CDC Resumption of Cruising RFI - Comments Are Overwhelmingly in Favor of Restarting

[mnocket]

Public comments are being posted on the CDC website.  I was surprised at how many are in favor of restarting cruising and restarting SOON (like now)!

Here's the link....

https://beta.regulations.gov/document/CDC-2020-0087-0001/comment

[Bo1953]

No need to be surprized, many of us here on CC wish to have cruising to start NOW with precautions in place, of course.

 

Now some of us have more stringent requirements than others to start sailing again and that is to be expected.

 

So, it appears that some of us are not 'outliers' in terms of wanting to sail again like NOW... in the greater cruising world.

 

This does not mean we do not want precautions in place before sailing, either.

 

In health and bon voyage

Edited August 19, 2020 by Bo1953

[markeb]

6 hours ago, mnocket said:

Public comments are being posted on the CDC website.  I was surprised at how many are in favor of restarting cruising and restarting SOON (like now)!

Here's the link....

https://beta.regulations.gov/document/CDC-2020-0087-0001/comment

 

Interestingly enough, that's not one of the questions for comment. Not sure what difference the start now, why are you so hard on the cruise industry and not the airlines, etc., comments will matter. They'll be a one paragraph summary as they move into rule making.

[PTC DAWG]

Scared people shouldn’t cruise, or travel at all...I’m ready to ROLL

[ECCruise]

More power to you if you somehow think that sailing out of a US port, especially Florida, NOW is a good idea.

 

I think the chances that those who want to sail NOW have no experience sailing in this environment is pretty strong.  I invite you to spend weeks sailing in uncharted waters where port after port refused entry.  Sailing at full speed to get to the only  port in 2000 miles that would accept us, less than 24 hours before they closed for good.  And this was on a 100% verified illness free ship (we were basically quarantined this time because no one would let us in). 

Enjoy being stuck in your cabin for days or weeks in there is even a single infection.  

 

Of course, there is zero chance that this is going to happen anytime in the near future.  One major misstep by any of the lines on restart and cruising will be done forever.  Sailing NOW from the US is just insanity, not fear.

 

[Arizona Wildcat]

2 hours ago, Bo1953 said:

No need to be surprized, many of us here on CC wish to have cruising to start NOW with precautions in place, of course.

 

Now some of us have more stringent requirements than others to start sailing again and that is to be expected.

 

So, it appears that some of us are not 'outliers' in terms of wanting to sail again like NOW... in the greater cruising world.

 

This does not mean we do not want precautions in place before sailing, either.

 

In health and bon voyage

The large number of comments wanting cruising to begin is no surprise.  Hundreds of thousands of people love cruising and many to most of them have FCCs they want to use.

The proof is in the rules.

Masks and vaccinations required would eliminate many.

Only cruise line tours for ports and more will.wait.

For each rule many will decided not to cruise until things change.

Some of would like to cruise now but with health conditions feel the need to wait.

[bouhunter]

It's a waste of time to read comments from individuals who just want to cruise.  The only comments that will have any influence (if at all) will be the ones from the industry, businesses, health professionals, etc.

Edited August 19, 2020 by bouhunter

[gerelmx]

My current concern is that the European Union allows us to travel, and that I can make my cruise in the interior cabin that I have booked since September 2019 (before the pandemic)

[paulh84]

And 99% of those 1,500 responses are from die hard cruisers with a few head-in-the-sand comments thrown in as well. Not exactly a neutral population base to determine public opinion. 

[npcl]

3 hours ago, markeb said:

 

Interestingly enough, that's not one of the questions for comment. Not sure what difference the start now, why are you so hard on the cruise industry and not the airlines, etc., comments will matter. They'll be a one paragraph summary as they move into rule making.

From my experience on the RFI process (same process, different agency) they will all get lumped in as being non-relevant responses since they did not address any of the asked questions.

 

Not surprising on the number of comments in that direction.  After all those most likely to comment are those that have an interest in cruising.  The rest of the population (majority) do not care enough to comment one way or another.

[Bo1953]

8 minutes ago, paulh84 said:

And 99% of those 1,500 responses are from die hard cruisers with a few head-in-the-sand comments thrown in as well. Not exactly a neutral population base to determine public opinion. 

Not sure the reason one would expect a neutral population in this type of vacation style, which generally has never appeal to the masses.

 

Same goes for here at CC, 99% (maybe 40% is closer to truth) are die hard cruisers, so not to base 'public opinion' on, while a further breakdown needs to include the different conditions under which we will sail from nothing to vaccine with 80%+ effective rate before boarding including no mask while aboard and other 'precautions' currently used on land.

 

I understand your thoughts on this, regardless.

 

bon voyage

[ABoatNerd]

5 minutes ago, Dwight1 said:

And the CDC will listen? Ha!!! Our Governor like many make their own decisions and dismiss what many people want. Here in my area two counties had the school boards issue a questionnaire to parents as to if they wanted classes all virtual or in classroom. In both over 50% of the parents wanted in classroom instructions. Final decision by both boards? Both ruled 100% virtual instruction. Why bother, government entities do what they want, believe we are all children.


Sent from my iPhone using Forums

 

Dwight1 - indeed most governments in all western countries are treating us like children. The entire "talking down" to the electorate is most obvious, everywhere.

Here in Ontario, Canada - it is about the same ratio 50/50 to send children to school in September.

Frankly, what do people want - perfection? Not going to happen.

You most all know that about the end of September, lots of us have colds which our children brought home from their first month in school - it is like clockwork. Every single year.

 

This virus is the consequence of the unrestricted movement of people - something Alvin Toffler noted in his 1970 book "Future Shock". Western society will need to address this before we can reasonably address the consequences of repeated viruses from China. 

 

Not cruising any time soon.

 

[markeb]

37 minutes ago, Dwight1 said:

And the CDC will listen? Ha!!! Our Governor like many make their own decisions and dismiss what many people want. Here in my area two counties had the school boards issue a questionnaire to parents as to if they wanted classes all virtual or in classroom. In both over 50% of the parents wanted in classroom instructions. Final decision by both boards? Both ruled 100% virtual instruction. Why bother, government entities do what they want, believe we are all children.


Sent from my iPhone using Forums

 

Yes, public comment matters. More so on the proposed regulation once it's drafted. But "start cruising now" is just wasting electrons without addressing the questions. Actual substantive comments on the questions will be addressed as they move forward. I haven't been involved in administrative regulations in VA and that's not what's happening here, or pretty much any state. But the federal process has plenty of places for comment, and meaningful comments on the actual subject have to be addressed to move through publication.

[Arizona Wildcat]

3 hours ago, Bo1953 said:

Not sure the reason one would expect a neutral population in this type of vacation style, which generally has never appeal to the masses.

 

Same goes for here at CC, 99% (maybe 40% is closer to truth) are die hard cruisers, so not to base 'public opinion' on, while a further breakdown needs to include the different conditions under which we will sail from nothing to vaccine with 80%+ effective rate before boarding including no mask while aboard and other 'precautions' currently used on land.

 

I understand your thoughts on this, regardless.

 

bon voyage

Bo, think about 80-90% of posts are from people that have cruised at least twice. 

Totally agree some would board a ship today even if the bubonic plague was present.  Others will wait till cruising resumes something more akin to pre COVID.  DW and I are in the second group.

[vulcan1971]

I only needed to read a handful of "comments" and had to stop. Beyond disgusting that people would want to cruise with no care or thought to the safety of anybody else. I feel sorry for the people that have to sift through all that chaff to get to a few good kernels of whatever.

[phoenix_dream]

I started reading some of the comments and the idiocy of the majority of the ones I read caused me to close it out and move on.  I want to start cruising as much as the next person - maybe more than most.  This was supposed to be our most cruised year ever since retiring recently.  Luckily we got in a couple before things went south.  So far have five cancelled, lifted and shifted a couple more, and likely will not be able to sail on our January B2B.  Very frustrating, but you can't just ignore the facts.  Cruising is very different from going to a restaurant or a hotel.  Don't need to elaborate here as everyone reading this knows the difference (I hope!).  I don't know why they are even asking people what they think - I can't imagine they will actually use any of the info, or hear any new ideas they have not already considered.

[npcl]

5 minutes ago, phoenix_dream said:

I started reading some of the comments and the idiocy of the majority of the ones I read caused me to close it out and move on.  I want to start cruising as much as the next person - maybe more than most.  This was supposed to be our most cruised year ever since retiring recently.  Luckily we got in a couple before things went south.  So far have five cancelled, lifted and shifted a couple more, and likely will not be able to sail on our January B2B.  Very frustrating, but you can't just ignore the facts.  Cruising is very different from going to a restaurant or a hotel.  Don't need to elaborate here as everyone reading this knows the difference (I hope!).  I don't know why they are even asking people what they think - I can't imagine they will actually use any of the info, or hear any new ideas they have not already considered.

While anyone can respond to the RFI it is really aimed at the cruise lines and other professionals that have expertise in the areas requested..  The comments that do not address question will just get classified as being non-relevant.  Those that actually address one or more of the questions with be reviewed in depth.

[Quo Vadis?]

https://www.miamiherald.com/news/business/tourism-cruises/article244792442.html?fbclid=IwAR3cwsaqOwxXOOziufvXvda6ASax_bhQlCXgcDQmkFnVTxNmP3gWONrqJ_E

[npcl]

3 hours ago, Argo. said:

https://www.miamiherald.com/news/business/tourism-cruises/article244792442.html?fbclid=IwAR3cwsaqOwxXOOziufvXvda6ASax_bhQlCXgcDQmkFnVTxNmP3gWONrqJ_E

I think the last 3 paragraphs is rather telling about how the CDC views the cooperation or the lack there of from the cruise lines.

[WonderMan3]

"The public" has been screaming for schools and colleges to open too. They have and now students are testing positive, hundreds are being quarantined and some of these places have now had to shut down again. You can't fix stupid.

[Quo Vadis?]

11 hours ago, WonderMan3 said:

"The public" has been screaming for schools and colleges to open too. They have and now students are testing positive, hundreds are being quarantined and some of these places have now had to shut down again. You can't fix stupid.

"Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large groups." George Carlin.

Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former.

Albert Einstein

Never argue with stupid people, they will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience.

 

Think of how stupid the average person is, and realize half of them are stupider than that.

George Carlin

 

"Anyway, no drug, not even alcohol, causes the fundamental ills of society. If we're looking for the source of our troubles, we shouldn't test people for drugs, we should test them for stupidity, ignorance, greed and love of power." ~ P. J. O'Rourke

 

"A fool flatters himself, a wise man flatters the fool." ~ Edward Bulwer-Lytton, 1st Baron Lytton

 

Just a few to make one smile... sadly..

[TeeRick]

6 minutes ago, Argo. said:

"Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large groups." George Carlin.

Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former.

Albert Einstein

Never argue with stupid people, they will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience.

 

Think of how stupid the average person is, and realize half of them are stupider than that.

George Carlin

 

"Anyway, no drug, not even alcohol, causes the fundamental ills of society. If we're looking for the source of our troubles, we shouldn't test people for drugs, we should test them for stupidity, ignorance, greed and love of power." ~ P. J. O'Rourke

 

"A fool flatters himself, a wise man flatters the fool." ~ Edward Bulwer-Lytton, 1st Baron Lytton

 

Just a few to make one smile... sadly..

“Stupid is as stupid does.” – Forrest Gump

[ExArkie]

On 8/19/2020 at 7:32 PM, npcl said:

While anyone can respond to the RFI it is really aimed at the cruise lines and other professionals that have expertise in the areas requested..  The comments that do not address question will just get classified as being non-relevant.  Those that actually address one or more of the questions with be reviewed in depth.

Having been on the receiving end of public comments from something published in the Federal Register, a couple of observations:

1. Virtually everyone that provides a comment has either a vested interest, usually economic, in the outcome or a strong (and frequently uninformed) opinion about the topic.
2. The agency requesting comments generally has an idea of what they plan to do, but want to see if anyone can point out fatal flaws in their idea, in this case without having to first offer the details of their plan - probably because that would divert the majority of comments into a "you can't do THAT" category rather than "here's what I'd like to see."
3. Public comments most definitely follow Sturgeon's Law, i.e., "ninety percent of everything is crap" as coined by science fiction writer Theodore Sturgeon.

[Quo Vadis?]

3 hours ago, ExArkie said:

1. Public comments most definitely follow Sturgeon's Law, i.e., "ninety percent of everything is crap" as coined by science fiction writer Theodore Sturgeon.

"Lies, damned lies, and statistics"...

[wwcruisers]

On 8/21/2020 at 11:26 AM, Argo. said:

"Lies, damned lies, and statistics"...

 

That's an oldie, but goodie, Arno! And, don't forget: 'Figures don't lie, but liars surely do figure!' (Can't remember who came up with that one.🤔)