Rare DCGuy64 Posted June 18, 2021 #26 Share Posted June 18, 2021 https://www.cruiseindustrynews.com/cruise-news/25266-florida-wins-court-case-against-cdc-to-lift-conditional-sail-order.html This is awesome. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rare DCGuy64 Posted June 18, 2021 #27 Share Posted June 18, 2021 11 minutes ago, At Sea At Peace said: LOL. Pass around the 'crow' to the legal experts. 124 pages of ~ Wrong. Wrong. Wrong. 🙃 Now we will see retorts that 'it was from 'a DeSantis Judge. 🙄 And, of course, with the same guarantee, it will be overturned on appeal. 😁 Right? Looks like crow is on the menu tonight for all of the DeSantis haters. (And you know who you are!) 20 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rare cruisinghawg Posted June 18, 2021 #28 Share Posted June 18, 2021 1 minute ago, Tapi said: I think that even if a judge had said that cruises could proceed with zero protocols and restrictions, the cruise lines will still choose to have some protocols in place. I’m guessing that news outlets will be watching the cruise industry closely after this ruling. No doubt that microscopic over watch by the press will be monumental. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coldflame Posted June 18, 2021 #29 Share Posted June 18, 2021 I think it's clear from the conclusion that, other claims aside, the CDC "expert" failed royally. Other people familiar with the case had raised concerns with the expert report/testimony the CDC provided (ranging from her titles and degrees to her lack epidemiology/virology expertise). Amy Powell must all sorts of pissed the CDC did not provide an adequate expert to make the case. The motion for the proposed injunction must support the proposed terms [...] scientific evidence, including methodology, raw data, analysis, and the like and the names and qualifications of the scientists participating in the study, modeling, or the like. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jakeil7 Posted June 18, 2021 #30 Share Posted June 18, 2021 There will be an appeal, so I would not get too excited. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DWBirdman Posted June 18, 2021 #31 Share Posted June 18, 2021 Hopefully this can be the first nail in the coffin of the CDC overreach. 22 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coldflame Posted June 18, 2021 #32 Share Posted June 18, 2021 3 minutes ago, jakeil7 said: There will be an appeal, so I would not get too excited. I don't think it will be appealed yet. The case still open and the judge did not set aside/vacate the CSO. It will change from mandatory to suggested July 18th unless the CDC proposes a new CSO that's reasonable in the framework put forth by the court (by July 2nd). So there is a possibility the CSO will remain as mandatory. Florida, of course will have a chance to respond to that and the Judge will issue a decision on those. The order also ordered both parties to return to mediation, so the judge clearly wants both parties to compromise. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rare DCGuy64 Posted June 18, 2021 #33 Share Posted June 18, 2021 6 minutes ago, jakeil7 said: There will be an appeal, so I would not get too excited. I doubt it, the CDC is on the ropes as it is. The judge clearly didn't buy their arguments and they've just lowered the risk level for cruising. https://www.cnn.com/travel/article/cruise-travel-cdc-lowers-warning/index.html Cruising is safe, the judge effectively said so, so did Florida, and Florida won. End of. 13 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BSocial Posted June 18, 2021 #34 Share Posted June 18, 2021 (edited) Does this mean beginning July 18, Royal and Celebrity will drop the separate venues on Florida sailings, and no mask or vaccine mandate on board? Edited June 18, 2021 by BSocial 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DWBirdman Posted June 18, 2021 #35 Share Posted June 18, 2021 3 minutes ago, BSocial said: Does this mean beginning July 18, Royal and Celebrity will drop the separate venues on Florida sailings, and no mask or vaccine mandate on board? One can hope. 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rare cruisinghawg Posted June 18, 2021 #36 Share Posted June 18, 2021 3 minutes ago, BSocial said: Does this mean beginning July 18, Royal and Celebrity will drop the separate venues on Florida sailings, and no mask or vaccine mandate on board? I wouldn't go that far and I do not think they will either. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coldflame Posted June 18, 2021 #37 Share Posted June 18, 2021 (edited) 10 minutes ago, BSocial said: Does this mean beginning July 18, Royal and Celebrity will drop the separate venues on Florida sailings, and no mask or vaccine mandate on board? Way too early to tell the repercussions to the cruise in the short term. The orders were very lenient i.e. the judge did not vacate or set aside the CSO. The CDC has the chance to propose a new CSO that's within the rules set by the court, which if the Judge rules it sufficient, they will remain mandatory. For example the CDC could say "sail with 100% vaccination and you can cough on each other mouths no other rules" and the judge could agree with that. If a case is a war, is undeniable FL won an important battle today, but the way the judge is deciding the case is clear there are a lot of doors open here in which the CDC can work this out. Edited June 18, 2021 by coldflame 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rare jean87510 Posted June 18, 2021 #38 Share Posted June 18, 2021 45 minutes ago, DCGuy64 said: Right? Looks like crow is on the menu tonight for all of the DeSantis haters. (And you know who you are!) 😁 4 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DallasGuy75219 Posted June 18, 2021 #39 Share Posted June 18, 2021 11 minutes ago, BSocial said: Does this mean beginning July 18, Royal and Celebrity will drop the separate venues on Florida sailings, and no mask or vaccine mandate on board? If they want COVID outbreaks that will halt cruising again, yes. 7 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrMarc Posted June 18, 2021 #40 Share Posted June 18, 2021 1 hour ago, coldflame said: The scope of this preliminary decision is very narrow: it applies to FL only. I think it is much broader than that because it finds that the CDC overstepped it's statutory power, so that would apply everywhere. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rare John&LaLa Posted June 18, 2021 #41 Share Posted June 18, 2021 20 minutes ago, DCGuy64 said: I doubt it, the CDC is on the ropes as it is. The judge clearly didn't buy their arguments and they've just lowered the risk level for cruising. https://www.cnn.com/travel/article/cruise-travel-cdc-lowers-warning/index.html Cruising is safe, the judge effectively said so, so did Florida, and Florida won. End of. Maybe the CDC is looking for an out, so no appeal Realised they over stepped, but want to save face 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rare John&LaLa Posted June 18, 2021 #42 Share Posted June 18, 2021 12 minutes ago, cruisinghawg said: I wouldn't go that far and I do not think they will either. Let them self regulate 🤔 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smokeybandit Posted June 18, 2021 Author #43 Share Posted June 18, 2021 Lack of a binding CSO affects more how quickly and easily cruises can restart, not necessarily how "back to normal" things are during a cruise. 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChutChut Posted June 18, 2021 #44 Share Posted June 18, 2021 Tried to tell the naysayers FL's case was compelling but no one listened.... 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rare Ferry_Watcher Posted June 18, 2021 #45 Share Posted June 18, 2021 6 minutes ago, John&LaLa said: Let them self regulate 🤔 Darwinism at its best. Not sure if a non vaccinated adult (especially an older adult male) should take those odds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harkinmr Posted June 18, 2021 #46 Share Posted June 18, 2021 7 minutes ago, coldflame said: I don't think it will be appealed yet. The case still open and the judge did not set aside/vacate the CSO. It will change from mandatory to suggested July 18th unless the CDC proposes a new CSO that's reasonable in the framework put forth by the court (by July 2nd). So there is a possibility the CSO will remain as mandatory. Florida, of course will have a chance to respond to that and the Judge will issue a decision on those. The order also ordered both parties to return to mediation, so the judge clearly wants both parties to compromise. I’m not sure that the order granting the injunction but leaving the CSO in place for 30 days (pending a new CSO and mediation) necessarily precludes the CDC from filing an appeal immediately. The district court’s order could be stayed pending the appeal. I don’t think that the CDC will just back away at this point. We will see what comes out of the mediation and what the CDC comes up with to replace the current version of the CSO. It will be interesting to see how this order impacts the current approval process for new sailings, as well as the RCI test cruises that still need to happen before July/August sailings. Will it slow down the process? It will also be interesting to see what happens with Alaska cruises and whether Conditional Sailing Certificates will be issued or even valid. The Alaska legislation may ultimately have to be amended. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChutChut Posted June 18, 2021 #47 Share Posted June 18, 2021 14 minutes ago, DallasGuy75219 said: If they want COVID outbreaks that will halt cruising again, yes. The previous disaster was due to the negligence of Princess (and I love Princess) and Japan. We've learned a lot in over a year. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yorkvillain Posted June 18, 2021 #48 Share Posted June 18, 2021 Did they say if my Allure cruise is going to happen??? I don’t have the Allure booked. I was just waiting for someone to say something like that. 4 8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harkinmr Posted June 18, 2021 #49 Share Posted June 18, 2021 13 minutes ago, John&LaLa said: Maybe the CDC is looking for an out, so no appeal Realised they over stepped, but want to save face I highly doubt that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChutChut Posted June 18, 2021 #50 Share Posted June 18, 2021 20 minutes ago, coldflame said: Way too early to tell the repercussions to the cruise in the short term. The orders were very lenient i.e. the judge did not vacate or set aside the CSO. The CDC has the chance to propose a new CSO that's within the rules set by the court, which if the Judge rules it sufficient, they will remain mandatory. For example the CDC could say "sail with 100% vaccination and you can cough on each other mouths no other rules" and the judge could agree with that. If a case is a war, is undeniable FL won an important battle today, but the way the judge is deciding the case is clear there are a lot of doors open here in which the CDC can work this out. Incorrect. The judge very clearly indicated the current CSO is invalid and gave the CDC one month to amend it consistent with the court order. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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