Italy shore excursions are restricted to cruise guided excursions.

[Hlitner]

Traveling today means taking a deep breath, trying to relax, and trying to control one's anxiety (not always easy).  The rules change on a regular basis (sometimes daily) and although you need to know and comply with the restrictions/rules you may not always know the source.  If you want to get hung up on the source of rules/restrictions it may add to your anxiety;  On our recent Seabourn cruise out of Barbados, we had lots of restrictions in all our Caribbean ports.  You would not find the source of those restrictions anywhere because they resulted from an agreement made between Seabourn and the Government of Barbados!  So, for example, when we were in St Maarten the island government would have been OK with passengers going ashore on their own but we were restricted to bubble excursions because of the deal made with Barbados!  Go figure.   The Seabourn deal with Barbados had lots of tough restrictions (that impacted every port) because that was part of the price paid by Seabourn if they wanted to use Barbados as their home port.

 

Since DW and I have been traveling throughout the pandemic (including 2 cruises in the past 3 months and another cruise coming up at the end of this month) we have learned to simply keep up with the changing rules and not get too hung up on who is ordering what.  It has become complicated and can often involve private deals made with governments.   Another example of these private deals is that until mid-August there was no mask mandate on the Seabourn Ovation which was cruising in Greece.  Apparently the Greek government and Seabourn decided to try the cruises without masking of passengers.  But other ships (such as Silverseas) did need to maintain a passenger mask mandate.  You will not find anything official about any of this on the Internet because these all involved direct negotiations between cruise lines and the government.

 

Hank

[zdcatc12]

17 hours ago, steamboats said:

 

That´s widely reported on the NCL board... NCL seems to have a different way of interpreting "bubble" shore tours. BTW, same for Capri... You can just walk around.

 

steamboats

Yes, happened with us on our NCL cruise in September. However, this was only for the tours originating in Naples. The other Italy tours, i.e. Florence and Sardinia, the bubble was strictly enforced. Not sure about Rome as that is where we embarked from.

[pompeii]

We'll be in Italy on a TA next fall and one of our excursion providers gave us this helpful link to an article she wrote:  https://www.driverinrome.com/blogs/independent-excursions-forbidden-in-italian-ports-the-truth.  She says in no uncertain terms that the decree is from the Italian government, and the article talks about the specific decree.  

[cruisemom42]

5 hours ago, pompeii said:

We'll be in Italy on a TA next fall and one of our excursion providers gave us this helpful link to an article she wrote:  https://www.driverinrome.com/blogs/independent-excursions-forbidden-in-italian-ports-the-truth.  She says in no uncertain terms that the decree is from the Italian government, and the article talks about the specific decree.  

 

Very interesting, thanks for posting this.

[steamboats]

That blog article doesn´t show the truth either. Actually the "rule" is in effect since August 2020 when cruising restarted in Italy. The March 2nd, 2021 decree did only repeat the already effective regulation. The March 2nd, 2021 decree is by the minister president of Italy while the others (which have an expiry date) are by the ministry of health and have different regulations (especially the list of countries which can travel to Italy... like UK had to quarantine until the Sep 5th decree came into effect and UK was taken off that list).

 

And yes, the regulation is based on talks between the Italian government and the cruise lines. They cruise lines presented their healthy sail plans to the Italian government. And it was the Italian government who decided what they wanted to implement in Italy. By August 2020 it would have been impossible to restart cruising without "bubble shore tours". Back then there were no vaccines available.

 

Of course it may be time to rethink this policy as times have changed (but I doubt that Italy will looking at the current situation in Europe with exploding numbers).

 

steamboats

[euro cruiser]

And the cruise lines have no incentive to push for a change, not until passengers refuse to cruise unless they can get off on their own.

[Vineyard View]

5 hours ago, euro cruiser said:

And the cruise lines have no incentive to push for a change, not until passengers refuse to cruise unless they can get off on their own.

There is that. I definitely agree with you. 
I also think that passengers are not ready to do that. 
Given we have an upcoming trip next spring and are not cruise excursion participants, we truly are not sure how we will decide once full payment is due in January. It is also a big part of our decision in choosing the cruise line we have switched to. We are not at this time open to paying in full so far in advance as we were previously. 

 

 

 

[steamboats]

8 hours ago, euro cruiser said:

And the cruise lines have no incentive to push for a change, not until passengers refuse to cruise unless they can get off on their own.

 

I´d say some cruise lines have no incentive... like MSC or Costa. TUI Cruises or NCL would have loved to let their passengers ashore individually. NCL (and RCI) have advertised this in the beginning and then had to push back.

 

steamboats

[marazul]

The whole situation may change by the Spring.  As of today, Nov. 19, 76.5 % of the eligible Italian population has been vaccinated.  At the present rate, 80% should be vaccinated by February.  It is very likely that excursion restrictions will be eased by the next cruising season especially if they continue the vaccine/testing requirements for entry into the country. So, relax and wait.

 

Here is the daily vaccination calculator for Italy: 

https://lab.gedidigital.it/gedi-visual/2021/covid-19-vaccini-scopri-in-tempo-reale-quando-saremo-tutti-vaccinati/

[steamboats]

76.5% of the eligible population is not that much as all under 12 y are not eligible. The number of eligible population will also rise when the 5-11 y age group can be vaccinated (the decision of the EMA is announced for next week). But I assume you meant "total population" not "eligible population".

 

And it´s not just the Italian population but also the cruisers which have to be vaccinated. So far especially Costa and MSC have not switched to "fully vaccinated" (or at least 12 and above fully vaccinated). The Italian government does not want to face a whole ship under quarantine.

 

steamboats

[marazul]

5 hours ago, steamboats said:

76.5% of the eligible population is not that much as all under 12 y are not eligible. The number of eligible population will also rise when the 5-11 y age group can be vaccinated (the decision of the EMA is announced for next week). But I assume you meant "total population" not "eligible population".

 

And it´s not just the Italian population but also the cruisers which have to be vaccinated. So far especially Costa and MSC have not switched to "fully vaccinated" (or at least 12 and above fully vaccinated). The Italian government does not want to face a whole ship under quarantine.

 

 You are right on many counts.  It is total population.  Italy has 60 million people and more than 45 million have been vaccinated.  That is 75%+ of the total population.  They expect 80% by February and more by summer, especially as soon as bambini can be vaccinated.

 

Italy requires visitors entering Italy to be vaccinated or tested (Green Pass or equivalent).  That is why tourists arriving in Italy can tour on their own. 

 

With cruises that disembark thousands of people for a few hours in each port, there is no practical way of policing where each tourist embarked, came from, or his/her vaccine status. That is why the bubbles are required now for all cruises.  There are many loopholes and inconveniences for tourists, but that is what works best for Italy's public health.  It is not perfect, but it can mitigate the spread of infection.  And bubble tours are better than no tours at all. 

 

The increase in vaccinations will allow Italy to relax the bubble shore excursion rules if they find it helps the tourism industry.  The cruise lines would be doing themselves and their passengers a favor by requiring passengers to be vaccinated.  Italy is not going to bother policing each port stop by each cruise ship to decide who can get out on their own or not. 

 

All we can do is chill and hope for the best. 

[IWantToLiveOverTheSea]

24 minutes ago, marazul said:

 You are right on many counts.  It is total population.  Italy has 60 million people and more than 45 million have been vaccinated.  That is 75%+ of the total population.  They expect 80% by February and more by summer, especially as soon as bambini can be vaccinated.

 

Italy requires visitors entering Italy to be vaccinated or tested (Green Pass or equivalent).  That is why tourists arriving in Italy can tour on their own. 

 

With cruises that disembark thousands of people for a few hours in each port, there is no practical way of policing where each tourist embarked, came from, or his/her vaccine status. That is why the bubbles are required now for all cruises.  There are many loopholes and inconveniences for tourists, but that is what works best for Italy's public health.  It is not perfect, but it can mitigate the spread of infection.  And bubble tours are better than no tours at all. 

 

The increase in vaccinations will allow Italy to relax the bubble shore excursion rules if they find it helps the tourism industry.  The cruise lines would be doing themselves and their passengers a favor by requiring passengers to be vaccinated.  Italy is not going to bother policing each port stop by each cruise ship to decide who can get out on their own or not. 

 

All we can do is chill and hope for the best. 

I have no problem with Italy (or any other country) doing whatever it needs to do to get this pandemic under control within their borders.  While I prefer to be able to do whatever I want in a port, in August in Iceland, I had a fabulous time on my bubble tours, and found it was perfectly acceptable in exchange for being able to resume cruising in the first place. And since I was on a cruise line which required 100% of its passengers to be fully vaccinated, with no young bambinos allowed, I felt safe.  I also felt passengers were only a small threat to the fabulous communities we visited.    

 

I think most cruise lines, or at least most of the ones appealing primarily to English speakers, are requiring vaccinations now.  I do wonder about next summer though, and whether the world will be in good enough shape to relax some restrictions, including whether vaccine boosters will be required.  But I don't have a crystal ball, so I'll just wait and see!  Even if I'm bubbled, it will be good!

 

[steamboats]

16 hours ago, marazul said:

 Italy requires visitors entering Italy to be vaccinated or tested (Green Pass or equivalent).  That is why tourists arriving in Italy can tour on their own.

 

NCL is cruising fully vaccinated and even then the passengers are not allowed to go onshore on their own. That´s definitely not making any sense at all.

 

RCI had fully vaccinated 18+. And people were free to roam around in Spain when fully vaccinated. As soon as they had a non vaccinated child in their group they had to go on organized shore tours. Not so for Italy - all had to go on organized shore tours.

 

MSC/Costa/TUI Cruises/AIDA did allow non vaccinated adults too. So it makes sense to do only organized shore tours.

 

Anyway... all passengers are tested despite the fact they are vaccinated, recovered or already tested. So in fact those who are not vaccinated were double tested. For entering Italy by car I only need a test (no, I´m vaccinated, so don´t worry).

 

Here in Germany the vaccination rate is a little lower than in Italy. We have roughly 68% of the total population fully vaccinated and 70.4% with at least one dose. But it´s not just the lower vaccination rate which lets the numbers explode... it´s that the people all thought, o.k., it´s over, I don´t have to take care anymore...

 

steamboats

[Torquer]

I just found this thread for the first time...very interesting.  Although no one knows what the policies will be next summer, for this past cruising season, what were the policies about independent touring before and after the cruise?  For example, we have a cruise that embarks from Venice (yes I know...Venice has other issues with cruise ships but hopefully the ship will use nearby Marghera as their port).  We had planned to fly in 3 days before and explore Venice on our own before the cruise starts.  I would hope this was not prohibited, but would like to hear from someone who knows for sure.

[ECCruise]

10 hours ago, Torquer said:

I just found this thread for the first time...very interesting.  Although no one knows what the policies will be next summer, for this past cruising season, what were the policies about independent touring before and after the cruise?  For example, we have a cruise that embarks from Venice (yes I know...Venice has other issues with cruise ships but hopefully the ship will use nearby Marghera as their port).  We had planned to fly in 3 days before and explore Venice on our own before the cruise starts.  I would hope this was not prohibited, but would like to hear from someone who knows for sure.

As far as your pre-cruise Venice visit, it will likely not be prohibited since it isn't now. We flew into Italy last week, roamed freely for four days, no problems. 

Now on a ship, and when we get back to Italy will be restricted to cruise line excursions only. 

[steamboats]

@Torquer the restrictions are only for cruise ship tours. For a land trip there are no such restrictions. So you can enjoy Italy pre and post cruise on your own. That was the silly part about these restrictions.

 

Sure you still need your prof of vaccination to go inside a museum, inside a restaurant and more. But that´s it. And yes, they do check the prof.

 

steamboats

Edited November 26, 2021 by steamboats

[marazul]

9 hours ago, steamboats said:

@Torquer the restrictions are only for cruise ship tours. For a land trip there are no such restrictions. So you can enjoy Italy pre and post cruise on your own. That was the silly part about these restrictions.

 

The restrictions are intended to reduce exposure from cruise passengers and they do just that. The problem is that not all cruises begin and end in Italy and visit only Italian ports.  Italy does not require cruise lines to do Italy-only cruises. 

 

Yes, if you fly or drive directly to Italy, you must be vaccinated or tested and you can tour on your own.  Customs can verify the status of every person arriving.  Presumably, there is a low chance that you will give COVID to anyone after you arrive. 

 

However, if you are on a cruise, you may have boarded in a different country, or been exposed to COVID in other ports, or contracted COVID from infections during the cruise.  Italy is not going to bother doing a vax/test check on every port for each and every passenger on each and every cruise ship.  They will not go through the enormous expense of setting up those facilities and/or slowing down the entry process for tourists that may be in port for just a few short hours.  They will not bother either differentiating between lines that require vaccinations and those that don't.  So, until all cruise lines at least require all passengers wherever they board to be vaccinated, Italy will not bother changing the rules.  It is not silly, it is what is the most convenient for Italy and Italians even if it is inconvenient for some foreign tourists.  

 

Is it perfect?  Absolutely not.  Especially in the case of a tourist that may have boarded in another country but stays in Italy post trip.  But it does go a long way towards reducing exposure from thousands of foreigners.  

[Vineyard View]

I am not disagreeing at all with Italy trying to protect their own from mass passengers arriving from cruises. We will not travel on a line that does not require all pax to be vaccinated for a variety of reasons. It just seems to me that a smarter play for Italy is to require ALL cruise lines entering any Italian port to be fully vaccinated?!  I am not understanding why this isn’t the case. I know that doesn’t change what is, but it seems like a sensible direction to take from a protective standpoint. 

[steamboats]

13 hours ago, marazul said:

However, if you are on a cruise, you may have boarded in a different country, or been exposed to COVID in other ports, or contracted COVID from infections during the cruise. 

 

I´ve been on the Costa Smeralda this June... boarded in Civitavecchia with all Italian ports 😉 and I only could get off the ship with a ship tour. But from the airport to port and vice versa I would have been free to roam around.

 

Of course the risk is higher the more countries are involved.

 

steamboats

[prekcruiser]

I just cancelled my NCL cruise to Italy and Greece yesterday. 😔 I was so excited for this once in a lifetime trip and I had eagerly booked hotel rooms for pre and post cruise and I even booked small group excursions on my own.  With my final payment looming, I decided that If I couldn't do what I wanted on my own in the many ports we were visiting I would just postpone until I could.  Also the new Omicron variant made me feel uneasy, although my DH and I have been vaccinated and boosted as well.  Another factor in my cancelling occurred on this past Sunday, when 17 cruise ship passengers tested positive for COVID on a NCL ship which disembarked in my hometown of New Orleans.  Despite the fact that everyone on NCL ships have to be vaccinated, 17 people disembarked with COVID.  I am thinking of just flying into Italy and visiting different cities as there seems to be less restrictions and I wouldn't have to stay in a bubble.  I hope that I made the right decision, I guess time will tell.  With the inability to know what is to come with this damn virus, it's certainly hard to make plans.  This is my third cruise that I have had to cancel/reschedule.  I can't wait to be able to cruise again without worry!!

[steamboats]

There might be individual shore tours even in Italy by March 2022. At least on the MSC website they announce individual shore tours for vaccinated passengers (those traveling with unvaccinated children still have to take a ships tour).

 

steamboats

[ECCruise]

We are presently on an NCL B2B that includes ports in Greece, Italy, Spain and Portugal. The only place excursions are restricted to ship tours is Italy. After having 17 trips cancelled in the past 2 years there was no way we were going to wait even longer to travel. 

Would I prefer that we would have been able to explore independently in Italy?  Of course and we have done it dozens of times in the past. But we considered it a minor bump in the road to facilitate getting back out in the world. We weren't willing to wait any longer and have maintained vigilance constantly over the last 6 weeks in Europe. 

Edited December 9, 2021 by ECCruise

[mcdeane]

The cruise we are on next year in Italy offers you to get a private van/car for a shore excursion.  Does anyone know if this would qualify as a ship excursion since it is booked through the ship?  I have reached out to our cruise line and am waiting on a response.  Just wondering if anyone has currently experienced this and if a private tour booked through the cruise line is still considered a cruise excursion.  Thanks!

[cruise kitty]

We'll be on a cruise out of Rome mid-May...  Only 3 ports in Italy, & I have high hopes that by then we'll be able to tour independently... if not,  we have a week or so pre-cruise in Italy that will be free time... & our stops in Greece, Montenegro, & Croatia we'll be free to do our own thing...

 

What's interesting is that the cruise line (Celebrity) is selling many "on your own" excursions in Italy, which will probably be our best bet if things don't open up by May there.  I fail to see how Celebrity transporting us to Cinque Terre & picking us up 6 hours later keeps anyone safer, but we've learned cruising in the last few months to go with the flow as much as possible.

 

[Host Jazzbeau]

1 hour ago, cruise kitty said:

What's interesting is that the cruise line (Celebrity) is selling many "on your own" excursions in Italy, which will probably be our best bet if things don't open up by May there.  I fail to see how Celebrity transporting us to Cinque Terre & picking us up 6 hours later keeps anyone safer, but we've learned cruising in the last few months to go with the flow as much as possible.

 

I think the answer is that since Italy is generally open to tourists [e.g. during your pre-cruise stay], the only place they check is at the port.  If everybody leaves together on a bus, and everybody comes back on the bus – who's to know what they did once the bus was out of sight?  But it satisfies the bureaucrats, who are sipping espresso in their offices in Rome...