Cuba.....uh, oh.

[gatour]

55 minutes ago, Beamafar said:

 

That is a strange one.  I wonder if it's politically motivated. 🤔  MSC has been homeporting out of Havana for a number of years.

In one sense yes, but not directed towards MSC.  Back in April they issued the ruling, but cruise lines were in the gray area.  They are now no longer in the gray area.  This applies to all cruise lines.

[Beamafar]

3 minutes ago, gatour said:

In one sense yes, but not directed towards MSC.  Back in April they issued the ruling, but cruise lines were in the gray area.  They are now no longer in the gray area.  This applies to all cruise lines.

 

Opera's sailings in Cuba have nothing to do with the US government's decision as it didn't operate from the US.

 

I was implying that MSC may have taken a political position regarding Cuba's 'involvement' in the Venezuala situation.

Edited June 4, 2019 by Beamafar

[thecruisers6]

9 minutes ago, Beamafar said:

 

Opera's sailings in Cuba have nothing to do with the US government's decision as it didn't operate from the US.

 

I was implying that MSC may have taken a political position regarding Cuba's 'involvement' in the Venezuala situation.

Or dare I say it, not wanting to jeopardise the new Miami terminal and drive into the US market?

if they follow US foreign policy there will be plenty of extra sea days on the next world cruise 🙄

[EngIceDave]

12 minutes ago, Beamafar said:

I was implying that MSC may have taken a political position regarding Cuba's 'involvement' in the Venezuala situation.

 

That was part of it as explained

[gatour]

6 minutes ago, Beamafar said:

 

Opera's sailings in Cuba have nothing to do with the US government's decision as it didn't operate from the US.

 

I was implying that MSC may have taken a political position regarding Cuba's 'involvement' in the Venezuala situation.

This most likely has nothing to do with "MSC may have taken a political position regarding Cuba's 'involvement' in the the Venezuela situation".  However it may be regards to the Cuba/Venezuela situation.  Royal Caribbean and Carnival have also been doing itineraries that include Cuba.  Royal Caribbean has multiple ships that visit Cuba.  I think NCL even has a ship that visits Cuba.

 

So to think this directive is a result MSC policy is a bit far fetched.

 

When the original directive was issued back in April, this was the writing on the wall, no matter cruise line and their political leanings.  The reasoning went way beyond cruise line implications, for better or worse.  It just took time for the US Gov't to come up with guidelines in regards to cruise lines, airlines, and other types of personal travel.

[Beamafar]

5 minutes ago, thecruisers6 said:

Or dare I say it, not wanting to jeopardise the new Miami terminal and drive into the US market?

if they follow US foreign policy there will be plenty of extra sea days on the next world cruise 🙄

 

Insightful!  Otherwise, the timing is awful coincidental!

[AerynSun_JohnCrighton]

5 minutes ago, gatour said:

  Royal Caribbean has multiple ships that visit Cuba.  I think NCL even has a ship that visits 

Yes NCL does... and both companies have statements on their website saying they are monitoring the situation and will notify when they know... so far.. nothing from MSC... I find their lack of communication very disturbing. I don't like it. No responses to any emails I sent regarding other issues either. 

Edited June 4, 2019 by AerynSun_JohnCrighton

[OceansOfTravels]

Really interested to see what our new ports are going to be. We leave June 17th and stop in Roatan June 19th, Costa Maya June 20th, Cozumel June 21st, and should've been Havana June 22nd-23rd. I'm hoping for maybe Grand Cayman June 22nd and then a Sea Day june 24th, or Belize for June 22nd. Really don't want to go to Key West or Nassau, that would be upsetting.

[Host Jazzbeau]

If I understand the regulations correctly, passengers who have already paid a down payment will be allowed to sail – but the cruise lines can't continue to sell cabins.  So unless the ship is nearly 100% sold out, I would expect the bean counters to require that Cuba be dropped from the itineraries.

[OceansOfTravels]

Just now, AerynSun_JohnCrighton said:

Yes NCL does... and both companies have statements on their website saying they are monitoring the situation and will notify when they know... so far.. nothing from MSC... I find their lack of communication very disturbing. I don't like it. No responses to any emails I sent regarding other issues either. 

To be fair, in MSC's case, they are dealing with many more international cruisers and are not running the itinerary predominantly for Americans. Granted, they are marketed as such on the USA website, but I have read in multiple cases that Americans are a minority onboard for the cruises to Cuba. So maybe they are having a different situation and it's not as cut and dry as it would be for Carnival or Norwegian, which are vastly American-based. Could be wrong, but if I won't personally start worrying about MSC until later tonight.

[sidari]

14 minutes ago, gatour said:

This most likely has nothing to do with "MSC may have taken a political position regarding Cuba's 'involvement' in the the Venezuela situation".  However it may be regards to the Cuba/Venezuela situation.  Royal Caribbean and Carnival have also been doing itineraries that include Cuba.  Royal Caribbean has multiple ships that visit Cuba.  I think NCL even has a ship that visits Cuba.

 

So to think this directive is a result MSC policy is a bit far fetched.

 

When the original directive was issued back in April, this was the writing on the wall, no matter cruise line and their political leanings.  The reasoning went way beyond cruise line implications, for better or worse.  It just took time for the US Gov't to come up with guidelines in regards to cruise lines, airlines, and other types of personal travel.

Other than political pressure applied to MSC, there is no other reason why Opera which has been based in Havana for a number of years would be pulled out.

My guess is that pressure has been applied in order to support the Trump decision and a you scratch my back and I scratch yours decision for MSC to keep their footprint in Miami.

[AerynSun_JohnCrighton]

Just now, OceansOfTravels said:

To be fair, in MSC's case, they are dealing with many more international cruisers and are not running the itinerary predominantly for Americans. Granted, they are marketed as such on the USA website, but I have read in multiple cases that Americans are a minority onboard for the cruises to Cuba. So maybe they are having a different situation and it's not as cut and dry as it would be for Carnival or Norwegian, which are vastly American-based. Could be wrong, but if I won't personally start worrying about MSC until later tonight.

That isn't my only non communication issue with them but regardless on the USA website could be a little note... yes we saw, we will figure it out and tell you... the whole website and customer service has left a bad taste in my mouth and I'm not sure I'll be booking again. I don't like to be kept in the dark and told nothing. It's a pet peeve of mine. 

[Kingofcool1947]

18 minutes ago, Host Jazzbeau said:

If I understand the regulations correctly, passengers who have already paid a down payment will be allowed to sail – but the cruise lines can't continue to sell cabins.  So unless the ship is nearly 100% sold out, I would expect the bean counters to require that Cuba be dropped from the itineraries.

 

Maybe allowed to sail to Cuba (doubtful).  But no way American citizens holding U.S. passports will be allowed to get off the ship in Cuba.  That is for certain.   The bean counters will change the itinerary from visiting Cuba to visiting Haiti or the Dominican Republic.   I have read both are beautiful, and welcoming to tourists (cruisers) with dollars to spend. 

Good luck, and enjoy your cruise .

[Host Jazzbeau]

21 minutes ago, Kingofcool1947 said:

 

Maybe allowed to sail to Cuba (doubtful).  But no way American citizens holding U.S. passports will be allowed to get off the ship in Cuba.  That is for certain.   The bean counters will change the itinerary from visiting Cuba to visiting Haiti or the Dominican Republic.   I have read both are beautiful, and welcoming to tourists (cruisers) with dollars to spend. 

Good luck, and enjoy your cruise .

 

I don't think anything about this new policy is certain yet, but several press reports have stated that cruise passengers (including Americans) who had already reserved a cruise are grandfathered:

"The policies have a grandfather clause stating that 'certain group people-to-people educational travel that previously was authorized will continue to be authorized where the traveler had already completed at least one travel-related transaction (such as purchasing a flight or reserving accommodation) prior to June 5, 2019.' "

https://www.cruisecritic.com/news/4155/

 

This would seem to imply that, since the passengers continue to be authorized, those sailings should also continue to be authorized – but I haven't seen that stated and in fact I have seen a blanket statement that no cruise ships will be authorized [but that may mean that no new licenses or exceptions will be given].

[abbeytravelstheworld]

1 hour ago, OceansOfTravels said:

Really interested to see what our new ports are going to be. We leave June 17th and stop in Roatan June 19th, Costa Maya June 20th, Cozumel June 21st, and should've been Havana June 22nd-23rd. I'm hoping for maybe Grand Cayman June 22nd and then a Sea Day june 24th, or Belize for June 22nd. Really don't want to go to Key West or Nassau, that would be upsetting.

We're on the same departure as you but have booked the 2 week back to back so that we were meant to end up with 4 days in Havana. We're flying with our ten month old all the way from New Zealand and i'm so bitterly dissapointed by this. We already go to Grand Cayman in the 2 week of the itinerary so i'll be super annoyed if it happens to stop there the first week as well. I've never been to Key West or Nassau but to be honest i think i'll be disappointed with anything short of a full refund which i know won't be possible. I'd rather take a refund and fly to Cuba via Mexico. We only went the cruise route as we thought it would be easier with our baby. 

 

I see Royal Caribbean have pulled Havana as a port for their cruise this week. That definitely doesn't bode well for other cruise lines i would think.

 

I work as a travel agent  but i don't think we'll get any more news before you the general public.

[AerynSun_JohnCrighton]

Just now, abbeytravelstheworld said:

I see Royal Caribbean have pulled Havana as a port for their cruise this week. That definitely doesn't bode well for other cruise lines i would think.

 

I work as a travel agent  but i don't think we'll get any more news before you the general public.

That's still more than most of us know get. Keep us posted. Sorry for you. I understand. That's a long way to go. We only booked the older Armonia for Cuba. We don't mind smaller ships but prefer newer ones for sure. I sincerely hope we get something... some booze... tour... something to ease the disappointment.

[8420PR]

1 hour ago, sidari said:

Other than political pressure applied to MSC, there is no other reason why Opera which has been based in Havana for a number of years would be pulled out.

My guess is that pressure has been applied in order to support the Trump decision and a you scratch my back and I scratch yours decision for MSC to keep their footprint in Miami.

I think it was more due to profit.  It wasn't unusual to see offers of €999 to €1199 for flights and a 2 week cruise on MSC Opera.  They recently added Cozumel as an embarkation port.   My guess is the challenge was profitably aligning the charter flight and cruise ship capacity into Havana, when Miami already has flights from all over Europe (as well as significant US demand) and has the biggest and best ships.

[CTurtlelvr]

3 hours ago, Kingofcool1947 said:

You will not be ok if you are an American citizen and hold an American passport.

Your cruise itinerary may change to port of calls in Haiti or the Dominican Republic.  I have read both are beautiful and very safe for tourists (cruisers).

Good luck and happy sailing.

That's exactly what I am. Have been to Haiti and Dominican Republic and only booked Armonia for Cuba. Grand Cayman would be an acceptable port to me, but others in our group have been there, and again only booked this cruise b/c of Cuba.....I guess we'll see in the coming days. We leave at the end of July.

[sfaaa]

7 hours ago, Host Jazzbeau said:

If I understand the regulations correctly, passengers who have already paid a down payment will be allowed to sail – but the cruise lines can't continue to sell cabins.  So unless the ship is nearly 100% sold out, I would expect the bean counters to require that Cuba be dropped from the itineraries.

Not too sure. One would think simply making a down payment or reservation does not equate to a paid and completed travel transaction especially if you have the right to cancel and receive a full refund. All you did was simply blocking off a cabin. Nothing has been sold (i.e. complete) or paid for.

Edited June 5, 2019 by sfaaa

[molole]

To think I canceled my Cuba sailing only last week but not because of any of this but because I realized cruising was not a good vacation to visit somewhere I really wanted to visit.  I canceled my Empress sailing and booked airfare and a multi-day land tour in Cuba instead.  

 

Luckily we won't be affected.  We have two citizenships and in the worst case scenario we will just fly to Cuba from a different country.  

 

Hope those who booked Cuban cruises will find some good alternatives. 

 

 

[Beamafar]

8 hours ago, 8420PR said:

I think it was more due to profit.  It wasn't unusual to see offers of €999 to €1199 for flights and a 2 week cruise on MSC Opera.  They recently added Cozumel as an embarkation port.   My guess is the challenge was profitably aligning the charter flight and cruise ship capacity into Havana, when Miami already has flights from all over Europe (as well as significant US demand) and has the biggest and best ships.

 

The decision to pull Opera was sudden and very recent - timing is awfully coincidental.

[abbeytravelstheworld]

So what is everyone's guesses for substitute ports for Havana ? We're on a 2 week back to back departing 17th June so i really hope we don't get the same replacement port both weeks! I wanted that for Cuba since i had so much we were planning to see but i wouldn't really want 4 days in any other Caribbean port.

 

 

[sidari]

From MSC Fans Italy page

6/4/2019

MSC Cruises is currently reviewing and working through the details of the Administration’s Cuba policy announcement to assess the scale and timing of its effect on its cruise sailings from the U.S. to Cuba. We will advise all guests and travel partners when additional information becomes available.

[sidari]

9 hours ago, 8420PR said:

I think it was more due to profit.  It wasn't unusual to see offers of €999 to €1199 for flights and a 2 week cruise on MSC Opera.  They recently added Cozumel as an embarkation port.   My guess is the challenge was profitably aligning the charter flight and cruise ship capacity into Havana, when Miami already has flights from all over Europe (as well as significant US demand) and has the biggest and best ships.

If it was profit why would the ship have been sailing out of Havana for so long ? There are direct flights from Europe to Cuba.

[AerynSun_JohnCrighton]

1 hour ago, sidari said:

From MSC Fans Italy page

6/4/2019

MSC Cruises is currently reviewing and working through the details of the Administration’s Cuba policy announcement to assess the scale and timing of its effect on its cruise sailings from the U.S. to Cuba. We will advise all guests and travel partners when additional information becomes available.

It's on the USA page too finally.