister's bands, I know absolutely nothing about laws in the UK.

[UKCruiseJeff]

6 minutes ago, alexandria said:

 

Sorry, but as much as I'd love to wear a powdered wig and barrister's bands, I know absolutely nothing about laws in the UK.

 

>.>In the US it can be changed because the fine print in the general terms permits the company to make those changes without the consent of the customer.<,<

 

Correct?

 

Jeff

Edited September 29, 2020 by UKCruiseJeff

[TLCOhio]

51 minutes ago, alexandria said:

Yes, some marketing is considered "mere puffery" when the language is subjective and which no reasonable person would take literally.  The Cruise with Confidence policy, and the marketing of such, is not mere puffery.  Certainly they "marketed" and "promoted" this modification in order to induce customers to book, but I believe the language of the policy conveys an actual modification to the cancellation provisions of the contract.  Otherwise, if it was not intended to replace and modify the existing terms of the contract, then you may be talking about wire, mail and computer fraud (considering the various methods Silversea used to make such representations) which is serious criminal conduct. 

 

Super comments and follow-ups from both alexandria and UK Jeff.  Excellent added background and insights.  Jeff makes a great point for the major differences with U.S. versus UK/EU consumer laws.   Totally different "legal worlds" on each of the two distant sides of the wide, wide Atlantic Ocean.  

 

From looking closely this afternoon through the "Cruise with Confidence" details and specifics on their Silversea website, i noticed this key section: "Silversea reserves the right to correct any errors, inaccuracies or omissions at any time without prior notice or liability.  Offer can be withdrawn without notice."  So if this "offer" and/or terms can be withdrawn or corrected at any point in time before you board, then that seems to give a high degree of "FLEXIBILITY" to Silversea to modify and adjust as to what will be in their "interests".  Maybe that could be negative for the U. S. consumer?  Maybe not?  Many if's and uncertainty during these times of unchartered water sailings!!! 

 

Clearly, it seems that if you find out you have a health "challenge" a month or two weeks before your cruise, you could cancel and get some future credit, etc.  BUT, if you find a problem a day or two prior to boarding, then you could be out of luck.  Right?  If while sailing on the second day, your temperature goes up and you might test positive for maybe having Covid through their rough sort of a test, then what?  At whose expense?  And which test results will prove most accurate and be totally binding in any legal sense affecting refunds? 

 

THANKS!  Enjoy!  Terry in Ohio

 

PS: I am sure that our Georgia friend would look great and be wonderful "wearing a powdered wig and barrister's bands."

 

Amazon River-Caribbean 2015 adventure live/blog starting in Barbados. Many visuals from this amazing river and Caribbean Islands (Dutch ABC's, St. Barts, Dominica, Grenada, San Juan, etc.).  Now at 67,458 views:

www.boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=2157696

[alexandria]

7 minutes ago, TLCOhio said:

...

From looking closely this afternoon through the "Cruise with Confidence" details and specifics on their Silversea website, i noticed this key section: "Silversea reserves the right to correct any errors, inaccuracies or omissions at any time without prior notice or liability.  Offer can be withdrawn without notice."  So if this "offer" and/or terms can be withdrawn or corrected at any point in time before you board, then that seems to give a high degree of "FLEXIBILITY" to Silversea to modify and adjust as to what will be in their "interests".  Maybe that could be negative for the U. S. consumer?  Maybe not?  Many if's and uncertainty during these times of unchartered water sailings!!! 

...

THANKS!  Enjoy!  Terry in Ohio

 

PS: I am sure that our Georgia friend would look great and be wonderful "wearing a powdered wig and barrister's bands."

 

Amazon River-Caribbean 2015 adventure live/blog starting in Barbados. Many visuals from this amazing river and Caribbean Islands (Dutch ABC's, St. Barts, Dominica, Grenada, San Juan, etc.).  Now at 67,458 views:

www.boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=2157696

 

Ah, but that is a later revision of the Cruise with Confidence policy.  Take a look at the April 8, 2020 version (attached) that applied to all bookings between April 8 and May 15, 2020.  It wasn't until May 15, 2020 that Silversea first added language permitting corrections of errors, inaccuracies or omissions and permitting Silversea to withdraw the offer.   So for those who booked from April 8-May 15, 2020, the attached April 8 amendment applied. 

 

Speaking of powdered wigs and barrister's bands, a favorite memory of cruising occurred about fifteen or twenty years ago when we took our young kids on a five day cruise to the Bahamas, Key West, etc.  In Nassau we decided to take a walking tour and I went into the courthouse there.  It was a run-down small courthouse very similar to some of the much older courthouses that were still in use in parts of rural Georgia.  I peeked into a courtroom and saw that they were in recess.  A fellow wearing a powdered wig, barrister's bands and a splendid top coat spotted me and asked "Are you a practitioner?"  I introduced myself and gave him my business card (at the time I was a District Attorney).  He introduced himself and handed me a business card.  He was the Attorney General of the Bahamas!  We were able to chat for about twenty minutes, get acquainted and learn about what each other did in their practice of law before I slipped out so he could focus back on his court cases.  It was a great once in a lifetime opportunity...that alone was worth the trip!

Silversea Cruise with Confidence Amendment to Cancellation Policy 20200408.pdf

[alexandria]

34 minutes ago, UKCruiseJeff said:

 

>.>In the US it can be changed because the fine print in the general terms permits the company to make those changes without the consent of the customer.<,<

 

Correct?

 

Jeff

 

Yes, paragraph 14 of the US passage contract entitled ITINERARY/CHANGES/SUBSTITUTION OF VESSELS/SAFETY AND SECURITY specifically permits Silversea to make changes to ports of call, itinerary and even dates of embarkation and disembarkation. 

[TLCOhio]

3 minutes ago, alexandria said:

a later revision of the Cruise with Confidence policy.  Take a look at the April 8, 2020 version that applied to all bookings between April 8 and May 15, 2020.

Speaking of powdered wigs and barrister's bands, a favorite memory of cruising occurred about fifteen or twenty years ago.  In Nassau we decided to take a walking tour and I went into the courthouse there.  A fellow wearing a powdered wig, barrister's bands and a splendid top coat spotted me and asked "Are you a practitioner?"  I introduced myself and gave him my business card (at the time I was a District Attorney).  He introduced himself and handed me a business card.  He was the Attorney General of the Bahamas!  We were able to chat for about twenty minutes, get acquainted and learn about what each other did in their practice of law.  It was a great once in a lifetime opportunity...that alone was worth the trip!

 

Love that story of you and the AG of the Bahamas.  Fun and fascinating!!  That's part of the excitement of travel.  You can meet and discover interesting people, gain unique local connections, experience varied situations, etc.  

 

Appreciate the added background for the sales terms between April 8 and May 15, 2020.  My guess is that the Silversea and/or Royal Caribbean "legal eagles" have added some added "details" somewhere in the contract fine print to cover that timing and those changes.  In general, I believe that Silversea and many of the "better" cruise lines value their images and seek good "PR".  Hopefully, they will try to do the "right thing".  But, if conditions drag on longer and get really "bad". they will work hard to "cover their butts" and save the future for some form of business existence in the future.  That's why asking key questions, now, and understanding the "legal details" would be vital for every consumer/traveler.  

 

THANKS!  Enjoy!  Terry in Ohio

 

AFRICA?!!?: Fun, interesting visuals, plus travel details from this early 2016 live/blog. At 50,161 views. Featuring Cape Town, South Africa’s coast, Mozambique, Victoria Falls/Zambia and Botswana's famed Okavango Delta.

www.boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=2310337

[Daveywavey70]

7 hours ago, les37b said:

 

 

Many thanks for letting me know. Happens every now and then. It is allowed and disputes can be raised. Takes 30 days to come back though unfortunately. I really should save myself all the hassle and simply replace the soundtracks and be done with it... (Makes note to put some time aside!) I think there was about 6 or 7 that weren't visible. I can still see them all, which kinda makes it less obvious.

 

Email address you can use if ever you need to contact is silversea@mail.co.uk    

 

I Get that frequently too Les. It’s so annoying. Most are ok if you agree to the “cannot be monetised” part but once  spent 3 days uploading a video only for it to be rejected completely because it picked up one song that was playing in the background in a restaurant. Can be so infuriating. 
 

[TLCOhio]

3 hours ago, Bucephalus53 said:

I'd prefer the Cruise route for my first time in an area, but....it now makes more sense to just fly into London for example, rent a car and set up in B&B's around Great Britain for a couple weeks. It is likely less expensive...and definitely less risky of an investment. 

 

Very good point and post by our "neighbor" in Ohio as to the options for in and around the UK.  There are pro/con factors in "normal times" with a cruise, including only need to unpack once.  BUT, now things are little different.  Right?

 

For us, we have visited parts of London and/or the UK in 1977, 1987, 1988, 2000, 2006 and 2010.  We would like to go back and explore more, especially in an "in-depth" manner that allow more evening adventures/activities and exploring more extensively than what a cruise would allow during brief port stops.  Ideally, we would like to have three weeks and stay/live "like a local" in only four or so key areas around in the UK.  Then from "bases", we would do a number of "day-trips".  Sound like a good plan? 

 

THANKS!  Enjoy!  Terry in Ohio

 

P.S.:  Refresh my foggy memory.  Where is Bucephalus53 located in our Ohio?

 

Kotor/Montenegro:  Exciting visual samples, tips, details, etc., for this scenic, historic location. Over 47,882 views.

http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=1439193

[Bucephalus53]

I'm in the old Steel belt of NE Ohio TLC.

 

As a history nerd...I need to see all the obligatory "touristy" stuff on the first trip like I did in Paris and Rome.

My SS Mediterrean Cruise was a great introduction to great cities like Rome, Monte Carlo and Barcelona. I was hoping to do the same with the London to London Great Britain trip last May, 

Then on the next trip to each location, we really want to do what you are talking about and dive in with more depth to other parts of the country like Tuscany...and (NERD ALERT) battlefields of the second Punic War for example in Italy.

Lord willing, I figure we are still young enough to do both while I am still healthy. As we all know, tomorrow is not guaranteed. We have so many things left to experience on our list. 

Edited September 29, 2020 by Bucephalus53

[Tothesunset]

9 hours ago, TLCOhio said:

Ideally, we would like to have three weeks and stay/live "like a local" in only four or so key areas around in the UK.  Then from "bases", we would do a number of "day-trips".  Sound like a good plan? 

 

Sounds like an excellent plan. There's a lot of the UK that doesn't feature on the international traveller's checklist. 

 

Might I make some suggestions (assuming you would have a hire car)? 

 

Fly in to Manchester and head North to Carlisle. That's a great base for the Lake District and Scottish Borders. 

 

Move East and stay in North Yorkshire - I suggest not staying in York - maybe Northallerton or Thirsk to explore the Yorkshire Dales and North Yorkshire Moors. 

 

Next stop Buxton in the Derbyshire Peak District to explore this area and visit the revitalised city of Sheffield. 

 

Finally why not visit the primitive beauty of North Wales - I think our friend Daveywavey70 might be able to recommend a base there (😏) and you are close to Manchester for the return flight. 

 

Just a thought but includes interesting scenery, typically British towns and villages and keeps you away from the tourist clichés and disappointments of London and the South East! 

 

 

Edited September 30, 2020 by Tothesunset

[worldtraveller99]

Deepest Lincolnshire is lovely too Tothesunset but I take issue that the whole of southern England is disappointing! We have just come back from a lovely week in Keswick (Lake District) and York - what is wrong with York?

 

If we cannot travel abroad in the near future I am planning a week next spring in the Somerset Levels and Gloucestershire. 

[Tothesunset]

35 minutes ago, worldtraveller99 said:

Deepest Lincolnshire is lovely too Tothesunset but I take issue that the whole of southern England is disappointing! We have just come back from a lovely week in Keswick (Lake District) and York - what is wrong with York?

 

Nothing wrong with York - quite the opposite but there are more "local" places that Terry might like if he wants to experience living like the locals. 

 

I agree about Lincolnshire if we include West Norfolk and North Cambridgeshire. Peterborough Cathedral us one of the finest of its kind in the land yet gets almost no international visitors, the Fens are eerily atmospheric and Lincoln is a bit like York but with steep streets. And let's not forget the little gem that is Stamford and the neighbouring Burghley House. 

 

Again, living like a local in the SE? Yes, but why go through the masses when the British Isles has such a variety of splendid scenery and interesting towns and villages that are far from the clichéd picture of Britain. 

 

I'm sure all areas have their charms but why not explore the areas that the international tourist generally never reaches? 

[worldtraveller99]

It depends on which local you want to live like! Walking on wild moors is not what this local would choose to do (though my husband loves it!). So I like "tourist attractions", which is why I love Florida, and as a child going with my Dad to Southend!

[Dermotsgirl]

2 minutes ago, worldtraveller99 said:

It depends on which local you want to live like! Walking on wild moors is not what this local would choose to do (though my husband loves it!). So I like "tourist attractions", which is why I love Florida, and as a child going with my Dad to Southend!

Day trips to the seaside are indeed living like a local. Trips to Southend featured heavily in my Essex childhood. Now that I live in Kent, we have regular day outings for coastal walking all along the north Kent coast, anywhere from Whitstable round to Sandwich. 

[brimary]

With regard to North Yorkshire use York as a stepping stone to the wonderful North East  coastal resorts of Scarborough,Whitby and Filey to enhance the visit with scenic beauty not available in the busy city of York.

[alexandria]

19 hours ago, TLCOhio said:

...In general, I believe that Silversea and many of the "better" cruise lines value their images and seek good "PR".  Hopefully, they will try to do the "right thing".  But, if conditions drag on longer and get really "bad". they will work hard to "cover their butts" and save the future for some form of business existence in the future.  That's why asking key questions, now, and understanding the "legal details" would be vital for every consumer/traveler.  

...

THANKS!  Enjoy!  Terry in Ohio

 

 

Based upon the recommendations I received from others about Silversea, I too thought they would "do the right thing."  After they announced the reduction of FCC to "up to 110%" for all bookings, including those made during the period covered by the April 8 amendment when the 125% FCC terms were clear, unambiguous and without limitation or restriction, an appeal was made to Silversea to honor those provisions for affected passengers whose cruises were cancelled by Silversea the very next day.  The response by Silversea senior management was curt and abrupt and simply indicated that they changed the terms on September 15, 2020, it was now "up to 110% FCC" and "thank you for your understanding." 

 

Two of our friends who have enjoyed Silversea cruising often over the years, and who chose not to cancel two existing bookings based upon the 125% FCC Cruise with Confidence policy, were among those affected by this issue when one of their cruises was also canceled in mid-September.  They recently called and apologized to us for recommending Silversea and shared their opinion that the Silversea they are now seeing does not appear to resemble in any way the Silversea they have loyally supported over the years.  They are so frustrated by what they view as a betrayal of their most loyal clients (those who were actually willing to invest in Silversea cruise bookings during the COVID crisis, rather that keeping their money on the sidelines), that they demanded a cash refund for the first booking, cancelled their second booking and have said that they don't intend to sail Silversea again.

 

I think it speaks volumes about the "new" Silversea that not only are they now refusing to honor a written commitment made to passengers in order to induce them to book a future cruise (or prevent them from cancelling an existing booking), but that they have also chosen to treat in this manner people who were actually willing to give Silversea thousands of dollars in the midst of this uncertainty and at a time when the US stock market and other parts of the economy were suffering.  It strikes me that those people who were willing to go out on a limb to support Silversea in "their time of need" would be the last customers that Silversea should alienate and betray.

 

I know I don't intend to consider Silversea again.  But I hope that by sharing my experience and knowledge with others and providing tools for them to research issues for themselves, fellow cruise enthusiasts can be well-informed in order to make the best decisions possible about their future travel plans.

Edited September 30, 2020 by alexandria
Grammar.