The End of Lincoln Center

[richstowe]

You guys beat me to the punch .

32 minutes ago, Ken the cruiser said:

It sure doesn't sound like HAL is getting rid of the Lincoln Stage, but rather moving it to the Main Stage.

You''ll pardon me if I'm a bit suspicious . IF the quartet remains and there are concerts without jugglers or mimes, I'll accept the change to a less cozy venue . It was lovely being 10 feet from the performers though.

Edited to say DW thinks I'm way too cynical .

Edited January 13, 2023 by richstowe

[ChinaShrek]

52 minutes ago, jljcruise said:

I wonder  if people are really reading these articles from both the Points Guy and Cruise Hive or just reacting to the title! Here are my paraphrasing of what those two have said in the last few days:

 

---Both say that Lincoln Center is going away, but it's the LOCATION, not the classical music! The understanding I got from both articles was that the Lincoln Center musicians will become a traveling ensemble by the summer of 2023 and be playing on the Main Stage.  They don't mention what is happening to the old Lincoln Center stage area (I'm personally hoping for a Grand Dutch Cafe!)  

---The Vista class ships plus the Eurodam and Nieuw Amsterdam are supposed to get a live band at the Ocean Bar, rollout beginning Feb 23 according to Cruise Hive.

---Rolling Stone will replace BB King's on the Vista class ships with R&B, rock, and pop, 6 nights/week.

---BB Kings will stay on the Signature and Pinnacle class ships.

---Billboard will be on all ships except the Volendam and Zandam.

---Step One and BBC Earth will continue.

 

 

I am excited about these changes! They will continue to make HAL different from other cruise lines.

[Queenvee]

On 1/12/2023 at 11:16 AM, bdd123 said:

Why oceania and viking?  No celebrity?

I have sailed on Celebrity (4 or 5 times) but don't like the style of their ships these days and their entertainment options don't appeal.

[Queenvee]

i interpreted the articles to mean that LCS would not be available on every cruise, nearly every day but INSTEAD would be available in the Main Stage venue a few times during a voyage IF the ship you were on happened to have a traveling LCS ensemble.  If in fact each ship will have an LCS ensemble and the only change is their location, I'm fine with that....but am not optimistic that is the correct interpretation.  I'm on the Oosterdam in April and will be eager to find out more info.

[foodsvcmgr]

Queenvee that’s what I also interpret it to mean, would be thrilled to be wrong.

The whole story is rather ambiguous, are Ocean Bar trios only on the Vistas and LCS only rotating on Pinnacles with wrap around screens?

Not being presented in a manner that is easily understood.

[richstowe]

38 minutes ago, foodsvcmgr said:

Not being presented in a manner that is easily understood.

Perhaps that's the point . Ambiguity allows maximum flexibility .  

[Guest ldtr]

2 hours ago, Ken the cruiser said:

It sure doesn't sound like HAL is getting rid of the Lincoln Stage, but rather moving it to the Main Stage.

 

Holland America Line Makes Major Entertainment Changes (cruisehive.com)

 

Except  it stated that it would become a traveling ensemble, a main stage act rotating between ships. Which makes one think more visiting artists, not full time on ship.  I expect that you will see LC quartets show up in the main theater on some cruises, but maybe not all. Maybe a performance or two during a cruise, instead of the much more extensive scope of performances that occur today.

Edited January 13, 2023 by ldtr

[cruisemom42]

3 hours ago, Ken the cruiser said:

It sure doesn't sound like HAL is getting rid of the Lincoln Stage, but rather moving it to the Main Stage.

 

Holland America Line Makes Major Entertainment Changes (cruisehive.com)

 

 

Read it carefully. 

 

They are talking about the difference between having a group on EVERY ship performing multiple times per voyage to having (one? two?) traveling groups that move from ship to ship and do performances (once? a couple of times?) in the main showroom.

 

It is apples and oranges. Under the new proposal, it's possible that some cruises may never have a single "Lincoln Center" performance.

 

 

Edited January 13, 2023 by cruisemom42

[cwtravel]

I am going on a Mediterranean cruise in May on NCL. This is what they are doing.

 

https://crew-center.com/ncl-lays-staff-members-entertainment-department-will-be-reduced-across-fleet
 

 

[PACD_JG]

1 hour ago, cruisemom42 said:

Under the new proposal, it's possible that some cruises may never have a single "Lincoln Center" performance.

 

 

That's how I read it as well.  And for those that don't enjoy the performances, think outside of your small box.  It's not like HAL is going to offer you something else instead, so it's a net loss in overall choice of entertainment, which hurts when you're paying more money for it.

[TiogaCruiser]

4 hours ago, ldtr said:

Except  it stated that it would become a traveling ensemble, a main stage act rotating between ships. Which makes one think more visiting artists, not full time on ship.  I expect that you will see LC quartets show up in the main theater on some cruises, but maybe not all. Maybe a performance or two during a cruise, instead of the much more extensive scope of performances that occur today.

Which in my book is a further downgrade, from when they went from Adagio (quartets, then duos) to LCS. Adagio was essentially most every night ( except for a couple of nights off per cruise), and they played multiple sets during the evening. On our last cruise LCS was really good, but mostly in the afternoon. Explorers Lounge with Adagio was my hang out when I wasn’t on the promenade deck.

[HappyInVan]

3 hours ago, cwtravel said:

I am going on a Mediterranean cruise in May on NCL. This is what they are doing.

 

https://crew-center.com/ncl-lays-staff-members-entertainment-department-will-be-reduced-across-fleet
 

 

 

Not a surprise. Gotta to cut expenses, if they don't reduce the executive suite. After all, inflation is high while cruise fares are stagnant.

 

I wonder what's next on the chopping block? Replace BB King with local performers?

Edited January 14, 2023 by HappyInVan

[Guest ldtr]

1 hour ago, HappyInVan said:

 

Not a surprise. Gotta to cut expenses, if they don't reduce the executive suite. After all, inflation is high while cruise fares are stagnant.

 

I wonder what's next on the chopping block? Replace BB King with local performers?

NCL cut corporate staff including some senior management (VP) slots back in December.

[aaaaa]

As a follow up to the venue changes: the HAL website description for the Oosterdam now lists neither the Rolling Stone Rock Room nor the B.B. King Blues Club.

[VMax1700]

14 minutes ago, aaaaa said:

As a follow up to the venue changes: the HAL website description for the Oosterdam now lists neither the Rolling Stone Rock Room nor the B.B. King Blues Club.

It is listed on the updated 'Ships at a glance' pdf - updated 27th December 2022.

https://www.hollandamerica.com/en_US/cruise-ships.html 

The website description for Noordam also does not show the newly titled 'Rolling Stone Lounge' (different to Rolling Stone Rock Room on Pinnacle class ships).

I will give HAL the benefit of the doubt (for the moment) and suggest that the web designers have not yet produced an icon for the RS Lounge.

[*Miss G*]

36 minutes ago, aaaaa said:

As a follow up to the venue changes: the HAL website description for the Oosterdam now lists neither the Rolling Stone Rock Room nor the B.B. King Blues Club.

 

On the Oosterdam in October, BB King’s had just been converted to the Rolling Stone Lounge, per @VMax1700’s post.

[Boatdrill]

On 1/7/2023 at 3:21 PM, bz said:

Between the poor food choices and the disappearance of LCS, the lack and qualtyi on the main stage, think it may be goodbye to HAL, hello Celebrity, Azamara, Oceania, maybe Seaborn/Regent, even at the higher prices.  Just as I'm getting to 3 star.

The prices may be higher, but the all inclusive amenities some of those lines offer often make up for it. 

[Hlitner]

Perhaps we need to think, "what's in a name."  Be it the HAL Cats, BB King, Rolling Stones, etc. all HAL has done is pay to use a name.  The actual bands are simply "pick up" bands in that HAL hired individual musicians, gives them very little time to come together as a group. and than tosses them onto a ship.  What you generally get are a group of individuals trying to act like a real "band" but often failing on mulitple levels.

 

As one time, HAL used to hire established groups.  In fact, many other lines, such as Celebrity and MSC, still hire established groups, trios and duos.  They do not waste their efforts (and money) with a name...but rather use their money to hire decent established groups that go on a ship and do their thing.  

 

There are plenty of land-based groups that will jump at the opportunity to work on ships.  We have quite a few of these folks on other cruise lines, and they are delighted to be working with a steady paycheck and contract.  But, for whatever reason, many years ago HAL thought they could do it better by simply hiring musicians and expecting them to perform like a seasoned group.  It just ain't going to happen except in a few rare instances when a group of musicians just happens to come together and create some magic.  

 

We think the "suits" in Seattle need to move away from creating "brand names" and change their focus on hiring real quality groups for their various lounges and piano bars (which should again be used as piano bars).

 

Hank

[VMax1700]

21 minutes ago, Hlitner said:

The actual bands are simply "pick up" bands in that HAL hired individual musicians,

Not entirely true as the BBK musicians are selected by BBK Corporate (first hand information from numerous BBK musicians).  Here is a link to the site where artists can apply for auditions.

https://bbkings.com/at-sea/auditions/

[Hlitner]

1 hour ago, VMax1700 said:

Not entirely true as the BBK musicians are selected by BBK Corporate (first hand information from numerous BBK musicians).  Here is a link to the site where artists can apply for auditions.

https://bbkings.com/at-sea/auditions/

Your link makes my point.  They audition individual musicians and then throw a few together and expect them to work like a skilled group.  That is entirely different then actually auditioning/hiring well-seasoned groups.

 

Hank

[Colorado Klutch]

2 minutes ago, Hlitner said:

Your link makes my point.  They audition individual musicians and then throw a few together and expect them to work like a skilled group.  That is entirely different then actually auditioning/hiring well-seasoned groups.

 

Hank

 

Well-seasoned groups don't want to ride cruise ships all over the planet away from their friends and family. Well-seasoned groups typically have plenty of work paying good money; likely more than cruise lines are willing to pay. 

I don't mean to disparage the performers on cruise ships. They are talented and hard-working. And cruise jobs are good, steady work which is hard to come by for performing artists. But let's be real. It's not Broadway and it's not Carnegie Hall. It is good experience and good resume fodder for moving on to other good, steady work. 

[VMax1700]

3 minutes ago, Hlitner said:

Your link makes my point.  They audition individual musicians and then throw a few together and expect them to work like a skilled group.  That is entirely different then actually auditioning/hiring well-seasoned groups.

 

Hank

My link shows that it is BBK that 'throw a few together' and not HAL as stated in your post #193.

How do you think bands/groups are formed?  Not all went to the same school/college.  Many bands were formed or reformed after auditions. e.g. Rolling Stones auditioned Rory Gallagher to replace Mick Taylor.   

[brovol]

I always appreciate it when there is maybe a couple guitarist who can play a good variety of music, and play a few sets a couple times a day.  There are a lot of quality people who can do this, and I can listen to that every night.  Wish there was more of that on cruise ships.  Cant cost that much for just a couple musicians, and they can be versatile and play at different times in different venues. 

 

On Sky Princess last year they alternated performances in the atrium (an awesome location) between a husband and wife (she played guitar and sang, and he played percussion and piano), and a piano and string trio.  We loved hanging out there every evening after dinner. 

 

I enjoy the simple music options like that much more than the larger production stuff.

[HUNKY]

Foolish me.

 

I thought Lincoln Center, Rolling Stone and BB Kings PAID Holland America to sponsor these venues and performances.  To help build their brands, and gain new advocates, not HAL's.

 

Time for HAL to partner with businesses that want to SPONSOR and pay HAL for the advantage of a locked in demographic.  (Those consumers who have money to spend.)

 

 

[*Miss G*]

19 minutes ago, HUNKY said:

 

I thought Lincoln Center, Rolling Stone and BB Kings PAID Holland America to sponsor these venues and performances.  To help build their brands, and gain new advocates, not HAL's.

 

It’s a contractual partnership.  Both parties have something to gain.

 

50 minutes ago, Hlitner said:

Your link makes my point.  They audition individual musicians and then throw a few together and expect them to work like a skilled group.  That is entirely different then actually auditioning/hiring well-seasoned groups.

 

Hank

 

Pre-formed groups are welcome to audition.

 

Post-Modern Jukebox and Cantaré are two touring groups which come to mind.

Edited January 27, 2023 by *Miss G*