CDC ends all restrictions as of July 18th (TODAY!!)

[Rusty_lock]

1 minute ago, notscb said:

The data indicates you're wrong about this.

 

 

LOL, the data you posted shows no measurable difference in the 18-29 cohort and doesn't even show the under 18 cohort.  I stand by my statement.  

[hazeleyes46]

8 minutes ago, notscb said:

 

...because it was a brand new disease that we had very little knowledge about that easily over-ran our healthcare system? I'm confused about what you're trying to say. Should sick people (with any sickness) be allowed to occupy confined spaces (like cruise ships) and spread it to others?

Do you honestly think before this NO ONE went on a cruise ship sick or got sick on any? You can easily spread any type of virus so you should avoid others with any sickness but we need to start treating this virus like every other. I wonder how much the compromised actually avoided others and made them avoid them before all of this and before the media drilled it in their heads they would die if they got it.

[Project-College]

As I stated in the other thread....

Not to overly simplify this but….

Be Honest:  People are very ‘stressed’ about the RISK of the test not the process, as it may be inconvenient but it’s not that hard or costly.  Risk is based simply on Probability and Impact.  Many, such as me, feel the Probability of any of my family of 4 testing Positive is small to medium BUT the impact is SIGNIFICANT!

Yes, you may get a refund (though the time to refund seems to be varied) BUT the disruption to you scheduling (vacations/school starting/etc.) is HIGH and that is usually where the STRESS rests.

Not everybody cruising is retired and, for me at least, if, after almost 1 ½ years of planning, I find out its cancelled 24-48 hours before the event… well that has ME Stressed!

We are fully vaxed and boosted and have taken pre-cruise precautions so honestly… I want the pre-cruise testing to stop.

I have been on 3 business trips and in no other venue what-so-ever have I been asked to test!  Even one with the NJ Governor in attendance!

[notscb]

Just now, hazeleyes46 said:

before the media drilled it in their heads they would die if they got it.

Yikes. We've lost a million americans to covid.

1 minute ago, hazeleyes46 said:

NO ONE went on a cruise ship sick or got sick on any?

Did I say that? No. Pre-Covid, peolpe went to work sick, people got on airplanes sick, and our culture in the U.S. was way, way too accepting of sick people roaming around spreading things. In other countries, when you're sick you stay home or wear a mask. Do I think sick people should be spreading any of what they're carrying? Ideally, no. But we don't live in a world where people have that luxury.

[Project-College]

Just now, ace2542 said:

But they won't because of lawsuits...... 😉 What happens when the first lawsuit for Covid comes in? I would like an answer to that question.

Before you start screaming Lawsuit... there have already been many many lawsuits.  Most failed and proving knowledge and negligence, specially in light of the CDC MANDATE being moved to guidance.... much much harder to prove and I am sure the 'liability' bean counters at the Cruise Lines are evaluating pros and cons leading to more sales and profit! 

[Project-College]

2 minutes ago, ace2542 said:

Another interesteing thing to ponder. How long will the refunds or fcc continue now? I can see it stoppng it you get Covid tough totty you lose out no more money back they can't afford it.

Now that is a more reasonable query!  It all comes down to the def of a Corporation... to enhance shareholder wealth!  

[exm]

17 minutes ago, notscb said:

The data indicates you're wrong about this.

 

 

 

That link has April 2021 data in it. That was the Delta strain: can't compare that with the Omicron variants.

[BND]

1 hour ago, Jimbo said:

I haven't been staying home. Not sure what you are talking about.

 

 

Well, you certainly haven't been on any cruises since restart.   But, you knew what I meant.

[the penguins]

4 minutes ago, Rusty_lock said:

Yeah but your I94 is $6 LOL.  Big difference.

 

Except it doesn't reduce the spread.  The vaccinated population gets it at the same rate as the un vaccinated and the risk of serious illness for young people with or without the vaccine is negligible.

 

If only,  it was increased in May from 💲14 to 💲21. It's the principle rather than the cost. 

The efficacy of the vaccines is indisputable and even if the benefit for young people (what is your definition of young - we have a 40 year old friend who is now wheelchair bound with no hope of recovery from Covid) is negligible it is not zero. 

We have happily been cruising since August 2021 but would not continue to do so if cruise lines dropped the vaccination requirements now.

Everyone and every country has to make its own decisions. The UK dropped its testing requirements for entry  long before the US. 

Finally we must consider the situation of the crew without whom we would not have the previelege of cruising. Testing/vaccinations is a small price to pay.

[hazeleyes46]

8 minutes ago, notscb said:

Yikes. We've lost a million americans to covid.

Did I say that? No. Pre-Covid, peolpe went to work sick, people got on airplanes sick, and our culture in the U.S. was way, way too accepting of sick people roaming around spreading things. In other countries, when you're sick you stay home or wear a mask. Do I think sick people should be spreading any of what they're carrying? Ideally, no. But we don't live in a world where people have that luxury.

Yes we lost a lot of people to covid. Did many if not most have underlying conditions? I am sure. I waited all winter for the horrible death that was going to come to me because I was unvaccinated. 

 

So people will still go on cruises sick and get sick as well as the same on land. We need to go back to normal and just be more cautious when you are sick and try and avoid others as much as you can.

[exm]

Cruise lines need to simply drop all testing and mandates with the caveat that any medical Covid emergencies on-board are at your own expense (isn't that the case already?).

 

Someone here mentioned an 80 year old: well, the 80 year old has to take responsibility for his actions: is he vaccinated/recovered? Health problems? Should he go on a cruise?

[ace2542]

1 minute ago, Project-College said:

Before you start screaming Lawsuit... there have already been many many lawsuits.  Most failed and proving knowledge and negligence, specially in light of the CDC MANDATE being moved to guidance.... much much harder to prove and I am sure the 'liability' bean counters at the Cruise Lines are evaluating pros and cons leading to more sales and profit! 

Ok it might be hard to prove but hard to disprove too.

 

[BND]

11 minutes ago, notscb said:

 In other countries, when you're sick you stay home or wear a mask.

Data on that?  

[Project-College]

Just now, ace2542 said:

Ok it might be hard to prove but hard to disprove too.

 

I agree that the Cruise Lines are 'thinking' about it but again they don't have to 'disprove' the plaintiff has to 'Prove' and the level is, as I think you agree, very high!

[notscb]

3 minutes ago, the penguins said:

consider the situation of the crew without whom we would not have the previelege of cruising

I'm surprised this thread had to get up to 8 pages without considering the crew.

 

The crew don't really have a choice but to fulfill their contracts. As cruisers, shouldn't we want to protect others onboard who also have families and live in even closer quarters than guests do?

[hazeleyes46]

13 minutes ago, Project-College said:

As I stated in the other thread....

Not to overly simplify this but….

Be Honest:  People are very ‘stressed’ about the RISK of the test not the process, as it may be inconvenient but it’s not that hard or costly.  Risk is based simply on Probability and Impact.  Many, such as me, feel the Probability of any of my family of 4 testing Positive is small to medium BUT the impact is SIGNIFICANT!

Yes, you may get a refund (though the time to refund seems to be varied) BUT the disruption to you scheduling (vacations/school starting/etc.) is HIGH and that is usually where the STRESS rests.

Not everybody cruising is retired and, for me at least, if, after almost 1 ½ years of planning, I find out its cancelled 24-48 hours before the event… well that has ME Stressed!

We are fully vaxed and boosted and have taken pre-cruise precautions so honestly… I want the pre-cruise testing to stop.

I have been on 3 business trips and in no other venue what-so-ever have I been asked to test!  Even one with the NJ Governor in attendance!

YES!!! I haven't been on vacation for 4 years. Have had 2 cruises cancelled and it IS stressing me out that I have to test. I have tested many times for work and I have never (as far as I know) have gotten covid (unvaccinated for 2 + years). There are 4 of us in our house. If one person gets it, our vacation will be ruined especially if they have no symptoms and can easily go about their week on a cruise like they have been doing on land.

[ace2542]

5 minutes ago, Project-College said:

Now that is a more reasonable query!  It all comes down to the def of a Corporation... to enhance shareholder wealth!  

So by extension of that how many people will come forward for testing and be locked in the cabin ten days?

[notscb]

3 minutes ago, hazeleyes46 said:

back to normal

"Back to normal" wasn't good, do you not remember? Pre-Covid life didn't allow for people to be sick or stay home when sick without the consequence of loss (financial, social, vocational).

 

We need to be better about preventing what we can, otherwise this weird value of American individualism is going to be the downfall of what we have left of a society.

[Project-College]

One of our IT guys just search the 'Dark', as she calls it,  (assuming Dark Web) and there are soooo many phony shops offering Covid Proctoring for our precious 'American' $$$$ and all GUARANTEE Negative test results.  

I don't have the skills, or inclination to do anything on the Dark Web but I am sure some individual in some country with some computer is making lots of money off us! 

[Project-College]

2 minutes ago, ace2542 said:

So by extension of that how many people will come forward for testing and be locked in the cabin ten days?

Correct as well!

[notscb]

5 minutes ago, BND said:

Data on that?  

Do you need data on that? It's in the value systems. Do you remember when SARS was a huge thing and even major cities like Toronto had a people wearing masks?

 

But here's an article about it,

And a study about mask usage

And another about attitudes about mask usage in Germany

[smokeybandit]

32 minutes ago, notscb said:

 

...because it was a brand new disease that we had very little knowledge about that easily over-ran our healthcare system? I'm confused about what you're trying to say. Should sick people (with any sickness) be allowed to occupy confined spaces (like cruise ships) and spread it to others?

It *was* brand new. Not anymore. And the health care system was never overrun. 

[notscb]

Just now, smokeybandit said:

And the health care system was never overrun. 

 

I'm not going to even engage with this comment. It's clearly a joke.

[firefly333]

21 minutes ago, ace2542 said:

But they won't because of lawsuits...... 😉 What happens when the first lawsuit for Covid comes in? I would like an answer to that question.

what is the difference between testing 2 days before I board and between legs that would make for law suits. I did a b2b2b2b in may, 4 legs and no testing between legs since I'm vaccinated. Sorry i fail to see your pt why its important to you i test before i board, but i can stay onboard for months with no tests. I know many of the folks who book for months the same ship and dont change over just to avoid testing. 

 

If it's not important to test between legs it's not important before i board.

Edited July 19, 2022 by firefly333

[aubreyc1988]

16 hours ago, BND said:

Most people feel that the vaccine requirement will be the very last thing to go.

 I hope it is.  Remember, the cruiselines probably have a goal of 1) having healthy passengers who do not go to the hospital during or after cruising 2) staying out of headlines in the terms of Covid news.  Requiring vaccination is a big part of achieving this.