River cruise equivalent to Azamara

[MNgardens]

In 2018 five family members and I went on an Azamara trip together and had a great time; it was not just the cruise but in terms of our dynamic. Thinking ahead to 2022 there has been interest expressed in a river cruise in Germany. (I am pushing for a Greek islands cruise.)

 

Thanks to excitedofharpenden posting the youtube Azamara video yesterday, I ended up going down the youtube rabbit hole looking at travel videos and river cruise video reviews. One company that caught my eye was Scenic. This was due to the fact that they have an option for gps aided self guided walks.  This would make it possible to stop and start, get distracted by a street performer, have a pastry, etc and not be part of a larger group. I can't see myself doing group tours every day for 1-2 weeks.

 

So- opinions please: If Azamara were a river cruise line, which one would it be?

 

Thanks to you all.

[uktog]

For us it has to be Ama, we found them really enjoyable and although there was the option of group walks every day the groups were very small, allocated by walking abilities, all with voice box guides so even if you stayed in the group you could wander quite far and take photos before rejoining them and you could leave these walks for good any time you wanted.  They did not give GPD but they gave maps.  There were also a range of biking activities as alternatives.  

 

The Ama boats were of a different "draft" to most of the others and so in 2018 when the rivers were so low, Ama was the only one sailing when we did the Danube everyone else was doing half their cruise staying on one boat with daily bus tours then being driven to a new boat and repeating driving tours around for the rest.  

[Riocca]

We’ve only done one river cruise, the Danube on Viking in December 2019, not realising it would be our last cruise for a long time!

One thing that we hadn’t realised, probably due to lack of research, was that most days you either had to take the ships tour or stay onboard as the ship moved location during the day. As ones who prefer doing our own thing not being fans of ships tours it was limiting.

As uktog says river levels can cause problems we were lucky as we were told we would be changing ship mid cruise but the river level rose overnight and we didn’t have to.

[acwmom]

We have cruised on Avalon once and Uniworld four times. Most of the river cruise lines will include at least once excursion at each stop. Some offer choices, some offer a morning and afternoon one, on some lines they are all included in the price, on others there is a fee. We have done a mix. The QuietVox system does reach quite far, and I am one who wanders and takes photos. Most walking tours only last a couple of hours, so there is time to "do your own thing."  If you want a river cruise without included excursions, look at Amadeus or Teeming.

Unlike ocean cruises, river cruise itineraries can change quickly, depending on water levels, lock schedules, etc, which makes it more difficult to schedule independent excursions. 

I recommend heading over to the river cruising forum, read the stickies, and ask questions. 

Knowing how companies are handling refunds/FCC etc with regard to low water, Covid, etc is also important.

I have yet to sail on Azamara (2020 and 2021 canceled, 2022 pending) 

Comparing Uniworld to Avalon, we much prefer Uniworld. The level of service and attention to detail was much higher. 

Robin

[royallondon]

6 minutes ago, Riocca said:

We’ve only done one river cruise, the Danube on Viking in December 2019, not realising it would be our last cruise for a long time!

One thing that we hadn’t realised, probably due to lack of research, was that most days you either had to take the ships tour or stay onboard as the ship moved location during the day. As ones who prefer doing our own thing not being fans of ships tours it was limiting.

As uktog says river levels can cause problems we were lucky as we were told we would be changing ship mid cruise but the river level rose overnight and we didn’t have to.

Similar feedback Riocca.  Actually, could have been the same cruise!  Viking, Danube, 8 December 2019.

Really enjoyed it (and have another booked for 2022) but more structured then we were expecting.  Would ideally have liked more “self time” to explore and take in the coffee and cake venues!

However, the food, service, ports of call and ship ambiance made for a really enjoyable first experience.  

 

So, if Azamara was a river cruise ship would it be Viking?  Based on our very limited experience, not quite.

[Riocca]

45 minutes ago, royallondon said:

Similar feedback Riocca.  Actually, could have been the same cruise!  Viking, Danube, 8 December 2019.

Really enjoyed it (and have another booked for 2022) but more structured then we were expecting.  Would ideally have liked more “self time” to explore and take in the coffee and cake venues!

However, the food, service, ports of call and ship ambiance made for a really enjoyable first experience.  

 

So, if Azamara was a river cruise ship would it be Viking?  Based on our very limited experience, not quite.

We were on Viking Gullveig on the 7th December, was super to be Viking Egil but they swapped the ships the previous cruise due to the water level.

Enjoyed the cruise other than KLM managed to lose my suitcase and Viking were less than helpful in getting it back, especially considering the flights were included and arranged by Viking.

[TeaBag]

Another vote here for AMA.  We cruised from Budapest to Amsterdam and it was fantastic.  AMA also has bicycles and when there are two ports relatively close, people can ride the bikes from one port to the next, picking up the ship several hours later.  When we sailed the Rhone river past the Lorelei rock, the band played the Lorelei song and it was ethereal.  We didn't do many organized tours with them, preferring to potter about on our own.  I would choose AMA again in a heartbeat but then, it's the only river cruise we have done.  Scenic sends out nice brochures.  You can order on-line. 

I know you'll have a wonderful cruise no matter who you choose.  River cruises are so different to ocean cruises and very special.

[Host Jazzbeau]

I created a series of threads which are 'pinned' at the top of the River Cruising forum to bring all the Cruise Critic resources together.  One that is particularly relevant to this question is:

 

[There was an even better article that compared each River Cruise line to an ocean cruise line and a hotel chain, but the link to that went dead.  I had posted it here as a PDF, but was told by Cruise Critic that it is obsolete and should be removed.]

[nordski]

47 minutes ago, TeaBag said:

 

I know you'll have a wonderful cruise no matter who you choose.  River cruises are so different to ocean cruises and very special.

I think this point is really important.

 

One’s expectations have to adjusted in terms of facilities, dining options, entertainment, even the demographics of your fellow cruisers.

 

If you like the “more inclusive” feature of Azamara, then you might consider Tauck or Scenic. Of course, they are at the upper end of the fare charged.

 

In general Uniworld and AMA are considered to be on the tier just below the above. 
 

There are a number of articles on Cruise Critic comparing the various lines.

 

I’m certain HostJazzbeau has thoughts to share as he hosts the River Cruise forum.

 

In fact, I see he has done so just as I am typing this.

Edited February 16, 2021 by nordski

[amyr]

I think you'll find that river cruise lines are more similar to each other than to a corresponding ocean line.  We love Viking Ocean, but we've found that on the rivers, where they're king, we feel like they put too many people on the ship and the cabins are smaller for more money.  YMMV.

 

We've taken AMA, Uniworld, and Avalon, and we keep going back to Avalon because their cabins are quite a bit larger (that matters to us but not most people) and because we travel with solo travelers.  Avalon regularly saves five cabins on each cruise (in any category) with no single supplement, and often opens up remaining cabins with no supplement closer to sailing time, though you can't count on that.  There are drawbacks, they only include wine and beer with meals, but that's fine with us. 

I think I would first pick a river and then deep dive the itineraries and additional excursions, etc.  Figure out what matters to your group, and then select four or five companies that were mentioned here and work up a spreadsheet.  I always pay attention to what hotels are used (location) and if they're included in the price or priced out as an add on, how they transport to the ship on itineraries where the embarking/disembarking cities aren't close (like Prague as an extension on the Budapest to Prague itineraries) and things like that.  Since we're all locked down, you, like I, probably have the time  🙂

[MNgardens]

I really appreciate all the advice and resources! I am mid dive into the AMA site. Next up are the resources Host Jazzbeau has provided and then on to Avalon.

[cruiservirginia]

Took an European river cruise with Scenic several years ago.  Definitely think their offering is comparable to Scenic.  

[Mrs Miggins]

Another vote for Scenic.  Their special evening activities are similar to the Azamazing evening but on a more intimate level.  Our Bordeaux cruise was splendid.  Also did the Rhine but that did have some water level disruption however Scenic offered cash back based on their formula as well as a discounted second cruise.  

[wjfan417]

We’ve taken 4 AMA cruises. The friendliness of the officers and crew reminds me of Azamara.  Other than the Mekong cruise, the ones we’ve taken have always been the wine cruises with hosts that were winery owners-a lot of extra tastings and a dinner paired with those wines included. We took one Uniworld cruise but the captain barely spoke English so didn’t spend much time interacting with the passengers.

[bobmcm]

AMA is the river cruise equivalent of Azamara.  We have our 4th AMA cruise coming up... to Egypt in November and several more Azamara booked! 

[Host Jazzbeau]

Our first river cruise was on AMA, based on lots of research but strongly on the recommendation of our Travel Agent – who continues to rate AMA as number one.  And for a long time I didn't even look very hard at the river cruise lines that are considered to be 'above' AMA (Scenic, Tauck and Uniworld) because they are all-inclusive and it seemed like a waste to pay for alcohol we wouldn't drink (wine and beer at meals is fine by me, and DW doesn't drink at all).  We have done three cruises with AMA and loved them all.

 

But recently I have found that those 'better' lines aren't necessarily more expensive than AMA, once you calculate the things that AMA charges extra for (taxes and fees, gratuities, all-inclusive alcohol, and a few other minor things).  So next spring we will be doing a back-to-back comparison of AMA and Scenic (Tulip Time followed by Normandy and Gems of the Seine).  Our AMA cruise in a BA cabin of 235sf costs $700 per person per night [with taxes and fees but not gratuities, bar bill, or transfers]; Scenic, in a PD of 225sf would cost $709 pppn – and we have just upgraded to an R category Royal Balcony Suite of 305sf and reduced the cost (by paying early) to only $658 pppn [both including all extras].  So we will get more room, more extras, and pay less!

 

Obviously at this point I can't personally compare the quality of a Scenic river cruise to AMA, but I haven't seen any reviews that would suggest the food, included wine and liquor, service, or tours are not first-class.  And to loop back to the question of comparison to Azamara:  Scenic includes unique shore events with concerts and special meals that sound very much like the Azamazing Evenings we enjoy so much on Azamara.  So I'm going out on a limb to suggest that the PDF I posted above is wrong about Scenic:  I wouldn't compare it to Celebrity, but rather to Celebrity's upscale ex-sibling Azamara.

 

[One caveat:  my TA wouldn't let me take the Scenic early payment discount unless I was buying travel insurance with 'vendor default' coverage.  Thankfully both AMA and Scenic are on the Allianz Covered Supplier List.]

[travelberlin]

From all river cruises I have taken, I have found the ones offered by Belmond the best. I have taken twice a river cruise with them on the Road to Mandalay in Myanmar. I am planning on taking a cruise on a barge with them on French rivers. They are pricey but excellent.

I have taken Avalon on a river cruise on the Mekong and I found it very nice. Not the quality of Belmond, but good cabins and friendly service.The river cruises in Asia include excursions and imho for a solo traveler this is the best in Asia. 

In Europe, I have taken river cruises with Arosa (Danube, Rhone and Saone). This company is also nice, not too pricey, and is mostly oriented to Germans. I do not remember if also English could be used on board. In all European river cruises, it was possible to borrow a bicycle and just drive on your own or take your own excursions. All ships stop in the middle of the towns so it is very easy to do do things on your own. 
Ivi

 

[nordski]

1 hour ago, travelberlin said:

All ships stop in the middle of the towns so it is very easy to do do things on your own. 

Ivi

 

Generally this is true, but on occasion we have docked a fair distance away from the attractions in a particular town/city. Vienna and Amsterdam immediately come to mind, but there have been others. The desk officers on board the ship can easily arrange for a taxi if needed. Ship tours may use a bus.

 

River Cruising has exploded in popularity and that means docking space is often at a premium, particularly for the larger ships owned by Viking and Scenic.

 

As a result, you may end up tied to another ship (called rafting), and that may mean a bit of a challenge if you are have serious problems with mobility.

[travelberlin]

27 minutes ago, nordski said:

Generally this is true, but on occasion we have docked a fair distance away from the attractions in a particular town/city. Vienna and Amsterdam immediately come to mind, but there have been others. The desk officers on board the ship can easily arrange for a taxi if needed. Ship tours may use a bus.

 

River Cruising has exploded in popularity and that means docking space is often at a premium, particularly for the larger ships owned by Viking and Scenic.

 

As a result, you may end up tied to another ship (called rafting), and that may mean a bit of a challenge if you are have serious problems with mobility.

Yes you are right. I remember we were once tied up to another ship on a cruise to the Danube.

Ivi

[uktog]

Rafting can mean your view can disappear and you have to be very careful when opening the curtains in the morning!!  I did not like what we were told was Ama's policy that their curtains in the dining room had to stay shut if there was a vessel tied next to us.  We found lunch in the dark a bit disconcerting.

[amyr]

7 hours ago, travelberlin said:

From all river cruises I have taken, I have found the ones offered by Belmond the best. I have taken twice a river cruise with them on the Road to Mandalay in Myanmar. I am planning on taking a cruise on a barge with them on French rivers. They are pricey but excellent.

I have taken Avalon on a river cruise on the Mekong and I found it very nice. Not the quality of Belmond, but good cabins and friendly service.The river cruises in Asia include excursions and imho for a solo traveler this is the best in Asia. 

 

 

I want to do all the things in the Belmond catalog.  I want to ride that train through Peru, and I want to take the Road to Mandalay through Myanmar some day.  My sister and I were planning to go a few years back, but things got in the way.  We were especially interested in that cruise because it's Belmond, and they have such great experience in Burma, but also because our father took that ship on the Rhine sometime in the early 60s when she was the Nederland.  Here are some shots Dad took back then: 

 

But honestly, I think that Host Jazz is right that the closest river line (at least in Europe) to Azamara is probably AMA, even though we usually chose Avalon when traveling with solo cruisers. 

[hamrag]

On 2/16/2021 at 3:29 PM, MNgardens said:

...opinions please: If Azamara were a river cruise line, which one would it be?...

 

No opinion, we have not yet experienced such! But, its interesting that Ama whom many have mentioned sits right in the centre of azAMAra!

 

For the limited few who will understand what it is, I'd settle for a jaunt down the River Clyde on the PS Waverley right now!

[travelberlin]

2 hours ago, amyr said:

I want to do all the things in the Belmond catalog.  I want to ride that train through Peru, and I want to take the Road to Mandalay through Myanmar some day.  My sister and I were planning to go a few years back, but things got in the way.  We were especially interested in that cruise because it's Belmond, and they have such great experience in Burma, but also because our father took that ship on the Rhine sometime in the early 60s when she was the Nederland.  Here are some shots Dad took back then: 

 

But honestly, I think that Host Jazz is right that the closest river line (at least in Europe) to Azamara is probably AMA, even though we usually chose Avalon when traveling with solo cruisers. 

The Road to Mandalay:

[caripoo]

Crystal for us....It is all inclusive, all suites, butlers, smaller numbers, great food...We liked Viking as well, but now they have a pretty hard to swallow payment policy.....

[malcliz]

We love Crystal too being all inclusive and very friendly with no set dining times so you can eat at a time you choose with the option to dine with others or at a table for 2 if you prefer.  The tours are great with many ‘special Crystal moments’. They have their own extremely spacious and comfortable tour buses that follow the ship.