Tears from Haven

[Shidah]

Haven’t been on the Escape yet, will be next spring. Have stayed both Haven and non-Haven, but mostly Haven. Escape will be non, as I am going solo. But I have found the entertainment on NCL to be extremely good. Reading about the entertainment and food on MSC makes me gun shy to try them, even in YC. I have very simple tastes. MSC seems to be rigid in how they serve their meals from what I read in allowing substitutions. Don’t know if I could live on pizza for a week (probably could!). Even not being a show person, I have been awed by the entertainment on the Epic, Getaway, and Breakaway. I also don’t love Cirque type shows even though we did go to the dinner theater ones on the Epic and Getaway. Once you see one, you’ve seen them all. RC boasts an ice show, which has zero appeal to me. But some people may love. It reminds me of the countless Disney on ice shows I took my family too when young. Then an aquatic show. Again blah. Brings back visions of theme park dive shows. Just not for me. But some people may love it. So to each their own. I find myself going back to the shows on NCL twice in a cruise since they are that good. And all the fun events like the perfect couple, love and marriage, etc are what make cruising so tacky and fun! I haven’t read of any similar planned events like those on MSC, but maybe just people don’t include those in their reports. But one constant that is reported is the need for more things to see and do in the evening, leading me to think there are not many offered. People rave about a violinist in YC in the evenings, again zero appeal. But others obviously enjoy. There is something for everyone on the different lines, and just hope everyone can find the line that suits them best,

[MHKBCrusin]

We just had Adrian on the Bliss and he and his staff were excellent. I have been on the Escape but don't remember anything about the Consierge there if it was David or not ... But, when service is truly bad I recommend emailing Andy Stuart about it and following through until you get a reply. Kevin Sheehan always replied when he was in charge. I haven't had to contact Andy so i'm not sure of his -or his office' philopsophy.

 

I have sailed the Haven several times, also. I feel the concierges are invaluable. They have done practically everything for me, with no hassle whatsoever. And, they seem to be able to do the impossible (like get me into a sold out show with no reservations). They take care of billing snafus, find my missing OBC, do all of my restaurant reservations. I pre-book nothing as a result.

 

 

My Butler, while nice, I don't require nearly as much of. That said, I've never had in-suite dining (by choice). He has actually taken care of changing bedding (different pillows requested) and was generally available to deliver room service, regardless of how small or large the request.

 

 

Have sailed MSC YC....twice. Similar situation, except the butler also doubled as a Top Sail Lounge waiter.

 

 

Will agree that entertainment on NCL is probably the best at sea, and that MSC has a ways to go. But, I still enjoyed the MSC entertainment.

 

 

Pricewise, I think NCL is waking up. I'm looking at a Haven cruise in the Caribbean for August/Sept. In the Haven Spa Suite, the fare is $4,800 for two. Plus, NCL throws in the kitchen sink....drinks, specialty dining, internet ($125 worth) and a $50 per excursion credit. Also, I'll get at least $300 of OBC.

 

 

 

MSC Seaside's fare for the YC is $4,000, with one specialty restaurant, no excursion credit, free drinks. I will assume the entertainment won't be as good, either. Still, it's a beautiful ship.

 

 

I think it's a wash.

 

 

Your use of the concierge depends on the concierge. On NCL, I've had Adrian twice. He's outstanding. Had Elvina on the NCL GEM several weeks ago. Simply wonderful! They both seem to be able to do the impossible.

 

 

 

Don't remember any of the concierge on MSC, but all were efficient and quite helpful.

[dexddd]

We just had Adrian on the Bliss and he and his staff were excellent. I have been on the Escape but don't remember anything about the Consierge there if it was David or not ... But, when service is truly bad I recommend emailing Andy Stuart about it and following through until you get a reply. Kevin Sheehan always replied when he was in charge. I haven't had to contact Andy so i'm not sure of his -or his office' philopsophy.

 

Good luck with that. I was very hesitant to do that and only have written to maybe two people in his position ever. I mulled it over and thought about the folks on here who say to do that to get something resolved.

 

So I wrote a short, to the point letter to him this Spring. Waited a few weeks, finally got a letter from a guy in Guest Relations who referenced our most recent sailing on the Gem and that he couldn't help and referred our letter back to Latitudes.

 

My letter made no reference to the Gem and had absolutely nothing to do with the Gem or that sailing. Whoever did read the letter - MAJOR FAILURE TO EVEN COMPREHEND WHAT I WROTE. My letter did have to do with Latitudes and their inability to respond to guests - that is partially why I wrote him. So guess what, nothing from Latitudes.

[Enavigo]

Your experience matches the experience of most Haven guests (myself, included) but.......

 

...if someone's experience was ruined by "out of control" children, there will likely be a post about it and any others who have had their experience ruined will likely post about their experience. By far, the vast majority of Haven guests are repeat guests or will be repeat guests after their first experience. The popularity of the "ship within a ship" concept continues to grow because even with the higher prices, most people have a fantastic time.

 

Those who have had a bad experience are more "vocal" but those who have had a great experience speak by continuing to book suites on NCL. There is growing competition and NCL's continuing insistence of raising Haven prices while offering less (plus, the bid process) is hurting NCL's Haven more than the occasional misbehaved child/children.

 

I agree with this 100%. We have always enjoyed our cruises in the Haven and are very much looking forward to our Sept cruise on the Escape. As I type this, I will admit that the experiences of others on CC have piqued our interest to discover if the grass is, indeed, greener on a luxury line. Just bit the bullet and booked a 14-night caribbean cruise on Seabourn Odyssey for March 2020. Plenty of time to plan (and pay!) I guess!

[Maya1234]

Your experience matches the experience of most Haven guests (myself, included) but.......

 

...if someone's experience was ruined by "out of control" children, there will likely be a post about it and any others who have had their experience ruined will likely post about their experience. By far, the vast majority of Haven guests are repeat guests or will be repeat guests after their first experience. The popularity of the "ship within a ship" concept continues to grow because even with the higher prices, most people have a fantastic time.

 

Those who have had a bad experience are more "vocal" but those who have had a great experience speak by continuing to book suites on NCL. There is growing competition and NCL's continuing insistence of raising Haven prices while offering less (plus, the bid process) is hurting NCL's Haven more than the occasional misbehaved child/children.

 

We had a wonderful experience overall in the Haven and I posted a very positive discussion of my experiences. BUT the Haven pool on the Bliss was definitely taken over by jumping screaming kids the vast majority of the time on sea days and often on port days as well later in the day.

 

For us the overall experience was worth every penny and we paid more than 15k to be in the Haven. But the pool being unusable much of the time by any adult wanting a relaxing time with no screaming was a fact. We were very pleased with the 16 plus rule on the sundeck

[david_sobe]

Some of you are way more optimistic about future Haven prices. I used to feel the same way. But with the bidding process, I believe the high prices will stick around forever. The bidding process is a secret way to sell the few remaining Haven cabins at a reduced price. As long as they can continue to do that, why would they need to change Haven pricing? The Haven sells out for most sailings and the ones that don't get sold at a slightly reduced rate. Don't get me wrong, I would love for NCL to drop the bidding process but from a financial standpoint I don't see it happening. IMHO as long as the bidding process stays in place, the Haven prices will remain outrageously high.

[dexddd]

Some of you are way more optimistic about future Haven prices. I used to feel the same way. But with the bidding process, I believe the high prices will stick around forever. The bidding process is a secret way to sell the few remaining Haven cabins at a reduced price. As long as they can continue to do that, why would they need to change Haven pricing? The Haven sells out for most sailings and the ones that don't get sold at a slightly reduced rate. Don't get me wrong, I would love for NCL to drop the bidding process but from a financial standpoint I don't see it happening. IMHO as long as the bidding process stays in place, the Haven prices will remain outrageously high.

 

Agree. And that is why we aren't booking.

[sverigecruiser]

Some of you are way more optimistic about future Haven prices. I used to feel the same way. But with the bidding process, I believe the high prices will stick around forever. The bidding process is a secret way to sell the few remaining Haven cabins at a reduced price. As long as they can continue to do that, why would they need to change Haven pricing? The Haven sells out for most sailings and the ones that don't get sold at a slightly reduced rate. Don't get me wrong, I would love for NCL to drop the bidding process but from a financial standpoint I don't see it happening. IMHO as long as the bidding process stays in place, the Haven prices will remain outrageously high.

 

I agree with you.

 

As long as they have the bidding process the "normal" Haven prices will most likely stay as high as they are now, why shouldn't they?

 

My hope is that lots of Havencruisers decide that the price is too high now and decides not to book Haven anymore. Then NCL might decide that the bidding process isn't the best way to make money.

 

I want to book Haven but think that it cost too much now so I book MSCs Yacht Club instead, much better value for money.

[kitty-sail]

I think my money is better spent getting a mini suite for 3 cruises compared to the Haven for one cruise for the same price;)

 

Did Haven a few times and it was great. Prices have increased but I didn't get that "Havenesque" feeling last time. So dropping to Spa Mini for a lot less $$ and all the same perks. Would try MSC but don't want to fly to Fla. Like sailing from NY.

[Two Wheels Only]

One thing that I have noticed is that many are not booking the Haven at the asking price but are willing to max bid. There is also (on occasion) a small window after final payment but before bidding when booking the Haven directly isn't so bad.

 

 

For example, a H6 on Getaway was . $12K when I booked Seaside and the price didn't really drop until after final payment date. There were many suites left that were going for $8K. Not great but better than $12K.

[DMH15]

I agree with you.

 

 

 

As long as they have the bidding process the "normal" Haven prices will most likely stay as high as they are now, why shouldn't they?

 

 

 

My hope is that lots of Havencruisers decide that the price is too high now and decides not to book Haven anymore. Then NCL might decide that the bidding process isn't the best way to make money.

 

 

 

I want to book Haven but think that it cost too much now so I book MSCs Yacht Club instead, much better value for money.

 

 

 

I could have written your post.

 

 

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[cruise4kicks]

Did Haven a few times and it was great. Prices have increased but I didn't get that "Havenesque" feeling last time. So dropping to Spa Mini for a lot less $$ and all the same perks. Would try MSC but don't want to fly to Fla. Like sailing from NY.

MSC Divina will be sailing from NYC. ;)

[Enavigo]

One thing that I have noticed is that many are not booking the Haven at the asking price but are willing to max bid. There is also (on occasion) a small window after final payment but before bidding when booking the Haven directly isn't so bad.

 

 

For example, a H6 on Getaway was . $12K when I booked Seaside and the price didn't really drop until after final payment date. There were many suites left that were going for $8K. Not great but better than $12K.

 

We have always booked our H2 at the asking price, but that price, for some reason, is never what is reported on here. For example, you quote $12K for an H6 but that is the price we pay for the H2 to Bermuda during the high season.

[dexddd]

Did Haven a few times and it was great. Prices have increased but I didn't get that "Havenesque" feeling last time. So dropping to Spa Mini for a lot less $$ and all the same perks. Would try MSC but don't want to fly to Fla. Like sailing from NY.

 

MSC has Meraveglia sailing out of NYC to Canada/NE in October of next year I believe (or this year??). That is a very new ship.

[dexddd]

We have always booked our H2 at the asking price, but that price, for some reason, is never what is reported on here. For example, you quote $12K for an H6 but that is the price we pay for the H2 to Bermuda during the high season.

 

Looking at next year 4th of July on Escape to Bermuda it is $7,899 for H2 and $4,599 for H4 so a mixed bag.

[jvsnana]

MSC has Meraveglia sailing out of NYC to Canada/NE in October of next year I believe (or this year??). That is a very new ship.

Hey Dex

We finally booked the YC on this sailing NEXT October! Actually doing the B2B. It will be interesting to compare the Haven with the Yacht Club :)

[richg35]

OP wants quiet hours on a mass market cruise line? LOL

 

Maybe you should try Crystal or Seabourn.

[DMH15]

OP wants quiet hours on a mass market cruise line? LOL

 

Maybe you should try Crystal or Seabourn.

 

 

 

Actually, I just googled

 

 

And here is what it said on NCL.com

 

"Hidden away at the top of the ship is the Haven by Norwegian, home to our most luxurious,well appointed and spacious accommodations. Not only will you have access to all the ship has to offer, you'll enjoy the personal service of a concierge and 24-hour butler throughout your entire stay. On top of that, complete privacy and tranquility are just steps away on a sundeck reserved exclusively for guests of the Haven. From embarkation to debarkation, boarding of tenders to shore," entertainment to dining times you will have priority. In your own ship within a ship, the Haven will make for unique experience you'll never forget.

 

Next, I looked up "tranquility" in the thesaurus. Here are the synonyms - serenity, calmness, peacefulness, quietude, quietness, stillness, calm, quiet, stillness, silence, harmony, peace, stillness, hush and peace and quiet...

 

So, if NCL's marketing says one thing and reality "might" contradict that... how can we blame the OP or anyone for being anywhere from mildly frustrated to upset?

 

 

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[BNBR]

Actually, I just googled

 

 

And here is what it said on NCL.com

 

"Hidden away at the top of the ship is the Haven by Norwegian, home to our most luxurious,well appointed and spacious accommodations. Not only will you have access to all the ship has to offer, you'll enjoy the personal service of a concierge and 24-hour butler throughout your entire stay. On top of that, complete privacy and tranquility are just steps away on a sundeck reserved exclusively for guests of the Haven. From embarkation to debarkation, boarding of tenders to shore," entertainment to dining times you will have priority. In your own ship within a ship, the Haven will make for unique experience you'll never forget.

 

Next, I looked up "tranquility" in the thesaurus. Here are the synonyms - serenity, calmness, peacefulness, quietude, quietness, stillness, calm, quiet, stillness, silence, harmony, peace, stillness, hush and peace and quiet...

 

So, if NCL's marketing says one thing and reality "might" contradict that... how can we blame the OP or anyone for being anywhere from mildly frustrated to upset?

 

 

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Thank you.

 

NCL most certainly sells a shangri la tranquil experience. "Quiet" is not how ANY person would describe the Haven during our sailing, and it seems this is a recurring theme with lots of other disappointed cruisers as well.

[Notnewtoit]

Thank you.

 

NCL most certainly sells a shangri la tranquil experience. "Quiet" is not how ANY person would describe the Haven during our sailing, and it seems this is a recurring theme with lots of other disappointed cruisers as well.

 

It has been said many times that CC tends to attract people who want to share a negative experience, people who had a positive experience tend not to come here and post. So while there clearly are problems with the Haven on some sailings it would be wrong to use empirical posting data from this board to conclude too much.

 

By way of example, we have exclusively sailed Jewel(s) Havens (subliminal message there) and have had no issues whatsoever... place was like a morgue and could have benefitted from a live body or two!

 

All of this not to argue with the bad experiences like yours that HAVE clearly occurred, they are unacceptable given the 'billing' of the Haven and I would be posting them too... I would just hate for someone looking here to research/book the Havens (particularly Jewels) to take away that the impression that they are all horrible most of the time on all ships. It's simply not the case.

Edited July 20, 2018 by Notnewtoit

[BNBR]

It has been said many times that CC tends to attract people who want to share a negative experience, people who had a positive experience tend not to come here and post. So while there clearly are problems with the Haven on some sailings it would be wrong to use empirical posting data from this board to conclude too much.

 

By way of example, we have exclusively sailed Jewel(s) Havens (subliminal message there) and have had no issues whatsoever... place was like a morgue and could have benefitted from a live body or two!

 

All of this not to argue with the bad experiences that HAVE occurred, they are unacceptable given the 'billing' of the Haven... I would just hate for someone looking here to research/book the Havens (particularly Jewels) to take away that the impression that they are all horrible most of the time on all ships. It's simply not the case.

 

As a business owner, I fully understand the concept of people going online to complain more often than praise. But this is a little different. NCL recognized the problem is bad enough that they kicked kids off the sundeck in the Haven recently. They weren't doing that on our sailing. It's an issue, a growing issue. Multi bedroom units with "3rd and 4th" (KIDS!) sail free. It's a built in issue. Maybe not on Jewel class, but definitely on Escape.

 

All that aside, if you are looking to book your yearly or whatever vacation, paying extra for that special Haven experience, what percentage of cruisers would want to play the "day care lotto"? Why would someone book this experience when there is a seemingly large chance of it being a disappointment due to kids ruining the tranquility of the product you bought? Who would want to knowingly do this when there are other, better options available?

[Notnewtoit]

As a business owner, I fully understand the concept of people going online to complain more often than praise. But this is a little different. NCL recognized the problem is bad enough that they kicked kids off the sundeck in the Haven recently. They weren't doing that on our sailing. It's an issue, a growing issue. Multi bedroom units with "3rd and 4th" (KIDS!) sail free. It's a built in issue. Maybe not on Jewel class, but definitely on Escape.

 

All that aside, if you are looking to book your yearly or whatever vacation, paying extra for that special Haven experience, what percentage of cruisers would want to play the "day care lotto"? Why would someone book this experience when there is a seemingly large chance of it being a disappointment due to kids ruining the tranquility of the product you bought? Who would want to knowingly do this when there are other, better options available?

 

Agreed but I take issue with just one word "large"[chance]. There is a chance, we have no valid or reliable data to conclude that it is large; the 'complain' hypothesis/law of averages would more strongly support "small"[chance].

 

That small chance is a problem that NCL needs to get on top of... 100% agreed.

[DMH15]

As a business owner, I fully understand the concept of people going online to complain more often than praise. But this is a little different. NCL recognized the problem is bad enough that they kicked kids off the sundeck in the Haven recently. They weren't doing that on our sailing. It's an issue, a growing issue. Multi bedroom units with "3rd and 4th" (KIDS!) sail free. It's a built in issue. Maybe not on Jewel class, but definitely on Escape.

 

All that aside, if you are looking to book your yearly or whatever vacation, paying extra for that special Haven experience, what percentage of cruisers would want to play the "day care lotto"? Why would someone book this experience when there is a seemingly large chance of it being a disappointment due to kids ruining the tranquility of the product you bought? Who would want to knowingly do this when there are other, better options available?

 

 

 

I agree with you 100%.

 

And I have certainly been accused of being a NCL cheerleader. So I do not consider myself a complainer.

 

But, yes, we are a small percent of NCL's base here on Cruise Critic, and I have read many accounts over the year ranging from

 

A. Quiet and peacful without a kid in sight

B. Rich Kid's pool - kids there but not overrun. Some might be rowdy.

C. All-out mad house overrun with screaming kids

 

So, it is a crap-shoot. But what does that matter what someone else's experience was if your week is "C"???

 

I have experienced only "A" and "B" on Jewel class and Mega (Epic), but I do believe "C" happens. And I commisserate!

 

I like kids but well-behaved ones.

 

 

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[BNBR]

Agreed but I take issue with just one word "large"[chance]. There is a chance, we have no valid or reliable data to conclude that it is large; the 'complain' hypothesis/law of averages would more strongly support "small"[chance].

 

That small chance is a problem that NCL needs to get on top of... 100% agreed.

 

This is why I used the example of ncl closing off the sundeck to kids. This certainly implies an issue that is more likely than not to occur and much more than a small chance.

[Notnewtoit]

I agree with you 100%.

 

And I have certainly been accused of being a NCL cheerleader. So I do not consider myself a complainer.

 

But, yes, we are a small percent of NCL's base here on Cruise Critic, and I have read many accounts over the year ranging from

 

A. Quiet and peacful without a kid in sight

B. Rich Kid's pool - kids there but not overrun. Some might be rowdy.

C. All-out mad house overrun with screaming kids

 

So, it is a crap-shoot. But what does that matter what someone else's experience was if your week is "C"???

 

I have experienced only "A" and "B" on Jewel class and Mega (Epic), but I do believe "C" happens. And I commisserate!

 

I like kids but well-behaved ones.

 

 

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Yup. Donna, as an aside, I see you have MSCYC upcoming in your signature... do you have any experience of this issue on MSCYC? (As a place an NCL Haven'r might bolt to?)