Crows Nest closed from 4-9 every evening for private (park west) group - Oostradam

[Real NHDOC]

I can say I would also be pretty upset if I were on this cruise.  It's another one of those "conditions of the contract" that most people never read and some apologists here on CC think HAL will never abuse that allows this, but clearly this crosses a moral line of what's right and wrong.  It's one thing to take a venue like the Rolling Stone lounge and close it during the day when it would not ordinarily be used for anything else and let the Park West people peddle their near worthless, objectively terrible art but it's quite another to take a space like the Crow's nest over every evening of a cruise. One of the bright spots of the post covid cruising was the absence of Park West on the ships - we had hoped it was permanent but apparently, like cockroaches, you just can't get rid of them!

[Mary229]

2 hours ago, TRLD said:

Where?

 

HAL ships do not have the best layout when it comes to multi use venues. Most are used for nightly entertainment and as such used after 4.

 

The Crows Nest is mostly used during the day for its ocean views with some activities.

On my35 day voyage they were set up on the first floor for several events, their studio was next to photography on the 3 and one special event for one evening in the Rock room

[TRLD]

8 minutes ago, Mary229 said:

On my35 day voyage they were set up on the first floor for several events, their studio was next to photography on the 3 and one special event for one evening in the Rock room

During normal cruises yes they do their auctions lasting about an hour else where. For these special "art" cruises for the size group and 4 hours every night really not anywhere else on a HAL.

 

Same reason they use Sky Walkers on Princess ships, where they do their normal auctions in explorers on Hrand class ships.

[TRLD]

1 hour ago, Blackduck59 said:

Aren't all the Lincoln center stage spaces basically unused for now?

Not large enough.

[TRLD]

1 hour ago, Haljo1935 said:

Dec Jan on K'dam, the "art fest" was set up during the day in Billboard Onboard and Rolling Stone Rock Room. 

 

 

 

 

 

Yes for one of their hour long art auctions during the day.

 

Problem is this is not one of their set up, auction to any passenger that wants to attend, take down after an hour.

 

This is a special cruise where they invite people especially for the cruise. Basically their best customers to do "special showings" by invitation only. Thus the closed off private event.

 

All to make the lambs feel special before the slaughter.

[TRLD]

42 minutes ago, Real NHDOC said:

I can say I would also be pretty upset if I were on this cruise.  It's another one of those "conditions of the contract" that most people never read and some apologists here on CC think HAL will never abuse that allows this, but clearly this crosses a moral line of what's right and wrong.  It's one thing to take a venue like the Rolling Stone lounge and close it during the day when it would not ordinarily be used for anything else and let the Park West people peddle their near worthless, objectively terrible art but it's quite another to take a space like the Crow's nest over every evening of a cruise. One of the bright spots of the post covid cruising was the absence of Park West on the ships - we had hoped it was permanent but apparently, like cockroaches, you just can't get rid of them!

Rather amazing how some here on cruise critic rather then talking about facts or the details of situations start throwing out labels or names when people post things counter to their view.

[TRLD]

55 minutes ago, Horizon chaser 1957 said:

The thing is, Park West is NOT a specialty group taking over ONE cruise. They are the company with the art contract for EVERY SAILING. If they paid big bucks to bring lots of people aboard and took over everything for one sailing, so be it. To let one of their contract service providers shut down the Crows Nest every evening of every sailing is a different thing entirely.

Except they are not doing that every sailing  Certainly have not done it on any of my recent sailings  Just as they do not take over Skywalkers on Princess.

 

They do have 1 or 2 sailings per year where they invite their best customers, offer "special" showings, usually gave one of the artists whose works they carry on board for presentations. During those sailing then yes they do take over space for their private events. In this case Crows Nest for 5 hours. A good portion of which is after dark. Same as they do Skywalkers on Princess when they do the same on that line.

[Mary229]

7 minutes ago, TRLD said:

Rather amazing how some here on cruise critic rather then talking about facts or the details of situations start throwing out labels or names when people post things counter to their view.

Well truth be told I have never met anyone on Cruise Critic defend Park West so fervently.   You do them a great service. Now back to why you think it is ok for a contractor to commandeer a popular space for the entire length of a cruise.  I don’t think anyone would complain about a single evening but not for the entire cruise.  
 

PS 30+ day cruises are fairly normal for HAL

Edited April 23 by Mary229

[terrydtx]

18 minutes ago, Mary229 said:

Well truth be told I have never met anyone on Cruise Critic defend Park West so fervently.   You do them a great service. Now back to why you think it is ok for a contractor to commandeer a popular space for the entire length of a cruise.  I don’t think anyone would complain about a single evening but not for the entire cruise.  
 

PS 30+ day cruises are fairly normal for HAL

I was thinking the poster was a Park West emplyee.

[Wehwalt]

It is not every night of the cruise. Looking through the Navigator App, on this 11 night cruise, embarking April 19, the Crows Nest is listed as closing at 4 pm on April 21, 23, 24 and 26, on the last of which it is scheduled to reopen at 8:30. Of course, the listed hours might change, but the Crow's Nest has already been open full time three of the first five nights of the cruise (it is night here now. Or almost).

[Essiesmom]

It is interesting that MSC does not have art auctions.  Could it be because their mostly European clientele are too art savvy to fall for such drivel?  I wonder if Costa, Mein Schiff, AIDA, Marella, Fred Olsen have Park West or similar?  
   If you want real art from the artist, visit an arts festival…many are held around the country during spring and summer.  EM

[Mary229]

1 minute ago, Essiesmom said:

It is interesting that MSC does not have art auctions.  Could it be because their mostly European clientele are too art savvy to fall for such drivel?  I wonder if Costa, Mein Schiff, AIDA, Marella, Fred Olsen have Park West or similar?  
   If you want real art from the artist, visit an arts festival…many are held around the country during spring and summer.  EM

HAL went quite a few years without auctions, it is disheartening to see their reappearance.  They had instead an untyped art gallery. 
 

you make a good point however one could get quite an art education on the ship just by downloading their art guide and walking around the ship and see the many incredible works of art which adorn the walls of the ship

[terrydtx]

3 hours ago, TRLD said:

Where?

 

HAL ships do not have the best layout when it comes to multi use venues. Most are used for nightly entertainment and as such used after 4.

 

The Crows Nest is mostly used during the day for its ocean views with some activities.

On our first Volendam cruise the first floor in the Atrium was used for the art auctions by PW and they were held during the daytime on sea days only. I would be very upset if they took over the Crow's Nest, one of the only two indoor bar venues and by far the quietist on the Volendam.

[TRLD]

19 minutes ago, terrydtx said:

On our first Volendam cruise the first floor in the Atrium was used for the art auctions by PW and they were held during the daytime on sea days only. I would be very upset if they took over the Crow's Nest, one of the only two indoor bar venues and by far the quietist on the Volendam.

Yes for there normal auctions. Problem is this is not their normal auctions. This is a special cruise where have negotiated for private events the same as other groups do on HAL and on competing cruise lines. Unlike the normal auctions these are private events.

 

So where else on HAL designed ships can they hold these private events with the same size and duration in the evening.

 

I suspect anyone that has cruised a lot has run into and been negatively impacted by groups. That is why the normal discussion is how to look for and avoid them. I have seen groups take over entire dining venue for a cruise, block a specialty dining venue for multiple nights, and many other things on HAL and its main competition Celebrity and Princess.

 

Nothing really new it happens.

[TRLD]

1 hour ago, Mary229 said:

Well truth be told I have never met anyone on Cruise Critic defend Park West so fervently.   You do them a great service. Now back to why you think it is ok for a contractor to commandeer a popular space for the entire length of a cruise.  I don’t think anyone would complain about a single evening but not for the entire cruise.  
 

PS 30+ day cruises are fairly normal for HAL

Too funny

 

Please quote anything I said in defense of Park West and that indicates that they are a good bisiness. What I said was 

1. That they do these special cruises

2. What is happening on HAL happens on their competition

3.Same thing happens with other groups holding special events in various venues.

 

If you actually ready posts I have been quite critical of Park West and there pretty bogus product.

 

What I have been presenting is what is going on is not unusual. In this case it is a special cruise where they have negotiated space for private events. The same as other groups have.

 

 

 

Edited April 23 by TRLD

[TRLD]

59 minutes ago, terrydtx said:

I was thinking the poster was a Park West emplyee.

Again instead of actually talking about details trying to discredit.

 

I am neither a cruise line, Park West employee. I am also not a Park West customer and consider them and other vendors omcruise ships such as Effy to be rather sleazy businesses that are heavily dependent upon the lack of knowledge of their business among cruise ship passengers.

 

I am someone that cruises about 100 days each year on multiple ships and have seen many such impacts by groups on board over the years.

 

I will point out that what is going on this ship is not unusual for a group onboard HAL and other mass market ships. 

[Mary229]

14 minutes ago, TRLD said:

Too funny

 

Please quote anything I said in defense of Park West and that indicates that they are a good bisiness. What I said was 

1. That they do these special cruises

2. What is happening on HAL happens on their competition

3.Same thing happens with other groups holding special events in various venues.

 

If you actually ready posts I have been quite critical of Park West and there pretty bogus product.

 

What I have been presenting is what is going on is not unusual. In this case it is a special cruise where they have negotiated space for private events. The same as other groups have.

 

 

 

I have sailed HaL for years and I have never seen any special group use the crow’s nest for more than 2 hours - ONCE, or twice during a very long sailing.  It is not a daily occurrence.  The Crow’s Nest has gone to any iterations but it has always been probably the most popular venue on HAL.  The original post has been called into question as to the complete facts, that I accept is a greater possibility than HAL using the Crow’s Nest as a reserved venue for special groups.    
 

 

[ChinaShrek]

If this is a special art cruise then there are people (maybe hundreds?) who have paid to enjoy the Park West art talks on the cruise. While some people are inconvenienced, others are happy.  I have a friend that loves going to Park West talks and feels that it is a good way to learn business practices or marketing.

[TRLD]

14 minutes ago, Mary229 said:

I have sailed HaL for years and I have never seen any special group use the crow’s nest for more than 2 hours - ONCE, or twice during a very long sailing.  It is not a daily occurrence.  The Crow’s Nest has gone to any iterations but it has always been probably the most popular venue on HAL.  The original post has been called into question as to the complete facts, that I accept is a greater possibility than HAL using the Crow’s Nest as a reserved venue for special groups.    
 

 

So where have I defended Park West?

 

After all that is the statement you made that you have not seen anyone Defend Park West that strongly.

 

 

You have not seen special groups take over the Crows Nest for more than 2 hours, but you have seen special groups take it over for private events  So apparently we agree that special groups do negotiate for private events and close venues 

 

So apparently the disagreement is over which venues and how long.

 

Apparently our experiences differ.

[Haljo1935]

3 hours ago, Haljo1935 said:

Exactly - and that's a real problem for cover lovers. Not to mention closing off an outside view.

This should read "coffee" lovers; too late to edit.

 

Closing off the only place to get paid coffee is a problem. 

[JennysUncle]

FYI  ArtAuctionsAbroad  No mention of knowing anything about art.

 

a CC thread on the VIP cruises

Edited April 23 by JennysUncle
added info

[Mary229]

44 minutes ago, TRLD said:

So where have I defended Park West?

I will let you reread your own responses as I just did. 

[Horizon chaser 1957]

2 hours ago, TRLD said:

Except they are not doing that every sailing  Certainly have not done it on any of my recent sailings  Just as they do not take over Skywalkers on Princess.

 

They do have 1 or 2 sailings per year where they invite their best customers, offer "special" showings, usually gave one of the artists whose works they carry on board for presentations. During those sailing then yes they do take over space for their private events. In this case Crows Nest for 5 hours. A good portion of which is after dark. Same as they do Skywalkers on Princess when they do the same on that line.

OK, thanks for clarifying. That was not made clear, and I was already donning battle gear for my fall cruise on Oosterdam.😂

[Blackduck59]

If this is indeed a special "art" ( I use the term lightly) cruise. It should have been billed as such so that full fare guests can make an informed decision to book it or not.

[TRLD]

24 minutes ago, Blackduck59 said:

If this is indeed a special "art" ( I use the term lightly) cruise. It should have been billed as such so that full fare guests can make an informed decision to book it or not.

Cruise lines do not disclose groups on board. Nor do they provide advance notice of any venues that might be closed for private functions.

 

Sometimes you get a warning when trying to select dining because some groups lock up  most of the dining capacity for a given time such as early or late fixed. Mcrcruiser opened a topic exactly about that happening on April 17. Which for many might be more impact full  then taking over Crows Nest for 4 nights.

 

Could be worse as this post indicated

https://boards.cruisecritic.com/topic/1443495-how-to-find-if-a-large-group-is-booked-on-a-cruise/?do=findComment&comment=29914780

Edited April 23 by TRLD