Cruising Without a Vaccination

[coffeebean]

7 hours ago, electro said:

So you are saying that all anti vaxxers are pro choice? I somehow doubt that.

Not really but they surely do like to default to that mantra to defend their anti-vaccine stance.

[coffeebean]

6 hours ago, Sinbadssailors said:

How about we have no vaccine requirements to cruise and YOU make the choice/take the risk of cruising with my unvaccinated self?

 

You know, like on every other cruise that's ever been taken?

 

You think that's a problem?  Can't you just decide not to cruise? 

 

Then maybe you'll understand.

Many people don't want the shot for a multitude of reasons.  And none of those reasons are any of my business.  I got the shot.  My choice, weighing the risks and benefits.

 

 

That was my reasoning too. The vaccine benefits FAR outweigh the risks of getting Covid. I'm older and in the more vulnerable age group although I have no serious co-morbidities, so there is that.

[coffeebean]

1 hour ago, complawyer said:

im afraid because of the many people who think like you ( this isnt personal by the way) even if ive been vaccinated, if enough people come on that havent, and there is an outbreak of covid on board,

i'm just as screwed as if i had never had the shots. still going to be quarantined along with everybpdy else.

 

so since ncl wont let you  on without proof of vaccination, i guess its a moot point isnt it

My comments really had nothing to do with life on board a cruise ship. My comments addressed the situation our country is in with regards to reaching SAFE herd immunity.

 

[BirdTravels]

1 hour ago, coffeebean said:

 

Only 0.008% of vaccinated people have had "breakthrough infections". If you don't have the virus then you can not transmit the virus to others.  Figure out how RARE that transmission is. It is essentially nil. Read about it..........

 

Vaccinated people transmit the virus to others EXTREMELY RARELY.

All you need is one micro-outbreak on a ship and the cruise industry will be shut down again. 

[BirdTravels]

41 minutes ago, coffeebean said:

My comments really had nothing to do with life on board a cruise ship. My comments addressed the situation our country is in with regards to reaching SAFE herd immunity.

No such thing so long as the worldwide new case count per day is at a all-time high. "Your Country" is not isolated from the rest of the world. And a cruise ship population of crew and passengers is much, much, much more than your country. 

[sugcarol]

59 minutes ago, coffeebean said:

 

Only 0.008% of vaccinated people have had "breakthrough infections". If you don't have the virus then you can not transmit the virus to others.  Figure out how RARE that transmission is. It is essentially nil. Read about it..........

 

Vaccinated people transmit the virus to others EXTREMELY RARELY.

I posted the same thing today myself. My Nephrologist (also one of the few docs that admjnistered the vax in North Dallas. He said our biggest enemy is the media. They salivate to get the "Big negative news just to get views or comments. More than 200 million got vaccine and 5726 got breakthrough Covid or in other words 0.00017, that isnt even close to the CDC statement that there is a 5% chance of breakthrough infection. As far as J&J 9 million doses of vax administered and 15 got blood clots, gimme a break, i would accept J&J with no hesitation.

 

[Trimone]

3 hours ago, coffeebean said:

 

Only 0.008% of vaccinated people have had "breakthrough infections". If you don't have the virus then you can not transmit the virus to others.  Figure out how RARE that transmission is. It is essentially nil. Read about it..........

 

Vaccinated people transmit the virus to others EXTREMELY RARELY.

So my local highly rated hospital is doing things wrong 😑? 
Reality check 

[cscurlock]

7 hours ago, BirdTravels said:

All you need is one micro-outbreak on a ship and the cruise industry will be shut down again. 

Well that depends. Does the outbreak just make them feel like they have a cold or put them in the hospital?  The vaccine is meant to prevent hospitalization, if that is the case it might end up being like a norovirus outbreak which would make the cruise unpleasant but not shut the ship down.  I think 100% vaccination requirement is fine.  it should allow the ship to not have to return to port in case of an outbreak. 

[winterbliss]

Perhaps read the paper in Medicina by Dr Ronald Brown. Outcome Reporting Bias in Covid-19 mRNA Vaccine trials. While complex, it's important.

 

Explain to me why it would seem prudent to push for 100 per cent vaccination when this important part of the equation and how it relates to the actual efficacy is hidden. Again, certainly not seeing this researcher on tv debating with public health officials. I wonder why.

[coffeebean]

8 hours ago, BirdTravels said:

All you need is one micro-outbreak on a ship and the cruise industry will be shut down again. 

Are you expecting cruise ships to have ZERO cases? I hope for that but I think zero percentage of cases is not achievable, even with fully vaccinated ships. Fully vaccinated ships afford the cruise lines positive passengers/crew with no chance of having severe symptoms, therefore not needing hospitalization. That is the goal I believe they are striving for.

[coffeebean]

6 hours ago, Trimone said:

So my local highly rated hospital is doing things wrong 😑? 
Reality check 

What is it they are doing that you feel I think they are doing wrong?

[coffeebean]

36 minutes ago, winterbliss said:

Perhaps read the paper in Medicina by Dr Ronald Brown. Outcome Reporting Bias in Covid-19 mRNA Vaccine trials. While complex, it's important.

 

Explain to me why it would seem prudent to push for 100 per cent vaccination when this important part of the equation and how it relates to the actual efficacy is hidden. Again, certainly not seeing this researcher on tv debating with public health officials. I wonder why.

Do you see that the numbers of positive cases and deaths are plummeting in the US? The vaccines have done that for our country. That is all I need to know. Thank you to all those that made the decision to be vaccinated.

[winterbliss]

8 minutes ago, coffeebean said:

Do you see that the numbers of positive cases and deaths are plummeting in the US? The vaccines have done that for our country. That is all I need to know. Thank you to all those that made the decision to be vaccinated.

I advocate for informed consent devoid of coercion and perpetual fear. That is not what is happening.

[Stallion]

4 hours ago, winterbliss said:

Perhaps read the paper in Medicina by Dr Ronald Brown. Outcome Reporting Bias in Covid-19 mRNA Vaccine trials. While complex, it's important.

 

Explain to me why it would seem prudent to push for 100 per cent vaccination when this important part of the equation and how it relates to the actual efficacy is hidden. Again, certainly not seeing this researcher on tv debating with public health officials. I wonder why.

For the record-Ronald B. Brown, Ph.D. not a medical doctor

[Sea Hag]

On 5/2/2021 at 5:36 AM, ericfromri said:

any job that has any responsibility.  i wish we could deport all of these druggies.. 

I'm not a "druggie" but I'd like to know what you think is the mechanism for deporting American citizens who have been classified as such by somebody? 

[ericfromri]

3 minutes ago, Sea Hag said:

I'm not a "druggie" but I'd like to know what you think is the mechanism for deporting American citizens who have been classified as such by somebody? 

i personally think all criminals should lose there right to live here.

[Stallion]

No I respect the PhD. just needs to be disclosed when a person is talking about medical issues so the reader can understand the alleged expert's qualification

[Sea Hag]

Just now, ericfromri said:

i personally think all criminals should lose there right to live here.

All criminals? Where do you draw the line? I'm sure you don't mean people who jaywalk, but where is that line that would need to be drawn? Who decides that? Do you mean native born citizens or naturalized citizens? Both? 

[DCGuy64]

10 minutes ago, Stallion said:

No I respect the PhD. just needs to be disclosed when a person is talking about medical issues so the reader can understand the alleged expert's qualification

OK, but your little one-liner there about him not being a medical doctor sure reads like "don't trust him, he's not even a doctor!"

I accept that I may have misinterpreted your intent, but it sure looked catty. 😉

Edited May 7, 2021 by DCGuy64

[Stallion]

11 minutes ago, DCGuy64 said:

OK, but your little one-liner there about him not being a medical doctor sure reads like "don't trust him, he's not even a doctor!"

I accept that I may have misinterpreted your intent, but it sure looked catty. 😉

No my mom was a Ph.D. -a full time Professor at two top 50 universities. I've called Professors Dr. ---------  all my life if I knew they were Ph. Ds. But when talking about medical expertise its important to examine the person' medical qualifications. I'm not discounting a Ph. D could have relevant opinions in an area of expertise related to Covid. I said "for the record" just so people understand that he wasn't a medical doctor

Edited May 7, 2021 by Stallion

[DCGuy64]

9 minutes ago, Stallion said:

No my mom was a Ph.D. -a full time Professor at two top 50 universities. I've called Professors Dr. ---------  all my life if I knew they were Ph. Ds. But when talking about medical expertise its important to examine the person' medical qualifications. I'm not discounting a Ph. D could have relevant opinions in an area of expertise related to Covid. I said "for the record" just so people understand that he wasn't a medical doctor

Thanks for providing the context, that makes all the difference. Nice that you had a "Dr Mom." 😁

[Fivelinks]

18 hours ago, coffeebean said:

I'm protected by the Moderna vaccine and I trust that protection implicitly. My concern, as I have said before, is those people who are reluctant to be vaxxed are hindering our country's ability to reach herd immunity safely. That is it in a nutshell and an extremely important piece of the puzzle for us to get back to the normal lives we knew pre-Covid.

 

I'm so sick and tired of hearing that same mantra that you speak of. It is all about achieving SAFE herd immunity and NOT about not believing in the vaccines protective benefits.

The sick and tired thing goes both ways here.... Herd immunity and worry about Covid on the ship is being worn out. How about the fact people who are vaccinated can still get the virus or transmit it? Or, the fact herd immunity isn't realistic as we will never have 100% or even close the majority of the world population vaccinated. Bottom line... there are people who can't or won't get the vaccine and those who will but none of this foolish banter will change any of it. Unkind words, hostility towards others, and sharing of ignorance does nothing to further humanity....

[coffeebean]

1 hour ago, Fivelinks said:

The sick and tired thing goes both ways here.... Herd immunity and worry about Covid on the ship is being worn out. How about the fact people who are vaccinated can still get the virus or transmit it? Or, the fact herd immunity isn't realistic as we will never have 100% or even close the majority of the world population vaccinated. Bottom line... there are people who can't or won't get the vaccine and those who will but none of this foolish banter will change any of it. Unkind words, hostility towards others, and sharing of ignorance does nothing to further humanity....

That is another mantra I'm sick and tired of hearing..........

 

The breakthrough rate of infection of vaccinated people is 0.008%. The chance of a vaccinated person with a break through infection transmitting the virus to others is extremely low. Couple that with the low viral load that has been revealed in studies of breakthrough infections, the transmission rate becomes essentially zero. This is why vaccinated people essentially pose zero threat to anyone.

 

0.008% Breakthrough rate for vaccinated people

[coffeebean]

6 hours ago, Stallion said:

For the record-Ronald B. Brown, Ph.D. not a medical doctor

Shall I say I'm not surprised in the least.

[winterbliss]

6 hours ago, Stallion said:

For the record-Ronald B. Brown, Ph.D. not a medical doctor

So you've had a look at Dr. Brown's lengthy list of peer reviewed articles in the National Library of Medicine of the NIH and have a little idea of the vast research that he's done, yes?

 

Your implication that one has to be a medical doctor to have knowledge and expertise with the topic at hand...you may or may not want to ponder that. 

Edited May 7, 2021 by winterbliss