Silversea Air Screws Up Again

[chrism23]

Bolllocks.  After leaving 4 emails and three voice messages, they still have my wife and I booked on separate flights.  This can be fixed with  one quick phone call to the Air Division.  I hope Barbara Muckerman is reading this thread, she used to, or someone else at SS to pick up the phone and get it done.    All I need is for the air for me under VS 3139334 to match the air for my wife inner V 3130193.  Or send my the number of your AIR division, you will have my particulars from the VS numbers, and I will do it myself.  Unfortunately I can't cancel because I would be out 25% of $54,000 which is real money these days.  I will also cancel my booking for the 2023 world cruise which is $144,000, which is significant real money.  This sailing is in January, part of the Grand Voyage promotion,, we are doing 2 legs, the whole cruise sails in December so its is not 11 months away.  I don not want to get my CC in hot water, he has been really very very good to us on out 5 previous cruises, which may happen because I included the VS numbers.  And I look forward, hopefully in working with him in the future.  

 

I started this thread and I can't believe how many people have piled. on.  Glad to know its not just me.   

[WesW]

chrism23, have sent Barbara Muckerman a copy of this thread and your post#30, hope

she can assist you with your air challenge.

 

Best, Wes

[FlyerTalker]

43 minutes ago, WesW said:

chrism23, have sent Barbara Muckerman a copy of this thread and your post#30, hope

she can assist you with your air challenge.

 

A timely reminded that some folks have juice with SS, while the mass of cruisers don't.

 

But nice that they use it for others.

 

 

[Catlover54]

3 hours ago, chrism23 said:

Bolllocks.  After leaving 4 emails and three voice messages, they still have my wife and I booked on separate flights.  This can be fixed with  one quick phone call to the Air Division.  I hope Barbara Muckerman is reading this thread, she used to, or someone else at SS to pick up the phone and get it done.    All I need is for the air for me under VS 3139334 to match the air for my wife inner V 3130193.  Or send my the number of your AIR division, you will have my particulars from the VS numbers, and I will do it myself.  Unfortunately I can't cancel because I would be out 25% of $54,000 which is real money these days.  I will also cancel my booking for the 2023 world cruise which is $144,000, which is significant real money.  This sailing is in January, part of the Grand Voyage promotion,, we are doing 2 legs, the whole cruise sails in December so its is not 11 months away.  I don not want to get my CC in hot water, he has been really very very good to us on out 5 previous cruises, which may happen because I included the VS numbers.  And I look forward, hopefully in working with him in the future.  

 

I started this thread and I can't believe how many people have piled. on.  Glad to know its not just me.   

I am glad you started this thread, thank you. With your level of planned financial outlay to SS you would think this would have been squared away long ago.

Having had negative experiences with both Crystal and Seabourn arranging air for me ( sort of arranging, anyway) I decided to just suck up the extra charges I land up paying on business class flights where I cannot use miles, and always do air arrangements myself if possible. 

 

I had not  yet formed an opinion on what to do with SS, but this thread ( and other sources) have convinced me that for the benefit of my blood pressure, if at all possible, I should do the same on SS, i.e., just avoid Silver Air.
 Unfortunately the extra air fees for health preservation are not deductable as misc. health related expenses, per the IRS. 🙂

 

 

[les37b]

20 hours ago, FlyerTalker said:

 

You are nowhere close to being actually ticketed.  All that is happening is that you have some placeholder reservations.

 

 

 

It may be priced about the same when you are talking about retail published fares as if you bought from the airline directly.  That does NOT mean that the pricing is anywhere close to the same when you are dealing with the contracted routings and airlines in their private contracts.  And any assumption that you can compare published to non-published (contract) fares and expect parity is foolhardy.

 

And one other further point:  A connection from ANC to SEA to LHR would involve neither a security screening nor passport control at SEA.  Purely domestic connection.  So that 3 hour number is not applicable.

 

I appreciate they dont ticket usually until 60 days before departure (I think), but I really don't want to have a place holding for flights we don't want. Getting it resolved should put us in good sted.

 

I hear what you say regarding prices, but since they have actually offered the flights we want (just not at the same time) I think it's a safe bet pricing is not going to be an issue. But if it is, they can tell us.

 

Interesting what you say on Seattle. Is this something new? All connecting flights involving one part international I've only ever known passport control and 2 lots of security.

 

If the 3 hours mentioned on the Seattle site doesn't apply to an Alaskan Airway connection to a BA flight, what would that time frame apply to?

 

Having missed a 4h15m connection in Atlanta, (and the inbound was on time,) I'm always very wary, particularly needing to be at the gate to board 30 mins before departure 

[Daveywavey70]

I Personally wouldn't really think about booking with Air included as I very much like to do my own thing, add a couple of bits on and go a bit Tailor made. The Horror stories both here and in the "other place" only reassure me that I'm doing the right thing.

[CruzinFeraBruzin]

 

I think if Silversea's fares include economy air with business upgrade or, in the case of Grand Voyages and World Cruises, business air included, then the flight options they offer guests should match the onboard experience (I'm sure I'll get a few eyerolls and laughs out of that comment).  Why sell a product that offers door to door luxury, but forces guests to settle for flight options with stress inducing short connection times, or makes them pay a significant upcharge for something better?  This, along with other shortcomings in the Air Department, is what needs to be addressed.  

Edited October 6, 2022 by CruzinFeraBruzin

[Stumblefoot]

1 hour ago, CruzinFeraBruzin said:

Why sell a product that offers door to door luxury, but forces guests to settle for flight options with stress inducing short connection times, or makes them pay a significant upcharge for something better?

This was my contention from the very beginning when introduced; door-to-door is nothing more than a marketing farce and a ploy to raise fares massively.  To think services outsourced to a third party could ever compare to SS’s onboard experience was a major miscalculation by management.

[FlyerTalker]

2 hours ago, les37b said:

Interesting what you say on Seattle. Is this something new? All connecting flights involving one part international I've only ever known passport control and 2 lots of security.

 

If the 3 hours mentioned on the Seattle site doesn't apply to an Alaskan Airway connection to a BA flight, what would that time frame apply to?

 

If the connection is USA airport to USA airport to International airport, then you have no passport control (as the USA does not do universal outbound control).  Has always been that way.

 

If the connnection is International airport to USA airport to USA airport, then you have the inbound passport control.  Always that way.

 

It all depends on the order of the airports.

[chrism23]

OK.  A couple of things.  Heard from ny CC consultant last night and it seems that they have finally gotten it right.  Let me stress how important it is to have a good CC at SS.  My last two were great at working out issues with SS air.  Probably by picking up the phone and threatening them with bodily harm.

 

But this begs the bigger and more important question.  Given the avalanche and horror stories above in response to my original post SS undeniably has as a major problem with its AIR division.  If as many people that responded to this thread are any indication, figure that the real number is at least 10x the number of people with problems, maybe even 100X.  This had been going on for some time, pre-COVID, so that is not an excuse, it just makes it more difficult.

 

So I think the solution here is self-evident.  SS needs to fire, immediately, the Director/Manager of their AIR division and bring  or promote someone who can fix it and get it right.  If this person worked for me back in the day, I would have had him/her clean their desk and be shown the door a while ago.  

 

Thanks to everyone that responded.  The problem was much more widespread and serious than I thought.

cheers all

chris

[les37b]

9 hours ago, FlyerTalker said:

 

If the connection is USA airport to USA airport to International airport, then you have no passport control (as the USA does not do universal outbound control).  Has always been that way.

 

If the connnection is International airport to USA airport to USA airport, then you have the inbound passport control.  Always that way.

 

It all depends on the order of the airports.

 

OK understood. My connections have always been inbound and had to suffer the awful stress of 2 lots of security and PP control on arrival between connections.

 

That said, would you accept a 1h07m connection from Anchorage to London via Seattle? Unfortunately the next flight has a 6 hour connection which I have requested and been accepted (but still not changed!)

 

In Japan, the incoming was 1h15m in Tokyo, which I had assumed would involve PP control on arrival and suspect does. The flight is an evening JAL London departure and I suspect the Japanese will be more efficient, but still dont fancy that chance. If it doesnt work, I potentially miss the cruise or hotel need in Osaka.

[chrism23]

14 hours ago, WesW said:

chrism23, have sent Barbara Muckerman a copy of this thread and your post#30, hope

she can assist you with your air challenge.

 

Best, Wes

Hi WES.  Thank you.  If Ms. Muckerman does check this out I want to make one think perfectly clear.  The problem was not with my cruise consultant (MN)  The delays, the phone calls the emails were caused by him trying to address our issues with SS Air.  He too was pulling his hair out. As I said he has been very good to us and I really don't want this to reflect badly on him.  I will send, with no hesitation all our business to him in the future.

 

The reason I am doing this is for new cruisers and people who have not been through this before.  It is a shame that people are getting angry at SS, because of the incompetence of just one part of their operation.  For these folks, calling their general number or emailing them, is not going to get your concerns addressed.  You absolutely need a CC that will strongly go to bat for you with the AIR division.  This is a shame because after sailing around, I feel the SS is the best cruise line in the world.  Selfishly I don't want to see them lose business,  both new and repeat, by having just one of their divisions ruining the experience for so many people.  Thanks again.  

[drron29]

Every year for 8 years we flew from Brisbane to New YorK via Narita on JAL. There was a 55 minute connection at Narita from the Brisbane flight to the JFK flight. We did this 2 or 3 times a year. We never missed a connection.

You don't have to go through immigration but you do have to go through security which was the choke point. If we were delayed at all the JAL staff would escort us to the front of the security line.

Being a domestic connection you would have to go through Immigration but the JAL staff does that for Immigration as well. We were actually taken to the staff line on the one occasion we had a late flight connecting from international to domestic.

So I think the Tokyo connection would be fine les37b.

Edited October 7, 2022 by drron29

[FlyerTalker]

8 hours ago, les37b said:

That said, would you accept a 1h07m connection from Anchorage to London via Seattle? Unfortunately the next flight has a 6 hour connection which I have requested and been accepted (but still not changed!)

 

Probably not.  But I can't figure out your issues completely, as you don't say dates, cities, flights and times.  Given the large number of flights between ANC and SEA, I can't figure out your six hour issue.

 

in addition, you also have options through other USA cities, such as SFO, LAX, ORD and more.

[Catlover54]

14 hours ago, les37b said:

 

OK understood. My connections have always been inbound and had to suffer the awful stress of 2 lots of security and PP control on arrival between connections.

 

That said, would you accept a 1h07m connection from Anchorage to London via Seattle? Unfortunately the next flight has a 6 hour connection which I have requested and been accepted (but still not changed!)

 

In Japan, the incoming was 1h15m in Tokyo, which I had assumed would involve PP control on arrival and suspect does. The flight is an evening JAL London departure and I suspect the Japanese will be more efficient, but still dont fancy that chance. If it doesnt work, I potentially miss the cruise or hotel need in Osaka.

A six-hour layover in Seattle is worth peace of mind.  It is a busy airport, but unlike at many American airports, people and staff are usually nice,  and very civilised  and the airport has great seafood options, chargers, etc.  
 

Have a wonderful, stress and Covid-free trip, Les.  You plan so much, so carefully, but have gotten unlucky ( e.g., the Panama cruise), and deserve a change.

[les37b]

23 hours ago, FlyerTalker said:

 

Probably not.  But I can't figure out your issues completely, as you don't say dates, cities, flights and times.  Given the large number of flights between ANC and SEA, I can't figure out your six hour issue.

 

in addition, you also have options through other USA cities, such as SFO, LAX, ORD and more.

The only option out of ANC we’ve been given on any effort has been 10.00 on Alaskan Airways. Personally I’d prefer a later time, but it’s not an issue, plus I’ve struggled to come up with other options.

 

The 6 hour connection, isn’t a problem and it has been suggested as an option. The issue is that was over 2 weeks ago and my flights haven’t been changed so as it stands I’m still on a 1 hour connection. Ordinarily I’d be confident it will be done, but this has been ongoing for 3 months and no changes have been made on either.

 

The outward was with JAL but only 1 hour connection. They had offered to use KLM via Amsterdam., but I’ve requested an earlier LHR first leg.

 

What keeps happening, is they make the change to one flight, but forget the other which we’d already said yes to and we go back to square one.

 

To make things a tad worrying, I’ve seen that KLM are planning to loose some of their long hauls and Osaka. Something to keep my eye on. This is an April 24th departure.

 

17 hours ago, Catlover54 said:

A six-hour layover in Seattle is worth peace of mind.  It is a busy airport, but unlike at many American airports, people and staff are usually nice,  and very civilised  and the airport has great seafood options, chargers, etc.  
 

Have a wonderful, stress and Covid-free trip, Les.  You plan so much, so carefully, but have gotten unlucky ( e.g., the Panama cruise), and deserve a change.

Howdie neighbour!

 

I can remember a few years back JFK was closed the day before our arrival because of a 4” snow dump. We chose even then to go for a 7 hour connection rather than 2. It all worked luckily. Shorter would be nicer if it could be guaranteed, so the less stressful option suits.

 

 

 

[FlyerTalker]

4 hours ago, les37b said:

The only option out of ANC we’ve been given on any effort has been 10.00 on Alaskan Airways. Personally I’d prefer a later time, but it’s not an issue, plus I’ve struggled to come up with other options.

 

In April of 2023, the current schedule between ANC and SEA has Alaska Airlines flights at:

 

0:55

1:55

2:55

5:00

6:00

7:00

8:00

9:00

10:00

11:00

12:00

14:00

15:45

17:45

20:35

 

Delta has three non-stops at 0:56, 13:50 and 15:53.  There are also connections from ANC through FAI and JNU and other Alaska cities as well.  Not sure why you are having trouble with only two options, unless those are the only flights that have contract space.

 

 

 

[les37b]

17 hours ago, FlyerTalker said:

 

In April of 2023, the current schedule between ANC and SEA has Alaska Airlines flights at:

 

0:55

1:55

2:55

5:00

6:00

7:00

8:00

9:00

10:00

11:00

12:00

14:00

15:45

17:45

20:35

 

Delta has three non-stops at 0:56, 13:50 and 15:53.  There are also connections from ANC through FAI and JNU and other Alaska cities as well.  Not sure why you are having trouble with only two options, unless those are the only flights that have contract space.

 

 

 

 

I'm not sure why I'm only having those options either, but that's all they have offered. As you stated earlier, it will all be about the rates that SS are charged and what they are prepared to offer.

 

Unfortunately you cannot speak direct and the third party TA has to wait 2 weeks or more to get a reply to the new option (if applicable), which still isn't whats been requested. That's the problem.

[Izena]

I thank everyone for their comments. Advice has been iawesome.   I’ve been thinking about a SS  Galapagos cruise in 2025.  Found the door to door enticing since I’m a Nervous Nelly when it come to airports etc.   I have a CC  who provided some info.   I know now  I need to be specific on air travel, ie a nonstop flight which shouldn’t be a problem since I’m in Houston.   

 

[les37b]

On 10/6/2022 at 11:16 PM, Daveywavey70 said:

I Personally wouldn't really think about booking with Air included as I very much like to do my own thing, add a couple of bits on and go a bit Tailor made. The Horror stories both here and in the "other place" only reassure me that I'm doing the right thing.

 

On our recent South America trip, had SS not been dealing with our air fare, we would have lost our paid for flights from Guayaquil (no refund)nand have to pay for a further on the day flight from from Santiago. True, the insurance company may have covered less any excess, but I trust Insurance as far as I can throw them. They didn't even pay out for the excess parking fees. (OK they did, but the excess ate most of it!)

 

Pre covid, I'd always DIY. I probably still will for any short haul flights, but not long distance. I don't have the luxury of air miles or concessionary fares unfortunately, hence the bookings places with Air. All 3 upcoming with SS are long haul and taken the included silversea air.

[CruzinFeraBruzin]

1 hour ago, Izena said:

I thank everyone for their comments. Advice has been iawesome.   I’ve been thinking about a SS  Galapagos cruise in 2025.  Found the door to door enticing since I’m a Nervous Nelly when it come to airports etc.   I have a CC  who provided some info.   I know now  I need to be specific on air travel, ie a nonstop flight which shouldn’t be a problem since I’m in Houston.   

 

Just be prepared if you do the door to door expecting a non-stop to Houston, it probably won't happen unless you're prepared to pay an upcharge.  You might get lucky, so I wish you the best.  Silversea's Air Department told us they'd be more than happy to fly us business class from London to San Antonio via Houston for an additional $2,930 per person.  That's on top of the $699 business class airfare (which is now selling for $999).  They want to route us thru Chicago with a 90 minute connection.  Sorry, not happening...

[chrism23]

On 9/8/2022 at 6:36 PM, cotto22 said:

That exact same thing happened to me, but I was actually pleasantly surprised, although a little uncomfortable at the same time. We were returning from a shore excursion that left me cold, damp and in need of a hot bath and perhaps a hot toddy as well. I do enjoy a hot bath, but truthfully never seem to have the time. And the weather where we live is so awfully warm that a brief cool shower is much more refreshing.

I have to give credit to where credit is due.  Cotto 22 above say he was 'pleasantly;'  surprised '.  I was floored.  My CC took care of all of my flight problems, and it seems like I am good to go.  (knock wood).  In this post-COVID (world (not really), Murphy's law applies.  There is still ample time for all to screw up.

 

But my experience underscores a point I alway make in my posts whee relevant.  There is nothing more important SS than to develop a relationship with you cruise consultant, if he or she is any good.  A good CC will, most importantly go to bat for you with SS air, throw in an extra night a hotel pre or post cruise if your time is too tight, throw out deviation fees,  all sorts of little things that makes your experience more seemless and thus more pleasurable.  

 

I thought I had hit a wall with mine, but I was wrong and he didn't disappoint.  The problems I was having with SS air was all SS air.  It seems, adding insult to injury, that SS air is having problems with its software which they are trying to correct on the fly.  Which may experience the chaos they are leaving in their wake. Anyhow, good luck to all.  

[bobolz]

I agree that having a good CC does make a difference. Mine did a great job for me recently and responded quickly to get  a nonstop flight  vs an undesirable connection. I have yet to utilize any of the flights that have been booked through SS, due to trip cancellations, but every flight they have selected for us so far have been good ones. We will see how this next one works out, but so far so good. 

Edited October 11, 2022 by bobolz

[MBP&O2/O]

Ours was very good also, then he left and went to Switzerland. His replacement could be head of the guild of village idiots.

Emails invariably ignored/acknowledged.

Failure to inform about urgent  procedural changes. Nothing overly important 🤪 just flight cancellations, no boarding/embarkation details etc 🙄

Misinformation given on telephone conversations.

Dismissive of our concerns.

Either arrogant or ingnorant? Dunno, but I will never deal with that person again.

Parties and breweries spring to mind😁

 

So yes, a good PCC is good, a poor one is dangerous.

 

[les37b]

Had my further chase up... and SS still haven't responded to the TA emails.

 

If it wasn't for the fact I'm desperate to go, I would cancel this cruise for a refund.