DeSantis nearing compromise on cruise vaccination requirements

[Sinbadssailors]

4 minutes ago, LeeRB said:

Please excuse my interruption in the discussion; but I couldn’t find where it says what those 31 children admitted to hospital(s) last week were admitted with. Can someone point me to the posting that identifies that information?

 

https://gis.cdc.gov/grasp/covidnet/COVID19_5.html

 

Weekly covid hospitalizations, can filter by age.

 

 

[BlerkOne]

1 minute ago, MrMarc said:

Wait, then we agree?  Maybe I'm getting the posts mixed up.

I don't know if children hospitalization are up or down. I know teenagers don't represent all young people 

 

I do know young people are getting hit harder by variants. That tends to support they should be vaccinated also 

 

Arguing slices of statistics doesn't really  approximate the big picture. 

 

Anyway I thing the suit will fall as will the law. I think cruise lines already are looking forward to moving a ship or two to nearby foreign ports so they can't be held hostage again by anyone  That will require one and hopefully two passports for everyone 

[BlerkOne]

6 minutes ago, MrMarc said:

But doesn't the original suit cite the economic impact as a harm?  I certainly would bring it up, as it seems to totally undercut that issue.

A problem with that claim is it took over a year for the suit to be brought. Why delay so long?

 

That no cruise line joined the suit is telling. It  highlights a lack of standing.

[Sinbadssailors]

Just now, BlerkOne said:

I don't know if children hospitalization are up or down. I know teenagers don't represent all young people 

 

I do know young people are getting hit harder by variants. That tends to support they should be vaccinated also 

 

Arguing slices of statistics doesn't really  approximate the big picture. 

 

 

Please check the website I have posted 3 times now.

 

It's not a slice of statistics, it's raw numbers from the CDC.

 

I don't know where you're getting this info on variants affecting the young 

[BlerkOne]

4 minutes ago, Sinbadssailors said:

Please check the website I have posted 3 times now.

 

It's not a slice of statistics, it's raw numbers from the CDC.

 

I don't know where you're getting this info on variants affecting the young 

Life is short enough without wasting more on numbers that I don't think are applicable to cruising 

 

Here is something I think is quite relevant.

 

https://oldurbanist.blogspot.com/2011/09/densest-urban-environment-in-world.html?m=1

 

 

[MrMarc]

6 minutes ago, BlerkOne said:

A problem with that claim is it took over a year for the suit to be brought. Why delay so long?

 

That no cruise line joined the suit is telling. It  highlights a lack of standing.

I think the cruise lines not joining might be based on worries that the CDC might retaliate since they were finally talking.  Also they might add complications based on where the corporate entities are based, where the ships are flagged and the citizenship of their employees.  

[BlerkOne]

3 minutes ago, MrMarc said:

I think the cruise lines not joining might be based on worries that the CDC might retaliate since they were finally talking.  Also they might add complications based on where the corporate entities are based, where the ships are flagged and the citizenship of their employees.  

Carnival is based in Miami ( for now). I believe the cruise lines were clear they would rather negotiate with the CDC and I think it has paid off. Cruising begins in July. Except maybe for one thing standing in the way 

[MrMarc]

3 minutes ago, BlerkOne said:

Carnival is based in Miami ( for now). I believe the cruise lines were clear they would rather negotiate with the CDC and I think it has paid off. Cruising begins in July. Except maybe for one thing standing in the way 

No, they are incorporated in Liberia.

[nyc12345]

1 hour ago, jfunk138 said:

Teen hospitalizations are NOT increasing.   Here's an explanation from Joseph Allen of Harvard School of Public Health:

 

 

 

 

Please note this graph is only showing 10% of population:

 

"The current network covers nearly 100 counties in the 10 Emerging Infections Program (EIP) states (CA, CO, CT, GA, MD, MN, NM, NY, OR, and TN) and four additional states through the Influenza Hospitalization Surveillance Project (IA, MI, OH, and UT). The network represents approximately 10% of US population (~32 million people)."

[BlerkOne]

9 minutes ago, MrMarc said:

No, they are incorporated in Liberia.

Carnival Cruise Line isn't incorporated - Carnival Corporation is.

 

As for the cruise line

 

 To contact us by phone, call 1-800-CARNIVAL.

 

Our world headquarters are located at:

3655 NW 87th Avenue. Miami, FL. 33178 U.S.A

[MrMarc]

3 minutes ago, BlerkOne said:

Carnival Cruise Line isn't incorporated - Carnival Corporation is.

 

As for the cruise line

 

 To contact us by phone, call 1-800-CARNIVAL.

 

Our world headquarters are located at:

3655 NW 87th Avenue. Miami, FL. 33178 U.S.A

Actually its Panama, I got my cruise lines mixed up.  https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carnival_Corporation_%26_plc

[jfunk138]

14 minutes ago, nyc12345 said:

 

Please note this graph is only showing 10% of population:

 

"The current network covers nearly 100 counties in the 10 Emerging Infections Program (EIP) states (CA, CO, CT, GA, MD, MN, NM, NY, OR, and TN) and four additional states through the Influenza Hospitalization Surveillance Project (IA, MI, OH, and UT). The network represents approximately 10% of US population (~32 million people)."

So are you arguing a single hospital in Texas is more representative of reality?  If not, I'm not really sure what your point is?

[MrMarc]

1 minute ago, jfunk138 said:

So are you arguing a single hospital in Texas is more representative of reality?  If not, I'm not really sure what your point is?

No, but I can't explain it to you anymore than I already have. I have a feeling you and I won't agree on what reality is.

[TNcruising02]

2 minutes ago, MrMarc said:

No, but I can't explain it to you anymore than I already have. I have a feeling you and I won't agree on what reality is.

It should not be a surprise that underlying health issues at any age can raise the risk level for covid.

"Most of the children had at least one underlying medical condition, such as obesity, asthma or a neurological disorder."

[jfunk138]

2 minutes ago, MrMarc said:

No, but I can't explain it to you anymore than I already have. I have a feeling you and I won't agree on what reality is.

MrMarc's reality:  Anecdotal evidence from a single hospital in Texas reflects reality because its an urban area and a single urban area can be extrapolated to a cruiseship.

jfunk138's reality: Harvard School of Public Health Professor John Allen says that in reality teen hospitalizations are decreasing in all states sharing data in the Emerging Infections Program.

[MrMarc]

2 minutes ago, jfunk138 said:

MrMarc's reality:  Anecdotal evidence from a single hospital in Texas reflects reality because its an urban area and a single urban area can be extrapolated to a cruiseship.

jfunk138's reality: Harvard School of Public Health Professor John Allen says that in reality teen hospitalizations are decreasing in all states sharing data in the Emerging Infections Program.

Nope. Try again

 

[amcankid]

28 minutes ago, MrMarc said:

Actually its Panama, I got my cruise lines mixed up.  https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carnival_Corporation_%26_plc

Actually Actually it’s Bahamas. They just announced the switch two or three weeks ago

[nyc12345]

29 minutes ago, jfunk138 said:

So are you arguing a single hospital in Texas is more representative of reality?  If not, I'm not really sure what your point is?

 

Just pointing out the facts.  10% is 10%. 

 

You can make whatever arguments you want, not trying to argue with anyone, but you can't say 10% is the whole country.  If the other 90% of the country shows a different breakdown of how many people in each age group is hospitalized, that will change the narrative.

[MrMarc]

3 minutes ago, amcankid said:

Actually Actually it’s Bahamas. They just announced the switch two or three weeks ago

I should know mot to trust Wikipedis

[jfunk138]

1 minute ago, nyc12345 said:

 

Just pointing out the facts.  10% is 10%. 

 

You can make whatever arguments you want, not trying to argue with anyone, but you can't say 10% is the whole country.  If the other 90% of the country shows a different breakdown of how many people in each age group is hospitalized, that will change the narrative.

I think the point of EIP is to get a cross-section of the country to track epidemic trends, they didn't just cherry pick the participants.  You don't need to survey everyone when you choose a good sample, which I think is their intent.

There's a mix of "perma-lockdown" and "neanderthal" states in there across varying geographies and seasonality zones.

And obviously it's better than anecdotal evidence from a single hospital in Texas.

[firefly333]

People are saying John said he would have a big announcement today, monday. I hope it's about vaccines myself so we can move on. I'd rather know than keep hearing guesses and debates. Just let us know. ..though who knows what it is about. 

[lobster1313]

5 hours ago, firefly333 said:

People are saying John said he would have a big announcement today, monday. I hope it's about vaccines myself so we can move on. I'd rather know than keep hearing guesses and debates. Just let us know. ..though who knows what it is about. 

The announcement may not come today.

[lobster1313]

6 hours ago, MrMarc said:

Actually Actually it’s Bahamas. They just announced the switch two or three weeks ago

That was just the flag for the Mardis Gras.

[MrMarc]

45 minutes ago, regoodwinjr said:

That was just the flag for the Mardis Gras.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carnival_Corporation_%26_plc

[evandbob]

Here's the Points Guy opinion on DeSantis' suit against the CDC: 

 

 https://thepointsguy.com/news/florida-cruise-lawsuit-alaska-impact/