CDC Not Faring Well In Federal Court

[Daniel A]

The CDC appealed the injunction issued on June 18 scheduled to take effect on July 18.  Yesterday the appeal of the injunction was denied and it appears that the CDC will no longer be able to issue requirements but can still offer guidelines in Florida.  It looks like the CDC may need to change the name of the program from Conditional Sail Order to Conditional Sail Suggestions...

 

From yesterday's ruling, you can get a sense of where the court stands in relation to the CDC's actions re: cruise industry in Florida.

 

Edited July 8, 2021 by Daniel A

[franktown]

It was from the same judge that issued the original order.  They will appeal to a higher court.

[ontheweb]

5 hours ago, franktown said:

It was from the same judge that issued the original order.  They will appeal to a higher court.

And it is not over until it is over. Not surprising that the original judge did not disagree with himself

[gardenbunny]

A judge that uses common sense!!  “The CSO was absolutley unwarranted, unprecendented and (IMO Massively) injurious exercise of government power…”

I could not have said it better myself!!  To single out one industry because of what happened at the very beginning of COVID, when no one knew what to do, and by quarantining everyone on board only made it worse, cruise lines were singled out as a death trap if you were to get on board!  Several cruise lines overseas have been doing cruises to nowhere for quite some time.  I think if there have been massive outbreaks it would be a lead headline breaking news story for the media.

 

 

[dogdoc2002]

Does anyone know if there is a separate suit from the cruiselines against Florida regarding the prohibition of vaccination proof?

 

[cruzsnooze]

I believe the CDC over a political judge. The court sees dollar signs the CDC sees public health. If California didn't require proof of vaccination I would cancel my two cruises on Princess .  

[gardenbunny]

I have not seen anything. Although I thought I read the CLIA was having formal talks with FL to try to negotiate a fair resolution.  

I thought CDC gave cruise ships 2 options to do either test cruises or have at least 95% vaccinated.  But I like the way they try to get around it by asking passengers to “volunteer” to show your card!  I have no problem with that.

I did all the requirements to spend a month in Hawaii in February - so whatever it takes, within reason, I’ll do it.

[franktown]

35 minutes ago, gardenbunny said:

I have not seen anything. Although I thought I read the CLIA was having formal talks with FL to try to negotiate a fair resolution.  

I thought CDC gave cruise ships 2 options to do either test cruises or have at least 95% vaccinated.  But I like the way they try to get around it by asking passengers to “volunteer” to show your card!  I have no problem with that.

I did all the requirements to spend a month in Hawaii in February - so whatever it takes, within reason, I’ll do it.

You are correct.  CDC gave them either options to resume cruises from US ports.

[Daniel A]

10 hours ago, dogdoc2002 said:

Does anyone know if there is a separate suit from the cruiselines against Florida regarding the prohibition of vaccination proof?

I would think if there was one, we would have heard about it.  All other industries in Florida are also covered by the no requirement law and I've not seen lawsuits from any of those industries either.  That said, just because I haven't seen any doesn't mean there aren't any out there.  (There may be lobbyists working behind the scenes with the legislature and we wouldn't be aware of any of that type of activity.)

[Musky Ike]

7 minutes ago, Daniel A said:

I would think if there was one, we would have heard about it.  All other industries in Florida are also covered by the no requirement law and I've not seen lawsuits from any of those industries either.  That said, just because I haven't seen any doesn't mean there aren't any out there.  (There may be lobbyists working behind the scenes with the legislature and we wouldn't be aware of any of that type of activity.)

I don't think any other business was required to have  95% unvaccinated customers by the CDC. Even Disney

[Daniel A]

11 minutes ago, Musky Ike said:

I don't think any other business was required to have  95% unvaccinated customers by the CDC. Even Disney

I think you just articulated the core reason for the lawsuit and the decisions by Judge Merryday.

[K.T.B.]

12 hours ago, cruzsnooze said:

I believe the CDC over a political judge. The court sees dollar signs the CDC sees public health. If California didn't require proof of vaccination I would cancel my two cruises on Princess .  

 

I agree to a point.  I feel the CDC overreached its authority where the cruise lines were concerned.  YES, for the health of the public cruises needed to stop.  However, the restart has been severely hindered by the CDC's inability to get out of its own way and probably took about 6 months longer than it needed.  They went nuclear option when something with more finesse was required.  And, as it's been proven so far, cruises can happen safely without the CDC telling the lines what to do or how to do it.

 

Be that as it may, ships are sailing again regardless.  Time to move on and enjoy our vaccinated life.

[Daniel A]

20 minutes ago, K.T.B. said:

 

I agree to a point.  I feel the CDC overreached its authority where the cruise lines were concerned.  YES, for the health of the public cruises needed to stop.  However, the restart has been severely hindered by the CDC's inability to get out of its own way and probably took about 6 months longer than it needed.  They went nuclear option when something with more finesse was required.  And, as it's been proven so far, cruises can happen safely without the CDC telling the lines what to do or how to do it.

 

Be that as it may, ships are sailing again regardless.  Time to move on and enjoy our vaccinated life.

Can you do a b2b or a 14 day Panama Canal cruise out of the US?

Edited July 9, 2021 by Daniel A

[cruzsnooze]

It wasn't an over reaction from the several health organizations originally. When more was learned protocols changed because science allows for learning and changing. When more was learned and new guidelines issued people stated the CDC didn't know what it was doing but the opposite was true. I believe Dr. Fauci and the WHO and the CDC more then non medical organisations. 

  I won't cruise on a ship that doesn't require 95% vaccination rate. That may not be enough with the new variants emerging.  

[K.T.B.]

48 minutes ago, Daniel A said:

Can you do a b2b or a 14 day Panama Canal cruise out of the US?

 I believe so.  I know people have them booked.  My next cruise in Feb. is a 15 day cruise.

[mom says]

I hope that the CDC will appeal to a higher court. I expected nothing less from the current judge. I have my doubts as to his ability or desire to be impartial.

[PMGS247]

1 minute ago, Baystate said:

If you believe that vaccines work why would you wear a mask if you're vaccinated?

 

I have been vaccinated since early February and do not wear a mask anywhere except at the hospital where it is required.  I couldn't care less if someone else is vaccinated or not.  That is a personal decision, and if they choose not to and get sick, that still does not put me at risk.  So why all the fuss about saying you will not cruise if others aren't vaccinated?  I don't get it.  You either believe that they work or you don't, and if you don't think the vaccine will protect you then why get it?!

 

This is a free country.  I wish people would stop trying to tell other people what to do and worry about themselves because I bet that they wouldn't want to be lectured by people who feel just as strongly, but the opposite way.

 

Generally I agree but I know my major concern from a cruising perspective is the prospect of a significant outbreak on board.  While the CDC might be pushed out from dictating cruising protocols, they will still have the jurisdiction to disallow a ship to disembark if there is a significant outbreak on board.

 

It'll be on the cruises to manage this and make sure they avoid it, but the more unvaccinated on board, the more masks are needed, and the greater the risk for outbreaks.  Even as someone vaccinated, I don't like either of those things.  The more vaccinated on board, the better. It's not just about personal safety.

[Baystate]

9 minutes ago, PMGS247 said:

 

Generally I agree but I know my major concern from a cruising perspective is the prospect of a significant outbreak on board.  While the CDC might be pushed out from dictating cruising protocols, they will still have the jurisdiction to disallow a ship to disembark if there is a significant outbreak on board.

 

It'll be on the cruises to manage this and make sure they avoid it, but the more unvaccinated on board, the more masks are needed, and the greater the risk for outbreaks.  Even as someone vaccinated, I don't like either of those things.  The more vaccinated on board, the better. It's not just about personal safety.

Good points

[Daniel A]

4 hours ago, K.T.B. said:

 I believe so.  I know people have them booked.  My next cruise in Feb. is a 15 day cruise.

Sorry, I should have said between now and November 1.  My bad...

[Steelers36]

6 hours ago, cruzsnooze said:

I believe Dr. Fauci and the WHO and the CDC more then non medical organisations. 

I get your point, but Fauci has been all over the map on Covid-19 - especially in 2021.

[K.T.B.]

2 hours ago, Daniel A said:

Sorry, I should have said between now and November 1.  My bad...

 

Again, I believe so.  I seem to recall reading it on the Celebrity part of the forum.  Not 100% sure though.

[caribill]

11 hours ago, Daniel A said:

Sorry, I should have said between now and November 1.  My bad...

 

In that case the answer is "No."

 

(And no 14 day cruises are scheduled in that time period.)

[K.T.B.]

2 hours ago, caribill said:

 

In that case the answer is "No."

 

(And no 14 day cruises are scheduled in that time period.)

 

The answer is "yes".  Someone posted that they're doing a B2B on Edge the end of this month:  LINK  However, the answer is "no" for any cruises 14 days or longer in 2021.

[kilkoyne]

On 7/8/2021 at 10:07 PM, cruzsnooze said:

I believe the CDC over a political judge. The court sees dollar signs the CDC sees public health. If California didn't require proof of vaccination I would cancel my two cruises on Princess .  

 

The CDC is saying it's ok to be around unvaccinated people as long as you are vaccinated and are also are not requiring 100% vaccination cruise ships.

 

Why would you cancel your cruise if vaccination wasn't required when the CDC is saying it's ok? I don't understand.

Edited July 10, 2021 by kilkoyne

[kilkoyne]

20 hours ago, K.T.B. said:

....cruises can happen safely without the CDC telling the lines what to do or how to do it.

 

Be that as it may, ships are sailing again regardless.  Time to move on and enjoy our vaccinated life.

 

Right on...👍

Edited July 10, 2021 by kilkoyne