another tipping thread

[janecambridge]

Interesting topic.

 

Two bad tipping experiences:

Our first cruise was from Buenos Aires and at the dock we handed over our cases,they were thrown in a heap and the man came back to us smiling.We had no idea that others were tipping these men and can honestly say we were not pleased with the luggage handling.Not only did we get a spit at our feet,but when our cases arrived in our cabins,they were slashed,presumably with a knife..(Princess were fantastic at repair and compensation).

 

The second was in a cafe in NYC where we ate some snacks and the waiter was appalling.We left no tip.It was in the days of the rollover credit card machine.The bill was $35. When we got our bill through at home,the waiter had changed the 3 to an 8 and given himself a $50 tip.Revenge I assume.

 

We always tip good service and hard workers.But part of me expects a little too much maybe if we automatically have to tip on cruise ships.I prefer to see what the service is like and tip accordingly.Maybe it's my upbringing or my lifetime job as a nurse where we are poorly paid and receive no tips.

We have ppg on our next trip,but will definatly take spare cash for tips at the end.

[njhorseman]

Funny - because the site you referred to above says that in English pubs several hundred years ago there were boxes placed with TIPS on them and also "to insure prompt service"... Looks as though I am correct from the snopes.com site.

 

On our next cruise - Riviera on 6 Nov - for the first time the gratuities are not included or covered by our TA. We have other "perks". So -- we will of course pay the daily charge put on our account AND give the butler and steward/ess a tip on top of that. We understand that this is the American way. That doesn't mean to say we like it. One of the things I prefer about Regent to Oceania is that tips are included in the fare. As they are here in Switzerland in our restaurant etc prices. We still give our butler something at the end of a voyage on Regent if we are happy with his services. And this has been the case with only one exception in the 15 or so years we have been cruising.

Funny, but you obviously completely misread or didn't understand the snopes.com article.

 

The "tips" box didn't exist. It's exactly what snopes.com debunks. From the article:

 

" Disappointingly, there were no TIPS-labeled boxes into which thirsty pub patrons of centuries past stuffed their offerings in efforts to keep the libations flowing — tip entered our lexicon in much more mundane fashion. We’ve yet to find an acronym that predates the 20th century, and tip (used in the sense of a gratuity) is much older than that."

[PaulMCO]

Tipping is all about performance. No difference than a sales person that earns a commission.

[robbie21]

Tipping is all about performance. No difference than a sales person that earns a commission.

 

That comparison doesn't make any sense. Presumably a restaurant server's tip will vary with both the cost of the meal and the quality of the service. A car salesman gets a commission based solely on the price of the car regardless of how much work he does.

 

In the first case the server has a positive incentive to provide good service. The car salesman is incentivized to get you to pay as much as he can get out of you with extra commissions for selling you the floor mats, undercoating or whatever. Not the same!

 

The more or less automatic tipping procedure Oceania uses provides no performance incentive since the overwhelming number of passengers simple let it be added to their bill. The "tips" become part of regular compensation without reference to actual service provided by the individual. Performance incentives are provided by supervisors reviews and the occasional passenger comments.

 

Fundamentally, cruise ship "tips" have nothing to do with tipping. They are marketing ruses intended to offer a lower base price or "free" incentives to repeat customers. The European custom of adding a service charge also has nothing to do with incentivizing service. It's just another part of the fee.

 

Robbie

[Earl Rosebery]

it just is what it is. in some countries, servers are paid such low wages they depend on tips to survive. It's even built in to minimum wage laws where the minimum is lower for certain industries where tips are common.

 

In other cultures, tipping is not part of the equation

 

Oceania advertises all kinds of nonsense to make their fares incomprehensible. (2 for1, free air, free internet, free gratuities, and so on)

Airlines advertise a bare bones price and then charge for telephone booking, knee room, luggage and so on.

 

Correct me if I'm wrong. Many of the staff on cruise lines are hired by 3rd party agencies and their basic pay may vary considerably depending on where they are from. Tipping is important for them. if you don't like it, don't go.

[sammiedawg]

Cruise lines deny it but tips constitute most or all of the wages paid to those sharing in the automatic tips. I cannot imagine stiffing these hard working souls who work day and night. Americans would never, ever take these jobs.

[Hambagahle]

Switzerland doesn't have a minimum wage but a waiter in a restaurant makes over 4000frs/month ($US4200) AND gets full benefits which include 4 weeks annual vacation, health insurance etc. The cost of this is factored into the price on the menu just as the cost of a secretary in a company goes into the equation when the company sets its prices for its goods. This - personally anyway - I think is reasonable. Making people work just for tips is not a stable existence for the staff.

 

Anyway - it is what it is - we are expected to add over $40/day to our cruise bill so we do. AND tip over and above that...

[drkitkat123]

I don't think anyone was considering "stiffing the hard working souls" and hopefully no one does. Just that many from all over the world may prefer to pay a higher price up front rather than worry about the hassle of tips.

[JimandStan]

I don't think anyone was considering "stiffing the hard working souls" and hopefully no one does. Just that many from all over the world may prefer to pay a higher price up front rather than worry about the hassle of tips.

 

I admire your positive attitude, but the reality is that some cruise passengers so regularly "stiffed the hard working souls" that there are now entire Continents where the tips are required to be paid upfront and are entirely non-cancellable.

 

Those Passengers do " pay a higher price up front rather than worrying about the hassle of tips", but they are most definitely NOT happy about it .

 

There always are and there always will be those among us who see ANY WAY of legally getting off of the ship having spent less money to be a victory, and the anonymous angle of tipping feeds into that.

 

Don't judge everyone by your own values, they will always win. :halo:

[Bootman4U]

I do not tip anyone based on what I THINK they are making or what anybody else SAYS they are/are not making. I tip based on the service I receive and that is the ONLY thing my tip is based on. I do not tip based on what anybody else says is "the norm" and I do not tip based on what anybody else will "think" of me.

 

The rest of you can do as you please.

[drkitkat123]

The problem we have got to though is tipping is trying to achieve two separate things which may or may not be related. Subsidising wages and rewarding or encouraging good service.

Edited August 27, 2017 by drkitkat123
Spelling

[LHT28]

The cruise industry operates differently than land based businesses

 

If you do not like the way they do business then spend your money on another type of holiday

 

JMO

[LHT28]

Switzerland doesn't have a minimum wage but a waiter in a restaurant makes over 4000frs/month ($US4200) AND gets full benefits which include 4 weeks annual vacation, health insurance etc. ..

In some Countries wait staff may be paid $10 or less per hour they may only get part time work 20 hours per week so the company does not have to pay health benefits or vacation time

 

Some work 2 or 3 jobs to make ends meet

 

I would say people are very lucky to live & work in Switzerland compared to other Countries

[Solas36]

I admire your positive attitude, but the reality is that some cruise passengers so regularly "stiffed the hard working souls" that there are now entire Continents where the tips are required to be paid upfront and are entirely non-cancellable.

 

Those Passengers do " pay a higher price up front rather than worrying about the hassle of tips", but they are most definitely NOT happy about it .

 

There always are and there always will be those among us who see ANY WAY of legally getting off of the ship having spent less money to be a victory, and the anonymous angle of tipping feeds into that.

 

Don't judge everyone by your own values, they will always win. :halo:

 

I think you just made a very good case for advocating higher fares which include the tips. And therefore a decent wage for all.

 

Like many on this thread I still don't understand why this idea is so objectionable. We all like to be treated with pleasant, courteous service by those we encounter face to face but why do some feel this is dependent on tipping? Do you tip your dentist, shop assistants?

 

Guess I will never really understand the US approach but I will still, as in most things, try to fit in with what is expected in whichever country I visit. That includes (when at home) tipping in UK restaurants, in UK hairdressers etc. I do it but I would still rather pay more and be assured that the employee is in secure employment and getting a decent reliable wage.

[Rob the Cruiser]

Employees know what their pay is going to be before they accept a position. They must think it is a decent wage, whatever that is, or they wouldn't sign on.

 

If you don't want to give additional tips then don't. If you feel the employees are being underpaid then give generously.

[Solas36]

Employees know what their pay is going to be before they accept a position. They must think it is a decent wage, whatever that is, or they wouldn't sign on.

 

If you don't want to give additional tips then don't. If you feel the employees are being underpaid then give generously.

 

I guess you missed the bit where I said I try to fit in with the local situation. It's not about avoiding what's due.

 

I am just voicing an opinion regarding the tipping philosophy in different areas. I might not like it, but I fall in line!

 

Perhaps crew are hired with incentive of getting tips to make up a decent wage.

[Rob the Cruiser]

I guess you missed the bit where I said I try to fit in with the local situation. It's not about avoiding what's due.

 

I am just voicing an opinion regarding the tipping philosophy in different areas. I might not like it, but I fall in line!

 

Perhaps crew are hired with incentive of getting tips to make up a decent wage.

 

I wasn't making a comment directly at you. If you think I was then I apologize.

 

We are generous with tips based on performance, not for what someone might do. We also submit positive comments about employees while on the cruise. We don't randomly tip because we think someone is not being paid a decent wage. What someone else gets paid is of our business.

[Solas36]

I wasn't making a comment directly at you. If you think I was then I apologize./quote]

 

No problem!

[LHT28]

Employees know what their pay is going to be before they accept a position. They must think it is a decent wage, whatever that is, or they wouldn't sign on.

 

Most sign on the ships because where they come from there may not be jobs

 

So getting a small wage with the incentive of tips is better than no job at all

Some are highly educated but cannot get a job in their Country

 

I just treat the DSC as part of the cruise fare

 

If you do not get the DSC included from other sourses you can always give yourself an OBC to cover the DSC then it makes the cruise more inclusive

 

It is pay now or pay later

 

YMMV

[ORV]

Funny - because the site you referred to above says that in English pubs several hundred years ago there were boxes placed with TIPS on them and also "to insure prompt service"... Looks as though I am correct from the snopes.com site.

 

On our next cruise - Riviera on 6 Nov - for the first time the gratuities are not included or covered by our TA. We have other "perks". So -- we will of course pay the daily charge put on our account AND give the butler and steward/ess a tip on top of that. We understand that this is the American way. That doesn't mean to say we like it. One of the things I prefer about Regent to Oceania is that tips are included in the fare. As they are here in Switzerland in our restaurant etc prices. We still give our butler something at the end of a voyage on Regent if we are happy with his services. And this has been the case with only one exception in the 15 or so years we have been cruising.

 

 

Please look up the words "insure" vs "ensure" English is such a tricky language.

[YoHoHo]

I think most would understand the meaning / intent of his or her post despite a spelling or a grammar error.

As well, CC Guideline do cover this.

[ORV]

I think most would understand the meaning / intent of his or her post despite a spelling or a grammar error.

As well, CC Guideline do cover this.

If you're talking to me be aware that I was not correcting anyone's grammar or spelling.

 

Just making the point that it would be called a tep and not a tip.

[Hambagahle]

I have lived and worked in both the UK and the USA. In the UK they use "ensure" to mean what in the US they call "insure". End of story...

[JimandStan]

I have lived and worked in both the UK and the USA. In the UK they use "ensure" to mean what in the US they call "insure". End of story...

 

Excuse me, but you are misinformed:

https://www.lloyds.com/lloyds

[globe_trekkers]

How much should you give someone who delivers room service, breakfast, lunch or dinner