Muster drills to return to pre-Covid style

[RocketMan275]

10 minutes ago, scooter6139 said:

Are you the Point Guy?  Or do you work for them?  You seem awfully INVESTED in their single article here.

I've nothing to do with the points guy.  I do find his analysis, not just this article, but his other subjects as well.

 

Now, why don't you ask the resident 'safety expert' why he seems so awfully INVESTED in the inpersonmuster drill.

[scooter6139]

28 minutes ago, RocketMan275 said:

I've nothing to do with the points guy.  I do find his analysis, not just this article, but his other subjects as well.

 

Now, why don't you ask the resident 'safety expert' why he seems so awfully INVESTED in the inpersonmuster drill.

Well that is simple:  he has experience in the field.  Next?

[ChiefMateJRK]

12 minutes ago, scooter6139 said:

Well that is simple:  he has experience in the field.  Next?

Sometimes it is possible to "know too much." 

[scooter6139]

15 minutes ago, ChiefMateJRK said:

Sometimes it is possible to "know too much." 

Agreed, but I personally will give more credence to "tons of real world work experience" vs "I just read an internet article."  

Just a reminder, I am for eMuster as it's more convenient for me and makes my cruise easier.  

 

 

[ontheweb]

18 minutes ago, scooter6139 said:

Agreed, but I personally will give more credence to "tons of real world work experience" vs "I just read an internet article."  

Just a reminder, I am for eMuster as it's more convenient for me and makes my cruise easier.  

 

 

But does it make is safer? If not, what is the point of having a muster drill other than it is required?

[KasperGutman]

If this discussion were occurring on my cruise, as this point I would be looking for a waiver to sign that says:

 

"In exchange for being excused the balance of the argument, I agree that in the event of the ship sinking, I will make no attempt to board a lifeboat and will quietly drown in my cabin" 🙂

[RocketMan275]

11 hours ago, ontheweb said:

But does it make is safer? If not, what is the point of having a muster drill other than it is required?

Exactly the point.  Does the inpersonmuster make cruising safer?  How does a briefing no one can hear or see improve safety?

[RocketMan275]

12 hours ago, scooter6139 said:

Well that is simple:  he has experience in the field.  Next?

Not so simple.  One can become emotionally involved in a specific solution to the deteriment of seeing how other solutions can be more effecitve, ie, we have to do it this way because we've always done it this way.

[ontheweb]

14 minutes ago, RocketMan275 said:

Not so simple.  One can become emotionally involved in a specific solution to the deteriment of seeing how other solutions can be more effecitve, ie, we have to do it this way because we've always done it this way.

Better, I have seen it work while I cannot see how the new way will work.

 

I have a feeling that you are not going to thank me for correcting how you characterized the reactions of veteran seamen. 🤣

[ontheweb]

18 minutes ago, RocketMan275 said:

Exactly the point.  Does the inpersonmuster make cruising safer?  How does a briefing no one can hear or see improve safety?

Better question---How does the training of the crew improve when they do not train in a situation with the passengers.

 

It has been pointed out that the first few old traditional muster drills have been a bit of a mess because the crews have not been doing them since the new e-muster drills. And it would be even worse if their performance was not good in a real muster situation.

[www3traveler]

If all of you who believe there is a better system to the Muster Drill, then I respectfully request that you write a letter to the International Maritime Organzation in London, U.K.  THEY are the only ones who can change how it is done.  The cruise lines have no say in the matter nor does the United States Coast Guard.  All but One Norwegian ships are foreign-registered (The Bahamas).  The Bahamaian flag flies off the stern of every Norwegian ship except the Pride of America.

Edited February 8, 2023 by www3traveler
add a word

[RocketMan275]

38 minutes ago, ontheweb said:

Better question---How does the training of the crew improve when they do not train in a situation with the passengers.

 

It has been pointed out that the first few old traditional muster drills have been a bit of a mess because the crews have not been doing them since the new e-muster drills. And it would be even worse if their performance was not good in a real muster situation.

I have a feeling that you are not going to thank me for correcting how you characterized the the 'mess' that occured at the inpersonmuster drill. 

 

It has been pointed out that the 'mess' occurred at the muster station during the safety briefing that was given.  It has also been pointed out that this safety briefing isn't an important part of the muster drill.  

[RocketMan275]

2 minutes ago, www3traveler said:

If all of you who believe there is a better system to the Muster Drill, then I respectfully request that you write a letter to the International Maritime Organzation in London, U.K.  THEY are the only ones who can change how it is done.  The cruise lines have no say in the matter nor does the United States Coast Guard.  All but One Norwegian ships are foreign-registered (The Bahamas).  The Bahamaian flag flies off the stern of every Norwegian ship except the Pride of America.

I suggest all of you who believe that the inpersonmuster drill is a better system to the eMuster Drill, write a letter to the International Maritime Organzation in London, U.K.  If the cruise lines have no say in this matter then why are Royal and Carnival keeping the emuster drill while NCL/Disney are reverting to the inpersonmuster drill to save money even though they believe the emuster provides better training.

[ChiefMateJRK]

57 minutes ago, www3traveler said:

If all of you who believe there is a better system to the Muster Drill, then I respectfully request that you write a letter to the International Maritime Organzation in London, U.K.  THEY are the only ones who can change how it is done.  The cruise lines have no say in the matter nor does the United States Coast Guard. 

Shouldn't it be the cruise lines working with the IMO to negotiate better processes?

[chengkp75]

Just now, ChiefMateJRK said:

Shouldn't it be the cruise lines working with the IMO to negotiate better processes?

And, doesn't the fact that they haven't done this, make you wonder why?  It makes me feel that the reason to keep the e-muster is for passenger convenience, and not safety, since the IMO could care less about passenger convenience.

[RocketMan275]

1 minute ago, chengkp75 said:

And, doesn't the fact that they haven't done this, make you wonder why?  It makes me feel that the reason to keep the e-muster is for passenger convenience, and not safety, since the IMO could care less about passenger convenience.

Since the IMO hasn't forced Royal or Carnival return to the inpersonmuster drill, it tells me that IMO is satisfied with the emuster drill.

[MoCruiseFan]

I'll gladly spend an hour to help ensure my safety in the event of an emergency

[ChiefMateJRK]

1 hour ago, RocketMan275 said:

Since the IMO hasn't forced Royal or Carnival return to the inpersonmuster drill, it tells me that IMO is satisfied with the emuster drill.

Bingo!!!!

[ChiefMateJRK]

41 minutes ago, MoCruiseFan said:

I'll gladly spend an hour to help ensure my safety in the event of an emergency

So would I.  I'm just not convinced that this cluster-drill has done anything to ensure my safety.

[chengkp75]

3 minutes ago, ChiefMateJRK said:

Bingo!!!!

No, since the WHO still considers covid to be a health emergency,  the IMO  will keep the conditional approval for the e-muster,  but still consider it subject to review of effectiveness of the training aspect. 

[scooter6139]

3 hours ago, RocketMan275 said:

Not so simple.  One can become emotionally involved in a specific solution to the deteriment of seeing how other solutions can be more effecitve, ie, we have to do it this way because we've always done it this way.

 Yes, not so simple as "one can become emotionally involved in a specific solution to the detriment of seeing how other solution can be more effective"  IE, you read a single article from a paid for advertising site that quotes only a few sources and have taken it on blind faith.  

 

I don't know which one is safer and neither do you, nor do we know much else on this entire topic.  Ergo we should probably listen to anyone who has experience on this, either from working on a cruise line OR been in actual emergency onboard a ship requiring lifeboat evacuation.

15 hours ago, ontheweb said:

But does it make is safer? If not, what is the point of having a muster drill other than it is required?

As I said, I don't know which one ultimately is safer.  I prefer the E as it is just easier.  Fact is, I probably learned the most from an old muster on the deck, as I knew what lifeboat was hopefully going to save my life if necessary.

 

34 minutes ago, ChiefMateJRK said:

So would I.  I'm just not convinced that this cluster-drill has done anything to ensure my safety.

It will get better and more streamlined with repeat use, just like the cruising itself did right after restart.  I recall reading about all that here on CC too.

[BirdTravels]

4 hours ago, RocketMan275 said:

Exactly the point.  Does the inpersonmuster make cruising safer?  How does a briefing no one can hear or see improve safety?

Guess what??? It doesn't matter. 

 

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