Court rules for Florida in cruise case, grants injunction stopping CDC order...

[AbbyCruiser45]

So from what I’m understanding, nothing changes? There’s no way Celebrity will back track their vaccine requirement. The Millennium reported today that they had zero cases on board with the debarkation testing. That’s what they want to continue to put out to the news. Especially considering articles ranged from hesitant to negative regarding last week’s positive cases, some even calling it an “outbreak”. Why would Celebrity risk that? The June 26th, July 3rd, and 17th sailings sold out. Clearly these are popular and people are okay with vaccines. 

[colliece]

Just now, Oville said:

He who knows it all.

Nope I do not, I just will wait to see what happens, but you obviously have a problem with me as you keep attacking me for some reason. 

 

I will wait to see what happens, but all I heard for the last month is Florida has no chance of winning and the Governor is going to have mud on his face, been hearing that for the last 15 months.  I just wish we could get back to actual cruising and not arguing.  But I am looking forward to my 7/3 cruise on the Edge, and hopefully everyone actually on board will be a lot more civil than on this message board.

[sasset]

3 hours ago, slewis7 said:

I will be cruising, but not from Florida.  Good luck to those who make that choice.

Amen. I may end a transatlantic in Florida, but then it's straight to the airport.

[colliece]

3 minutes ago, AbbyCruiser45 said:

So from what I’m understanding, nothing changes? There’s no way Celebrity will back track their vaccine requirement. The Millennium reported today that they had zero cases on board with the debarkation testing. That’s what they want to continue to put out to the news. Especially considering articles ranged from hesitant to negative regarding last week’s positive cases, some even calling it an “outbreak”. Why would Celebrity risk that? The June 26th, July 3rd, and 17th sailings sold out. Clearly these are popular and people are okay with vaccines. 

To be clear though sold out is a little misleading as they are only at 30-50% capacity.  Kind like when I went to a hockey game that was sold out, but yet there were 12,000 empty seats.  

 

But I agree that I don't think they will change to much, as they know most of the customers will want them to do more.

[harkinmr]

2 hours ago, Ken the cruiser said:

Also, does this mean simulated cruises are not required anymore. RCCL will like that.

No. It just means that test cruises are up in the air if they are after July 18th. The CSO remains in place until that date. An alternative order could come into play at that time or the CDC could appeal today’s ruling which could leave the current order in place beyond July 18th.  There’s probably not going to be any immediate change to any plans. 

[gone2c]

1 minute ago, colliece said:

To be clear though sold out is a little misleading as they are only at 30-50% capacity.  Kind like when I went to a hockey game that was sold out, but yet there were 12,000 empty seats.  

 

But I agree that I don't think they will change to much, as they know most of the customers will want them to do more.

I'm on the 17th cruise so should be okay as nothing will have been changed by then.  Then it's off to Africa and then none of my next 6 cruises originate or end in Florida.  It will be February 2023 before my next Florida cruise.  Hopefully this insanity will be resolved by then.    

[Nymich]

So we get the CSO that was until Nov 1 lifted effective July 18 and that isn't a victory?  It is a huge victory for the industry and now CDC can come back by July 2 with a more realistic plan.  Vaccine is a whole different story.  This was a big victory for the Industry.

[wrk2cruise]

But what is stopping sailing this summer with the current instructions?   Celebrity is sailing 1 ship next next week and the second one a few weeks later?   That's all Celebrity has planned for USA this summer.    Alaska was nuked by PVSA, not the CDC.

[mayleeman]

1 hour ago, Nymich said:

So we get the CSO that was until Nov 1 lifted effective July 18 and that isn't a victory?  It is a huge victory for the industry and now CDC can come back by July 2 with a more realistic plan.  Vaccine is a whole different story.  This was a big victory for the Industry.

 

Wasn't CDC modifying parts of the NSO anyway, recognizing the vax effectiveness?  Seems likely the delayed injunction may, if not vacated, simply speed up the CDC's timeline. Which is what many if not most people were urging anyway.

[hulamoon]

2 hours ago, sasset said:

Amen. I may end a transatlantic in Florida, but then it's straight to the airport.

How would transatlantic work leaving Florida? Would Europe take unvaccinated passengers? 

[slewis7]

2 hours ago, sasset said:

Amen. I may end a transatlantic in Florida, but then it's straight to the airport.

That is actually what I am booked on and that is exactly my plan.

[iamaqt2]

I see little change to the cruise lines current plans due to this.  There's no way they're going to risk an outbreak by dropping CSO protocols. If anything, they've embraced them, and gone a few steps further.

[BermudaBound2014]

4 hours ago, Jazzbo said:

I couldn't get the link, but here's the headline, source, date, and  author (I had forgotten it was specific to cruises)

By Anthony Man

I found a link describing the survey results Here if interested: I think this headline is very misleading. The survey sample was N= 600 with a SD of 4%. No generalizations can be made to the entire population, but the headline sells newspapers.

[Nymich]

53 minutes ago, mayleeman said:

 

Wasn't CDC modifying parts of the NSO anyway, recognizing the vax effectiveness?  Seems likely the delayed injunction may, if not vacated, simply speed up the CDC's timeline. Which is what many if not most people were urging anyway.

Looks to me like the CDC knew they were going to lose this case which is why they have been working with the cruise lines and loosening their grip the last few weeks. Del Rio credited the Florida Governor with this even after they had some back and forth.  At least now we can get a more realistic plan and I do think all sides will have to work together.

[grandgeezer]

What has/will change?? They are well on their way to cruising again anyway. Wall Street wasn't impressed, it was down for the day and down some more in after hours trading.

[Grandma Cruising]

9 hours ago, medtech71 said:

Fantastic!! Freedom wins!

And that includes my freedom not to go on a cruise that doesn’t include a requirement for all passengers & crew to be vaccinated.

[graphicguy]

9 hours ago, K12Guy said:

If you read and understand the ruling it really isn't much of a victory, rather it just says that the CDC orders are not enforceable in Florida. DeSantis hasn't really 'won' anything. Also, Florida cannot keep cruise lines from creating and enforcing policy for those who want to board as nonvaccinated.

The governor may actually be hurting the industry by forcing cruise lines to allow non-vaccinated passengers. Time will tell.

Agree.  The cruise lines are actually the adults in the room regarding all of this.  Plus, I notice Celebrity still hasn’t changed their policy.  Don’t show COVID Vaccine proof, you’re considered unvaccinated.  And, they keep the 5% unvaccinated cap.   As such, you’ll pay more, be required to wear masks, and not be allowed/be restricted in some venues.

 

Assuming  NCL and Carnival remain 100% vaccinated cruises.  

[tunaman2011]

Greetings

 

It's too early for anyone to celebrate or commiserate this ruling.  Even if the CSO is null and void what will the cruise lines change?  The only item really delaying the industry is the "test cruises" and the possible delay between the test cruise and revenue sailings.  It doesn't mandate that lines "must" allow non-vaccinated on-board or that the lines can't adhere to many of the other requirements of the CSO.  Many line would advertise their "enhanced health protocols" as a selling point.  They will cater to their customers.  

 

Good Sailing

Tom

[ipeeinthepool]

4 minutes ago, tunaman2011 said:

Greetings

 

It's too early for anyone to celebrate or commiserate this ruling.  Even if the CSO is null and void what will the cruise lines change?  The only item really delaying the industry is the "test cruises" and the possible delay between the test cruise and revenue sailings.  It doesn't mandate that lines "must" allow non-vaccinated on-board or that the lines can't adhere to many of the other requirements of the CSO.  Many line would advertise their "enhanced health protocols" as a selling point.  They will cater to their customers.  

 

Good Sailing

Tom

 

In addition, what are the restrictive policies that people think need to be changed.  At this point the cruise lines are moving as fast as possible to get sailing again.

[hcat]

Agree.seems case was about the powers of CDC and how they can make, impose and enforce rules...not just about cruises??? Waiting to hear and read more.

 

Many local and state rules have been  tossed based upon agency or legis or gov exceeding authority,  or failing to follow rule making procedures.

 

Most everything  here in NY is open and unmasked..honor system  for vaccine proof.

[bajathree]

11 hours ago, evandbob said:

I received an email solicitation for a free balcony for up to 4 people on the June 26 Edge sailing about an hour after the preliminary injunction was announced.

 

Coincidence?

Absolutely cause the sailing has been closed for a week now.

[harkinmr]

9 hours ago, wrk2cruise said:

But what is stopping sailing this summer with the current instructions?   Celebrity is sailing 1 ship next next week and the second one a few weeks later?   That's all Celebrity has planned for USA this summer.    Alaska was nuked by PVSA, not the CDC.

Because the restart is not easy.  And because the cruise lines as a whole are going to remain cautious, not because of the CDC but because of the last 15 months.
 

If everyone would take note, most cruise lines planning to depart from the US have some level of vaccine requirement and those with at least 95% passenger/98% crew vaccinated have pretty much free reign under the CSO. They can sail when they want and virtually how they want.

 

Many of these lines are instituting testing and other policies they aren’t even obligated to under the CSO. Why?  Because they are not stupid or negligent. They will do what they have to and remain cautious because they need to and want to. And that means a slow and measured restart. Not acting like they’ve been shot out of a cannon.  

[CI66774]

53 minutes ago, harkinmr said:

Because the restart is not easy.  And because the cruise lines as a whole are going to remain cautious, not because of the CDC but because of the last 15 months.
 

If everyone would take note, most cruise lines planning to depart from the US have some level of vaccine requirement and those with at least 95% passenger/98% crew vaccinated have pretty much free reign under the CSO. They can sail when they want and virtually how they want.

 

Many of these lines are instituting testing and other policies they aren’t even obligated to under the CSO. Why?  Because they are not stupid or negligent. They will do what they have to and remain cautious because they need to and want to. And that means a slow and measured restart. Not acting like they’ve been shot out of a cannon.  

I agree but any going forward with a vaccine verification out of Florida are going to get spanked with monumental fines per sailing. The FL law is in force and I predict will be upheld against any legal challenge. I also predict FL will be successful in collecting those fines if any cruise line ignores the law. 

[harkinmr]

1 minute ago, CI66774 said:

I agree but any going forward with a vaccine verification out of Florida are going to get spanked with monumental fines per sailing. The FL law is in force and I predict will be upheld against any legal challenge. I also predict FL will be successful in collecting those fines if any cruise line ignores the law. 

I don’t think they will be fined. The cruise lines have crafted a workaround and have been openly promoting it and so far the state has been silent on that plan.  Prior to that, the state was much more vocal. My suspicion is that the plan received a nod from the state.  We will see of course if there are further hiccups, but my bet (for what it’s worth) is that ships will sail and no fines or legal recourse will be necessary.  

[Cruising89143]

4 hours ago, graphicguy said:

Agree.  The cruise lines are actually the adults in the room regarding all of this.  Plus, I notice Celebrity still hasn’t changed their policy.  Don’t show COVID Vaccine proof, you’re considered unvaccinated.  And, they keep the 5% unvaccinated cap.   As such, you’ll pay more, be required to wear masks, and not be allowed/be restricted in some venues.

 

Assuming  NCL and Carnival remain 100% vaccinated cruises.  

100% agree with the above comment. I’m willing to sit back to wait and see what happens but I don’t think the cruise lines are going to chance having major issues as they know they have shot to get this right. They’re still allowed to follow any of the guidelines given by the CDC if they so choose.