Is Princess Trying Too Hard

[CPA92]

A large part of what keeps me coming back to Princess (I'm on a cruise right now!) can be said in two words - PROMENADE DECK!!!

 

I look at all these new behemoths being built and wonder what it feels like to cruise without easy access to a good walking deck.

 

 

I agree! I'm sailing for the first time on RCI and am disappointed already that there is no promenade deck. It's by far my favorite place on a ship. I don't need rock climbing walls and Johnny rockets on a cruise ship when I can get them on land. I can't get a promenade deck on land!

Princess better not ever take away the promenade decks!

[Amuse Bouche]

:D This made me laugh, as I prefer Southwest as well, even tho I usually prefer everything higher end if I can afford it. But, I think I know why. southwest has more comfortable seats. I don't know how, but they do, no shoulder crunch.

And airlines started flying cattle cars. LOL. Ironically, I prefer Southwest to the other majors, but I digress...

 

On topic-

So, we took our first cruise on the Regal Princess in 2001 to Alaska. It was our honeymoon, and there were a lot of things we didn't like. The food smelled wonderful but had no taste- we purchased the honeymoon package and called every day but didn't get it until day 5, and it being our first cruise, we fell for every sale tactic that was slipped under the door. But, we had a wonderful time in spite of that. It's really hard to expect perfection when 2000 people are expecting the same thing you are all the time. The room was nice, the activities were cheesy but met expectations.

After that, we switched to HAL. We visit Alaska every year, and the port times were better than everyone else. The food was better, but we are terrible foodies, so it really wasn't 4 star, but really not bad considering the masses they feed all at once.

We are back to Princess this year because we are finally tired of Alaska, and the 15 day RT from SF is right where we want to be. (we live 30 miles away, and never see the GG bridge, so it's a gimme)

That all being said, it all really doesn't matter. We want a nice room, no hourly schedule, no drive, no living out of a suitcase, and to spend time with each other with no distractions. That's what we are getting.

I've looked at all the photos, on here and the Princess site, of the food. No 4 star again, but at least there is regular food. Yep, that's what I said, regular food. On HAL, I would CRAVE a burger or a burrito, something normal, but it was all not very well executed soft gourmet. Yes, there is the buffet, but like all buffets, it all tastes like it came out of a can or cardboard. I don't really care this time, as long as it is edible. Of course, i'm bringing srirachi for DH, and sea salt for me.

I don't really care if the perks are at a minimum. I don't really care if the temperature of the pool isn't up to par. I don't even really care if the carpet is a hideous color. All I care about is having a comfortable bed, warm water, a wide selection of mundane food, and no grumpiness from DH, who has a high stress occupation.

It's a vacation. It's a floating resort full of thousands of people who all want the best bang for the buck. The thing is...is it a reasonable bang? Or are we all wanting even more bang because that's human nature?

I don't like to see quality go down anymore than the next person...but that's the way of our ever expanding world. Look at architecture. A hand crafted home used to be the norm before they had better ways to build them. Now we get nearly prefab homes and only the very rich can afford hand crafted. It's life.

Create the memories, smell the roses, take the photos...10 yrs from now, you could be looking at photos with loving reminiscence...and completely forget that for a brief moment your ears were assaulted by the MUTS.

[Loonbeam]

The drawback to the smaller profile is that you have to spread fixed costs among a smaller pool, which raises prices and makes it harder to compete.

 

Or as someone on RCCL put it to me, it doesn't matter if its the Oasis or a tugboat. There still is one captain.

 

I think Princess could be a totally successful cruise line if it was smaller and marketed to the premium customer. As I mentioned the original idea of "Grand Class Cruising" - which was actually ushered in with Sun Princess' inaugural in 1995 - was to offer a premium product on bigger ships that provided more options. The problem is that Princess created too many bigger ships and right, there aren't enough in the premium market to fill a cruise line with a mass market business profile. It's like a nice little neighborhood restaurant that expands and then goes out of business because the quality goes down the drain. Is the root cause greed?

 

Princess - even when it was a smaller cruise line - was always an innovator and many times inaugurated the largest passenger ships sailing. But it was a controlled size and so the premium product could be offered. I know it's a pipe dream, but if they were to sell off all of the mega-Grand ships and concentrate on a smaller operation, they could satisfy some of the complaints from long time passengers...what that might do to the per diem is a different story.

 

And I don’t like to point fingers, but it seems after Phillip Kleweno left the CEO position, the quality started to be chipped away from the product.

[baldercash]

A recent cruise on Emerald convinced us not to book our long planned bucket list trans-pacific cruise on Princess.

For years we have dreamed of doing this cruise and always thought we would do it on Princess. Now that we finally have the time and money to do a 35 day exotic cruise we went with Celebrity for next Oct. The decision was based on their Aqua Class cabins and that Modern Luxury feel of their ships.

This cruise is a big deal for us and is a lot of money to us, we want it to be special. We want to feel pampered. X delivers on that, our last cruise on Princess did not.

 

In spite of my wife telling me not to I left 4 deposits for future cruises on Emerald.

Once home we reviewed the cruise and agreed that it was likely our last planned cruise on Princess, as we were not impressed.

We will cruise Princess again but based only on the cruise being deeply discounted and a special itinerary.

We appreciate Princess may need to cut corners but we are not willing to pay top price for a discounted ho hum experience.

[Redwing55]

Wow,

I guess blood is in the water.

I admit that I haven't cruised a multiple of lines. I was on the Emerald just this last March. I have also read more than a few blogs and reviews since then.

I'll see first hand in a couple of months, but I truly would be surprised if things changed that much in such a bad direction. I believe the posters aren't making things up. I do wonder if ones expectations are just too high. Nothing wrong with that.

 

Maybe we're in an age of too much information (TMI.) People hear, read about a nit and just keep looking for it and more. I remember this occurred on a message board about a vehicle that I owned. We were mostly all very passionate owners. When reading through it, one might suspect that most of the vehicles were lemons. And people were posting things that most of us would never have noticed or have been bothered by. Over the years, it turns out it was one of the most reliable vehicle with one of the highest % resale value- go figure. (I still think it was a great vehicle- so much so that for the first time in my life, I actually bought the same model, seven years later.)

 

I guess such is the age we live in. For me, I'll continue to enjoy my cruises. I'll be open minded enough keep an eye open too. But I do wonder if people are just ruining their experiences by looking for flaws instead of seeing what is in front of them on the plus side.

I guess my glass is just 3/4 full.

[dmwnc1959]

I'm not sure that it started with the Carnival merger, but it certainly was on it's way...

 

I was on the Sun Princess in 1997 (two years after her inaugural) and the Dawn Princess in 1998 (the year after her inaugural) doing the Western Caribbean and Alaska respectively, both before the Carnival Corporation take over, and even then I didn't consider them premium ships. Maybe upper mass market, but certainly not premium. The food was superb, the ships was very nice, and the experience was amazing. But so was the Celebrity Galaxy when I cruised her in 1997 to Alaska. As a matter of fact, it was much better. That was what I considered being as close to 'premium' as you could get without actually sailing on a premium cruise line.

 

(Referring to Post #60)...

The best post I have seen on the subject! Thanks for your insight Brian.

 

Mike:)

 

Agree and well said bdjam!

 

If Princess was a premium product with a much smaller fleet of older, bigger ships (pre-Carnival Corp takeover) could they compete today against the modern and upgraded fleets of Celebrity Cruises, the diversity of RCI, the premium ships of Azamara, and new builds of Seabourn and Oceania Cruises?

 

Without the influx of money from Carnival Corporation could they have built newer, smaller ships and still competed, or would they just have a fleet of aging 15+ year old ships? And who would they be competing against then?

 

Holland-America and Cunard would most likely would be gone without Carnival Corporation stepping in. HAL's entire current fleet of ships (minus the Prinsendam) was built after Carnival Corp took them over. Same goes for Cunard. They would have nothing as they were well on their way to bankruptcy with their ageing fleet and the QE2.

 

And without so many mass-market ships Princess could not position themselves as they have done in a vast global market, especially with today's economy.

 

.

[Cruise Junky]

We must be completely oblivious. We've cruised Princess most years since 2001 and other than different menus that still offer great choices, we haven't noticed any downgrading of quality. Most recently on Ruby in September, great cruise, great service and seeing as my luggage was lost I boarded that ship pissy. There was nothing to complain about. Cruising is evolving as a vacation, obviously there are people that aren't happy with that, but reading these boards, there is not a cruiseline out there that's not going through the same thing.

[pris993]

Glad you posted this. Thought I was the only one feeling this way.

 

LuLu

~~~~

 

We probably are in the minority. Glad we have each other. :)

[Cruise Junky]

Have enjoyed several cruises on Princess but the one thing that is making me jump ship to Celebrity is MUTS. Can not take one more cruise where a concert or sports activity is blaring at me.

 

You might want to check out the 100s of posts about screaming loud techno music in public areas before committing.

[caribill]

Whether directly or indirectly, a number of changes have been in response to passengers requests as indicated by postings on these boards.

 

a) People complained that other cruise lines has free soft-serve "ice cream" and Princess did not. Result, gained the free soft-serve, but lost the daily ice cream sundae hour in the buffet.

 

b) People complained that the menus have not been changed for several years. Result, the new menus with hamburger and tri-tips and less dessert choices.

 

c) People complained it was hard to find a seat for the shows in the Princess Theater. Result, shows' length was cut by 1/3rd so they could be offere4d three times a night.

 

d) People complained the aisles were too crowded in the Horizon Court. Result: A modified Horizon Court with wider aisles and better traffic flow, but less food selections so that the lines could come from multiple directions.

 

Sometimes you get what you ask for...and that does not always mean you will be happy with what you get.

[Coral]

Whether directly or indirectly, a number of changes have been in response to passengers requests as indicated by postings on these boards.

 

a) People complained that other cruise lines has free soft-serve "ice cream" and Princess did not. Result, gained the free soft-serve, but lost the daily ice cream sundae hour in the buffet.

 

b) People complained that the menus have not been changed for several years. Result, the new menus with hamburger and tri-tips and less dessert choices.

 

c) People complained it was hard to find a seat for the shows in the Princess Theater. Result, shows' length was cut by 1/3rd so they could be offere4d three times a night.

 

d) People complained the aisles were too crowded in the Horizon Court. Result: A modified Horizon Court with wider aisles and better traffic flow, but less food selections so that the lines could come from multiple directions.

 

Sometimes you get what you ask for...and that does not always mean you will be happy with what you get.

 

The menus were changed to save money. I doubt it had anything to do with people on this board or on the ship asking for new menus. They could easily have created new menus and kept a higher quality of items and higher quality of meat on the menus. They purposely changed menus to cut costs. We have a local restaurant that changes their menus 3x a year - they don't decline the items in the menu just change them to something more seasonly.

 

As far as the Theatre - Princess had poor planning by taking a Grand class ship, adding 500 people and then not increasing the size of the Theatre. People really had the right to complain. The result was more due to Princess having too many people on a ship and not enough space in the theatre. People really didn't complain about getting a seat in the theatre on the Grand, Golden, Star, Sun, Dawn, Coral or Island, Sapphire or Diamond Princess.....

 

New buffet - again, this was more of a cost cutting feature. The new design is wonderful but Princess choose to cut the the items that are offered in the buffet. They could easily kept the variety but choose not to do so.

 

Ice cream - they could easily have installed a soft serve for those who wanted it. On RCCL, it was a self serve machine on one of my ships. How difficult would that have been to add that? My work cafeteria offers both types of ice cream as self serve and I can tell you that our cafeteria is not luxury by any means.

[Shogun]

Hi Caribill

 

Nice post,

 

Hi All

 

May be its just down to UK marketing but never thought of Princess as a

 

4 star cruise line always looked at them as a 3 star mass market, main stream family cruise line,

 

while HAL was the 4 star line based on couples rather than family and more expensive

 

however in the last few years HAL prices have come down and thy now appear a more main stream cruise line,

 

so if HAL moves into Princess market where does that leave Princess

go down market,

 

yours Shogun

[Coral]

delete

[Seafoam Green]

I don't really care if the perks are at a minimum. I don't really care if the temperature of the pool isn't up to par. I don't even really care if the carpet is a hideous color. All I care about is having a comfortable bed, warm water, a wide selection of mundane food, and no grumpiness from DH, who has a high stress occupation.

It's a vacation. It's a floating resort full of thousands of people who all want the best bang for the buck. The thing is...is it a reasonable bang? Or are we all wanting even more bang because that's human nature?

I don't like to see quality go down anymore than the next person...but that's the way of our ever expanding world. Look at architecture. A hand crafted home used to be the norm before they had better ways to build them. Now we get nearly prefab homes and only the very rich can afford hand crafted. It's life.

Create the memories, smell the roses, take the photos...10 yrs from now, you could be looking at photos with loving reminiscence...and completely forget that for a brief moment your ears were assaulted by the MUTS.

 

+1 Exactly!

[mr green]

We must be completely oblivious. We've cruised Princess most years since 2001 and other than different menus that still offer great choices, we haven't noticed any downgrading of quality. Most recently on Ruby in September, great cruise, great service and seeing as my luggage was lost I boarded that ship pissy. There was nothing to complain about. Cruising is evolving as a vacation, obviously there are people that aren't happy with that, but reading these boards, there is not a cruiseline out there that's not going through the same thing.

 

Strange. We also began cruising Princess in 2001, and it was great

! However, IMO every year since that time little cut backs kept creeping in, to the point that last month I listed seven I recalled having taken place as of our last cruise in May of 2012. So sad to see the line sink a little each year.

 

john

[baldercash]

"Originally Posted by Amuse Bouche View Post

I don't really care if the perks are at a minimum. I don't really care if the temperature of the pool isn't up to par. I don't even really care if the carpet is a hideous color. All I care about is having a comfortable bed, warm water, a wide selection of mundane food, and no grumpiness from DH, who has a high stress occupation.

It's a vacation. It's a floating resort full of thousands of people who all want the best bang for the buck. The thing is...is it a reasonable bang? Or are we all wanting even more bang because that's human nature?

I don't like to see quality go down anymore than the next person...but that's the way of our ever expanding world. Look at architecture. A hand crafted home used to be the norm before they had better ways to build them. Now we get nearly prefab homes and only the very rich can afford hand crafted. It's life.

Create the memories, smell the roses, take the photos...10 yrs from now, you could be looking at photos with loving reminiscence...and completely forget that for a brief moment your ears were assaulted by the MUTS."

 

This is the problem and why we don't want to do a exotic 35 day cruise on Princess. We have no problem sailing in an inside cabin or Ocean view and we would not complain about our experience especially when we get a great discount. Whats to complain about you get more then you pay for. Who cares about deterioration of the cruise experience.

But read the reviews on how a new suite passenger gets treated http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=1763331. Princess will loose it's highest profit generating Passengers with this approach. Read the link and you see the loyalty passengers are acknowledged better then a premium suite paying passenger. In my opinion the new reality is that the vast majority of loyalty passengers are cruising with big discounts and not premium cabins which is why Princess is geared the way they currently are. Princess now feels to us like going to a family lodge.

 

It is not just Princess we did a trans-atlantic on RCI last spring and the ship was packed with Diamond and Diamond plus passengers. Truth be told we cruised for the same reason, 16 days at $490.00 for an inside cabin with a $300 ship board credit! Who cares as it is cheaper then staying at home, no cooking or cleaning.

But the casino was dead and the bartenders were complaining that no one ordered a drink during the cruise. We all did the free drinks every evening thing. We had a great time but it was a floating retirement home. We used the cruise to get to Europe as it was cheaper then flying!

 

We found a similar atmosphere on our Emerald cruise but the beds were shot and the sheets were thread bare and we did not go discount we sailed for the itinerary and it was Princess. But the ship seemed dated and dark and the shows did not entice and the food was just fair. But our table service was excellent.

As stated earlier we just booked at full price to get the cabins we want for a 35 day b to b and maybe the cabins will come down and we will save a bit. But we are willing to pay full price because it is Aqua class on Celebrity and we are happy to pay for what we get.

We have sailed Oceania and would not do it again because we do not feel it is good value, it was not the price but what we receive that determines were we shop. We have enjoyed lines Like MSC, NCL and P&O and thought them to be good value just not our cup of tea. We really enjoyed Azamara but the itinerary was amazing and we would have done that cruise on a barge and thought it was great value.

To each their own but we will take our dollars somewhere else to get a premium experience.

[wizard-of-roz]

This and several other recent threads have made me think about why we stay with Princess, although we've also sailed with RCI, Carnival, and X. We're now in the Platinum category and are booked on the CB for the British Isles next August. We always get a balcony somewhere midships, but nothing fancier than that.

 

What keeps us coming back, I think, is the overall consistency of the experience. We know what to expect and those expectations are nearly always met. We expect an organized, well-run ship and interesting itineraries. We expect a variety of good food. We expect a clean, comfortable, well-maintained cabin. We expect a selection of interesting, well-organized excursions (yes, we favor the "geezer bus" tours). We expect professional, easily accessible entertainment, and this is perhaps the one area in which we've been a bit disappointed of late. We pretty much gave up on the first evening shows in the theatre when it became impossible to find a seat an hour or more before the show. We've not yet sailed with the new half hour format, but my inclination is to wonder if it's worth the effort to go for something that short. On the brighter side, instead of the theatre we now enjoy the lounge shows, piano bar, and atrium performances.

 

Are there things we don't like about Princess? Well, the Horizon buffet can be a competition sport at times. And it would be nice to take an outside walk around the ship without changing decks, as is the case on some ships. Daytime MUTS (an oxymoron?) is distracting. Also, shower controls can be challenging.

 

All in all, though, the positives far outweigh the negatives for us, and in the end I think the main reason we like Princess is that they always look after us.

 

You said every thing just the way I would......I feel taken care of and cared for [not that I want a convalescent home feeling], I just want all the positives about a Princess vacation to truly exceed any negative that may pop-up here or there!!!!

[pablo222]

Whether directly or indirectly, a number of changes have been in response to passengers requests as indicated by postings on these boards.

Interesting list.

 

However, it's pretty easy to make a list of things that have been

complained about here that haven't changed.

 

Shorter shows.

Show costumes too risque'.

Bad coffee in buffet

MUTS too loud

MUTS existing at all.

Photos too expensive

Wine too expensive

Drinks too expensive

Photographers delaying embarcation

Crown Bay rather than Havensite

etc.

etc.

 

It would be impossible to run a business based on trying to

respond to every (negative) comment posted here. For one

thing, you don't even know if the poster is an actual customer.

 

Who knows, a cruise line might compensate posters to pump up their cruiseline, and denigrate others...

 

I know this WOULD NEVER HAPPEN HERE. :)

[baldercash]

We actually go to McDonald's when in foriegn lands because of it's consistency. We know we can use the washroom, and it will be clean. The staff will be helpful and they will give us free wifi access. If we want to eat we know we can usually get what we are familiar or comfortable with and it won't make us sick as it will be prepared in a hygenic manner.

 

For all the mocking that McDonald's gets it is a corporation that does strive to constantly do better, keep it's store appearance current, be innovative while giving consistent service and value to it's customers. They use sale promotions to increase market share and profits or introduce new products.

Does Princess?

[pablo222]

the product appeals to a very large segment of the population. Both companies strive to keep their products available at a fair price.

 

As (part of) a public company, their goal is to maximize shareholder

value. If they're not doing this, management should be replaced.

 

I don't think anyone at princess sits around and discusses what's

a fair price -- rather they discuss how they can maximize revenue

and profit.

[fishywood]

The comparison of McDonalds to Princess brings us full circle back to the point Shogun was making in starting this thread. Princess is trying too hard to keep its eye on the competition and cobble together what is perceived as the most popular new features on RC/X and NCL. Unfortunately it has done so at the cost of its own identity.

 

What many of us are labelling as "cuts" are actually, in my opinion, indications of Princess rebranding itself in the marketplace:

(1) heavy emphasis on the alternatives to dressing up on formal nights;

(2) many more "comfort food" items on the MDR dinner menus;

(3) the Piazza as primary live music venue, with no more string quartets and much less "dinner music";

(4) activities in general redesigned for shorter attention spans;

(5) the return of shipwide PA announcements all afternoon pushing bingo, art acutions, etc...

 

I know that drawing new first-time passengers is essential for every cruiselines survival. But is Princess' new strategy doing so at the cost of losing the "Escape Completely" diehards? When I boarded the Grand Princess last month, I still felt like I was meeting a familiar friend. But that friendship has obviously become tenuous for many of us. Princess really needs to step back and take a deep breath and contemplate their next move very carefully to avoid adding the straw that will break the camel's back of their long-time fan base.

[swedish weave]

As (part of) a public company, their goal is to maximize shareholder

value. If they're not doing this, management should be replaced.

 

I don't think anyone at princess sits around and discusses what's

a fair price -- rather they discuss how they can maximize revenue

and profit.

 

I think we are saying the same thing, just in different words.

 

Good management has to know what price to put on their product in order to meet or beat the competition and still turn a profit.

[swedish weave]

The comparison of McDonalds to Princess brings us full circle back to the point Shogun was making in starting this thread. Princess is trying too hard to keep its eye on the competition and cobble together what is perceived as the most popular new features on RC/X and NCL. Unfortunately it has done so at the cost of its own identity.

 

What many of us are labelling as "cuts" are actually, in my opinion, indications of Princess rebranding itself in the marketplace:

(1) heavy emphasis on the alternatives to dressing up on formal nights;

(2) many more "comfort food" items on the MDR dinner menus;

(3) the Piazza as primary live music venue, with no more string quartets and much less "dinner music";

(4) activities in general redesigned for shorter attention spans;

(5) the return of shipwide PA announcements all afternoon pushing bingo, art acutions, etc...

 

I know that drawing new first-time passengers is essential for every cruiselines survival. But is Princess' new strategy doing so at the cost of losing the "Escape Completely" diehards? When I boarded the Grand Princess last month, I still felt like I was meeting a familiar friend. But that friendship has obviously become tenuous for many of us. Princess really needs to step back and take a deep breath and contemplate their next move very carefully to avoid adding the straw that will break the camel's back of their long-time fan base.

 

Any time a company makes changes, they are going to upset some people.

 

The trade-off is that the changes may open them up to a much larger segment of the market.

[bonsai3s]

...for the first time on the Fair Princess...here's the reason why..you are welcome to sing it...

Love, exciting and new

Come Aboard. We're expecting you.

Love, life's sweetest reward.

Let it flow, it floats back to you.

Love Boat soon will be making another run

The Love Boat promises something for everyone

Set a course for adventure,

Your mind on a new romance.

Love won't hurt anymore

It's an open smile on a friendly shore.

Yes LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOVE! It's LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOVE! (hey-ah!)

Love Boat soon will be making another run

The Love Boat promises something for everyone

Set a course for adventure,

Your mind on a new romance.

Love won't hurt anymore

It's an open smile on a friendly shore.

It's LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOVE! It's LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOVE! It's

LOOOOOOOOOOOVE!

It's the Love Boat-ah! It's the Love Boat-ah!

[OCruisers]

...for the first time on the Fair Princess...here's the reason why..you are welcome to sing it...

Love, exciting and new

Come Aboard. We're expecting you.

Love, life's sweetest reward.

Let it flow, it floats back to you.

Love Boat soon will be making another run

The Love Boat promises something for everyone

Set a course for adventure,

Your mind on a new romance.

Love won't hurt anymore

It's an open smile on a friendly shore.

Yes LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOVE! It's LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOVE! (hey-ah!)

Love Boat soon will be making another run

The Love Boat promises something for everyone

Set a course for adventure,

Your mind on a new romance.

Love won't hurt anymore

It's an open smile on a friendly shore.

It's LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOVE! It's LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOVE! It's

LOOOOOOOOOOOVE!

It's the Love Boat-ah! It's the Love Boat-ah!

 

:o Wonder WHY it's no longer played on Princess ships. I miss it!